Poll: Tomb Raider reboot, what is your opinion on it now?

[Erttheking]

So what, are you saying that they're flat out lying?

Ok first of all, it was only implied rape, and as someone who has watched the scene "implied" is the key word here, because if there hadn't been a big fuss about it, my mind might not have made the leap from what happened in that scene to "he's going to rape her". And maybe this is my inner writer talking, but having bad things happen to characters is pretty common, it makes characters sympathetic and gets us on their side, and it helps that Lara ends up fighting off her assaulter and kills him, showing that she's far from helpless. That's what I took away from that scene, Lara was going to go through a metric ton of crap, but that she had what it takes to take it on. I want to see her get back up, I want to see her overcome this. Like I said, you're basing your entire opinion off of what one guy said, even when the dev team said that he was full of it.

Like I said, my mind is hardwired so that I can't do that. I always view the character as a separate entity. I feel bad for them when bad things happen to them and I like it when they're sympathetic, but they're always separate from me. But hey, different strokes for different folks, am I right?

The implied didn't even come up til later when everyone was freaking out at the rape. Also tropes like a traumatic incident only work if they're well written. When you get to something controversial like rape it's even harder to get it right, especially since every reacts differently. Not to mention games are not movies or books and have the interactive element which makes them even harder to write for. You said she's going through a metric ton of crap, but wasn't that suppose to be her first kill? I was guessing that that scene was going to happen early in the game.

Though is the scene even public? I haven't seen it yet so that's why I'm going off what that guy said. Those send two completely different images for her character. Though I didn't ask for your reaction I asked what the dev team wanted. They denied what that guy said but never said what they meant. Not to mention devs don't always speak the truth, they deny leaked endings or will change things due to backlash.

If people hadn't said anything about the rape, then my mind wouldn't have gone there when I saw the scene. Like I said, my mind didn't even go to rape and the implications in that scene were very light, so I think the reaction will be more towards her surviving in an incredibly brutal environment. Well, technically she did kill a wild wolf that attacked her, but yeah, it's supposed to be her first kill, and IMHO, it's supposed to be symbolic of the long road ahead.

Yes it is. Wait, you haven't seen it?
<youtube=ol_-QGlwRqc>

Starts at around 2:22, and well it's really not that bad. No throwing her to the ground and trying to pull her pants off, no ripping off her tank top, no unzipping his fly, at the very worst there's a whole two seconds of groping. I'm pretty sure they wanted to show Lara facing hardships and overcoming them, plus if they lie and change, then shouldn't you be happy that they're changing this? I'm not trying to be rude, I'm honestly confused.

 

[m19]

Again... sex fantasy =/= sexist. Why would it be?

This new Lara is a far more healthy and organic reboot. Her story is more developed than "big breasted British Batman". I do not like the name though "Tomb Raider", does she actually raid tombs? Should't the series be called "Lara Croft" or something? But I guess brand recognition is more important than practical naming conventions.

There are tombs.

 

[Sixcess]

I still think it looks terrible.

The most recent trailers have at least moved away from the woman-in-peril torture porn theme that's hung over this game since the first trailer - presumably because it finally sunk in to CD that this was a stupid fucking angle to work in a Tomb Raider game in the first place - but now...

Now it looks like

Tomb Raider: Uncharted
Tomb Raider: Press X To Do Every Fucking Thing
Tomb Raider: Actually We Just Wanted To Make A Movie
Tomb Raider: In Name Only

And the really funny thing is that the one dimensional sociopathic killer that the revisionists rail against so enthusiastically will reappear in this game. The traumatised, psychologically 'realistic' character people are praising will be gunning people down and sticking arrows through the necks of bad guys and as likely as not racking up as high a body count as any other video game protagonist.

So what was the fucking point of all that other bullshit if by some point in the game it's going to revert to a standard 3rd person actioner?

There's nothing inherently wrong with the idea of the reboot, but I simply don't think that CD has either the ability to carry it off, or the nerve to do anything genuinely interesting and different.

 

[Abomination]

Again... sex fantasy =/= sexist. Why would it be?

Spoiler: snip

This new Lara is a far more healthy and organic reboot. Her story is more developed than "big breasted British Batman". I do not like the name though "Tomb Raider", does she actually raid tombs? Should't the series be called "Lara Croft" or something? But I guess brand recognition is more important than practical naming conventions.

There are tombs.

Yes but does she -raid- them?

 

[DementedSheep]

There is a whole hour of gameplay on IGN:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j9i_U9y4BWI

Cool, I hadn't seen that.

Even when Lara is at the ?inexperienced and unsure of herself? stage she still pretty badass. She fights through armed guys with only a bow to get to Roth who is the guy who has the most experience and should know what to do only to find he's been badly injured by wolves and lost a pack with a radio and medical supplies in the den of said wolves. She ties up his wound, drags him to shelter when he faints and goes off to get the pack back by herself without being pressured too. She scared sure but she is most certainly not weak unless maybe you?re comparing her to the likes of Rambo.

We might actually have more female protagonists if people stopped judging them too harshly. I know some writers have said they don?t write female protagonists because they get shit for either making her too weak or making her a ?Mary Sue? (which is one of the most abused terms there is) or even both at the same time. If the protagonist is male you don?t get any controversy.

 

[TehCookie]

If people hadn't said anything about the rape, then my mind wouldn't have gone there when I saw the scene. Like I said, my mind didn't even go to rape and the implications in that scene were very light, so I think the reaction will be more towards her surviving in an incredibly brutal environment. Well, technically she did kill a wild wolf that attacked her, but yeah, it's supposed to be her first kill, and IMHO, it's supposed to be symbolic of the long road ahead.

Yes it is. Wait, you haven't seen it?
<youtube=ol_-QGlwRqc>

Starts at around 2:22, and well it's really not that bad. No throwing her to the ground and trying to pull her pants off, no ripping off her tank top, no unzipping his fly, at the very worst there's a whole two seconds of groping. I'm pretty sure they wanted to show Lara facing hardships and overcoming them, plus if they lie and change, then shouldn't you be happy that they're changing this? I'm not trying to be rude, I'm honestly confused.

I think the devs need to learn the difference between rape and molestation, or the devs did change it. Also I do prefer the change, since I was imagine pretty much what you written above and I don't think game stories would be currently able to handle that maturely. So yeah it was my lack of information, that guy pissed me off so much I wanted nothing more to do with it.

Though it does make me wonder why they advertised it the way they did, whether it was just to stir the controversy pot or if they really thought they could do it.

 

[Erttheking]

If people hadn't said anything about the rape, then my mind wouldn't have gone there when I saw the scene. Like I said, my mind didn't even go to rape and the implications in that scene were very light, so I think the reaction will be more towards her surviving in an incredibly brutal environment. Well, technically she did kill a wild wolf that attacked her, but yeah, it's supposed to be her first kill, and IMHO, it's supposed to be symbolic of the long road ahead.

Yes it is. Wait, you haven't seen it?
<youtube=ol_-QGlwRqc>

Starts at around 2:22, and well it's really not that bad. No throwing her to the ground and trying to pull her pants off, no ripping off her tank top, no unzipping his fly, at the very worst there's a whole two seconds of groping. I'm pretty sure they wanted to show Lara facing hardships and overcoming them, plus if they lie and change, then shouldn't you be happy that they're changing this? I'm not trying to be rude, I'm honestly confused.

I think the devs need to learn the difference between rape and molestation, or the devs did change it. Also I do prefer the change, since I was imagine pretty much what you written above and I don't think game stories would be currently able to handle that maturely. So yeah it was my lack of information, that guy pissed me off so much I wanted nothing more to do with it.

Though it does make me wonder why they advertised it the way they did, whether it was just to stir the controversy pot or if they really thought they could do it.

I know what it feels like to make a mistake based on lack of information, don't worry, you're not alone there.

I think it might be that some people consider them to be rather close, or that one could easily lead into the other, but I'm still of the opinion that the one guy went and shot his mouth off without thinking.

 

[DementedSheep]

If people hadn't said anything about the rape, then my mind wouldn't have gone there when I saw the scene. Like I said, my mind didn't even go to rape and the implications in that scene were very light, so I think the reaction will be more towards her surviving in an incredibly brutal environment. Well, technically she did kill a wild wolf that attacked her, but yeah, it's supposed to be her first kill, and IMHO, it's supposed to be symbolic of the long road ahead.

Yes it is. Wait, you haven't seen it?
<youtube=ol_-QGlwRqc>

Starts at around 2:22, and well it's really not that bad. No throwing her to the ground and trying to pull her pants off, no ripping off her tank top, no unzipping his fly, at the very worst there's a whole two seconds of groping. I'm pretty sure they wanted to show Lara facing hardships and overcoming them, plus if they lie and change, then shouldn't you be happy that they're changing this? I'm not trying to be rude, I'm honestly confused.

I think the devs need to learn the difference between rape and molestation, or the devs did change it. Also I do prefer the change, since I was imagine pretty much what you written above and I don't think game stories would be currently able to handle that maturely. So yeah it was my lack of information, that guy pissed me off so much I wanted nothing more to do with it.

Though it does make me wonder why they advertised it the way they did, whether it was just to stir the controversy pot or if they really thought they could do it.

I'm pretty sure that trailer was around before that one Dev said some stupid shit so they didn't change anything. It wasn't really advertised its was just brought up by one person in an interview and got blown totally out of propitiation because attention was drawn too it.

 

[IronMit]

The game is not sexist. But it is just shit.

can't we just have a fighting mechanic? instead we have QTE fighting. sigh

wow, the AI is simple. The first video posted on this thread; She shoots an arrow..past a guys line of vision. killing another guy. No1 notices. Later, On a different setpiece she shoots a fire arrow at some oil. immediately the 3rd guy knows where she is.

Convenient flammables everywhere. So when you play you sneak forward. Immediately realise what the game wants you to do. Do it. Repeat. 9 hours. over.

 

[m19]

Yeah. That trailer was there from the beginning and the scene was always as you see above. It's the guy's interpretation which used the word "rape" that had people raging.

 

[Rose and Thorn]

I don't think it is sexist no?

I haven't played it or anything but it looks really good, I like gritty things. I'll probably play it at some point in 2014.

 

[lacktheknack]

Wat?

I was just playing Tomb Raider 3 a few minutes ago. For all of your intents and purposes, I was Lara's brain, yes. Just as it will be in the new Tomb Raider. If I didn't press buttons, Lara wouldn't save herself, she'd die. It I left the keyboard alone, she won't solve puzzles herself, I'm Lara.

Are you saying that the new Lara does stuff by herself? Did this turn into "Experiment 114" or "Republique" when I wasn't looking?

It was a stupid answer to a stupid question. When you played Lara you said you were her brain and not her helper. That's the difference.

Are you SERIOUSLY taking the word of one overly mouthy guy and declaring his word gospel?

You ARE Lara's brain in the new one as well, unless, as I mentioned, it turned into Experiment 114 when I wasn't looking.

If you're going to be stubborn on something, try picking something that makes some sense.

 

[TehCookie]

Wat?

I was just playing Tomb Raider 3 a few minutes ago. For all of your intents and purposes, I was Lara's brain, yes. Just as it will be in the new Tomb Raider. If I didn't press buttons, Lara wouldn't save herself, she'd die. It I left the keyboard alone, she won't solve puzzles herself, I'm Lara.

Are you saying that the new Lara does stuff by herself? Did this turn into "Experiment 114" or "Republique" when I wasn't looking?

It was a stupid answer to a stupid question. When you played Lara you said you were her brain and not her helper. That's the difference.

Are you SERIOUSLY taking the word of one overly mouthy guy and declaring his word gospel?

You ARE Lara's brain in the new one as well, unless, as I mentioned, it turned into Experiment 114 when I wasn't looking.

If you're going to be stubborn on something, try picking something that makes some sense.

Can you SERIOUSLY not read the rest of the thread?

 

[lacktheknack]

Wat?

I was just playing Tomb Raider 3 a few minutes ago. For all of your intents and purposes, I was Lara's brain, yes. Just as it will be in the new Tomb Raider. If I didn't press buttons, Lara wouldn't save herself, she'd die. It I left the keyboard alone, she won't solve puzzles herself, I'm Lara.

Are you saying that the new Lara does stuff by herself? Did this turn into "Experiment 114" or "Republique" when I wasn't looking?

It was a stupid answer to a stupid question. When you played Lara you said you were her brain and not her helper. That's the difference.

Are you SERIOUSLY taking the word of one overly mouthy guy and declaring his word gospel?

You ARE Lara's brain in the new one as well, unless, as I mentioned, it turned into Experiment 114 when I wasn't looking.

If you're going to be stubborn on something, try picking something that makes some sense.

Can you SERIOUSLY not read the rest of the thread?

I've read all I should need to - back to the beginning of the quote line. You know, with this quote:

I find the new game to be way more sexist than the old ones. In the old ones she was sexy, I don't get how that is sexist. In the new ones she's unable to do anything on her own and you're suppose to be her helper and cheering her on. Having a game that you're not suppose to role-play/relate to her because she's a women and are suppose to watch over her instead is plain offensive to me.

...which is pure WTFery. Tell me I'm wrong.

 

[Erttheking]

Snip

snip

Ok, ok, let's calm down for a second, there was a misunderstanding with Teh Cookie not actually seeing the scene in question, therefore she thought that it was worse than it actually was. Ok? Let's back off with the insults.

 

[lacktheknack]

Snip

snip

Ok, ok, let's calm down for a second, there was a misunderstanding with Teh Cookie not actually seeing the scene in question, therefore she thought that it was worse than it actually was. Ok? Let's back off with the insults.

OK.

I'm still immensely frustrated with the massive wave of stupid that happened back when this all started, so I'm taking it out unfairly now. Sorry.

 

[TehCookie]

I find the new game to be way more sexist than the old ones. In the old ones she was sexy, I don't get how that is sexist. In the new ones she's unable to do anything on her own and you're suppose to be her helper and cheering her on. Having a game that you're not suppose to role-play/relate to her because she's a women and are suppose to watch over her instead is plain offensive to me.

...which is pure WTFery. Tell me I'm wrong.

How is that WTF? He said that, I thought such a thing was BS and erttheking pointed out that it changed. Post 67 if you feel the need to check it out. I would of been more polite if you were, if you act like a dick I'm going to be one back.

 

[velcrokidneyz]

I am so sick of the PC bullshit about this game. Shes been established in numerous games as a bad ass. It's not like she is being portrayed as a negative stereotype or something like that. Probably won't play it at launch but it seems good and this whole debate just seems silly to me.

 

[TheCommanders]

I don't think it's sexist. I'm pretty neutral about the game at this point, will probably pick it up at some point. I do love how people are so ignorant about accents. I hear all these complaints about how bad Lara's British accent is... you guys do know that the actress is British right? So maybe it's your perceptions of a British accent that are off. This reminds me of how people complained about Leliana (from DA:Origins) having a really phony French accent when, again... the actress was French. Obviously these people are excellent judges of accents...