Poll: Why don't they just have keybord/mouse functionality on the consoles?

[orangeapples]

I'm not talking about a third party adapter, I'm talking about first party support.

your post is entirely pointless.

And? There is still keyboard and mouse functionality. How is my post pointless? Judging by your original post, you didn't even know such a thing existed.

Seriously. How is pointing out that such functionality actually exists is pointless? I'm sorry that your post was just absolutely pointless, but don't insult me just because you didn't feel like doing a modicum of research before posting.

You CAN use keyboard and mouse on console. What is there it discuss?

yes, my topic and post are indeed asking about using keyboard/mouse on the consoles, but the main part of the question is why is it not allowed by the console makers. Giving the player the option out of the box; NOT buying a third party device that works by tricking the console into thinking your keyboard/mouse is a regular controller.

 

[Stall]

yes, my topic and post are indeed asking about using keyboard/mouse on the consoles, but the main part of the question is why is it not allowed by the console makers. Giving the player the option out of the box; NOT buying a third party device that works by tricking the console into thinking your keyboard/mouse is a regular controller.

Either way, it's made moot by the simple fact that you can get a keyboard and mouse to work on a console, regardless of whether or not it has native support on the console. It's no real different than using a program on a PC to trick it into thinking a gamepad is a mouse and keyboard.

It's all just pointless. Who cares if you need a third party device? The functionality is there, so why did you bother making this thread?

 

[Dexter Willett]

I skimmed this thread so excuse me if this was already stated. Since my computer is absolute CRAP I switched to OnLive. So, two things: 1. The speculation about OnLive being laggy is false 2. The MicroConsole for Onlive DOES support USB keyboards and mice. This is mainly for playing games that require them for playing on your TV but it also allows PC players to feel at home when playing on a console.

 

[Lopsided Weener]

Has nobody played Unreal Tournament 3 on PS3? That had full keyboard and mouse support on PS3, though the controls were a bit different to the PC version, so it's not like it's never been done before.

 

[orangeapples]

yes, my topic and post are indeed asking about using keyboard/mouse on the consoles, but the main part of the question is why is it not allowed by the console makers. Giving the player the option out of the box; NOT buying a third party device that works by tricking the console into thinking your keyboard/mouse is a regular controller.

Either way, it's made moot by the simple fact that you can get a keyboard and mouse to work on a console, regardless of whether or not it has native support on the console. It's no real different than using a program on a PC to trick it into thinking a gamepad is a mouse and keyboard.

It's all just pointless. Who cares if you need a third party device? The functionality is there, so why did you bother making this thread?

well, I'm just going to ignore you after this since your answer does not answer the main part of my question and you seem to not care about what my main question is. Because you seem perfectly content with your $150 solution when I'm asking about support out of the box authorized by the console makers.

So I'm ignoring you now. bye.

 

[Stall]

well, I'm just going to ignore you after this since your answer does not answer the main part of my question and you seem to not care about what my main question is. Because you seem perfectly content with your $150 solution when I'm asking about support out of the box authorized by the console makers.

So I'm ignoring you now. bye.

I'm sorry that you are grossly offended by common sense and someone pointing out the obvious (and exposing your painful lack of doing a google search). It's not like a care that you ignore me anyways... no real loss that someone who can't google search and changes the point of their thread once someone points out how they are wrong.

 

[DarkRyter]

A keyboard would be mostly useless for most games.

The only keys you need are wasd, and keys close to wasd.

Each of the other keys on a keyboard would go unused, and waste costs money.

Oh yeah, and you need a desk for a keyboard and mouse. Consoles are meant to hook up to tvs.

TV's are generally in living rooms. In front of couches or other deskless seating arrangements.

How do you not know this?

 

[BoredRolePlayer]

yes, my topic and post are indeed asking about using keyboard/mouse on the consoles, but the main part of the question is why is it not allowed by the console makers. Giving the player the option out of the box; NOT buying a third party device that works by tricking the console into thinking your keyboard/mouse is a regular controller.

Either way, it's made moot by the simple fact that you can get a keyboard and mouse to work on a console, regardless of whether or not it has native support on the console. It's no real different than using a program on a PC to trick it into thinking a gamepad is a mouse and keyboard.

It's all just pointless. Who cares if you need a third party device? The functionality is there, so why did you bother making this thread?

well, I'm just going to ignore you after this since your answer does not answer the main part of my question and you seem to not care about what my main question is. Because you seem perfectly content with your $150 solution when I'm asking about support out of the box authorized by the console makers.

So I'm ignoring you now. bye.

Dude stall has a point, consoles have had keyboard/mouse support for games in the past. The Dreamcast has it's own FIRST PARTY keyboard and mouse, the PS2 had suppose for third party keyboard no adapters. The Wii supports keyboards, and so does the PS3 (with a mouse). But do you know how stupid it would be to play with a keyboard and mouse with a TV. It works on computers because the keyboard and mouse are close to the monitor, odds are with a TV that isn't the case and odds are you won't have a flat surface to make it worth using for the mouse. And what the hell is wrong with third party options? Isn't that what desktops use, if you buy a dell desktop and get a Logitech gamer mouse that is a third party option for the dell machine isn't, because it's dells hardware.

If you ask me I think stall is right you didn't know that consoles support keyboards and mouses with or without the help if any third party work.

EDIT:

I'm pretty sure if the gamecube wasn't made to support keyboards in mind and Ascii made a keyboard to support a game I'm sure others can but the big is. IT IS POINTLESS FOR A CONSOLE.

 

[Outright Villainy]

Absolutely, yes. I'm a cheap ass, and I don't really care that much about graphics/mods, I just far prefer using KB + Mouse for my manshoots. I'd frickin' love if support was added to consoles.

 

[BoredRolePlayer]

Absolutely, yes. I'm a cheap ass, and I don't really care that much about graphics/mods, I just far prefer using KB + Mouse for my manshoots. I'd frickin' love if support was added to consoles.

Unreal Torniment has full keyboard and mouse support for the PS3, so me thinks it's the developers who don't want to add the function in.

 

[orangeapples]

A keyboard would be mostly useless for most games.

The only keys you need are wasd, and keys close to wasd.

Each of the other keys on a keyboard would go unused, and waste costs money.

Oh yeah, and you need a desk for a keyboard and mouse. Consoles are meant to hook up to tvs.

TV's are generally in living rooms. In front of couches or other deskless seating arrangements.

How do you not know this?

I guess this should be addressed at some point. Yes, for gaming most of the keys would not be used, but they will still be used for internet browsing.

This will also allow for the RTS genre to properly break into the console market properly.

Also which would get more use? a keyboard mouse setup for FPS/RTS/internet OR the steering wheel controller for racing games? because they are still making steering wheel controllers.

And I've set up my PC to use my TV as a monitor in the past. Keyboard on my lap and the mouse on the sofa. It works

 

[BoredRolePlayer]

A keyboard would be mostly useless for most games.

The only keys you need are wasd, and keys close to wasd.

Each of the other keys on a keyboard would go unused, and waste costs money.

Oh yeah, and you need a desk for a keyboard and mouse. Consoles are meant to hook up to tvs.

TV's are generally in living rooms. In front of couches or other deskless seating arrangements.

How do you not know this?

I guess this should be addressed at some point. Yes, for gaming most of the keys would not be used, but they will still be used for internet browsing.

This will also allow for the RTS genre to properly break into the console market properly.

Also which would get more use? a keyboard mouse setup for FPS/RTS/internet OR the steering wheel controller for racing games? because they are still making steering wheel controllers.

And I've set up my PC to use my TV as a monitor in the past. Keyboard on my lap and the mouse on the sofa. It works

Funny you mention online since the Wii and PS3 uses a keyboard to do that . Also explain to me how RTS games don't work on consoles, I don't have problems playing them, same with a FPS (steering wheels are just stupid unless it's at a arcade)? Because when ever someone says "A RTS can't work on a console" they just say control, but I don't have much problems with it.

 

[DarkRyter]

A keyboard would be mostly useless for most games.

The only keys you need are wasd, and keys close to wasd.

Each of the other keys on a keyboard would go unused, and waste costs money.

Oh yeah, and you need a desk for a keyboard and mouse. Consoles are meant to hook up to tvs.

TV's are generally in living rooms. In front of couches or other deskless seating arrangements.

How do you not know this?

I guess this should be addressed at some point. Yes, for gaming most of the keys would not be used, but they will still be used for internet browsing.

This will also allow for the RTS genre to properly break into the console market properly.

Also which would get more use? a keyboard mouse setup for FPS/RTS/internet OR the steering wheel controller for racing games? because they are still making steering wheel controllers.

And I've set up my PC to use my TV as a monitor in the past. Keyboard on my lap and the mouse on the sofa. It works

You are suggesting that console makers set up a costly additional control scheme for what is ultimately a tertiary purpose.

RTS is a niche genre. It's fans have pc's already, so adding keyboard and mouse to consoles would make little difference.

And there do exist third party Keyboard/mouse setups for consoles as shown in previous posts. Steering Wheel controllers outsell them by quite a bit.

Also, that little setup on the sofa you have is not very ergonomic for the most part.

 

[orangeapples]

[snip]

yes this has been enlightening as I did not know that there were keyboard controllers for the Dreamcast or the Gamecube, but what this post kinda does is reinforce the idea that Japan gets all of the cool stuff.

however this post also reinforces another problem with the internet: people who feel that things that never left Japan should be common knowledge...

despite my annoyance, it does bring up another point that I've never thought about: Perhaps the reason they don't do keyboard work here is because it didn't do well in Japan. No one would be willing to pay for a keyboard/mouse dedicated for the PS360 when they already have bought a simple USB keyboard for their computers... Looking at those two controllers, I don't think the concept sold well. Also, that gamecube controller thing looks wierd. Kinda glad they changed it to the thumb pad thing on the PS360 controllers...

 

[BoredRolePlayer]

[snip]

yes this has been enlightening as I did not know that there were keyboard controllers for the Dreamcast or the Gamecube, but what this post kinda does is reinforce the idea that Japan gets all of the cool stuff.

however this post also reinforces another problem with the internet: people who feel that things that never left Japan should be common knowledge...

despite my annoyance, it does bring up another point that I've never thought about: Perhaps the reason they don't do keyboard work here is because it didn't do well in Japan. No one would be willing to pay for a keyboard/mouse dedicated for the PS360 when they already have bought a simple USB keyboard for their computers... Looking at those two controllers, I don't think the concept sold well. Also, that gamecube controller thing looks wierd. Kinda glad they changed it to the thumb pad thing on the PS360 controllers...

Well the gamecube one is from japan but the dreamcast keyboard and mouse was made for the US also. I just grabbed a bad photo, here a English copy. So yeah the gamecube one is obscure but not the dreamcast one.

And again Unreal Torniment for the PS3 has full keyboard and mouse support with the USB stuff. It's mostly game makers who decide if it should work or not along with the console makers (But sony is more open then microsoft so it doesn't seem to be a issue that my dell keyboard works for it).

EDIT: The reason there wasn't a US release of that keyboard is that Phantasy Star Online wasn't in "high" demand for the gamecube in the US. And since you were talking about lack of keyboards for consoles I figured you bother to do the research to figure out if a console had one or not. I mean all I did was google "keyboard gamecube", if your going to complain about a lack of a feature make sure you research it first to be sure it is lacking a feature or not.

EDIT 2:I forgot about this mouse

This mouse was used for the SNES and had support for quite a few games, and yes it was released in the US I had one with mario paint and I just googled "SNES Mouse". I'm pretty sure you didn't research anything you just noticed the lack of something for consoles PC had and complained about it.

 

[teqrevisited]

Peripherals are one of the ways that console companies make back the money they lose producing the consoles themselves. I wouldn't be surprised if they actively tried to keep kb&m off their machines.

 

[Mcupobob]

You know, the whole argument that a mouse is more precise than a controller is one that I just never bought. I know a keyboard has more options for buttons and such but they only games I've every really needed the keyboard/mouse for is RTS's other than that I don't see them as superior. Don't get me wrong though every since my 360 broke back in 06 I've been a PC gamer since because of the modding and that Digital distribution has really been my only option to buy games. Though I miss the comfort of console gaming, kicking back on the couch, gripping a controller tightly while slamming buttons as I quest or kill hoards of enemies was my past time. Might pick up again now that I live in a city and its easier to get a hold of the gear.

Anyways, yeah consoles should have the option. Prolly will someday, or maybe gaming computers will get cheaper and more main stream and accessible. OR maybe the only games will be able to play is on facebook and the Iphone 1000 or whatever apple will come out with next.

Movement on a console might be slightly better, but it's aiming where the differences are dramatically different. Not only do you have the speed to turn around instantly, but fine-tuning your aim is a lot easier.

Check out some Quake gameplay videos on YouTube to watch some of the madness an experienced player can achieve with practice. Videos are actually a bit hard to watch because there's so many instant 90 degree or 180 degree movements, making it look like there was a framerate problem... there isn't, that's just how quickly you can turn. And a good mouse aimer can pin-point any position in his range of movement instantly... so long as the game didn't link mouse movement to framerate, as Unreal Tournament did, which is why it never enjoyed popularity on the professional gaming circuit.

Most players never achieve that level of skill and the console controller is a fair substitute for an average skill level (I'm probably at about 90% effectiveness on a console controller). But for the player willing to put in the time and effort, the mouse is a far superior aiming device. It's not an accident that PC shooters eliminated aiming assistance once they switched to mouselook (early FPS often used keyboard keys to look up and down) and it's not an accident that aiming assistance is standard for a console shooter.

If you have to become an expert then of course you'll be good at aiming with a mouse. I'm sure with enough practice and tweaking the controller can be just as precises.

 

[BoredRolePlayer]

You know, the whole argument that a mouse is more precise than a controller is one that I just never bought. I know a keyboard has more options for buttons and such but they only games I've every really needed the keyboard/mouse for is RTS's other than that I don't see them as superior. Don't get me wrong though every since my 360 broke back in 06 I've been a PC gamer since because of the modding and that Digital distribution has really been my only option to buy games. Though I miss the comfort of console gaming, kicking back on the couch, gripping a controller tightly while slamming buttons as I quest or kill hoards of enemies was my past time. Might pick up again now that I live in a city and its easier to get a hold of the gear.

Anyways, yeah consoles should have the option. Prolly will someday, or maybe gaming computers will get cheaper and more main stream and accessible. OR maybe the only games will be able to play is on facebook and the Iphone 1000 or whatever apple will come out with next.

Movement on a console might be slightly better, but it's aiming where the differences are dramatically different. Not only do you have the speed to turn around instantly, but fine-tuning your aim is a lot easier.

Check out some Quake gameplay videos on YouTube to watch some of the madness an experienced player can achieve with practice. Videos are actually a bit hard to watch because there's so many instant 90 degree or 180 degree movements, making it look like there was a framerate problem... there isn't, that's just how quickly you can turn. And a good mouse aimer can pin-point any position in his range of movement instantly... so long as the game didn't link mouse movement to framerate, as Unreal Tournament did, which is why it never enjoyed popularity on the professional gaming circuit.

Most players never achieve that level of skill and the console controller is a fair substitute for an average skill level (I'm probably at about 90% effectiveness on a console controller). But for the player willing to put in the time and effort, the mouse is a far superior aiming device. It's not an accident that PC shooters eliminated aiming assistance once they switched to mouselook (early FPS often used keyboard keys to look up and down) and it's not an accident that aiming assistance is standard for a console shooter.

If you have to become an expert then of course you'll be good at aiming with a mouse. I'm sure with enough practice and tweaking the controller can be just as precises.

I was playing Section 8 on the PC with a controller and I'm doing pretty well at it (Then again I have a old ball mouse so controller is the best bet).

 

[Netrigan]

You know, the whole argument that a mouse is more precise than a controller is one that I just never bought. I know a keyboard has more options for buttons and such but they only games I've every really needed the keyboard/mouse for is RTS's other than that I don't see them as superior. Don't get me wrong though every since my 360 broke back in 06 I've been a PC gamer since because of the modding and that Digital distribution has really been my only option to buy games. Though I miss the comfort of console gaming, kicking back on the couch, gripping a controller tightly while slamming buttons as I quest or kill hoards of enemies was my past time. Might pick up again now that I live in a city and its easier to get a hold of the gear.

Anyways, yeah consoles should have the option. Prolly will someday, or maybe gaming computers will get cheaper and more main stream and accessible. OR maybe the only games will be able to play is on facebook and the Iphone 1000 or whatever apple will come out with next.

Movement on a console might be slightly better, but it's aiming where the differences are dramatically different. Not only do you have the speed to turn around instantly, but fine-tuning your aim is a lot easier.

Check out some Quake gameplay videos on YouTube to watch some of the madness an experienced player can achieve with practice. Videos are actually a bit hard to watch because there's so many instant 90 degree or 180 degree movements, making it look like there was a framerate problem... there isn't, that's just how quickly you can turn. And a good mouse aimer can pin-point any position in his range of movement instantly... so long as the game didn't link mouse movement to framerate, as Unreal Tournament did, which is why it never enjoyed popularity on the professional gaming circuit.

Most players never achieve that level of skill and the console controller is a fair substitute for an average skill level (I'm probably at about 90% effectiveness on a console controller). But for the player willing to put in the time and effort, the mouse is a far superior aiming device. It's not an accident that PC shooters eliminated aiming assistance once they switched to mouselook (early FPS often used keyboard keys to look up and down) and it's not an accident that aiming assistance is standard for a console shooter.

If you have to become an expert then of course you'll be good at aiming with a mouse. I'm sure with enough practice and tweaking the controller can be just as precises.

No doubt a console player can get really good with a controller, but mice allow for both speed and precision. I've seen multiplayer videos from console gaming and I've never seen the type of rapid turning that is common in PC gaming.

Here's a single player video from Quake, which is on the mild side of the effect.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Et3UByMSmg4

Or for some impressive Quake 3 MP

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kRMn1tj5-Nc&NR=1&feature=fvwp

I've played pretty extensively on PC and consoles... and even years later, I still have a problem with unassisted aiming on console, but I've never had a problem aiming with a mouse. A mouse is simply the best pointing device we have. Don't believe me, try web-surfing using a mouse on your PC, then try surfing with the controller on the PS3. With a quick wrist-snap and a bit of fine-tuning, you can snap to any link on a page, much quicker than you can with an analog stick.