LiudvikasT said:
Jedihunter4 said:
LiudvikasT said:
Jedihunter4 said:
LiudvikasT said:
ravensheart18 said:
LiudvikasT said:
I don't trust justice system, he can be hitler himself and I wouldn't tell police anything.
Not to mention justice system is meant to protect the population, not to punish (at least it should be). If he's remorseful, then there's no need to imprison him.
Then I'll ask you as well to answer my question... Would you also protect the 80 year old ex-pedophile priest who had abused, and possibly even murdered, dozens or even hundreds of little boys and girls but who is now deepl remorseful and hasn't hurt fly in 50 years?
I would protect anyone who I was sure felt remorseful. If they are remorseful then they won't repeat the crime, therefore no need to imprison them.
Then as I said to someone else, can you tell me where you live an I'll pump my self up force myself to come over murder your family an steal all your worldly possessions, cause I know that I can always repent, then perhaps we can become friends and come to find the whole thing funny in time!
I mean screw the basic morals of doing bad things have a consequence like every 5 year old learns, I mean fck the prison system and making victims feel happy with a sense of justice, lets all just say sorry and go play in the candy floss forest with father Christmas! I mean the idea of punishing those who have done wrong has essentially held our society together since the stone age and stopped us descending into hell on earth, but screw it lets try something new! I'm gunna go torch an orphanage now, rob a bank and shit on a baby cause I know I'll probably feel bad about it in the morning, so it will all be all right!
Thank you for showing me the light I don't know how I got by before.
1. In your scenario you wouldn't be remorseful, so I would turn you in. You can't simply say I'll do crime now and feel bad afterwards.
2. Basic morals condone revenge? Avenging victims is making them feel happy? Eye for any eye kept our society together? I'm not sure this blood lust is healthy for our society.
1. I dont want to murder your family, I dont want to murder anyone, I was talking about forcing myself to do it so i'm pretty sure I would be remorseful afterwards, so answer that, its the exact same sort of situation some nazi's may not have wanted to do it but may have forced themselves to, an then repented after, whats your answer to that?
2. Well being as the death penalty is next to non existent any more within Europe, (to my knowledge no European country has it) And that is where he would be tried, its not really an eye for an eye is it? going to prison is not really equal to what the Nazi's did is it, he would be living in a humane environment. Seriously how is that a blood lust, its not vengeance its justice.
criminals being put in prison may not make every victim happy but i'm sure it will make them alot more happy than letting them off scot free, seriously how can anyone argue with the simple fact that there must be a consequence to wrongdoing. And in the case of the nazi's who committed the worst crimes ever committed in recorded history I don't know how anyone can argue they should go to prison. The death penalty is another issue entirely if thats what you think happens in modern day nazi trials.
1. For what reason would you have to force yourself to kill anyone? You either want to kill someone or you don't. If someone is forcing you to kill, then you are not guilty, in my eyes only though, as some idiots decided that following orders was not a good excuse.
2. Well death penalty was existent in Nuremberg Trials (a circus of justice). Going to prison is not equivalent to what nazis did, but it is still a form of vengeance, unless the only reason to imprison someone is to prevent any more crimes being committed it is vengeance.
3. Punishment for crimes is a flawed idea, two wrongs doesn't make a right, the crime is still done already and nothing will undo that.
Justice is defined as;
1. The quality of being just; fairness.
2.
a. The principle of moral rightness; equity.
b. Conformity to moral rightness in action or attitude; righteousness.
3.
a. The upholding of what is just, especially fair treatment and due reward in accordance with honor, standards, or law.
b. Law The administration and procedure of law.
4. Conformity to truth, fact, or sound reason: The overcharged customer was angry, and with justice.
5. Abbr. J. Law
a. A judge.
b. A justice of the peace.
Vengeance
Infliction of punishment in return for a wrong committed; retribution.
Idiom:
with a vengeance
1. With great violence or force.
2. To an extreme degree
Comparing the two you can quite easily conclude that Justice is where you have a fair and just legal system, and justice is bringing into balance the wrong that has been committed with a richeous punishment. ie the scales of justice righting the wrong with a right. There is nothing wrong with punishing someone who has done wrong, its how we learn right from wrong at an early age with things like a time out or getting grounded. But at an age of adult hood it is a deterant to others to do wrong. If you let people like the nazi's run away and get away with it surely those who think to commit such atrocities will know they can do the same, if the goes wrong.
And vengeance is justice to an extreme, its an act that is committed "with great violence" ie capitol punishment. And in this situation we are not talking about the original trials. And what are you talking about "a circus of justice" they had a fair trial it just so happens that the evidence was stacked sky high because they bloody did it! I've herd something to that effect used to describe the trials before, but I believe it was Churchill stating that it was just an excuse to parade the victory about and that they should just be lined up and shot because it was so obvious they did it.
Okay here is a hypothetical question for you, this may not be how you would react but lets say you are another person. You are walking through a rough area of a city taking a short cut to meet up with some friends, you cut through a side street and are confronted by a Large man much bigger in size and bulk than yourself bearing a bloodied knife, he demands your money and phone, you stutter an pause to reply in shock by the situation. In reply he stabs you in the shoulder and beats you to the ground, left barely conscious you are raped for what seems like hours, eventually you are left on the ground half naked an bloodied.
You are there all night until you are found. Many of your bones are broken and rehabilitation takes many many months. However the mental scars stay with you much much longer. you find it hard to hold down relationships with other human beings. You find it impossible to walk anywhere for fear he will find you, the only way you find it possible to travel is by car. You can't hold down a job for longer than a year due to the inability to converse and keep productive working relationships with people. You are paranoid he will find you, you are paranoid having friends will mean he will find you through word of mouth.
Your family loves you but after 15 year since the incident they have begun to loose faith that you will recover to a level you can live with. You can sense this and subconsciously you have begun to close regular contact.
Eventually you find a job you love, you love beyond belief which finally make you feel you may still have something to live for. However the same problems begin to propergate again and you can slowly feel you job being taken from you. Until one day you are called to your bosses office and told you are being let go. You are crushed, this is your lowest point, images flsh through you head how you are going to end it when you get home. You are broken, this one act against you has ruined your life. As you are leaving the building you are stunned to see the man who attacked you in a suit surrounded by the executives of the company. You are terrified but feel as you have nothing to live for anymore you have nothing to loose. you wait in the car park to confront him. As he approaches you leaning against his car he seems to recognise you immediately. And breaks down into tears without saying anything. Kneeling in front of you he explains how sorry he is, that his family had been killed by a drink driver, he had fallen into alcoholism and drugs and become homeless. That you had met him at his lowest point, that he had been high on drugs and was not truly aware what he was doing. He admits you were not the only one who he has attacked. he then explains how it took him several years but he got back on his feet, he has just recently been appointed at the company you have just been let go from as a high up executive. He says he has tried to put things right and lives an honest life and donates half of what he earns to rape and drugs charities. His remaining salary is still 4 times as much as you have ever earned in a year. He also has a new wife and a young son. He admits he is truly happy but still lives with the guilt.
He begs you not to tell the police or anyone that he is truly sorry, but admits he will not try and stop you if you choose to. This man has ruined your life, possibly others. Is it right for him to live a rich and full life after having ruined yours? or is it justice for him to be punished for his crimes, and he can then continue with his life. Perhaps justice being done will give you the drive to not let this ruin the rest of your life. Answer me that what would you do? what would you do if horrific crimes had been done to you and it had ruined your life?
