Privacy in Schools

[SL33TBL1ND]

furthermore, punishing an entire group for the action of one individual is just plain idiotic as well. Credit should be given where due.

Actually, punishing a group for the actions of one is a pretty often used re-training method. The idea behind it being the individual's rely on the support of the rest of the group to get through whatever is going on. By punishing the whole group, that individual must decide between risking being alienated from the group or having a little moral fortitude and owning up to the wrong doing.

But that doesn't work. The sorts of people who cause a group to be punished are the sorts of people who don't care or sometimes even think it's funny that everyone else got in trouble.

It works very well when done correctly. As I said, the intention is to cause the group to turn against the individual. And believe me, this will happen given enough time. Just look at this thread. TS is obviously pissed off about how things have panned out here and would prefer no one else gave reason for it to happen again. Now, I don't condone the school going as far as accessing the content on the phones due to the privacy issues involved, but I see no issue at all with confiscation. I'm sure TS and fellow students would still get pretty pissed off if their phones were confiscated every other day.

I'm not saying it will work in every instance, but to call the tactic idiotic is, in itself, idiotic.

And I'm saying I've never seen it work. Every single time I've seen a teacher try that all that's happened is that the person who should've gotten in trouble by themselves just laughs about it and makes fun of all the people who didn't do anything wrong, but got punished anyway. The people who fuck around don't give a shit, and will do whatever they can to annoy everyone else.

Also, no teacher's intention should ever be to turn a group against an individual. It is their responsibility to dispense discipline, not the students. Any teacher that tries to get the students to do their job for them isn't a good teach.

 

[Trippy Turtle]

I say I don't have a phone which a lot of the time I don't. If a teacher tries to take my stuff I just say no and get a detention because I find a detention better then losing something I own. With the exception of phones teachers at my school take our stuff forever.
And they still think we are being unfair when we mess with their laptops.

snip

It happens all the time to me and I just get very annoyed at the teacher. The person that got into trouble I love just for annoying the teacher that would be this annoying.

 

[gkid87]

If you live in the US, contact the ACLU. And tell some local newspapers and such.

Frankly, this is pretty dang hard to believe. If this is a US public school, it's absolutely illegal and would be stopped almost immediately after it gets out into the news, barring an inner-city school or something. I know nothing of non-US schools or private schools, though.

in a us public school they can go through your stuff simply because u may r may not at some point have countryband on u we had a least 3 a semster was totaly bullshit but there is nothing u can do about it and it is not agaist the law since they are 'keeping us safe"

 

[Flames66]

So I ask you Escapist, how do you feel about school privacy?

I feel you are pretty stupid to not have a password on your phone.

I also feel its pretty stupid to bring your phone to school if its not allowed.

I should have added that they get past the password on your phone.

And how exactly do they get past the password on your phone?

No idea, and that's what bugs me the most. I have no idea how, but they can. Because they'll tell you exactly when you sent/recieved a message. With a password, or without a password.

Do not allow them to take your phone, make your facebook friends only and next time they tell anyone what their messages were have them say that it is an invasion of their privacy and they will take legal action.

 

[Lazier Than Thou]

How about you just dont take your phone to school? You are there to learn. Not to fucking socialise.
So if your phone is not at school then they cant go through your shit. Easy fix.

Not actually true. Many people against homeschooling say that it's important for people to go to public schools so they do just that; socialize.

I do agree with the phone not being needed and should be left in a locker or at home.

 

[Monkeyman O'Brien]

Not actually true. Many people against homeschooling say that it's important for people to go to public schools so they do just that; socialize.

I do agree with the phone not being needed and should be left in a locker or at home.

True however that is out of the classroom. In class your main goal is not to socialise.
And ultimately the purpose of school, everything from the classes to the school yard socialising is to teach kids how to behave in society.
Thats why I get annoyed when people complain about schools having uniforms or not allowing phones in class. Most jobs make you wear a uniform of one sort or another (a friend of mine is a lawyer, his uniform just so happens to be a suit but its a uniform regardless) and using a cell phone for personal calls in your job will more than likely get you fired.

 

[Fatboy_41]

It is their responsibility to dispense discipline

No, it is their responsibility to teach. If you're at an age where you own a mobile and take it to school, then you're at an age to know rules and punishments. One of the major arguments for slipping education standards is the fact the teachers are no longer teachers. They're babysitters. If you go into class, fuck about and then laugh at the guy getting you all in to trouble, you really shouldn't be expecting sympathy.

 

[Rhaff]

Wow. That's pretty strict.
I'd be surprised if it wasn't illegal to go through your private material though.

I'm glad my school isn't that strict. The standard response to a ringing phone around here is to laugh at the person for forgetting to set it to vibrate.

At my old school, you had to bring cake the next day if your phone went off in class, but most of us just walked out of the class room and took the call

 

[Lazier Than Thou]

Not actually true. Many people against homeschooling say that it's important for people to go to public schools so they do just that; socialize.

I do agree with the phone not being needed and should be left in a locker or at home.

True however that is out of the classroom. In class your main goal is not to socialise.
And ultimately the purpose of school, everything from the classes to the school yard socialising is to teach kids how to behave in society.
Thats why I get annoyed when people complain about schools having uniforms or not allowing phones in class. Most jobs make you wear a uniform of one sort or another (a friend of mine is a lawyer, his uniform just so happens to be a suit but its a uniform regardless) and using a cell phone for personal calls in your job will more than likely get you fired.

You make a compelling point about uniforms. Never actually heard that before. Everyone always seems to frame it like they're trying to stamp out individuality or some such.

 

[Sgt Doom]

At least here in Finland, it is blatantly illegal for a person who otherwise has the right to confiscate your phone temporarily to go through any of your personal data. One corporal in my unit nearly got done in for doing exactly that when he confiscated someone's phone and started going through the guy's text messages. I would've thought the law would be similar in most countries.

 

[FamoFunk]

I wouldn't give them my phone full stop.

Never had a problem with phones when I was in school, but I'd accidently still be wearing a necklace from the weekend or something, the teachers (mainly my forum teacher who had it in for me) would try and take it away from me to be collected at the end of term.
Point blank told her no, I'll take it off but there's no way in hell She's keeping my stuff for a whole term, caused a lot of problems between me and school but there was no way they were controlling my stuff like that.

 

[Giftfromme]

I'm pretty sure its illegal for some stupid assistant or principal to go through your messages without a viable reason.

I'd would've raised heck about it, theres no way in hades thats legal

what about a smart assistant or principal?

 

[SL33TBL1ND]

It is their responsibility to dispense discipline

No, it is their responsibility to teach. If you're at an age where you own a mobile and take it to school, then you're at an age to know rules and punishments. One of the major arguments for slipping education standards is the fact the teachers are no longer teachers. They're babysitters. If you go into class, fuck about and then laugh at the guy getting you all in to trouble, you really shouldn't be expecting sympathy.

What? I'm saying the problem is the people fucking about. You seem to be countering your own method of discipline there. You said the group should handle the problem and then you come around and say those same students telling off the person who got you into trouble are in the wrong? Make up your mind.

 

[TerribleAssassin]

Nobody even had cell phones when I was in school. I had one for emergencies by the time I was a junior in high school. My thoughts are, if we could get through the day without using a cell phone in school, so can you kids. If you don't want it confiscated or searched when there is a disciplinary incident, don't bring it in or leave it in your locker/car/whatever.

But then again, if you've got it in school, you'd usually have it in a pocket, just to make sure it was there and safe. And I'm sure they can't do that, at least without consent. And also, wouldn't it mean that you're education was being affected?

 

[Sergeytov]

A topic I'm interested enough in to actually motivate me to sign up for an account.

I'm old, okay, and I could say things like 'cell phones shouldn't be brought into schools', but that's not really important to the point of privacy in schools here. Second, I'm assuming the scenario is as presented, and that it's presented in an accurate manner, since I have no way to verify.

In the US, schools have a lot of power over their students. Public (I'm assuming public since it's never been said otherwise) school administrators have a lot of power in the classroom. It depends on a lot of factors, but the school may very well have the legal right to search the contents of confiscated phones, depending on various legal factors.

There is good news in that there are steps that can be taken in reaction to this, even if the school did have the legal right.

1) Parental pressure. - Issues brought up by parents have a lot more weight than those of students. I've witnessed many students suddenly see issues clear up with a school bending over backwards to appease a parent.

2) Media attention. - School administrators hate media attention they aren't controlling, and the media has interest in generating content that gets views/hits. If the school really did something out of the ordinary and questionable, they might just be interested.

3) Funding. - Public schools need funding. In many places, this funding has to be voted upon by the public. If you're committed to seeing this through and believe this is that wrong, you can try and get anyone of voting age to contact the school and inform them that they will be reconsidering their votes for school board (if voted on) and any funding issues in the future. It gave congress pause with SOPA, and it can work here.

4) Cast Summon Lawyer. - Once again, if you were really wronged and this isn't some minor complaint, there are civil remedies available.

The big thing to keep in mind is that these take effort and more than simple complains.

 

[dkeck]

It is not always illegal as some schools do have it stated that they do have permission to confiscate and search a students phone or electronics. (this is usually tied in on a school application form that the parents sign or something similar, back when I was in high school they have it. I can send you a scan if you want.

 

[Fatboy_41]

It is their responsibility to dispense discipline

No, it is their responsibility to teach. If you're at an age where you own a mobile and take it to school, then you're at an age to know rules and punishments. One of the major arguments for slipping education standards is the fact the teachers are no longer teachers. They're babysitters. If you go into class, fuck about and then laugh at the guy getting you all in to trouble, you really shouldn't be expecting sympathy.

What? I'm saying the problem is the people fucking about. You seem to be countering your own method of discipline there. You said the group should handle the problem and then you come around and say those same students telling off the person who got you into trouble are in the wrong? Make up your mind.

Like I said, the method works when used correctly. If the same guy is causing the troubles every single day and everyone else is suffering for it, they're going to get over that pretty damn quick. When they get pissed off enough, they're going to start losing loyalty to the troublemaker. Sure, it'll take more than one or two instances, but it does happen. I know that because I have observed it, been on the receiving end of it and I have used it.

When you've got a whole class that just don't give a shit, there then are deeper problems anyway.

 

[Coruptin]

New Jersey Vs. TLO guarantees the legality of these actions. No law was broken. Schools are just allowed to do this kind of stuff, for the students' own good, of course.

 

[Psychedelic Spartan]

On one hand, there is absolutely no reason why you need your phone in class. There is no benefit to having them in the classroom, and they only serve to distract and annoy the people around the student using the phone (or everyone, if it goes off).

On the other hand, the school has no rights to go through personal information like that. It is a definite violation of privacy, and it needs to be stopped.

Well, theoretically, there is. What if there is a personal emergency in your family, and they need to reach you as quickly as possible?