Quality wars: We've lost.

[TacticalShoe]

-snip-

I disagree. Comparing making films to making games is like comparing a cockroach's movement speed to that of an elephant.

When you make a game you have to have animators, the game engine, a publisher, (at least some kind of) a writer, much time and quite a lot of money. Movies, on the other hand, can be shot in less than a week (Phone Booth was shot in 10 days), don't have to look better all the time to receive better ratings nor care about the newest technological advancements and can be made with a minimal budget (cough cough Blair Witch cough Project).

I think you missed what he was getting at. It's not a comparison of the process involved, it's a comparison on different consumers.

There are movies made for discerning audiences, who want plot, characterization, etc.
There are movies made for the summer blockbuster audience, who just wants to see shit blow up.

There are books written for discerning audiences, who want plot, characterization, etc.
There are books written for the crowd that wants shitty, overdone, and unrealistic romance.

There are games made for discerning audiences, who want plot, characterization, etc.
There are games made for your impatient twat who just wants to blow shit up.

What he's trying to say is that good games will still be around because there will always be someone that demands plot, characterization, etc. vs. generic shoot 'em ups.

I completely agree with that statement, but I feel like the people who want more from their entertainment media are slowly fading out from society.

 

[Vel Getica]

But everyone loves a boy becomes a hero or a buff guy kills things story, and that's all we've got left. Original/likable characters have become a creature of myth like unicorns or classy women. My friends and I have spoken of the degrading state of the gaming community for around 7 years now, we were the people who had to write down passwords for SNES games, went to arcades, owned a Dreamcast even, people who don't just look at a game and go "ohhhhhhh pretty" people who expect games to play well, even expecting an amount of depth has become a step beyond reality at this point, people who don't consider over zealous blood spray to be an important gameplay aspect, but we don't matter anymore, once again proving the only god left is the all mighty dollar.

May the true gamers rest in peace for they shall never again know it in life.

p.s. I'M $%&*@!% SICK AND TIRED OF SPACE MARINES!!!!!!!!

 

[Captain Pancake]

You'll still find quality. See this as an opportunity to make yourselves gaming connisseurs.

 

[imp_spittle]

I completely agree with that statement, but I feel like the people who want more from their entertainment media are slowly fading out from society.

It's debatable. Personally, I think they're just going underground. Not being vocal about it. Hanging around used book stores instead of Borders; picking up used previous generation games on eBay. I can't say for sure though, it's just my hypothesis.

 

[Geo Da Sponge]

I'm sick and tired of people on this website rambling on and on about how everything's gone wrong and it's all the fault of the dirty, unwashed masses. The ensuing frenzy of self righteous indignation makes me lose more faith in the gaming community than the high sales for any bad game. The underlying logic seems to go like this:

Fact 1: People prefer bad things to good things.
Fact 2: When people say they are enjoying something you don't like, they are lying and/or ignorant.
Fact 3: I am one of the intelligent, informed gamers and therefore I know best.

 

[Ganthrinor]

It's always been quantity over quality. Because it's all about the money.

MONEY! MONEY! MONEY! MONEY! MONEY! MONEY!



Yep. Aint capitalism a *****?

 

[Quadtrix]

We still have quality games being made, but for how long? It's not often I see an original game that has next to no glaring faults, perhaps even well above average, not selling like total shit because it isn't a big-name title. If this keeps up, we'll most likely reach a point where bland and repetitive is the norm.

 

[Stevepinto3]

I really hate when people act like expansion of something into mainstream is a bad thing. You should know that hardcore gamers are still a HUGE part of the gaming population, and that's not likely to change.

Besides, shouldn't gamers be happy to see their media expand and reach many people? Sure you get games made for casual players, but how often do such people truly buy games? Not enough to make a reliable market off of. Many of those people are just satisfied playing Wii bowling and are unlikely to actually go buy big titles like Modern Warfare 2, Assassin's Creed 2, Borderlands, etc.

I'll start saying gaming is going downhill for the hardcore crowd once there aren't any games that reward playing for 100+ hours (and last time I checked there are more and more every day).

 

[InsertWittyName]

You know what, there was a point where I liked activision more but with mw2 being a cockslap and remembering all those fun times on battlefield bad company and how bc2 looks awesome and ea publishing a bioware they actually have me on their side. I don't know though, ea might actually make some good games for some of us who are struggling to find indie games or maybe ea will just go back to making the same sports game every year.

 

[Kasawd]

I'm not sure why I haven't seen anyone say this yet.

Video game making is an art, yes.

You know what else is?

Big business. There is so much thought and effort actually put towards a healthy bottom line, it can only be considered as such. Marketting, especially.

 

[SonicKoala]

Gaming is FINE. Hell, I'd argue that this is one of the greatest periods for gaming, I can't remember the last time such a staggering amount of quality games were released in such a short period of time, at least not for consoles anyway.

It hasn't been that way since 2007. 2008 was mediocre and 2009 was utterly shit in terms of game releases; 2009 was essentially the year of clichéd genres and gameplay mechanics which should have died a decade ago.

When I look at games like Modern Warfare 2, Uncharted 2, Assassin's Creed 2, Dragon Age: Origins, Batman: Arkham Asylum, Rock Band 2, inFamous, Killzone 2, or Borderlands, the last thing that comes to mind is "utter shit" - really, what gameplay mechanics in here should have died a decade ago? Sure, a lot of these are sequels, and not all of them are all that original, but they're all still a lot of fun, which is what matters.

 

[SonicKoala]

Modern Warfare 2

PC version was broken - I don't consider that to be good service.

Uncharted 2

OK, I'll give you a point for that; it appears to be a genuinely fun game.

Assassin's Creed 2

Another point. This will probably be the game in the series to stop me from calling it "Ass Creed".

Dragon Age: Origins

And another one. Well done - you've successfully named all three of this year's good mainstream titles.

Batman: Arkham Asylum

While this is a polished example of the genre, it doesn't change the fact that it's a third-person beat-'em-up. The only genre more clichéd than that is the World War II FPS.

Rock Band 2

Tried playing Guitar Hero, a game with similar game mechanics, and hated it. Good for parties, but I don't want to play it myself.

inFamous

Along with Prototype, I'd consider this to be one of the worst things to happen to computer gaming since the crash of 1983. Another third-person beat-'em-up, this time with mystical powers. Loathsome.

Killzone 2

If it weren't for the graphics, I wouldn't have noticed this game at all. Hardly a showstopper.

Borderlands

I played enough Diablo when it was still called "Diablo". Adding guns and procedurally-generated levels doesn't change the fact that the game is derivative and slightly mindless.

The only games I remember purchasing this year happen to have been in niche genres, because that's the only place where I considered that I'd get value for money. I've bought ARMA 2 and Empire: Total War, and everything else, I've ignored. When I upgrade my graphics card, I'll be buying Dragon Age: Origins.

That makes a total of three games that I've considered worth buying this year, and when you add a couple of other niche-genre titles, like Hearts of Iron 2 and DCS: Black Shark, that makes a total of five. Hardly on par with 2007 at all, as unoriginal as some of the titles that I bought then were - BioShock was, admittedly, a dieselpunk System Shock 2, and CoD4 was a relatively generic first-person shooter, although a good one.

Well, I don't know if you noticed in my original post, but I was talking almost exclusively from a console perspective. I admit that games like Modern Warfare 2 had their fair share of problems on the PC, but on consoles (I have a PS3), it worked just fine. As for the games which you consider "overdone", ie. the third person beat-em-ups such as inFamous and Batman Arkham Asylum, I'll admit that they aren't all that original, but I personally had a lot of fun with them, and I found them to be very well-made. Just because a genre is over-done doesn't mean that quality games can't be made for that genre.

As for the Borderlands/Diablo comparison, I too loved Diablo, and so to see a game which is similar with additional gameplay mechanics thrown in was something I really enjoyed. As for Rock Band 2, rhythm games aren't for everyone - personally, RB2 is one of my favourite titles as I can always go back to that game and never get bored with it; not to mention RB is of an infinitely higher quality than recent guitar hero games, and the DLC in RB2 is staggering. Really, you can't expect every game to be a "showstopper", or to start some sort of revolution. Even you could admit that great titles from 2007 like Bioshock and CoD4 weren't all that original, but they were still high quality games. I suppose it comes down to perspective and personal opinion.

 

[Glademaster_v1legacy]

This is why gaming innovation and invention has slowed down alot lately, and why shovelware is generally more profitable than quality games (Modern Warfare 2 and Halo are expections to this rule - they aren't shovelware, and have enthusiast gamer fans).

I'm sorry I laughed a little when you added Modern Warfare 2 and were talking about hardcore and enthusiast and in a way Halo especially after what you said about Activision. Also realising by that part that you are apparently up to date on current game affair must know the full importance of dedicated servers and mods to the CoD Pc community.

That said what is isn't shovelware in mainstream can be entirely subjective as when one person finds JRPGS and MMORPGS shovelware easier as they aren't that genra savvy for that genre anther person might find Modern Warfare 2 shovelware or a complete whore of the series but that is just opinion.

OT: No we have not lost the quality wars good games are still being developed but we can't expect perfection to same a few good games Bioshock, Assassin's Creed, Call of Duty 4 Modern Warfare, Devil May Cry 4, Mirror's Edge, Guild Wars, BFME, WoW(if your into that kinda thing), etc.

Sure Gaming is not in it's "Golden Age" as it was compared to some games that have come out but everything goes through it's ups and downs we are just in a down at the moment but quality of games will rise when people stop buying crap games which are copys with a new cover art tacked on. People will do that as you see games that do badly have sequels released.

 

[Thaius]

It sucks, but it was an obvious inevitability. The film industry has done the same thing: most people just go to the movies to see violence and sex; there are very few of us who actually look at each film we see as a work of art, who study it and love it. As games become more popular, this is inevitable for them as well.

But there is good news. There will always be people pushing the limits, rare though they may be, so we don't need to worry about gaming innovation coming to a standstill. However, as it becomes more generally acceptable in society, we will stop being looked down upon for our love of it and start being respected for it. I mean no one hates me for being so into film: they may not look at it the same way I do, but movies are such an ingrained part of our society that being passionate about it is acceptable, even respectable. So when gaming reaches this point, there will not be quite as much out there for people like us, but we will have finally gained the respect we've deserved all along.

You decide if it's a worthy trade.

 

[GrinningManiac]

If I enjoy a game, I don't care

Guess what: It Is That Simple

 

[badgersprite]

Alright, guys, seriously...Get off the ledge.

Gaming isn't dead. In fact, I'd say it's getting progressively better, it's just that gamers are becoming an unpleasable fanbase, so we perceive quality going downhill, and people love to whine about it and act like it's the end of gaming as we know it. Or maybe it's just that you buy bad games. Who knows? But I just get sick of people saying that gaming has been ruined FOREVER every five minutes. It hasn't.

Besides, if you really think games suck so much now, then there's a simple solution; stop playing. Seriously. If games are of such bad quality now, then you're not missing anything, right? So stop. Problem solved.

Either jump or get off the ledge.

 

[Internet Kraken]

Alright, guys, seriously...Get off the ledge.

Gaming isn't dead. In fact, I'd say it's getting progressively better, it's just that gamers are becoming an unpleasable fanbase, so we perceive quality going downhill, and people love to whine about it and act like it's the end of gaming as we know it. Or maybe it's just that you buy bad games. Who knows? But I just get sick of people saying that gaming has been ruined FOREVER every five minutes. It hasn't.

Besides, if you really think games suck so much now, then there's a simple solution; stop playing. Seriously. If games are of such bad quality now, then you're not missing anything, right? So stop. Problem solved.

Either jump or get off the ledge.

I agree with this.

Gaming looks like it is improving rather than decaying. Sure, there is a lot of crappy shovelware in the market, but there has always been crappy shovelware in the market. Throughout history people have tried to cash in on the success of others by making cheap knock offs of high quality products.

But then again I'm an idiot, so I'm probably to dumb to notice this decline in quality. So long as a game entertains me I'm satisfied with it.

 

[Zenode]

Gaming has been "mainstream" for a while now

a game can be for "enthusiasts" as much as you can make it, thats why they have Xbox achievements and Playstation trophy's so this hardcore audience can try and get these achievements by getting as good as they possibly can at the game.

Sure there are more casual games but certain elements within them also make for the enthusiasts as well.

what the hell is it with people and thinking achievements are what a "hardcore" (enthusiast) gamer wants? Just because there's achievements doesn't mean it's a hardcore game, who the hell thought that one up to begin with?

OP: I disagree, MW2 and Halo are shovel ware (exempting Halo one even though it got us into this mess, it was still good)

If you can tell me what a "hardcore" game is then i will gladly listen.