Came across this thread while doing research on 'friends zone.' For sure, this thread is a trainwreck. Nothing here has pursuaded me either way, but let me share my thoughts.
1) Any guy who pursues a girl by being her friend first is a wanker with serious social problems. By being so 'nice,' he's being manipulative and she should just be rid of him. To stick around after being TOLD (not hinted) 'no' to anything amorous, then he is a potential stalker entitled to nothing more from her by virtue of his presence (than her shoe in his face). It is possible to develop feelings for someone over time, after she gets her braces off, looks beautiful now not gauky, etc. That's a more complex matter.
Zantos said:
The friend zone is a lie someone made up to cover the fact that they wouldn't have been into you at any time of day.
Now for some of the people posting in here, and you know who you are, have you ever tried to go into a friendship with a girl and just been their friend instead of trying to angle for relationships and sex? It's actually kind of nice, plus it makes them more willing to try and set you up with one of their friends. So drop the whole sexually tense friendship or whatever and just have friends.
And this brings me to
2) As one put it, Nice Guys made up the friends zone. Well if they made it up, it therefore exists. Nothing wrong with friendship for friendship based on friendship...and don't count on being set up with anyone among her friends but the DUFF. The underlying problem here is that while women never saw him as anything more, yet he subsequently sees himself being dumped into the friends zone...this often lies in the fact that either a) he thinks wishfully and projects his fantasies onto women, or b) she doesn't clearly communicate this major fact CLEARLY to him along the way. One must wonder in such a case if she needs to keep him around for the guaranteed attention.
3) "Just friends" when it happens, happens almost upon introduction to one another in her mind...not after this so-called make or break critical window of opportunity for him to make his case as lover material by being a wild bad boy before getting dumped in the friends zone. That's just absurd. The problem for guys is that it's often difficult to discern where he stands, often because some 'popular' women nowadays tend to well-distribute their affections (i.e. lots of hugs to everyone) and unless she's already TAKEN, he must stick his neck out to find out (a very SEXIST reality this day in age). Of course, plenty of mama's boy losers will find a woman already taken, often with her romance on the rocks, and try to be her emotional tampon in the hopes of getting laid.
4) While there are problem guys, there are also problem gals. Some may be very pretty and kind of popular, too. Here's what I'm talking about: a) Guy asks girl out mono a mona for a DATE, she agrees, he wines and dines her a few times, etc...for her THEN to turn around and say she sees him as just a friend. She should have just rejected him from the jump...but doesn't because she just looooves the attention.
Another scenario: b) a girl pursues a known single guy she recently met for something...makes a few grand gestures of kindness toward him, sends him messages, etc. all the while being kind of coy about the whole thing. Then suddenly she starts dating someone else as her new BF (who she's already been getting close to simultaneously) leaving the first guy -- whose interest is now piqued -- as just a friend. Totally manipulative.
In both cases a and b, any guy should just run for the hills. He's no more obligated to be her friend than she (or any other aforementioned scenario woman) is obligated to be his lover. Why is it that post-rejection men are somehow OBLIGATED to stay or be friends -- which has its own set of demands to begin with (not to mention midnight phonecalls crying about new BF, etc). It's as though he must continue to PROVE his maturity and virtue of sexual retraint. THAT's why the friends zone is sexist. Women have every right to date who they please, just as men have every right to control their own associations.
As adults, single men and women should prioritize their birthright of finding their true 'other' to spend their lives with. Platonic stuff can happen...that's fine. But it's a lower priority, and both must want the same for it to work.
Men and women routinely mistreat each other these days. Otherwise we wouldn't be having these forum discussions.
