Question of the Day, December 18, 2010

[Sarah Frazier]

There are valid points for and against botting, but for me, there are more points against.

FPS type games where things like actual skill and reaction time matter, bots destroy any balance unless everyone uses a bot. Auto-tracking all targets and auto-aiming for vital points takes away any chance for real players to get a shot in edge-wise. It hurts the ability of other players to play, so they should not be allowed.

RPGs have a trickier time since they tend to be filled with time-wasting grinds and side fillers; especially in MMOs that have time sinks like crafting or having to master an action by repeating it a million times. Other than fast-forwarding through basic lessons of gameplay, bots are also sometimes used to quickly tag special mobs as soon as they spawn so other players can't kill them for quests or useful items they drop. It's not as 'harmful' as the FPS bots, but it's still disruptive and pulls down the quality of play.

In the end... If a person feels they need to let the computer play a game for them, they probably shouldn't waste their money on the game in the first place because they'll completely miss the lessons that make it possible to play when the fun parts come around.

 

[William Dickbringer]

I think a bot should be in game and only activates when the player pauses their game while they are in a match online when they need to do something else (like getting something to eat, being called out, doing other chores, etc.) but have the bot on a timer so that if they're afk for too long it disconnects them and when the bot is active they don't get exp. since that's what most games give for playing online of course this is only fps's and we're not asking a god-like bot just a not too horrible and not too difficult to kill bot oh and the bot does not give the team any points
at least I think that's how they could be incorporated

 

[Rack]

In terms of having an aim-bot to ruin everyone elses fun in a shooter then no, that kind of thing isn't on. But having a bot to grind gold for you should be just about mandatory for any MMO. The reason for that is that games giving you chores to do is all part of the ugly skinner-box design that players should be able to defend against. In the end games would be better for it.

 

[The Rogue Wolf]

I'm not that familiar with how WoW works, how exactly can this affect other players? Everyone can play at any rhythm they want, IMO. If some want to cheat and get around faster then it's their business. Where's the harm?

The harm is this: Bots allow players (the term used euphemistically here, since they're not, you know, playing) to mechanically track down and gather all the resource nodes in an area. This makes it much more difficult for actual human beings to gather anything that they might need, since there's probably already a botted character snagging it. Also, the gold-selling companies sometimes use bots (often in conjunction with terrain glitches and characters on hijacked accounts) to completely overrun an area, then sell the resources on the in-game market for ridiculously low prices, deflating the prices set by real players (and fueling the gold-selling companies' enterprises, which is never a good thing).

How would you like it if you were puttering along in an MMO, saw some sort of mineral deposit that you needed, and just as you got to it, it vanished- and you saw "Awesomestabber has mined Inorite Vein" even though you couldn't see him anywhere? It's happened to me, and it's aggravating as hell.

 

[The Rockerfly]

If it's an inbuilt game mechanic then yeah go for it, totally within the players rights however if it is a a program then the player should get banned. If it's a glitch then it's perfectly within the players rights to do it otherwise the developer should patch it

 

[Therumancer]

I chose "other".

Simply put I believe the point of a persistant world game is to present a level playing field. Attachments like these third party programs give the people using them an unfair advantage, and especially in games where there is competition over gold, loot, and similar things that's a big deal. I pretty much feel everyone should pay a single, set membership fee and wind up having to use the same set of controls and options as everyone else.

I chose "other" here because Blizzard is a special case on this principle, in that they actually INVITED people to mod the game, and set the whole thing up to make it easy to do. I think this was a REALLY bad idea, but like with most things it's hard to put the genie back into the bottle. I think Blizzard needs to either give it up, or put down their foot all together and ban ALL mods from the game (which i'd prefer) including things like "Deadly Boss Mods" and the like.

I do not agree with the sentiments that "bots" are a way of playing the game you paid for, as they are run by third party programs, and not part of the game itself. Your basically using another program to cheat in a competitive game.

The big defense for using "bots" and the like is by "casual" players who don't think that it's "fair" that someone else who doesn't have to work, go to school, or whatever else can put in a lot more time and benefit from it. To me "I have a life" isn't an excuse for cheating. You need to set priorities and if a game like World Of Warcraft isn't that high on your priority lists, then you shouldn't be competing with people who set a much higher stock by it and adjust their lives accordingly. Judgement about the kind of person who would live their lives based on a game being irrelevent to the situation, even if they are complete wastes of flesh, they put in the time, you don't, they should reap the benefits. Using programs to automate the game or play for you when your not on is cheating.

This situation will never end for Blizzard though because as a company it cares more about the money than the game itself or it's itegrity. To solve the problem they would have to set a more consistant policy by banning mods entirely, remove the game's inherant support for them, and then effectively losign millions of dollars in revenue as they performed a massive banhammering of at least one third of the playerbase (for modding, which many would not stop, not just using Glide). This would result in a stronger game overall, but less revenues, and at the end of the day you can probably guess what matters to Blizzard (the quality matters which is why they make noise, but not enough to actually do anything that is going to cut into their revenues signifigantly).

As things stand now though I imagine this will becoming a non-factor along with gold farming. Simply put, the industry is going "cash shop" crazy with every game going either "Free to Play" with a cash shop you need to spend more money than a subscription in
to do well, or setting up both a subscription service AND a cash shop. Asians aren't going to sell gold if the company will sell it to you cheaper for example. What's more the companies will just sell people success in the game if they don't want to put in the time, and perhaps even sell their own cheat programs. Really, the only reason why we haven't seen a botting program (for 2 and 3 boxing, or just for grinding for you while your offline) for sale in cash shops yet is probably because nobody thought of it (or at least not to my knowlege). Guaranteed with the next generation of MMOs some people are going to notice the guys with multiple accounts who 2-box, generate special account access "deals" for it, and sell their own programs to help with running multiple accounts seperatly. The industry is just that greedy, and to be honest where paying a subscription on top of software was already expensive, I expect in a generation or so MMOs are going to very much be for rich people, or at least for those that want to succeed at them.

 

[Acidwell]

I'm stuck between 4 and 5, because i mean why pay for a game you aren't going to play you are just losing money but at the same time as a wow player(ex) there is nothing more annoying than someone in a high level group who brags about their level but doesn't know what to do.

 

[Lord Kloo]

If its just for grinding, like mining coal in games like Runescape (sorry to have to bring it in here) then it should be okay because if players want to let a bot waste its time instead of theirs then thats fine, unless you like continuously clicking a mouse at a sharp block....

Now computer controlled, aim bot-ing, wall hacking, not reloading, mini-gun wielding, 100% accurate machines are just an unfair and pointless advantage where the enjoyment of the game is killing other players is taken away by a machine..

So my two pence, if its a grind, let the machine take over, if its enjoyment or annoys other players, don't..

 

[Naeo]

I say yes, but only in single-player modes. As long as my botting/modding/hacking/etc doesn't affect any other players, it shouldn't matter. But the second I start botting/modding/hacking/etc either the multiplayer portion of the game or any part that directly affects multiplayer (like unlockables obtainable via single player or something), it should absolutely be against the rules.

 

[Firetaffer]

I said only during certain parts of the game. If it's only you and a friend, and you really have nothing better to do for the day, you can go ahead and aimbot the crap outta the game. I used to play like that in Unreal Tournament, it's like a totally different game, 'Who has the better aimbot' .

 

[Sabazios]

People should be able to do what they want, but the download should have a .pdf file saying exactly how far gone you are when this is what you are doing. If you find a game too boring and monotonous to even play it, then why the hell are you still playing, let alone paying a fee to continue to have the right?

 

[dnadns]

I have played my fair share in different MMOs and some of them were grind-tastic. I can't really blame players for circumventing mechanics that are not fun and simply exist for the sake of grinding.
(WoW actually ain't that bad about it when compared to some older or more obscure MMOs)

But I blame the developers for implementing something like that. Surprisingly, grinding Facebook games got a better approach to the matter by simply limiting the actions you can do within a certain timeframe. That way you can actually do something else while waiting for a task to finish.

If players start to use bots (especially for very specific tasks, i.e. crafting), I would rather appreciate them to rethink their gameplay mechanics. There are still ways to reward players who want to actively spend time doing stuff by offering items/scrolls/whatever that increase the yield of crafting or something similar (preferably in a way that can not be grinded). I am pretty sure that the majority of people is simply annoyed by the time they have to put into the grinding activity itself rather than having to wait for it to finish.

Of course, there are still some idiots around who will try anything to get an advantage over other players, but with a system that limits the amount of stuff that can be done in a certain timeframe, at least they cant screw a whole economy.

 

[Yoshisummons]

Some people people already mentioned "runescape" which is true if you're free to play or do not know anything on the member side. They have been recently releasing content if you call almost 2 years recent called "mini-games" like stealing creation, and others.
explanation of stealing creation in spoilers if you want.

Spoiler

Two teams spawn on different corners and fight over resource nodes a sacred clay that can made turned into weapons etc. and depositing clay at your base gives points and after the 20minute round you can exchange points for tools that give double the experience for limited amounts for certain skills

All of them are designed as slower than optimal experience gaining in exchange for FUN! In fact there are entire clans of people dedicated to optimizing stealing creation for fastest experience/tools by no real competition and whenever I am asked to join those I say "Clicking a clay tree instead of a green one does not constitute as fun to me."

 

[AwesomeExpress]

They paid for it, so they can do what they please.. but I think running a bot is rediculous! Why pay for something only to not play it until you're leveled up as far as you can? I just don't have respect for these people who take all the work out of it, cause that's when you get n00bs who don't know what they're doing, but they're at level 70 and they can kick your ass, but they're whiney little kids..

And I just don't understand why you would play the kind of game that takes time to build your charactor, and be impatient about it. If you don't have time to develope your charactor, don't play those kind of games! Stupid noobs..

 

[Shoggoth2588]

I voted before reading the full description. Anyway:

Bots that play the game for you, like the WoW Glider is stupid. Why buy the game if you're not going to play it? Granted, grinding for EXP is time consuming (as Final Fantasy XIII taught me) so before I continue berating people, I admit that I would use one of those on my second or so playthrough or, if I want to max my character's level without sacrificing sleep.

Really, I think bots would be best for FPS's. How many times have you joined a game online only to find that minutes after the game starts, your entire party has left the game, leaving you against a full team. Bots could be used to bridge those gaps and open up formerly online-only gameplay for people like me who dislike online play (or can't play online for whatever reason.) That's what I thought this was about.

 

[The Fork of Truth]

If you feel the need to have a program to play the game for you, perhaps that says something about the game.

 

[Danpascooch]

The "it hurts developers rights" is bullshit, they paid for the game.

That said, the developer should definitely make it against the rules and ban people who do it because it hurts other players, but any argument about copyright infringement or anything like that is crap.

What ever happened to people actually OWNING the things they buy? Do we own anything anymore? Or am I just "licensing" the rights to my sofa?

 

[SodaDew]

On Starcraft I had a chat-bot, which I loved because if you had a clan the where amazing! but in-game bots where a ***** and made it unfair