Question to girls who've suffered from body image 'issues'

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Jenvas1306

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VoEC said:
Jenvas1306 said:
yeah... thats a difficult topic for me. If there are people out there who wouldnt even see you as a woman at all, its difficult to belive when someone tells you you were pretty. In fact, I guess I am not ugly at all, but I think its especially difficult if you're TG.
Yeah, I know how that feels. Being tg is probably the only reason that my self-image is so f*cked up.

I guess the only thing anyone could say that would make me stop thinking that I'm disgusting is something like "I love you". Because then the other stuff wouldn't matter... probably.
Thing is that Im actually good looking, for testosterone having an influence for 7 years or so, but you allways see yourself different. Its still much the same face in the mirror, a face I once considered male and its really difficult to change that view. People who only know me as a woman seem to dont see that so much, but I remember too well.

OT: Its hard to dont let the media influence you, all the game characters that seem to have only the one purpose of being sexy. Breasts everywhere, fake, special selection or manipulated and we value or selves by comparing to an unnatural standard. Besides that women are more judged by their look, even or especially by other women (also a thing among m2f TGs)
 

JaceArveduin

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EeveeElectro said:
I've heard people say "Compliment a girl a thousand times and she won't believe you. Insult her once and she'll never forget it."
That seems to be the case, sadly.
Yeah, very very very very very true. I'm one of those sarcastic smartasses that no one's supposed to take seriously, but there's this one girl that does... And even when I'm not trying to dig myself deeper, I seem to manage it...

Doesn't even have to be clear, if it can misconstrued in any way, no matter how... illogical/insane the thought process goes, it turns into an insult.
 

Vault101

I'm in your mind fuzz
Sep 26, 2010
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Evil Smurf said:
Why are women so image centered?
really?............

because it is carved into our brains with an ice pick once we hit 13 (and before that)
 

VoEC

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Jenvas1306 said:
VoEC said:
Jenvas1306 said:
yeah... thats a difficult topic for me. If there are people out there who wouldnt even see you as a woman at all, its difficult to belive when someone tells you you were pretty. In fact, I guess I am not ugly at all, but I think its especially difficult if you're TG.
Yeah, I know how that feels. Being tg is probably the only reason that my self-image is so f*cked up.

I guess the only thing anyone could say that would make me stop thinking that I'm disgusting is something like "I love you". Because then the other stuff wouldn't matter... probably.
Thing is that Im actually good looking, for testosterone having an influence for 7 years or so, but you allways see yourself different. Its still much the same face in the mirror, a face I once considered male and its really difficult to change that view. People who only know me as a woman seem to dont see that so much, but I remember too well.
It seems to me like I could have written that. It is the same for me.

Whenever I get a compliment or one of my friends says how different I look now, somewhere in the back of my mind I still think, that they're only saying it because they don't want to upset me.
I don't know, somedays when I feel better and look in the mirror I can't be happier with what I see and I feel great.
But somedays, especially when something got me down, I look at myself and I feel that I haven't changed a bit and am ugly and manly...
For me it also has a lot to do with comparing myself to other people, like friends, models or even other TG women. It is really one of the worst things you could do because you'll always think that you're uglier than someone else. Yet, I still do it.
 

WWmelb

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mechashiva77 said:
Why don't we just make this a body issues in general thread? Guys, tell me, I'm curious about what body issues you have. (I'm legitimately curious and not being sarcastic here. Sorry if I did)
Well, 5'10... weigh in about 60kgs.. so very thin. Can't put on weight no matter what i do, and generally find it hard to maintain that weight level. Have birthmarks... which make me too self aware to be even shirtless in front of a girl, let alone in public...

Big ears... look older than my years due to treating myself rather poorly and working too hard... the list goes on.

captcha: sacred cow

lol
 

nine

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Dec 6, 2012
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What are you referring to here, exactly? General problems with body image, or something more serious, such as anorexia, bulimia, or binge-eating?

Before anything, if you don't understand what body image issues means, I once heard an analogy that might help. Start with the idea of perceptual bias. The example was, what if you had to wear a really ugly t-shirt or something equally ridiculous over your normal clothes, and then asked to give a presentation? The presentation is unrelated to the shirt, but most people will be still having thoughts about that shirt even though you are doing something unrelated. And if asked what you thought your peers thought about that shirt, you will think your peers remember more about the shirt more than they actually do. Replace the shirt with "body size", and there you have it.

Many girls have - I wouldn't say "body image issues" because it kind of trivializes what could on the whole be a much bigger problem - but let's start with an inaccurate perception of their body. Most of this stems from, as someone already pointed out, culture. The images this culture directs at women have a lot to do with body - slim models, celebrities with perfect bodies and hair, diet plans (your life will suddenly be this much better if you only lost X number of pounds), bikini models, clothing... a lot of what is in our culture is beauty pressure.

But this clean 1 minute video says it all better than I ever can here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ei6JvK0W60I

So some girls may feel a lot of pressure to stay thin. Because that's desirable (as advertised) and praised. For example, I once read an anecdote about a woman who was a lawyer, she's accomplished all sorts of things in her work, she's heading all these great projects... and yet does anyone compliment her on any of this? Sure. But she notices that she gets way more compliments about how thin she is way, way more than anything else. So the massive percentage of compliments she gets is about her weight, her figure... rather than these real accomplishments. So in culture at least on average, a thin appearance is enviable and praised.

The problem is when girls start getting wrapped up in this sort of thinking. Young girls who come to associate getting compliments about their thinness as a self-affirmation, as a matter of self-worth. This is also the group most prone to self-appraisal and social comparison. This may seem silly to some guys, but it is how some girls get to feeling after all the cultural bombardment. You're more likely to be complimented on your looks because it's easy. And suddenly here is something that you can control. Being thin = more self-worth, more praise. It seems to be how culture measures your worth, I mean, look at all the bikini ads!

(There was a presentation in which a psychologist did just that, showed pictures of bikini ads, and one of those pictures was a larger woman in a bikini. She noticed the audience chuckling uncomfortably at that picture, or just looking away. Instead of glossing over it, she stopped there, and started questioning the audience why? Leading to a discussion of this stuff. Every presentation she does this)

Body dissatisfaction is another problem. Where does it come from?

It was found that you can manipulate body satisfaction after having people, for instance, view fashion magazines versus viewing non-fashion ones (women who viewed the fashion magazines had a lower opinion of themselves). Therefore, the issues of body image tie into issues of self-esteem as well. Also, this is not limited to girls. Reading muscle and fitness magazines, looking at biologically-impossible super-muscular action figures, all correlated to body dissatisfaction among males as well. Males also have culturally-mediated standards they may feel pressured to meet, it is not confined to women.

For anyone who thinks media images are not a problem, there's a study called The Effect of Experimental Presentation of Thin-Media Images on Body Satisfaction: A Meta-Analytic Review (Groesz, Levine, Murnen) I can direct you to. As to whether media effects are the real problem, there was an experiment done by Groesz where they went to the island of Fiji, whether these people's values encourage a more robust appetite. So this was in 1995, and they introduced TV to Fiji, then interviewed adolescent girls before and after. These girls all expressed admiration for specific TV reality-show characters, and more importantly, reported later that they and their friends now feel differently about body weight and shape (83%) of them. 3 years later, you suddenly have a small percentage of these girls who had never done these behaviors before, suddenly throwing up to control their weight.

What do media images do? First, it gave these young girls unrealistic goals. Also, as the characters in the shows were presented as affluent, suddenly beauty and body size and thinness becomes associated with social influence, power, and mate choice... because the men in these shows were always paired up with the prettiest girls.

So "body image issues' stems less from just fearing weight than something else, something bigger. And that's when you start to segue way into anorexia, which is a whole other can of worms.


** Before I go any further: If you are dating someone who will not eat publicly, in fact refuses to eat and denies hunger (denial of hunger is not an absence of hunger!), engages in weight-suppression behaviors to the extreme, denies there is a problem with any of that, really fears gaining weight, exercises to an extreme degree (see Portia deRosi on youtube), is apathetic, withdrawn, or depressed in mood... it might likely be a bigger problem, and this person needs HELP more than your compliments. In addition, starvation can also skew the thinking, reinforcing it's own behaviors. **


Eating and body weight can also be less about body IMAGE than they are about bigger problems with control, power, or anxiety.

Examples:

- Hunger strikes as a response to a situation you feel you have no power over, hunger strikes as a response to someone, something that wronged you.

- Self-starvation and denial of food to yourself as an exercise of control and self-disciplined that may make the person doing that feel successful, better than others because they can control their bodies in ways the average person can't.

- Perhaps there are areas in someone who has these severe body-perception issues, areas in that person's life that feels out of control, or too complicated, or life feels like it's too damn MUCH, and NOT eating boils down all these issues to just one - the fight to not eat, something that you can emerge 'victorious' in. If this sounds like depression, anorexia is comorbid with depression.

- Or maybe not-eating and controlling your body shape (I think these all tie in with body image issues), is being used as a way to reduce anxiety. Again, there are all these complicated, terrifying things going on in life right now, boil it down to not-eating, control it.

- Or what if our person is a perfectionist (statistics say many anorexics are), and of course the pursuit of perfection is both time-consuming but also impossible as no one's perfect. But what if that person sees perfection (of body, as in all things) as a real, noble state they have a right to pursue? There is the expectation that you excel (you must excel, get perfect grades, because that is who you are, and people will like you only if you succeed their expectations), the guilt of feeling as if you don't deserve how you are treated, the desire to please, to be accepted by someone who can never accept you as you are, the feeling that, by not eating, you can starve away loneliness and uncertainty. You want the narrowness of attention (if your thoughts are preoccupied with only food, for instance), you don't and you can't think about the other concerns.

I certainly don't wish to speak for someone with anorexia, but these are all things that have been brought up in my classes on the subject and through my own experiences. Body image "issues" certainly differ in the spectrum of severity between people, and of course anorexia presents differently depending on the person as well.



But overall. To the person who asked why do women have body image issues... this. All of this. It's not simple, it's not laughable, it's above all not petty. It's not just about appetite, or looking "pretty", it's a response to culturally-instigated propaganda, it's a search for self-worth, it's a lot more than just beauty.

There's more to all this, but since I'm taking this thread as a discussion of body image issues I thought I would bring it up a little bit. As a girl who has dealt with borderline-anorexia and have known family who have dealt with much worse and have studied this topic for some time in uni, I feel that the need to just... throw it out there that "body image issues" may or may not actually be something more serious. Just keep that in mind and be a little empathetic to your girlfriends, I think, and that should help.

To the 5ilver who wrote, "What I would have liked to hear more than anything else, 'I want to help you'", I think that's right. On my part, that is exactly what I would have liked to hear. Not all of the assurances that you're fine as you are (you may not be, psychologically speaking), but that someone wants to help, someone who asks What's wrong, and How can I help? Also, you don't deserve what you're inflicting on yourself. Without judging or dismissing the problem as petty.

Also, I think that if compliments are genuine, they will help to. I don't know about getting too many compliments that it... cheapens, because I don't get compliments, true compliments, all that often so I tend to value them. But that's me.

To the person who wrote - "Share food. But really don't. Sandwiches and pizza are good for this one. Take minute bites and pass them strait back. That way, because the food is being shared, more of it can be eaten. If you are careful this can mean you get a decent meal into someone. Sneaky? Mean? Someone might get angry with me? Don't care." That is... sneaky and underhanded and very smart. :) No matter the means, it's more important first of all that she doesn't starve, and if you have to resort to a bit of trickery to get her to eat, I say it's worth her... not dying.

For anyone who is interested in the subject further, or just wants to increase their empathy a little, I can recommend the books Brave Girl Eating, and to a lesser extent, Dying to Please and Appetites (by Caroline Knapp), although to a lesser extent because the last two are not as psychologically sound, more feelings oriented, while Brave Girl Eating is more practical and straightforward, which is why I prefer it.

So yeah, just my two cents on the matter. I usually lurk these forums without an account but this topic just sort of hit the nail on the head for me.
 

V8 Ninja

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Looking At The Thread Title: Oh god, this is going to be another rant complaining that a widespread issue isn't really an issue/problem, right?

After Reading The OP: I am pleasantly surprised. Good job, Spaloooooka! Keep up the good work!
 

Crenelate

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Harley Q said:
I keep getting told that I need to lose weight, I'm a UK size 10-12. Yesterday I mentioned that I've lost a stone since april and straight away my family responded with "you just need to lose one more now" "your thighs are a bit chunky" "you really need to lose the back fat" etc etc.

As a result of this I'm not very good at receiving compliments. Plus actions speak louder than words. Unless you're screaming them .... :/
Ah I feel ya there, my mum's exactly the same. Either straight up insults or backhanded compliments, like "[family friend] says your so pretty even though you're fat". Thanks Ma.

I used to have loads of hang ups about my weight but now that I'm at uni I've realised I actually don't care all that much. The reason I'm a stone overweight is because I like cooking nice food and it's super cold outside so I don't wanna run. That's kinda my choice so I live with the extra flab. I have more important things to do with my life then go and cry/vom myself thin like my mother would want.

A male friend complimented me the other day an I actually thought he was taking the piss because I felt really tired and washed out that day, so I took offence. I think it's hard to compliment girls generally.

Although, my housemate said that she and her boyfriend had ranked me as the prettiest and the nicest-bodied in our house, despite the fact they are all attractive and thinner than me. That made me feel nice because it was so completely unexpected.
 

Aariana

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MetalMagpie said:
Spaloooooka said:
What could have been said to make you feel not gross?
Honestly? I can't really think of anything.

My mother was always the best at reassuring me by a) insisting very firmly that there was nothing wrong with the way I looked and b) saying that I would probably lose the extra pounds at the end of my teens (which I did), because that's what happened to her. My mother was the only person who I could accept comments about my appearance from.
Really? Lucky. My mother was the one who GAVE me my body issues. I've been "fat" my entire life, and looking at my childhood pictures, that woman can go fuck herself. I was a perfectly healthy child, until I was told this, and forced to be on diets since I was six years old. I am now ACTUALLY fat because I grew up with such messed up notions of what was a healthy way to deal with life. I have just started losing the weight (at 30 years old).

My boyfriend tells me every day that I look amazing, and that he loves me, but the thing is...sometimes you can't just give a girl (or guy)a compliment and expect them to take it at face value. Sometimes there is a whole lotta shit going on behind the scenes that makes it difficult, if not impossible, for that person to believe that yes, they DO think you deserve that compliment.

Keep giving compliments, be sincere about it, and maybe one day the person in question might believe you. But it can be a long, uphill battle.
 

CrazyCapnMorgan

Is not insane, just crazy >:)
Jan 5, 2011
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You know, appearance is not how I judge a person. I judge a person on the sum of their dreams, beliefs and their actions. (which I give 5%, 20% and 75% value, respectively. Also, thank you Library in the Magic City of Vane!)

In this age of botox, plastic surgery and body "enhancements", you can alter the body to anything you wish...as long as you have the money. What you can't alter, externally at least, is how a person thinks and acts. These things have to come from within a person and that such a change is desired from the person - something much more relevant and noticeable to me than how someone appears on the outside.

However, I will not bash someone for wanting to appear attractive. I will bash them if they go to ridiculous lengths about the whole ordeal.
 

DugMachine

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I'm not a female but I'm sort of the same way. I just don't believe compliments. I've been told I'm handsome, rugged, good looking etc but I just don't believe people as I think it's all bullshit. I was overweight a majority of my life and even though I've lost it all I can tell you I still feel like a fat slob every day of my life. It's hard to describe the feeling of being apparently "good looking" but feeling disgusting on the inside.
 

Glaciatedhands

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Dec 6, 2012
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Being a guy who has body issues and I generally don't like talking about this since I'm used to the "Tumblr response" being that girls get it worse, honestly, I cannot comment on who gets it worse but I digress.
If I was a member of the opposite sex and felt this way, honestly, I'd probably wouldn't want anyone to say anything to me to lessen the feeling but rather people acted like they like my look. What I mean is if your friend is in real life, ask to do more activities with them, stuff like going to the cinema. With me mainly I point the blame at my self for other people not wanting to do stuff with me and little things like a day out would make them feel like they're wanted. People will compare themselves to others all the time and if they seem like they're going downhill then I guess just complementing them on something small, for example, if they're wearing a ring, say it looks nice. However, try not to flirt either, that might make the situation awkward.

If the friend is online then maybe offering to do a web call thing... umm... Skype video call with them and just start out by saying "You looks good today" or comment on something like "New hairstyle" clichéd, agreed but if they see it as a cliché then they'd probably find it funny and thus get pulled away from their own insecurities a tad.

Sorry if my advice is poor, my lack of experience being a female does kinda shine here and I try to keep it gender-neutral which might come off as offensive and I apologize.