RPG protagonists and Mass Effect. And other things.
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Why am I the only one that thinks the Mass Effect guy does a great job. Great now I'M the Popular choice hater.
Reminds me of Voices, a bit of interactive fiction where the standard text-adventure commands like "go north" are a direct part of the narrative rather than just an interface element. Basically, your little commands are the angelic voices in Joan of Arc's head. It definitely changed the way I thought about video-game protagonists a bit.shatnershaman said:
(Check it out if you like stories. Short, free, somewhat replayable, no real "game" part to speak of -- just a quick, evocative interactive story.)
-- Alex
There's no "adventure" to it.shatnershaman said:
When text adventures really, truly died (after they became even non-viable even in a tiny niche market of only die-hard fans), the medium changed pretty drastically. Puzzle and story more or less went their separate ways. "Interactive fiction" today really isn't very game-like (i.e. challenge-oriented). It's really... fiction, done interactively. Probably one of the closest things to art in the computer-game world.
-- Alex
Having played Mass Effect to death and generally liking the game except for a few flaws, I have to agree with the above that I thought the female Shepard had a much better voice actor and that it definitely made the difference in my game experience. Granted, I'm a fan of the good ol' days before anyone could talk, or at the very least, when the speech was limited to cutscenes or bubbles wherein the characters shot back and forth for maybe five minutes. Nowadays, it gets to the point where, even in content I haven't "seen" yet, I end up mashing the "skip" button until I get to the end. It helps to be a fast reader, but the characters of most modern RPGs don't do much to entice me to sit through the pages and pages of what they have to say regarding the war, the weather, or your brand of shoes.
Mass Effect was kind of an in-betweener for me. I liked most of the characters and I thought the choice to cast nearly the entire lineup from Disney's Gargoyles was a good one, especially since I know a lot of fans of my age bracket loved them in the cartoon series and still like them now. Having the main character talk was very "meh," because in every game I've played past Final Fantasy X, I've wanted to choke off the protagonist's air supply so I wouldn't have to hear him say . Still, when you think about it, they could have done much worse, and since this RPG had put so much emphasis on its freestyle system and revolutionary AI, they couldn't have characterized Shepard too much without giving you the idea that you're being railroaded into whatever path the story writers wanted you to take without any input on your part.
In the end, I guess Mass Effect falls into that gray area for me, where the protagonist having a voice is only slightly more annoying than having to go through 50-60 hours of gameplay listening to everyone around me repeating what I just selected incredulously. Remember Chrono Cross? "What's that, Serge? Timmy fell down a well? We have to go save him! What'd you say boy? You have to retrieve the Frozen Flame before you can unlock the Well of Eden? By golly!"
Mass Effect was kind of an in-betweener for me. I liked most of the characters and I thought the choice to cast nearly the entire lineup from Disney's Gargoyles was a good one, especially since I know a lot of fans of my age bracket loved them in the cartoon series and still like them now. Having the main character talk was very "meh," because in every game I've played past Final Fantasy X, I've wanted to choke off the protagonist's air supply so I wouldn't have to hear him say . Still, when you think about it, they could have done much worse, and since this RPG had put so much emphasis on its freestyle system and revolutionary AI, they couldn't have characterized Shepard too much without giving you the idea that you're being railroaded into whatever path the story writers wanted you to take without any input on your part.
In the end, I guess Mass Effect falls into that gray area for me, where the protagonist having a voice is only slightly more annoying than having to go through 50-60 hours of gameplay listening to everyone around me repeating what I just selected incredulously. Remember Chrono Cross? "What's that, Serge? Timmy fell down a well? We have to go save him! What'd you say boy? You have to retrieve the Frozen Flame before you can unlock the Well of Eden? By golly!"
He does fine (depending on what choices you pick, sometimes he's better with the Paragon choices, and the Woman is better with intimidate) - we didn't say he's bad, just the girl is better, but I just like her better because she doesn't sound like she's reading off a paper and being completely emotionless.shatnershaman said:
-and what's wrong with hating the popular choice? Are you still going by that "If everyone jumps off a bridge I would too" ideology?
Tough. Learn to look past that. Otherwise you're missing out on a lot of cool stuff just because someone else chose to stick a particular label to it, just like all the people who think that video games are entirely worthless as a medium.shatnershaman said:
-- Alex
No its just weird usually I'm the supporter of the mainstream idea (Halo=awesomeness for example)ElArabDeMagnifico said:
Bad experiences with artsy gamesAlex_P said:
MGS
Portal
HL2 (except episode 2)
Pyschonauts
BioShock
I think you may have missed Alex's point altogether. What does you, disliking the word "art", have to do with anything?shatnershaman said:
(Sorry if your comment wasn't supposed to be as obnoxious as it came off.)
I consider them art because the term was used to describe them by others (reviews). By elimination that means portal,HL2, and Pyschonauts are artsy? Hated them too (except episode 2 that was fun)runtheplacered said:
Those reviewsmust have low standards because the only artsy one of those I saw on that list are MGS and Psychonauts.shatnershaman said:
Well those devs have low gameplay standards because all of them are not fun to play artsy or not.ElArabDeMagnifico said:
Overused quote that fits well here: "90% of everything is crap." That applies here. The existence of sucky "art" does not in and of itself render "art" as a whole sucky, any more than the flood of crap that gets called "sci-fi" means the whole genre is worthless. I like one thing on that list, hate two more, and have never played the others. (Although your dislike of Portal *is* a very bad kind of heresy and you should burn for it, yes.)shatnershaman said:
So, just to be absolutely clear:
I'm not recommending that you specifically, Mr. ShatnerShaman, go play Voices. Just you-everyone-that's-reading-along (including you-specifically but only if you care), if any of y'all want to see an example of what I mean by not really playing the character you're directing with your little text commands, though, then go find the damn thing and try it out. Short and free.
(This thing has gotten just a bit harder to find on Google than it was a year ago. So here's a link [http://www.wurb.com/if/game/1184].)
-- Alex
Low gameplay standards with MGS? You must have not played it right or something and given up about 10 minutes into it because their gameplay standards are far from "low". As with Psychonauts, that game is old, what are you going to expect with a platformer that old? Back then that was the "good formula" - it needed the "artsy"-ness to keep people interested.shatnershaman said:
I think including the face-morphing engine was a mistake. The combination of that and only one voice can easily lead to disappointment.
I kinda like the weird dialog thing. It is pretty jarring on occasion, but I don't think it's a bad design overall. It gives the game a kind of movie-ness without taking away from the interactivity the way pure cutscenes would.
-- Alex
I kinda like the weird dialog thing. It is pretty jarring on occasion, but I don't think it's a bad design overall. It gives the game a kind of movie-ness without taking away from the interactivity the way pure cutscenes would.
-- Alex
MGS series is freaking great. They actually care about the people who play the game more than i can say for mass effect.( That stupid wheel needs to be smashed its useless. Kinda like Russian roulette.) Now artsy games most likely arn't going to be mainstream. But artsy games is a reason why gaming should be considered a medium. When the day Gears or the halo series actually makes a point it can be considered crap. It doesn't stimulate nothing, Its not revolutionary.(Why the hell are people going into a geek spasm over 100 people on screen at once? Ever hear of zerg rush? The dreaded tank rush? They don't make me change how I live my life.
/rant about halo and whatnot shooters
/rant about halo and whatnot shooters