Wow, was it really that bad? I remember I enjoyed it so much, more than all the GTA I've played, I made two playthroughs one right after another.
Saints Row 1 is disturbingly overtly racist, homophobic and mysognistic.
- Thread starter DudeistBelieve
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As there are exploitation-style movies, GTA and its clones, among other games, brought us exploitation-style video games.
Of course the humor is outrageously offensive, that's one of the calling cards of the series.
Is the fact that it contains some bad words and mean people as bad or worse than the core gameplay mechanic which involves wholesale massacre of anyone who crosses your path?
Sometimes I find the selective outrage over mere language to be pretty laughable.
Of course the humor is outrageously offensive, that's one of the calling cards of the series.
Is the fact that it contains some bad words and mean people as bad or worse than the core gameplay mechanic which involves wholesale massacre of anyone who crosses your path?
Sometimes I find the selective outrage over mere language to be pretty laughable.
So...You listen to conservative radio, you want the piss taken out of it, but Saints Row is...Homophobic...For taking the piss out of them?SaneAmongInsane said:
Huh.
I listened to conservative talking heads talk for months about why it was okay to beat up and kill gays when hate crime legislation was up in Congress, so it doesn't sound inaccurate. Which makes me wonder where the problem lies here.
Oddly enough, I just wrote a blog posting on a similar topic. The short answer is, with tongue in cheek, yes. Bad words are worse than violence.mattaui said:
Its Dark humor, at least the first game was. The second was dark humor mixed with silliness mixed with gritty gang drama, and it was made all the better for it. Not everyone can handle dark humor, these are the people that dont laugh at dead baby jokes, and thats ok. I doubt many, if any, people on the developement team are racist or dont like gays. BUt the people in the game do because that is the world that the people in the game live in. The best thing abou the series was that everything going on is completely normal, to those people. Everyone is over the top but to them they just dont see it. Its this reason that the third was such a letdown. It made it seem like the over the topness was even over the top to them too which just took me out of it.
i played the shit out of the first, second, and third Saint's Row games (check the cheeves if you don't beleeves), and I don't ever recall stopping and thinking, "wow, too far bro..." as for the "niggers" line, i honestly don't recall ever hearing it. but there is something to consider about that... was the pedestrian black? like it or not, the race of the "offender" ENTIRELY matters here.
what's ALWAYS the most important thing to consider is not content, but context and intention. and never once have i gotten an uncomfortable vibe from the dark humor in these games.
what's ALWAYS the most important thing to consider is not content, but context and intention. and never once have i gotten an uncomfortable vibe from the dark humor in these games.
I remember stopping my car in that game to listen to the conservative radio show. That was brilliant.
"And I mean, technically it's our oil, not their oil. We're the ones who need it, and we're the ones who use it, they just happen to have the land that's it's on."
"And I mean, technically it's our oil, not their oil. We're the ones who need it, and we're the ones who use it, they just happen to have the land that's it's on."
Okay, so that's fine then. They are clearly making those people out to be morons. The game is not racist.SaneAmongInsane said:
This is an example of someone with little respect for women. The game makes out random pedestrians to be assholes. Does that make the game itself sexist? No.
You love Sean Hannity, huh?
Well, I'm not going to touch that, but at the very least, this is a parody of conservative radio bias. This doesn't reflect the views of the developers (more-so the opposite) and it CERTAINLY doesn't reflect the view of the game.
So no. Still no actual racism, homophobia, or misogyny coming from the game...
The game was absolutely intended for the mid 20's male in it's comedy and intent. 100% of the marketing shows this without a doubt. Almost every single review mentions the intended audience for this game to be people with a penchant for this sort of humor.
The real question is, what made you think this game would be anything else?
Racism is a term referring to a sentiment of one race being superior to another. You mentioned one thing about race, and it's a fictional character within the game being bastardized who isn't distinctly portraying that sentiment without context.
Homophobia is the fear of homosexuality. You mentioned one thing about homosexuals, and it's a fictional character within the game being bastardized. He is clearly homophobic, but that's the joke. Extreme conservatives have shown to be some of the most homophobic people on the planet. That's NOT the game being homophobic. It's a parody.
Misogyny is a hatred of women. You mentioned one thing about women (and there are so many reasons why that's not a misogynistic statement), but most importantly, it's still a fictional character within the game being bastardized as being an asshole.
If anything, the entire game bastardizes all of the people in the game so much that I would say the game portrays an insanely anti-violence, anti-racist, and anti-sexist ideal through its ridiculousness.
If you want to see racism, however, check out Hannity's obviously racially based character assassinations of the President.
Now that's what I call a racist.
EDIT: Should've read the whole title, my b.
I take it you've never been to a seedier part of town before? Or at least exposed to your average trailer park?SaneAmongInsane said:
Maybe I'm a bit 'blessed' to live near Detroit and Flint and Pontiac, but that language really isn't too uncommon among the poor or urban or uneducated, and is a pretty normal cultural word for some parts that also isn't inherently negative nor racist. Since you didn't indicate the tone or context of the phrase, there's a billion different ways it could have been played out, and few of them would have been racist on the part of the developers (or unrealistic, for that matter).
On an unrelated note, I have a funny story about my (black) friend from Flint who, before trusting me over some other friends with his bottle of Hypnotiq (stereotypical American black drink) while he went out for food, made me first look him in the eye and say 'niggah,' to which he replied, 'mah niggah.'
I can perfectly envision him (or myself) saying "What the fuck you doing nigga?" to me (or to him) without it being racist or problematic.
(Before I post, I realize while reading this that I used the word "or" many, many times in this, so I apologize if any parts are hard to understand).
No one has ever said that.Lono Shrugged said:
Wow, get over yourself...
There are a huge slew of adults who find offensive humor funny (might wanna look up "taboo", you used it wrong). Humor is subjective, and I'd love to hear about what YOU think is "mature" humor.
Sure, there's a line, but a huge majority of the stand-up comedians who have shaped humor would disagree with you that being offensive in jest is for children.
It's the people who linger on the line of what is and isn't offensive who truly push comedy to it's limits.
George Carlin, Richard Pryor, and Bill Hicks are some of the most enlightened, brilliant, and funny men to ever live.
They took offensive to a new level, and you would be in awe of how well they use that offensiveness to a greater good.
Sounds like their sense of humour sort of went over your head while making a wooshing sound. Or, if you prefer, under your legs.
It's Saints Row. The series that went on to handing out dildo swords as promotional material. Jokes in poor taste are still jokes.
It's Saints Row. The series that went on to handing out dildo swords as promotional material. Jokes in poor taste are still jokes.
Yes they have. Look at threads about Saint's Row 4. I'll wait...TomLikesGuitar said:
I did not for a second say that some comedians can't use offensive humour to tell a funny joke.TomLikesGuitar said:
Also the majority of stand up comedians use shock humour to make money off of people who find the IDEA of off colour jokes funny. I think you will find that the comedians you mentioned all had a strong message behind their humour and that some of them in later years regretted saying the things they said the way they did sometimes.
Showing that they too grew as people and matured in their outlook. I don't think you read my post properly or maybe just chose to twist it around to argue a well laboured point of view that I was not at all attacking. I actually said there is nothing wrong with offensive humour. I used the word taboo right for the context as well but thank you very much anyway, I appreciate you keeping tabs on me.
I think you are the one who needs to get over themselves and stop attacking opinions when you have no idea what the hell you are talking about.
Looking forward to your response where you pick minor points to pick holes in and ignore my overall argument!
oh and:
Actually, it's a rather sophisticated joke. It takes a rather nasty shot at the far Right.hazabaza1 said:
The joke functions on the fact that the commentators are so upset about burning Flags - pieces of cloth, but have no problem burning people they don't like.
It is a wonderful piece of satire, and not at all homophobic (it is making a deeply critical point about the irrational and awful nature of homophobia, and is thus pro-gay).
Did it mean to be all these things? Considering the tone of the game, probably not. It was probably just meant to be funny. But the reason it IS funny is because of those things above.
That's the thing about a good satire. It's mean. Because it's making fun of the thing it emulates.
...That flag burning joke was actually pretty good.
Yeah, I interpret that as a huge joke. If you take anything in Saint's Row serious, then you've missed the point of the game. It's mean because it is hilarious, and Saint's Row's meanness is the best kind of ridiculous that you don't get offended.
Yeah, I interpret that as a huge joke. If you take anything in Saint's Row serious, then you've missed the point of the game. It's mean because it is hilarious, and Saint's Row's meanness is the best kind of ridiculous that you don't get offended.
This isn't the "ga" friendly term. This was the "er" variation, by a random pedestrian at the player character. It just felt hate filled to me.chadachada123 said:
yeah theres taking a piss, like saying the illeagle immagrants should have to take a blood oath and have a chip installed in their arm, that's hilariously absurd. I laughed at that.Zachary Amaranth said:
Theres nothing absurd about fag burning, just my opinion but I think the joke falls short of putting the blunt of the joke on the conservative talkshow host.
Yeah not buying that this is suppose to be a piss at society ala the Postal games, because if that's the case it doesn't go far enough. It feels more like Volition sat down and said "Okay, market research says the consumers want a more bla-erm I mean URBAN game! So what's urban?"8-Bit_Jack said:
"Bitches and money!" Say pillick.
"Bling." Say Lyle.
and so on.
Look I love me some dark humor, but I feel a lot of it done in this game so far is done with out a point of reference. Like I can see someone laughing at the flag joke because they actually agree with it, or even agreeing with the tight pussy comment.Darkasassin96 said:
Yeah. I enjoy the program. Doesn't make me a nazi. Christ.TomLikesGuitar said:
Again here's the thing, I am not a prude by any sort. Really quite the opposite, christ I can sit back and enjoy Uwe Bole's Postal movie.
None of this stuff is really all that funny.... Well Flag burning made me chuckle the first time I heard, the more I heard it the more it started to bother me, but what's funny about a female pedestrian calling the player character "******"? What's hilarious about male pedestrians commenting loudly on the bodies of the non-hooker pedestrians? It's like a 13 year old's brand of humor were they think saying things that are shocking and offensive is hilarious.
Okay, EVERY complaint you list here, not just the response to me, but ALL of them, are bullshit.SaneAmongInsane said:
You either don't understand, or don't appreciate the style in which the game is made, and that just means it isn't for you.
If you don't understand, I don't know how to explain it to you. If you don't appreciate it, there is no way to make you. You don't like the naughty language in the game, and that's it.
Just stop complaining and go do something else.
In fact, that's good advice for all of the internet, myself included.
Stop whining about things online, and go do something else. Your moaning won't fix the industry, it'll just be ignored and paved over for the next terrible thing. Saint's Row will be retarded, Mass Effect will still be broken, Assassin's Creed will get even dumber, Medal of Duty will churn out 13 more copies of itself, games will continue to tell you how to play them, and the publishers will still find new and interesting ways to screw us out of our money, a decent product, or both.
captcha: keep calm
good advice, magical internet box of hate
-Not complaining, just sharing something I found profoundly fucked up.8-Bit_Jack said:
-A message board exists for discussion.
-I understand the style and appreciate it just fine when it's done correctly, ala Saints Row 2.
And since we're never going to agree there, I'll leave it at that. But the point remains, you're complaining of overt homophobia on the game's part and that's not true. Whether or not you like a joke or find it funny, it was a joke.SaneAmongInsane said:
Also, for the record, since we're talking about slurs, "******" and "nigga" are used interchangably far more than would befit this conversation. It really is an artificial distinction that people keep cleaving to, as "******" will still be used by (ostensibly black) people positively and "nigga" will still be used negatively. Hell, for the latter, look at how often it is proceeded by things like "broke" "Drunk" or "dumb" in rap.
The game is suppose to be over the top and silly, they have a goddamn baby killing his on father to keep the breastmilk for himself! Don't take it seriously. After all you're playing a drug dealing, cop killing ganster to goes around stealing hookers. Ridiculous game calls for ridiculous dialogue.