Should we (as a species) make one language our "go-to" language?

[sanquin]

Wrong. Read my post again, I never claimed your native language was English. You are still biased by your first language.

It's scientific fact that no language is objectively speaking harder than any other language. All languages are equivalently easy/difficult. It is only from the biased perspective of the first language that we can claim languages have difficulty, and even then it is only due to the difference of the language from our first language, not because of any inherent trait of the L2.

This isn't opinion. This is fact. Chinese children progress in their language at exactly the same rate as English, Dutch, Swahili, Russian, Japanese, French, Urdu, and Algonquian children. No language is more difficult than any other. Sorry, you are speaking from a subjective, biased point of view.

you might be right. But saying it is scientific fact warrants a source, in my opinion. Don't get me wrong, it's not that I don't believe you. But if I am to change my viewpoint on language difficulties I want a study or something that proves your facts. Also, correlation doesn't mean causation. Languages can still be harder to learn even if every country's children progress at the same rates. As I said before, if you have a source, I'd like to see it.

 

[Deshin]

Language splintering happens any time one group of speakers feels culturally distinct from another group of speakers and wants to develop internal familiarity. Hell, we observed changes in grammaticality between one of my class professors and the students in the class, and we weren't even isolated from each other geographically.

That's not going to happen now we have the internet; we've reached the point of singularity for language's evolution.

CITATION NEEDED.

Because I've been in conferences where people have analyzed language development in Internet communities. And those communities rapidly and easily developed their own conventions and slang.

We'll never be cut off from one another again, and that is a BEAUTIFUL thing.

Humans, by their desire to form tight-knit communities, forcefully cut themselves off from each other. I've heard it said that humans only have the mental processing power to maintain about 20 or so close relationships, and if true that would apply to language communities. If all of your relationships come from the same community- bang, you have instant language drift.

Slang =/= a whole new language. Let's use me as an example. Around my family I use normal English, around my friends I use English with slang, around tourists at work I use simple English (because most can't speak proper English), and around British tourists I use British English (slang, coloquisms, etc). So this means I'm quadlingual now?

It's all the same language whether you want to make up slang for it or not. Drift is one thing, but you're acting as if slang is itself an entirely foreign language. You mention language on internet communities, it's still English at the end of the day, if some "community" uses 1337 5p32|< with each other they're not going to turn around to someone in the street and have magically forgotten how to speak. With the internet it's either a cipher or deliberate altering of words/grammar for (typically comical) effect (I can haz cheezeburger?) or making up a bunch of acronyms or terms in order to shorten commonly used phrases. Such as in MMOs you'll have 'cc', 'dps', 'aggro', 'res', 'gank' etc; it doesn't mean it's a new language is it?

 

[SacremPyrobolum]

Whatever it becomes I hope it's mine because I suck at learning languages.

 

[Tom Windsor]

Unlike some commentators here, I see Esperanto as a remarkable ! success story. It has survived wars and revolutions and economic crises and continues to attract people to learn and speak it. Esperanto works - I know from experience. If you're interested in Esperanto, take a look at http://www.lernu.net

 

[Olas]

It's a very practical idea, and English would definitely be the most logical first choice.

The only worry I'd have is that if everyone knows English there won't be much need or reason for people to become fluent in their native languages anymore. Why would they want to when the rest of the world speaks English including people in their own country? Slowly, native languages would start to deprecate until every country is like Ireland where only 2% of the population actually know Gaelic.

How about the Netherlands? Where despite most of their population being very well spoken in English, French and German (as well as Flemish in certain areas), they still manage with Dutch.

I appreciate what you're saying, however native languages don't die simply because people know other languages - English is already "Universal" (sort of), but only in nations where the English actually went out of their way to stamp out native languages (Scotland, Wales, Ireland), have these languages nearly died out.

Recently, attempts to bring about a resurgence of Welsh and Scots Gaelic have met with some success (moreso in Wales than Scotland, I think), can't speak for the Irish.

In Ireland there are some communities, the Gaeltacht (literally "Irish speaking region"), that insist on keeping Irish Gaelic the main language, however they're a tiny, mostly isolated, minority. The rest of Ireland not only doesn't speak it but, is reconsidering whether Gaelic should even be taught in primary schools anymore as it serves little purpose, most kids don't like it, and few remember it anyway. It's become a novelty, something you put on souvenirs for tourists, not something people actually use.

You're right that the existence of a second language doesn't usually cause a conflict. But my fear is that globalization is going to put increasing pressure on people to learn English like never before. This is something history can't account for because throughout history there has always been large divides between countries and there's never been a universal language. English will be emphasized more than native languages in school, It'll be the more valuable language to know. Sure some people will work to keep the native languages alive, but they'll only be alive in the sense that Gaelic is alive.

I'm tempted to say: So what? Do we really need thousands of languages? What do they produce? Other than a barrier for international understanding?

Hey, if people are cool with it then so am I. I'm just assuming lots of people would see it as a sad cultural loss to homogenization.

 

[IamLEAM1983]

Uh, ever hear of a Lingua Franca? At present, English is the dominant language for those purposes and is used for everything from the Olympics to International Trade to Air Traffic Control. That's probably about as close to a universal language as we're going to see in our lifetimes.

This, and I apologize if it's been mentioned already, but Esperanto is more or less designed to be a quick-and-dirty means of getting people of various linguistic backgrounds to reach some basic levels of understanding. I've heard it spoken fluently in academic circles, but I doubt it's the kind of idiom you could expect to find out in the streets.

Although, to go back on the subject of the Lingua Franca, I'd mention that French is also fairly massive in terms of retention and adoption rate.

The problem is French grammar is extremely complex, if not downright tedious at times. One of the early posters said that English was complex?

Heh, take it from me, and this comes from a bilingual person whose second language is English; but Shakespeare's tongue is a cinch to master, compared to French. The way you've blended in formality and informality and more or less made them distinct only through the use of certain linguistic registries is much, much easier than trying to figure out when you're supposed to be formal or informal.

I speak French as a native speaker, been speaking it for 30 years, and I still occasionally get hung up on "vous" and "tu" - which obviously makes me look hopelessly awkward on the social level.

 

[Someone Depressing]

It would probably be English, French, or Mandarin. But yeah, it'd solve a lot of communication issues.

But yeah, it'd be a good idea to have schools teach a staple language. I think Japan and China is really into this, but not really into this. Just look up Engrish tatoos. The results are both funny in that they're so stupid, but sad in that these people are going to live their entire lives with those horrible words on their skin.

 

[SpAc3man]

I say let language do it's own thing. Language will always be constantly evolving. If everyone started speaking a single language you will still end up with very distinct geographic dialects after a few hundred years.

 

[Yuuki]

A single language is a great idea, but everyone who is saying "English!", no thank you. English is an absolute MESS of a language and probably ranking in some of the most difficult languages to pick up. To a non-English speaking person it's an absolutely nightmare to learn and nothing makes any sense since there are so many exceptions to rules and new words being added to the dictionary every damn day.
I mean the very fact English has Spelling Competitions is proof as to just how disjointed the spoken is compared to written/reading.

I would recommend something far more "stable" and easy to pick up (spoken at least), e.g. Japanese. Their writing system also makes perfect sense as long as you stick to Hirigana/Katakana (spelled exactly how it's pronounced, always!).

 

[Flunk]

All those saying "English!", no thank you. English is an absolute MESS of a language and probably ranking in some of the most difficult languages to learn in the world. To a non-English speaking person, it's is an absolutely nightmare to learn and nothing makes any sense since there are so many exceptions to rules and new words being added to the dictionary every damn day.

I would recommend something far more "stable" and easy to pick up (verbally at least), e.g. Japanese.

The problem with Japanese as an international language is that no one outside of Japan speaks it. And as much as I like living in Japan, it's just not essential in practical terms for the world at large to speak with Japanese people on their own turf. Being able to debate the nuance of feeling one experiences while looking at cherry blossoms in Japanese may be very gratifying for some, but it's not going to get you a better job or secure an important business contract. Besides, I think most Japanese people wouldn't want their language to be the world's lingua franca. There is a certain amount of discomfort from many people here whenever non-Japanese people are able to read into Japanese discourse and understand what's really being said. Take for example, the Daily WaiWai, a now-defunct website that translated salacious gossip from various Japanese tabloids into English. These tabloids are all over the place, and Japan is filled with racy stories in magazines. But the moment a group of Japanese people got wind that these stories were being translated and were potentially making Japan look bad to foreigners, they made a petition to get the website shut down. And they succeeded, since the site was hosted by a Japanese news agency rather than an organization abroad. While it's by no means universal, there is a segment of the Japanese population that wants very badly to keep foreigners and the Japanese language separate.

Which winds us all back around to my original point. It's great if you want to study Japanese. There's just no point in anyone declaring a lingua franca. These things arise not because we will them into being, but just by shifting masses of people converging on one opinion.

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But seriously, just because I speak Japanese and the first poster speaks Japanese doesn't make it a common thing. It's true that Japanese is quite a consistent language but the written language is a horrible mess. I don't think that there is a person alive who has truly mastered every possible Kanji still in use.

English is a pretty bad language to master because there are a lot of things that are poorly defined like correct preposition use, definite/indefinite particles, proper use of modals and the fact that every verb is irregular. However, picking up a working knowledge to get your point across isn't any harder than any other language.

There are pluses and minuses of every language. I firmly support a single world language, but suggesting that it must be English because it has been influential in the past, in an English-language forum kinda seems a bit like enthnocentrism (my culture is the best because it's mine!). I would say that Spanish and Chinese would also be popular options along with some more unusual choices like Swahili which is apparently quite easy to learn.

It's not going to happen though, maybe people will all end up learning a single trade language in the end but they'll all speak whatever suits them best at home. I could be wrong but historical precedent agrees with me.

 

[BeeGeenie]

What you are describing is a "Lingua Franca."
People always tend to learn the language of large, powerful cultures for the purpose of multicultural communications, but it's only recently that technology has allowed that kind of thing on a global scale.

If it happens, it'll happen naturally, without any interference from us... and given recent changes in global politics and economics, we might easily end up all speaking a Chinese/English creole someday.

 

[Abomination]

Considering how in almost every other country other than English speaking countries advertisements for learning English are the most dominant language advertisement I think we're actually well on our way to English becoming the international language.

The culture is dominant, there's some English speaking nation in almost every corner of the globe... I think every single nation has an English speaking nation as a major trading partner already. From Asia to South America to Europe to Africa.

If you were going to decide on a language it's probably best to start with the one that has the highest proportion of speakers in non-official language nations than any other language.

I think it's also a language that has had to deal with other people not having the most fluent grasp of it more than other languages. I would say English speakers are far more capable of understanding non-fluent English speakers than other languages are trying to understand non-fluent other language speakers.

I don't even believe we'd need to make it official, I think English becoming the international language will happen organically. Maybe not in our generation but perhaps in 6-10 more.

 

[Guitarmasterx7]

I say let language do it's own thing. Language will always be constantly evolving. If everyone started speaking a single language you will still end up with very distinct geographic dialects after a few hundred years.

With as much communication and travel as there is due to technological advances, I don't know that this would happen anymore. If we can somehow miraculously get everyone in the whole world speaking the same language, keeping it together is nothing in comparison.

I don't really hold culture or heritage in any high regard so I think it would greatly benefit us as a species if it was realistically possible, so long as there was still a place for linguistics among historians and such.

On the issue of what it should be, if we're just going by population it comes down to English VS Chinese. I'm not going to claim to be completely unbiased here, but English has the advantage of having a phonetic alphabet that it shares with a plethora of other languages. I do think if it became a global language we would need to retool the spelling of some of our words to be more phonetically stable. Inconsistencies like the "gh" sound in "laughter" and "slaughter" are pretty stupid. (The new spellings would be something like "laffter" and "slawter")

But on the subject of dialects, it should be pretty noteworthy that English doesn't really have many dialects so much as it does accents. I can understand someone from Australia just fine and that's across the world. I don't know if it's an exaggeration or not, but I heard from someone born and raised in India that the dialects are so varied and numerous there that if you drive for an hour in any given direction, the people will be speaking a dialect so different it might as well be a different language. English does have dialects like patois but even those you can somewhat understand.
I don't know why English has been able to remain so intact but even if it's due to coincidence or circumstance, it's a pretty good track record for a potential global language I think.

 

[Jacco]

I would much prefer the singapore school system to be adopted everywhere: Get language lessons for both english and your parent's native language.

Obviously I would prefer english over mandarin, but that's only because I've already learned english.

Would you still be as fervent a supporter of one world language if that language was mandarin?

What you said is pretty much what I did in my OP. That we shouldn't stamp out native languages. Only provide early education in a universal second language. So people in China would still speak Mandarin on a daily basis, but if they travelled to, say Germany, they could converse in English since ideally the Germans would also know english. Or vice versa.

If what you say about Singapore is true, they have it right in my opinion.

 

[Chemical Alia]

A single language is a great idea, but everyone who is saying "English!", no thank you. English is an absolute MESS of a language and probably ranking in some of the most difficult languages to pick up. To a non-English speaking person it's an absolutely nightmare to learn and nothing makes any sense since there are so many exceptions to rules and new words being added to the dictionary every damn day.
I mean the very fact English has Spelling Competitions is proof as to just how disjointed the spoken is compared to written/reading.

I would recommend something far more "stable" and easy to pick up (spoken at least), e.g. Japanese. Their writing system also makes perfect sense as long as you stick to Hirigana/Katakana (spelled exactly how it's pronounced, always!).

So, Chinese, in other words? I wasn't aware that a sizeable number of people speak Japanese outside of Japan, aside from your occasional college anime club member.

 

[Jacco]

Why English? Why not Chinese? Most people in the world know Chinese.

I explained my reasoning in my post. And to say that most people in the world speak Chinese is wrong. By sheer numbers that may be true, but that is only becuase China itself has 1.3 billion people. Chinese is almost non-exitent in any other area of the world.

That being said, I wouldn't be against making a language other than Enligsh a universal standard. As long as there was one.