Skyrim: Same button-mashing level system as before?

[mike1921]

Because if you don't get all 5s (or at least 3s) every level you're going to get fucked up the ass.

Except I didnt and I didnt, not only speaking from other peoples experience of not sucking at Oblivion but also speaking from my own experience of not sucking at Oblivion.

But see here's the thing, you need those stats. No matter how much you don't suck (also, seriously , shut the fuck up about that. It's not whether you suck, it's that your interests work in a way that you will level with the enemies) if you play a certain way you will just be at a point where everything feels like an invincible wall of steel you're hacking away by level 20.

I found the levelling system to work really well, it blended almost seamlessly into gameplay for me with the exception of a few buggy little pieces. It just sounds like you were trying to turn it into some sort of grindfest. I'm hoping they debug, but mostly keep the oblivion levelling system.

To set some of your fears to reast they're ditching major and minor attributes, and theres no real level cap, so it should just work in on a "You're using spells ergo getting better at them" kind of level.

I understand how for some people the oblivion leveling system works fine in the gameplay. But for some people, like me, if you just play normally, not specifically leveling anything and selecting your major skills to just be the skills you plan on using the most (I will note that once you get 10 points in your major skills that's when you get the level up so that just means +5 to that one stat when you can boost 3 if you do no minor skills) your character will be so underleveled compared to the enemies that a highwayman will feel like the ultimate boss that you have to slowly ping health away from.

I just set my major skills to the ones I used most and had almost no trouble with the scaling. I didn't specifically level any skills I simply used the ones I liked and it just flowed naturally. Maybe you just made decisions for major and minor skills that clashed with your style of play.

I don't know, I was trying to play a mage warrior hybrid. Hopefully my old xbox file (I since pirated it for PC because my TV screen was so small and I wanted to try mods) is still there so I can look at it and see

Yeah? you were playing the game wrong.

When I played, I would essentially ignore the "you can level up dialog" until I actually found a bed. This could take weeks. By the time I was actually ready to level, any of the stats I was actually interested in increasing (because I used them a lot) were at the +5 mark.

Keep in mind, that I wasn't ignoring the level up because I wanted better stats. I was ignoring the level up because finding a bed would take me away from whatever adventure I was currently on.

What you were doing is referred to as "munchkining" and is one of the many forms of metagaming, the bane of any role-playing experience. You're better off taking the lower numbers and forming a real narrative.

Except what you're doing really is giving you the best numbers possible in comparison to enemies (well unless you count just not leveling period in which case you'll destroy everything just by looking at it). They wouldn't be taking the lower numbers if they did it your way they'd be taking higher numbers.

Also, playing the game the way that'll feel natural (When someone sees that they're going to level up once they find a bed they're probably going to think they're supposed to go find a bed) is munchkining?

And, were you never in cities or by "found a bed" do you mean "a bed was less than 15 feet away from me)

 

[Kinguendo]

But see here's the thing, you need those stats. No matter how much you don't suck (also, seriously , shut the fuck up about that. It's not whether you suck, it's that your interests work in a way that you will level with the enemies) if you play a certain way you will just be at a point where everything feels like an invincible wall of steel you're hacking away by level 20.

So what you are saying is that I mastered the game from the moment I started playing it? Seems rather unlikely... and why should I "shut the fuck up about that"? Is it because you want to sing my praises instead and proclaim how I am a natural at Oblivion and how much I dont suck at it? Because I agree with that (read my previous reply), looks like we agree. Jolly good.

 

[mike1921]

But see here's the thing, you need those stats. No matter how much you don't suck (also, seriously , shut the fuck up about that. It's not whether you suck, it's that your interests work in a way that you will level with the enemies) if you play a certain way you will just be at a point where everything feels like an invincible wall of steel you're hacking away by level 20.

So what you are saying is that I mastered the game from the moment I started playing it? Seems rather unlikely... and why should I "shut the fuck up about that"? Is it because you want to sing my praises instead and proclaim how I am a natural at Oblivion and how much I dont suck at it? Because I agree with that (read my previous reply), looks like we agree. Jolly good.

No, just that you're interests allign in a way that make the game easier. There is no "mastering" wanting to use solely swords and shields . You might as well say you "mastered" eating sandwiches with mayonnaise because I hate mayonnaise.

 

[Kinguendo]

But see here's the thing, you need those stats. No matter how much you don't suck (also, seriously , shut the fuck up about that. It's not whether you suck, it's that your interests work in a way that you will level with the enemies) if you play a certain way you will just be at a point where everything feels like an invincible wall of steel you're hacking away by level 20.

So what you are saying is that I mastered the game from the moment I started playing it? Seems rather unlikely... and why should I "shut the fuck up about that"? Is it because you want to sing my praises instead and proclaim how I am a natural at Oblivion and how much I dont suck at it? Because I agree with that (read my previous reply), looks like we agree. Jolly good.

No, just that you're interests allign in a way that make the game easier. There is no "mastering" wanting to use solely swords and shields . You might as well say you "mastered" eating sandwiches with mayonnaise because I hate mayonnaise.

AH! So you just assumed I used swords and shields and only ever played as one class? Good, because thats completely wrong. You could have ASKED what weapons I use before pretending thats the secret to winning and it having nothing to do with being good at the game.

 

[mike1921]

But see here's the thing, you need those stats. No matter how much you don't suck (also, seriously , shut the fuck up about that. It's not whether you suck, it's that your interests work in a way that you will level with the enemies) if you play a certain way you will just be at a point where everything feels like an invincible wall of steel you're hacking away by level 20.

So what you are saying is that I mastered the game from the moment I started playing it? Seems rather unlikely... and why should I "shut the fuck up about that"? Is it because you want to sing my praises instead and proclaim how I am a natural at Oblivion and how much I dont suck at it? Because I agree with that (read my previous reply), looks like we agree. Jolly good.

No, just that you're interests allign in a way that make the game easier. There is no "mastering" wanting to use solely swords and shields . You might as well say you "mastered" eating sandwiches with mayonnaise because I hate mayonnaise.

AH! So you just assumed I used swords and shields and only ever played as one class? Good, because thats completely wrong. You could have ASKED what weapons I use before pretending thats the secret to winning and it having nothing to do with being good at the game.

Please be joking. Please be joking. Please for the love of all that is good and holy, along with all that is evil and demonic, be joking.

 

[The Gnome King]

Like right now, by me, for referring to yourself in the third person you arrogant bastard.

Savvy. The Gnome approves of your cheek.

Truthfully, it would seem Bethesda wasn't wasting our time waiting so long to make Skyrim. Oblivion was a good game and it seems like Skyrim will be an absolute improvement. As it is though, I won't be getting it immediately because strictly single player games tend to drop pretty fast in price and I'm a cheap buyer.

Agreed on the game; it looks fantastic. Now that I know the leveling issues I had with it are at least partially resolved, I'll be picking it up immediately.

My wife still wants a copy of Dragon Age 2 for her own Steam account, though, and I need to get her the Portal games... and I have a few other gems coming out before Skyrim releases that should keep me busy.

And there's Dungeons & Dragons Online to fill in the gaps while we wait.

 

[The Gnome King]

Lol dude, all I can say is that you're worrying WAY too much about it. I never had any problems with this, and my biggest hobbies in Oblivion were Alchemy and Enchantment.

Apparently enough people had problems with the Oblivion system that the development team completely changed things for Skyrim; which is a good thing. I feel vindicated.

And as somebody who enjoyed toying with alchemy and the magic system, I will say that it was a darned pain in the ass. If you didn't have problems with it more power to ya, of course - but quite a lot of people spent quite a lot of time talking about that very feature.

You can even Google "Oblivion leveling" or "Oblivion efficient leveling" to get some ideas.

 

[Kinguendo]

Please be joking. Please be joking. Please for the love of all that is good and holy, along with all that is evil and demonic, be joking.

Wrong again, you are on a roll. Stop stalling with non-replies and admit that you are WRONG.

 

[triggrhappy94]

The leveling trait system wasn't great. But I prefer leveling your skills this way, because you can actually raise all (or most) of your skills to 100, and not have to wait until you level to do so.

 

[Jumplion]

I enjoyed the leveling system, though it was really easy to abuse it by grinding. The new leveling system in Skyrim doesn't seem to stray too far off Oblivion's, though there are some minor changes to it as far as I've seen.

 

[The Gnome King]

Played Oblivion. Liked it; hated the leveling system. I should NOT have to sit in a corner blocking with my shield while a giant rat attacks me over and over in order to raise my "endurance" trait.

I fear sir you've been missing the point - you don't raise your trait artificially by 'doing it your way' - you raise your traits organically by doing whatever you require; and the enemies scale with you. So you don't have to grindtastic your face off.

No, I think you're missing the point... when trying to raise your traits "organically" as you put it, if you ignore the "grinding for attributes" often the enemies would scale to be much more powerful than you, combat wise, by level 10 or so.

I'll spell it out again:
Let's say you level a character mainly using, say, running and jumping and alchemy. You pick them as major attributes or whatever. By level 10 you have NO endurance or strength upgrades, but the enemies - oh, they sure as heck do. You *have* to watch what attributes you are raising - in particular, endurance for health value - which is raised by such inane things as blocking and letting yourself get hit while wearing armor.

I'm not the only person who felt this way, sir. I am one of many people who had problems with the Oblivion leveling system, and I was simply asking a question as to if they fixed this issue with Skyrim. If you read the entire thread I think you will find, sir, that they have indeed fixed this problem and that the game will be released with a new leveling system to address the issues of Oblivion.

Here's a link:

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Leveling

Here's a quote from the link:

The fact that monsters and other enemies level up at the same time as your character leads to the "leveling problem". If you make poor choices in leveling up, your character will become weaker than the monsters as your level progresses. Therefore the game will become harder rather than easier, even though you would expect the game to be easier for high-level characters.
There are several strategies for overcoming the leveling problem. One is to never let your character sleep, and therefore your character will never level up (as described at Under Leveling). Another is to just decrease the game's difficulty slider.

Now, given that I didn't write the article or ANY of the articles in the Oblivion Wiki it would stand to reason that the fact "The Oblivion Leveling Problem" exists as a term you can Google would lend credence to my statement that it was 1) a problem and 2) many people disliked it. This is further backed up by 3) the admittance of the development team that there WERE problems with the leveling system and the fact that they FIXED it for Skyrim.

But thank you, sir, for your input.

 

[The Gnome King]

I enjoyed the leveling system, though it was really easy to abuse it by grinding. The new leveling system in Skyrim doesn't seem to stray too far off Oblivion's, though there are some minor changes to it as far as I've seen.

One HUGE thing is that there are no more major/minor skills - this will go a long way to alleviating the problem that I was talking about. Looks like they have streamlined the system to make it more invisible, too. We'll have to see when it comes out if standing in a corner and spamming a spell still is the way to power-level.

 

[Kinguendo]

Please be joking. Please be joking. Please for the love of all that is good and holy, along with all that is evil and demonic, be joking.

Wrong again, you are on a roll. Stop stalling with non-replies and admit that you are WRONG.

No, I will admit one thing though. That I am talking to a fucking retard and got fooled into thinking that they were mentally competent. Attempting to sound smug when they have the reading comprehension of a gnat. I mean you have to be pretty fucking retarded to think

there is no "mastering" wanting to use solely swords and shields .

was talking about how going swords is obviously what you did as opposed to just an example.

Dont worry, I wont report you. When faced with your own inadequacies, it is only natural to be enraged and reject them. I understood exactly what you were saying as you wrote it... you might have a point if I thought you were claiming I liked mayonnaise.

It was you who said there was a specific way of playing that meant you didnt have to have all 5s AND that I was doing it, you quite clearly state that you know what my interests are directly before the "sword and shield accusation". The only example this could be is an example of my interests as that is the context you had literally just created... and as I said, thats an assumption you made falsely.

 

[mike1921]

. you might have a point if I thought you were claiming I liked mayonnaise..

Well I am reporting you. You are either trolling or have no business posting without adult supervision. But just incase

It was you who said there was a specific way of playing that meant you didnt have to have all 5s AND that I was doing it, you quite clearly state that you know what my interests are directly before the "sword and shield accusation".

No, I implied there were specific WAYS of playing that you didn't have all 3s (you don't need all 5s all you need is 3s). When was it said that there was a single way.

 

[ninja51]

Best to type skyrim into a search engine before making a whole topic. You'll get the information you'll want after like 2 minutes, and the bulk of that is the laoding time of pages

 

[Jumplion]

I enjoyed the leveling system, though it was really easy to abuse it by grinding. The new leveling system in Skyrim doesn't seem to stray too far off Oblivion's, though there are some minor changes to it as far as I've seen.

One HUGE thing is that there are no more major/minor skills - this will go a long way to alleviating the problem that I was talking about. Looks like they have streamlined the system to make it more invisible, too. We'll have to see when it comes out if standing in a corner and spamming a spell still is the way to power-level.

Yeah, they have done that, though I do worry that it is being oversimplified. Not "dumbed down", but simplified, and while it may give way to a more streamlined experience, I think I'll miss a few certain skills (is alchemy still in? I'm gonna mortar the shit out of my pestle if it's still in).

 

[Kinguendo]

. you might have a point if I thought you were claiming I liked mayonnaise..

Well I am reporting you. You are either trolling or have no business posting without adult supervision. But just incase

It was you who said there was a specific way of playing that meant you didnt have to have all 5s AND that I was doing it, you quite clearly state that you know what my interests are directly before the "sword and shield accusation".

No, I implied there were specific WAYS of playing that you didn't have all 3s (you don't need all 5s all you need is 3s). When was it said that there was a single way.

You appear to have dropped your argument here... care to drop the semantics and get back to the point?

 

[espressojet]

all you had to do was google: skyrim leveling and then click the very first link