'Slut' Parade

[Epic Fail 1977]

Now I'm really confused. I'm not intentionally being an idiot, I just don't get where you're coming from.

Point 1: Rape is usually extremely painful.
Point 2: The vast majority of people do not find pain 'mentally stimulating'.

Point 3: The vagina is not very sensitive.
Point 4: The vast majority of people are unable to have orgasms purely from vaginal contact.

Conclusion: Vaginal rape does not produce orgasms on the scale you are describing.

If you want to try and convince me otherwise, you're going to need to show me some evidence describing how an organ which in most cases is incapable of getting a person to orgasm at all is suddenly able to do so while in a state of extreme pain.

It is possible such a phenomenon exists, but your suggestion is just that it happens not through some quirk of physiology, which might actually be convincing, but that women fundamentally enjoy getting raped. Your evidence is the existence of rape fantasies. I'm sorry, but unless you can prove a conclusive link here, your argument has zero validity.

I've said a lot. Which part(s) did you want reference(s) for?

I want evidence that 25% of women who are raped experience orgasm.

I want a description of the sample, the way in which the information was gathered, and the analysis.

Most of all, I want a reference for your assertion of a correlation between rape fantasies and this phenomenon beyond 'occams razor', which by the way you are using completely incorrectly. Even were you not, however, occams razor is not a proof, it it a method for allocating the burden of proof, and right now the burden of proof is still incumbent on you to demonstrate any case whatsoever for this hypothesis you have.

I gave my references above for the 50% stats. I'm sorry but I really can't remember where I read 25%, and the Google I just did turned up numbers that were all over the place. It wouldn't make any difference anyway. Some people aren't liking what I'm saying and are asking for "proof" in an attempt to "win" the argument, but I already stated that I have no proof (no amount of stats could prove this, it's psychology ffs) and even if I produced it, it clearly wouldn't make any difference. I've stated my opinions and why I believe them to be true. Nobody else has produced jack shit by way of a counter-argument, unless you count the existence of the autonomous nervous system which is pretty fucking ridiculous given that 10% of women can't orgasm at all, and some women can orgasm without any physical stimulation whatsoever.

 

[Dys]

I think you've totally missed the point of the article, I support them on this. They should be able to choose how they dress without the worry of being raped.

Absolutely agree. There's no sense in vilify sexually promiscuous ladys, I'd be pissed if society villanised me for enjoying casual sex.

 

[Belated]

The police shouldn't be discouraging alternate lifestyles. Those who trade freedom for safety deserve neither.

The quote is "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety deserve neither Liberty nor Safety". And while I don?t believe in all that ?asking for it? crap how you dress is not an essential Liberty.

Don't get technical with me. Just because it's not an "essential" liberty (which is subjective by the way. I could make the argument that it is one, but that's beside the point), the fact remains that it should still be a right, and that people shouldn't be afraid to do it just because crime might happen. I like how you ignored the rest of my post that expanded on my argument and backed it up quite well, just to zero in on this one flaw so small that even a microscope couldn't see it.

I?ve read the rest of your past and you?re right I just wanted point that mistake out.

Oh... well... now I feel like a jackass. Wow. That's what I get for jumping to conclusions. Well then, I apologize.

 

[agrajagthetesty]

...but you do realize that the dudes don't know that right?

It may be a difference between the male and female mind but when i get dressed up and walk around, even if its for something completely unsocial, i want girls to look.

maybe its hormones+being in my early 20's talking but i kind of expect and look forward to it when i dress up because i know i will get a higher female attention level than average (admittedly that means going form 1 to 5 but still)

I never considered that line of thought, maybe its because i'm a dude or maybe because i'm only a 6 (8 on a good day) but i never even considered that.

I might have to try the whole dressing up to go online thing though.

Sure, I imagine that at least some men don't understand this. Guy Jackson clearly doesn't, for one. That's why I'm trying to explain it to him.

It may be a difference between men and women, or a difference in our cultures, or even just a difference between you and me. Whatever the reason, I'd just like to qualify here that I think your attitude is fine as well. Makes perfect sense for a straight person to want to dress up to impress the opposite sex. It's just that lots of people in this thread were making very sweeping, universal statements about the motives behind dressing up nicely, which I wanted to counter.

I'd recommend it. Makes surfing the net feel like more of an occasion.

 

[Epic Fail 1977]

And feel free to point me in the right direction, but I've only found one scientific study being cited in this thread. It was from a journal published in 1988. Sorry, but that's a little too old to be relevant.

1988 is too old to be relevant? Wow, I really am getting old.

 

[JonnWood]

Wow, The Escapist has surprised me again. I knew this place was a bit of a sausage fest but I never thought we had this much sexism :-/

Clearly you haven't been reading the Brink or Other M threads haha.

I'd really, really like to know why some people are so obsessed with getting their parkour gunwoman on.

I'm more curious about why some other people are obsessed with others *not* getting their parkour gunwoman on.

Not that I'm against the idea, I just don't agree with the decision to not purchase the entire game because there aren't girls in it. Hopefully, they'll be in Brink 2.

So you're trying to cover the numbers you made up by making up more numbers? Wow. Just, wow.

Also, the fact that you appear to be conflating arousal and orgasm, combined with other assumptions you appear to be making about the possibility of orgasm through penetrative-only sex, indicates to me that you don't have a lot of personal experience re: female orgasms.

*snerk*

The police shouldn't be discouraging alternate lifestyles. Those who trade freedom for safety deserve neither.

The quote is "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety deserve neither Liberty nor Safety". And while I don?t believe in all that ?asking for it? crap how you dress is not an essential Liberty.

Franklin was a smart man, but Freedom and Safety are diametrically opposed. The more you have of one, the less you have of the other.

I kinda wonder how many of the people who use that quote enjoyed the Dark Knight, which makes a really big point about freedom vs. safety.

 

[conflictofinterests]

I gave my references above for the 50% stats. I'm sorry but I really can't remember where I read 25%, and the Google I just did turned up numbers that were all over the place. It wouldn't make any difference anyway. Some people aren't liking what I'm saying and are asking for "proof" in an attempt to "win" the argument, but I already stated that I have no proof (no amount of stats could prove this, it's psychology ffs) and even if I produced it, it clearly wouldn't make any difference. I've stated my opinions and why I believe them to be true. Nobody else has produced jack shit by way of a counter-argument, unless you count the existence of the autonomous nervous system which is pretty fucking ridiculous given that 10% of women can't orgasm at all.

For the sake of argument, I'll accept the statistics of 50% of women having rape fantasies and 50% of women having orgasm during vaginal sex. I don't think your statistics took into account the number of women who had rape fantasies but wish never to be raped. I am almost certain the previous calculation was inaccurate because of this.

(Also leaving out, for the sake of argument, rape victims may not be a representative sample of the population, as well as that rape can include acts in addition to vaginal intercourse.)

 

[maninahat]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-13333013

So these women are proud of being sluts, think that there is nothing wrong with acting in that way, and rather then listening to advice on how to avoid rape, they want to protest?

Does anyone else find this type of behavior ridiculous and shows how warped/hedonistic parts of Western society is becoming?

Perhaps they are making an issue of gender double standards: a promiscuous man is a "stud", and is often treated by his peers as cool for it. A promiscuous women on the other hand is a "slut" and is considered the worst thing possible. In otherwords, a woman can't enjoy herself like a man without being seen in a negative light.

 

[ezeroast]

Meh good on them, How the fuck can you blame the woman who is raped for being raped? Even if you dress in nothing at all and get raped... ummm you still got raped by a rapist.
Stop blaming the victim.

 

[Crazy_Man_42]

If they want to dress the way they do they can but if their blaming their clothing for being rape is just well, being lazy.

If they don't want to get rape then KEEP A TAZER OR GUN WITH YOU OR LEARN A MARTIAL ART. It's called self-defense ladies it's a better way to stop rape then protesting about it.

 

[Kahunaburger]

snip

I gave my references above for the 50% stats. I'm sorry but I really can't remember where I read 25%, and the Google I just did turned up numbers that were all over the place. It wouldn't make any difference anyway. Some people aren't liking what I'm saying and are asking for "proof" in an attempt to "win" the argument, but I already stated that I have no proof (no amount of stats could prove this, it's psychology ffs) and even if I produced it, it clearly wouldn't make any difference. I've stated my opinions and why I believe them to be true. Nobody else has produced jack shit by way of a counter-argument, unless you count the existence of the autonomous nervous system which is pretty fucking ridiculous given that 10% of women can't orgasm at all, and some women can orgasm without any physical stimulation whatsoever.

No, they've provided several well-reasoned critiques of your arguments, which you, for whatever reason chose not to address completely. The reason why your arguments have been met with such universal opposition is that they are:
A. insanely offensive,
B. obviously incorrect to any Escapist that has had a female orgasm or given a woman an orgasm.

 

[WouldYouKindly]

Nothing like standing against the double standard society has set. Men are praised for having lots of sex with different women but women are chastised for sexual promiscuity.

Basically, go for it girls, equality in expectations.

 

[JonnWood]

By contrast, women are exalted for refraining from sex, while men are mocked and denigrated. For some reason, a lot of the people crusading against the whole "dressing like sluts" thing seem to have no complaint about that.

 

[JonnWood]

No, they've provided several well-reasoned critiques of your arguments, which you, for whatever reason chose not to address completely. The reason why your arguments have been met with such universal opposition is that they are:
A. insanely offensive,
B. obviously incorrect to any Escapist that has had a female orgasm or given a woman an orgasm.

Heck, I'm a dude waiting until marriage, and I'm still facepalming.

 

[Jimbo1212]

Perhaps they are making an issue of gender double standards: a promiscuous man is a "stud", and is often treated by his peers as cool for it. A promiscuous women on the other hand is a "slut" and is considered the worst thing possible. In otherwords, a woman can't enjoy herself like a man without being seen in a negative light.

Well firstly a 'stud' is a bit of an urban myth as many studs are looked down upon by everyone - look at Jersey Shore. Would you call them studs or douches?
Secondly, nature is involved in this decision. Men can go around nailing anyone with little consequences, and of course women can not as they get pregnant. Therefore men have evolved to be more open about sex were as women have not and become more attached to a partner. Check google scholar if you want some proof.

Either way, a stud or a slut is a bad thing as it shows that the person can not have a relationship and is either very insecure and/or hedonistic. To try to justify it is ludicrous and proves places like Iran to be right when it comes to Western standards.

 

[JonnWood]

If they want to dress the way they do they can but if their blaming their clothing for being rape is just well, being lazy.

No, they're protesting the people who blame their clothing for the rapes.

If they don't want to get rape then KEEP A TAZER OR GUN WITH YOU OR LEARN A MARTIAL ART. It's called self-defense ladies it's a better way to stop rape then protesting about it.

Most rapes are committed by someone the victim knows personally, such as a spouse, boyfriend, or relative. The people you don't keep your guard up around.

 

[artanis_neravar]

They can dress how ever they want, they just have to acknowledge that there are some sick fucked up people out there who can and will try to rape them given the chance, it's not the girls fault there is a good chance that they would have been raped if they were more "appropriately" dressed, but still in the same place at the same time with those same sick fucked up people.

 

[JonnWood]

Perhaps they are making an issue of gender double standards: a promiscuous man is a "stud", and is often treated by his peers as cool for it. A promiscuous women on the other hand is a "slut" and is considered the worst thing possible. In otherwords, a woman can't enjoy herself like a man without being seen in a negative light.

Well firstly a 'stud' is a bit of an urban myth as many studs are looked down upon by everyone - look at Jersey Shore. Would you call them studs or douches?
Secondly, nature is involved in this decision. Men can go around nailing anyone with little consequences, and of course women can not as they get pregnant. Therefore men have evolved to be more open about sex were as women have not and become more attached to a partner. Check google scholar if you want some proof.

Either way, a stud or a slut is a bad thing as it shows that the person can not have a relationship and is either very insecure and/or hedonistic. To try to justify it is ludicrous and proves places like Iran to be right when it comes to Western standards.

Hello, I am a conservative Christian.

You are wrong.

Sincerely,

 

[Terminal Blue]

Penis goes in, then out, then in. Orgasm happens.

Or is there something I'm not understanding about what happens during rape? My thought of how it worked was that orgasming was kinda like peeing, where you could delay it or something, but sooner or later it's gonna cum out.

Wow.. I'm told you don't get much sex education in the states, but..

An orgasm is an autonomic response, it's thought to be quite similar to a sneeze in fact. It's the culmination of what is called the 'sexual response cycle', which is a series of physiological changes people undergo when they're sexually aroused and stimulated.

The sexual response cycle is incredibly individualistic. People can require radically different levels of excitement and stimulation in order to orgasm. Generally and in popular culture, the common male experience is that of orgasming in every sexual encounter, usually quite quickly (within 2 minutes of penetration), hence the emphasis being on 'delaying orgasm'. A significant number of men, however, take a lot longer or even can't achieve climax at all through penetrative sex (I'll admit to being one of them, not that I'm complaining).

For women, the general experience is very different because their primary sexual organ (the clitoris) is not heavily stimulated at all during penetrative sex. Thus, most women cannot physically have an orgasm purely from being penetrated. This is why foreplay is so important in most people's sexual experience, because it not only allows the woman to become sufficiently excited to achieve orgasm but also increases the erectness and sensitivity of the clitoris so that it is better stimulated during penetration, making it more likely the woman will achieve orgasm through indirect stimulation.

Some women (not all) reporting having a 'g spot', a point about six inches deep on the inside wall of the vagina which can give them orgasms. More likely, this is a misunderstanding of the nature of the clitoris. The clitoris actually extends right up inside the body, meaning its likely that hitting a particular angle along the inside wall of the vagina can stimulate the clitoris to some degree and possibly even produce orgasms.