So Cuphead then

[Jamcie Kerbizz]

It's a great game and I for one really appreciate, like A LOT, the fact that no enemies show any sign of taking damage until they go puff. This lets this game be really small children friendly (while retaining grim story and adorable theme) and given it requires fair ammount of practice it is an absolutely awsome game to play with your kids togeather. It has enough challange to not be a boring chore to a parent but isn't a brick wall to face plant into for a 3 yo. Sure they may not finish most of the stages but the fun is there to them regardless.

 

[Chimpzy_v1legacy]

Looks really pretty, but I've never gotten into run 'n gun games like Contra or Gunstar Heroes. Might pick it up if it gets a big discount sometimes, but for now: pass.

it's the dark souls of videogames

Can't wait for it to grow a fanbase of lovely people with more time than sense to tell everyone to 'git gud, scrub'.

There probably already are.

 

[Jamcie Kerbizz]

Looks really pretty, but I've never gotten into run 'n gun games like Contra or Gunstar Heroes. Might pick it up if it gets a big discount sometimes, but for now: pass.

it's the dark souls of videogames

Can't wait for it to grow a fanbase of lovely people with more time than sense to tell everyone to 'git gud, scrub'.

There probably already are.

It's already at 33% (19.99 tag) of 'standard' 'tipple eeEeeh?' game price (59.99) these days.

 

[Chimpzy_v1legacy]

snip

It's already at 33% (19.99 tag) of 'standard' 'tipple eeEeeh?' game price (59.99) these days.

Doesn't matter. It's too low on the priority list to consider a full price purchase.

 

[Jamcie Kerbizz]

snip

It's already at 33% (19.99 tag) of 'standard' 'tipple eeEeeh?' game price (59.99) these days.

Doesn't matter. It's too low on the priority list to consider a full price purchase.

Sure, I can definetly relate to that. Just ment it as a heads up on actual price, the 3 guys that coded this game, put it up for.

 

[sXeth]

Yeah, toss me in the "Graphics are aesthetically awesome, but kind of overpower the gameplay in bad ways" camp.

Other then clutter, which folks have mentioned. The main indicator of a hit is a brief flicker. But everything has a film grain/flicker over it to give it the old timey vibe, which can start to overlap fast. You can pick it out obviously, but its one more obscuring bit on the flurry of stuff on screen at any given time.

 

[Potjeslatinist]

I would like a skip button for the boss fights.

 

[TheMysteriousGX]

I would like a skip button for the boss fights.

That said: sure, why not? I like the art style, and would like to see more of it.

 

[maninahat]

I would like a skip button for the boss fights.

That said: sure, why not? I like the art style, and would like to see more of it.

My wife loves Max Fleischer type cartoons, but there is no way on god's green earth she has the skill, nor the time and patience to a acquire them, to last more than a few seconds. That sadly means she's relegated to sitting and watching, rather than getting to take part.

I'm having a lot of fun with it myself though.

 

[Silentpony_v1legacy]

I'll get it when it comes to the PS4 as part of some indie bundle. No way I'd pay full price for that, let alone on Steam or go out and get a Xbone.

 

[CritialGaming]

I'll get it when it comes to the PS4 as part of some indie bundle. No way I'd pay full price for that, let alone on Steam or go out and get a Xbone.

You consider 20 bucks full price? I mean your cash value is your cash value, but I feel like 20 is a more than fair price for the game and don't understand the "wait for a sale" folks. I'd understand if it was 30+ bucks, but 20 is perfect imo for what you get.

 

[Silentpony_v1legacy]

I'll get it when it comes to the PS4 as part of some indie bundle. No way I'd pay full price for that, let alone on Steam or go out and get a Xbone.

You consider 20 bucks full price? I mean your cash value is your cash value, but I feel like 20 is a more than fair price for the game and don't understand the "wait for a sale" folks. I'd understand if it was 30+ bucks, but 20 is perfect imo for what you get.

I don't pay full price across the board. $80, $60, $20 whatever. I never believe any game can justify its retail price.

 

[CritialGaming]

I'll get it when it comes to the PS4 as part of some indie bundle. No way I'd pay full price for that, let alone on Steam or go out and get a Xbone.

You consider 20 bucks full price? I mean your cash value is your cash value, but I feel like 20 is a more than fair price for the game and don't understand the "wait for a sale" folks. I'd understand if it was 30+ bucks, but 20 is perfect imo for what you get.

I don't pay full price across the board. $80, $60, $20 whatever. I never believe any game can justify its retail price.

I.....uh...what...? Dude I...err...I feel like that is...Wait. What? Okay hold up. What does a game need to do to justify a specific price?

For example how cheap does a 60 dollar title need to get to be "justified"? 40? 20? Like what quantifiers do you use to determine when a game is worth your money?

I mean Cuphead is a 14 hour experience by the time the average person gets through it. And a movie would cost about the same price for only 2 hours of experience. So that is how I sort of measure value over time.

 

[Silentpony_v1legacy]

I'll get it when it comes to the PS4 as part of some indie bundle. No way I'd pay full price for that, let alone on Steam or go out and get a Xbone.

You consider 20 bucks full price? I mean your cash value is your cash value, but I feel like 20 is a more than fair price for the game and don't understand the "wait for a sale" folks. I'd understand if it was 30+ bucks, but 20 is perfect imo for what you get.

I don't pay full price across the board. $80, $60, $20 whatever. I never believe any game can justify its retail price.

I.....uh...what...? Dude I...err...I feel like that is...Wait. What? Okay hold up. What does a game need to do to justify a specific price?

For example how cheap does a 60 dollar title need to get to be "justified"? 40? 20? Like what quantifiers do you use to determine when a game is worth your money?

I mean Cuphead is a 14 hour experience by the time the average person gets through it. And a movie would cost about the same price for only 2 hours of experience. So that is how I sort of measure value over time.

Who cares about the length of a game?! If that's our metric, then wow are games under-priced! I'm still playing Apotheon I got for like $10! I should have paid $50! According to Steam I've put 116 hours into Bioshock Infinite and 753 into Dawn of War 2. What's a fair price then? $232 for Infinite at 2 bucks an hour, and maybe $2,259 for DoW2 at 3 bucks an hour?

Length doesn't matter. Having shit to do matters. To me there's more value in 10mins with say...Stanley's Parable or Apotheon than there is in 5 hours of WOW or GTA #.

I don't buy into hype-culture or marketing spins. And the price is set by marketers, and by definition I don't believe them. I assume they're at best misleading, at worst lying, to get me to buy their product. And in their defense Cuphead does look legitimately fun. But because they told me they value it at $20 I assume that's too high a price.

 

[CritialGaming]

Who cares about the length of a game?! If that's our metric, then wow are games under-priced! I'm still playing Apotheon I got for like $10! I should have paid $50! According to Steam I've put 116 hours into Bioshock Infinite and 753 into Dawn of War 2. What's a fair price then? $232 for Infinite at 2 bucks an hour, and maybe $2,259 for DoW2 at 3 bucks an hour?

Length doesn't matter. Having shit to do matters. To me there's more value in 10mins with say...Stanley's Parable or Apotheon than there is in 5 hours of WOW or GTA #.

I don't buy into hype-culture or marketing spins. And the price is set by marketers, and by definition I don't believe them. I assume they're at best misleading, at worst lying, to get me to buy their product. And in their defense Cuphead does look legitimately fun. But because they told me they value it at $20 I assume that's too high a price.

So what would you value a game like Final Fantasy XV? Or The Witcher 3? Or Shovel Knight? What game would be worth the full 60 bucks to you if it's about fun? What about Civilization? I just don't understand your metric. How can you quantify fun, before you've purchased the game and therefore how can you possibly determine what the price drop needs to be to fulfill your "fun" quota?

It just seems like a jaded stance to have towards entertainment. Especially considering it is the kind of attitude that would explain why publishers feel the need to add milking Microtransactions into the game as that would allow them to make money back on people who buy the game on sale or cheaper than initial market price.

 

[Silentpony_v1legacy]

Who cares about the length of a game?! If that's our metric, then wow are games under-priced! I'm still playing Apotheon I got for like $10! I should have paid $50! According to Steam I've put 116 hours into Bioshock Infinite and 753 into Dawn of War 2. What's a fair price then? $232 for Infinite at 2 bucks an hour, and maybe $2,259 for DoW2 at 3 bucks an hour?

Length doesn't matter. Having shit to do matters. To me there's more value in 10mins with say...Stanley's Parable or Apotheon than there is in 5 hours of WOW or GTA #.

I don't buy into hype-culture or marketing spins. And the price is set by marketers, and by definition I don't believe them. I assume they're at best misleading, at worst lying, to get me to buy their product. And in their defense Cuphead does look legitimately fun. But because they told me they value it at $20 I assume that's too high a price.

So what would you value a game like Final Fantasy XV? Or The Witcher 3? Or Shovel Knight? What game would be worth the full 60 bucks to you if it's about fun? What about Civilization? I just don't understand your metric. How can you quantify fun, before you've purchased the game and therefore how can you possibly determine what the price drop needs to be to fulfill your "fun" quota?

It just seems like a jaded stance to have towards entertainment. Especially considering it is the kind of attitude that would explain why publishers feel the need to add milking Microtransactions into the game as that would allow them to make money back on people who buy the game on sale or cheaper than initial market price.

Oh please. The industry uses micro-transactions as a way to put a limitless cap on their profits. No one really thinks that poor WB or Konami are so strapped for cash they need season passes and enough DLC to double the price of a game to break even. What was the line on RE6, that it needed to sell 5+million copies to justify it's cost. And people really believed that?! Bullshit.

Or to go to Jim's video today, Mordor 2 has enough DLC and extra content to put its price at $110+, not $60.
So there's really only two scenarios with that: 1. Monolith spent a huge amount of money on the game, and need a $110+ price to make a profit, and broke the game down into a DLC vector priced for $60 to sucker people in so they'll buy the DLC never realizing the real price of the game.
Or 2. The game isn't worth what Monolith thinks it really is, and they're just up-charging everyone because they can. Because people think length of game = quality = cash.

I mean how much money do you think Clash of Clans pulls in? Candy Crush? Pokemon Go?! Think they turned a profit? How much do you think they spent making those games to need to put microtransactions in?

As far as Witcher 3, Shovel Knight and FF15, couldn't tell ya'. Never played them. Not games I'm interested in, so I wouldn't guess what they'd be worth to me.

Here's a good rule of thumb: A few weeks down the line all AAA titles go on sale. So the epic long lasting $110 Mordor 2 experience suddenly isn't worth as much. The game is the same, but suddenly Monolith feels comfortable charging less. If they were convinced of the game's quality to justify its price, they'd never lower the price. Why sell a quality good for cheap when the quality allows for a larger price? If its quality, people will pay that price happily.
A sale means the original price was higher than what they thought the game was worth.

 

[Cycloptomese]

Who cares about the length of a game?! If that's our metric, then wow are games under-priced! I'm still playing Apotheon I got for like $10! I should have paid $50! According to Steam I've put 116 hours into Bioshock Infinite and 753 into Dawn of War 2. What's a fair price then? $232 for Infinite at 2 bucks an hour, and maybe $2,259 for DoW2 at 3 bucks an hour?

Length doesn't matter. Having shit to do matters. To me there's more value in 10mins with say...Stanley's Parable or Apotheon than there is in 5 hours of WOW or GTA #.

I don't buy into hype-culture or marketing spins. And the price is set by marketers, and by definition I don't believe them. I assume they're at best misleading, at worst lying, to get me to buy their product. And in their defense Cuphead does look legitimately fun. But because they told me they value it at $20 I assume that's too high a price.

So what would you value a game like Final Fantasy XV? Or The Witcher 3? Or Shovel Knight? What game would be worth the full 60 bucks to you if it's about fun? What about Civilization? I just don't understand your metric. How can you quantify fun, before you've purchased the game and therefore how can you possibly determine what the price drop needs to be to fulfill your "fun" quota?

It just seems like a jaded stance to have towards entertainment. Especially considering it is the kind of attitude that would explain why publishers feel the need to add milking Microtransactions into the game as that would allow them to make money back on people who buy the game on sale or cheaper than initial market price.

Oh please. The industry uses micro-transactions as a way to put a limitless cap on their profits. No one really thinks that poor WB or Konami are so strapped for cash they need season passes and enough DLC to double the price of a game to break even. What was the line on RE6, that it needed to sell 5+million copies to justify it's cost. And people really believed that?! Bullshit.

Or to go to Jim's video today, Mordor 2 has enough DLC and extra content to put its price at $110+, not $60.
So there's really only two scenarios with that: 1. Monolith spent a huge amount of money on the game, and need a $110+ price to make a profit, and broke the game down into a DLC vector priced for $60 to sucker people in so they'll buy the DLC never realizing the real price of the game.
Or 2. The game isn't worth what Monolith thinks it really is, and they're just up-charging everyone because they can. Because people think length of game = quality = cash.

I mean how much money do you think Clash of Clans pulls in? Candy Crush? Pokemon Go?! Think they turned a profit? How much do you think they spent making those games to need to put microtransactions in?

As far as Witcher 3, Shovel Knight and FF15, couldn't tell ya'. Never played them. Not games I'm interested in, so I wouldn't guess what they'd be worth to me.

Here's a good rule of thumb: A few weeks down the line all AAA titles go on sale. So the epic long lasting $110 Mordor 2 experience suddenly isn't worth as much. The game is the same, but suddenly Monolith feels comfortable charging less. If they were convinced of the game's quality to justify its price, they'd never lower the price. Why sell a quality good for cheap when the quality allows for a larger price? If its quality, people will pay that price happily.
A sale means the original price was higher than what they thought the game was worth.

I'm pretty sure that what Silent Pony is trying to say is that they never pay full price for a game. My dad does the same thing with everything. Also, there's nothing wrong with that. Also, also, dad's stacking some serious cash.

 

[CritialGaming]

A sale means the original price was higher than what they thought the game was worth.

That's not at all what a sale means. Where in the world did you get that idea?

Sales are basic economics. The biggest wave of purchases on a game are in the first two to three weeks. When the fans of the IP, people looking forward to the game, and new game shoppers are finished buying up however many copies they are going to total out too, the game has reached it's peak sale volume for full price.

Then what happens is that the game will then go on sale a couple months or so down the line, attracting those buyers that were on the fence originally that now see the game as a deal since it's on 30% off or whatever.

Then you get a standard price cut. Where they mark the retail price of the game down to say 49 or 39 dollars. This picks up on the buyers who didn't get it in time on the sale price.

Then finally you start seeing those deep steam sales, and further market downs when the game is about a year old and it simply can't attract attention any longer in the sea of a years worth of new games come out.

This is the same basic sale system that almost every retailer on the planet uses. The difference between physical stores and a video game, is that physical products are finite. After a physical product goes out for it's initial sale, retailers mark down the price of whatever is left in order to clear out the unwanted inventory.

Additionally sales happen at the end of the tax year because the more inventory that a store has at the end of the year, the more they have to pay in tax on that inventory. So they would rather sell shit cheaply instead of having to pay taxes on it. This applies to all U.S. retailers including Gamestop and Steam. Which is why you often see a shitload of sales in March-April. Digital codes count as inventory as far as Steam is concerned.



As for game value...The retail price on a game has nothing to do with the value the publishers deem the game is worth. The games industry has a set standard for retail pricing, which they are rapidly trying to fuck with. It all has to do with the budget of a game's development and how many expected copies are guaranteed to be sold.

For example if a game like Shadow of War cost 50 Million dollars to make. And they project 2 million guaranteed to sell? Can they make their money back by charging $20? Obviously no. But at $60 a pop they would make their money back plus enough to fund another 50 million dollar game, plus a bit of profit to pay around to the execs.

(Note for the above example I'm not talking about the greedy extra bullshit that legendary $110 versions and lootboxes bring into the mix)

Now Cuphead obviously didn't have a 50 million dollar budget. More likely it was under 1 million. so it not only requires far less copies to be sold to make money, but each copy doesn't have to sell for a high price to begin with. Thus the $20 price tag.

The value of gaming (especially AAA gaming) has been the same for a long long time. If games in the PS2 era were worth 60 bucks. Then today's games should be worth far more as your average experience is far better looking, and far more in depth that anything from 2 generations ago.