So why did someone expressing their freedom of speech become unpopular?

[Grand_Pamplemousse]

Yeah, but didn't Nick Griffin also deny that the Holocaust ever happend?

There's freedom of speech and there's just plain ignorance.

Aren't we allowed to believe whatever the hell we like? Come on, religion isn't too different.

So you're compairing "religion" to "denying the Holocaust"?

I'm Christain myself, but that doesn't mean I deny the theory of evolution or the Spanish inquisition. Denying the Holocaust is like denying the Hiroshima bomb or the Vietnam war. If you "agree" with what happend in the Holocaust, okay. But just stone cold refusing to believe it is f*cking childish.

I always find it weird that nazi sympathisers deny the holocaust. Shouldn't they be glad that it happend and use it as there personel anthem?

I can compare religion to believing in fairies. Or the magical moon people from beyond the stars. Religion has no bases in fact, if I were to believe in a magical man who can make everything okay (God) then why not Fairies? None of these things can be proved so surely belief in one is just the same as belief in the other?

What I'm saying here is that I wont stop you believing whatever you want. I'm not gonna stop you believing in your God, just let other people believe what they wanna believe.

Saying the Holocaust didn't happen isn't hurting anyone.

 

[Spitfire]

They only want to mix and associate with white "native" English people, and for what reason would this be? I can think of no area or circumstance in which white English people are different from black or Asian people (who may or may not be English) other than in their skin colour.

If we're talking about native African or native Asian people, then what about culture? That is a huge difference, which could serve as the defining factor in this case, and there's nothing racist about ethnocentrism per se.
I'm not saying this is the case or not, as I'm not very knowledgeable on the subject, but it's something to keep in mind.

Sure there probably will be cultural differences, but again, they are not so vast that they should cause someone to be excluded from joining a political party

It's their right to have whatever policies they want, and if they want to keep a close ethnic group, it's their right to do so.

 

[Crimson Cade]

I really don't see a problem with allowing utter and total free speech. Let people make complete idiots of themselves, so the rest of us can save time and avoid/ignore them from the start.

Remove a basic rights and equality for the unpopular, and... well, I am sure we have all read "Animal Farm".

Enforced anti-fascism = fascism. If nothing but the politically correct is to be tolerated, then political correctness is the new flavor of fascism.

 

[MortisLegio]

mainly because people have the "Im right your wrong" complex

 

[Aerodyamic]

I can compare religion to believing in fairies. Or the magical moon people from beyond the stars. Religion has no bases in fact, if I were to believe in a magical man who can make everything okay (God) then why not Fairies? None of these things can be proved so surely belief in one is just the same as belief in the other?

What I'm saying here is that I wont stop you believing whatever you want. I'm not gonna stop you believing in your God, just let other people believe what they wanna believe.

Saying the Holocaust didn't happen isn't hurting anyone.

1. Comparing Religion to The Kingdom of the Moon is fine, as long as you realize that faith in the 'Theory of Evolution' is fair game, within that exact comparison structure. Evolution, while a better proven theory than the 'theory of the existence of God/YHVH/Allah/Buddha/etc.', is still just a theory, as it hasn't been PROVEN in it's entirety.

2. You're completely welcome to believe ANYTHING you want, provided that you don't expect to be allowed to spew any of it in public without being considered a loon. Feel free to assume that I have pointed and laughed.

3. Denying the Holocaust is slapping 6 million dead peoples memory, then corn-holing them with a rusty rake. If you substitute the ethnic identifier 'Jewish' for 'British', you'd have a different opinion, wouldn't you? And before you get any stupider, no, I'm not Jewish.

 

[Spitfire]

I really don't see a problem with allowing utter and total free speech. Let people make complete idiots of themselves, so the rest of us can save time and avoid/ignore them from the start.

Remove a basic rights and equality for the unpopular, and... well, I am sure we have all read "Animal Farm".

Enforced anti-fascism = fascism. If nothing but the politically correct is to be tolerated, then political correctness is the new flavor of fascism.

I wouldn't compare political correctness to fascism, but otherwise, I agree.

 

[Superbeast]

They only want to mix and associate with white "native" English people, and for what reason would this be? I can think of no area or circumstance in which white English people are different from black or Asian people (who may or may not be English) other than in their skin colour.

If we're talking about native African or native Asian people, then what about culture? That is a huge difference, which could serve as the defining factor in this case, and there's nothing racist about ethnocentrism per se.
I'm not saying this is the case or not, as I'm not very knowledgeable on the subject, but it's something to keep in mind.

Sure there probably will be cultural differences, but again, they are not so vast that they should cause someone to be excluded from joining a political party

It's their right to have whatever policies they want, and if they want to keep a close ethnic group, it's their right to do so.

No, it's not.

In the UK to be a legitimate and legal political party there is a charter of conduct that the aspiring party must sign and abide by. Refusing a particular ethnic group it is a breech of the charter.

Hence the fact they have been sued (can't remember if it was by the UK government or the EU) and forced to accept members of different ethnic background or lose the legitimacy of the party. Ergo they have to change their constitution.

The fact that many people of a non-British Caucasian ethnicity wouldn't actually want to join the party is irrelevant, the BNP still would theoretically have to accept them - and since (at least at the time of the recording of that Question Time episode, this may have changed since) the party hasn't yet changed it's constitution then it is currently an illegal party - hence many people didn't want it on QT.

 

[cuddly_tomato]

I can compare religion to believing in fairies. Or the magical moon people from beyond the stars. Religion has no bases in fact, if I were to believe in a magical man who can make everything okay (God) then why not Fairies? None of these things can be proved so surely belief in one is just the same as belief in the other?

What I'm saying here is that I wont stop you believing whatever you want. I'm not gonna stop you believing in your God, just let other people believe what they wanna believe.

Saying the Holocaust didn't happen isn't hurting anyone.

1. Comparing Religion to The Kingdom of the Moon is fine, as long as you realize that faith in the 'Theory of Evolution' is fair game, within that exact comparison structure. Evolution, while a better proven theory than the 'theory of the existence of God/YHVH/Allah/Buddha/etc.', is still just a theory, as it hasn't been PROVEN in it's entirety.

2. You're completely welcome to believe ANYTHING you want, provided that you don't expect to be allowed to spew any of it in public without being considered a loon. Feel free to assume that I have pointed and laughed.

In all honesty, do you seriously think you are going to get anywhere with him? The most you could do is making him look foolish, and I doubt you could do a better job of that than he is at the moment.

3. Denying the Holocaust is slapping 6 million dead peoples memory, then corn-holing them with a rusty rake. If you substitute the ethnic identifier 'Jewish' for 'British', you'd have a different opinion, wouldn't you? And before you get any stupider, no, I'm not Jewish.

I would say it is even worse. The holocaust is an example to us all that humans are not gods. There is no secret line that all humans have where they will suddenly become say "enough is enough" and do the right thing. The Nazis in the death camps were family men, with wives and kids. They didn't ask to be evil, but did unspeakable things. The potential to be a monster exists within us all, it is vital that we remember the holocaust so that we don't fall into that trap ourselves.

Let us say, just as an example, a radical racist group became elected in the UK and started rounding up people with "impure" genes - mixed race people in other words - in order to forcibly sterilize them? If such a thing was ever done I for one would fight the system (violently if necessary), even though I am as white as can possibly be (generic red-head here). Someone who thought the holocaust was made up? It is interesting that holocaust deniers tend to be the kind who seem to be advocating fascism.

 

[Spitfire]

They only want to mix and associate with white "native" English people, and for what reason would this be? I can think of no area or circumstance in which white English people are different from black or Asian people (who may or may not be English) other than in their skin colour.

If we're talking about native African or native Asian people, then what about culture? That is a huge difference, which could serve as the defining factor in this case, and there's nothing racist about ethnocentrism per se.
I'm not saying this is the case or not, as I'm not very knowledgeable on the subject, but it's something to keep in mind.

Sure there probably will be cultural differences, but again, they are not so vast that they should cause someone to be excluded from joining a political party

It's their right to have whatever policies they want, and if they want to keep a close ethnic group, it's their right to do so.

No, it's not.

In the UK to be a legitimate and legal political party there is a charter of conduct that the aspiring party must sign and abide by. Refusing a particular ethnic group it is a breech of the charter.

Hence the fact they have been sued (can't remember if it was by the UK government or the EU) and forced to accept members of different ethnic background or lose the legitimacy of the party. Ergo they have to change their constitution.

The fact that many people of a non-British Caucasian ethnicity wouldn't actually want to join the party is irrelevant, the BNP still would theoretically have to accept them - and since (at least at the time of the recording of that Question Time episode, this may have changed since) the party hasn't yet changed it's constitution then it is currently an illegal party - hence many people didn't want it on QT.

You're correct. My argument was based on faulty knowledge. My mistake.

 

[LimeJester]

The BNP are correct about asylum seekers though, asylum seekers are supposed to declare themselves in the closest safe country and that is rarely if ever England or Ireland.

What if all of these people are allergic to any other accent but English / Irish? Therefore the rest of the world would be unsafe for them to live. Haha.

 

[Skeleon]

Well, the protesters also have the right to voice their disagreement and, frankly, dislike.
I don't see anything wrong with what was described in the OP.

 

[The_ModeRazor]

Because fucking degenerates should not be allowed to express their retarded opinions.
A system where the opinion of the local idiot means as much as that of a university graduate doesn't really work.

 

[Finrear]

(b) The British National Party stands for the preservation of the national and ethnic character of the British people and is wholly opposed to any form of racial integration between British and non-European peoples. It is therefore committed to stemming and reversing the tide of non-white immigration and to restoring, by legal changes, negotiation and consent, the overwhelmingly white makeup of the British population that existed in Britain prior to 1948.[/I]

How is that not racist?

How is it racist? They're not stating the supremacy of a specific race. They're not stating that one race is better or worse than another. They're stating that they want their racial heritage to live on and they want to go through legal channels wherewith they can accomplish that goal.

They want their racial heritage to live on. How is that racist?

Read it again, they want to use legal changes, negotiation and consent to evict non white people from the UK. How is that anything but racist?

 

[cuddly_tomato]

You know who had views? Hitler.
You know who had an opinion? Jack the Ripper.
You know what this proves? Absolutely nothing.

BNP is in may respects correct, but don't let anyone hear me; their rightous indignation detectors will go crazy.

Can you be more specific about in which respect this neo fascist party is correct?

 

[Vault boy Eddie]

Because you get teenagers thinking they are big shit, only to proceed to spew racist comments, not knowing a goddamn thing about life, not realizing there opinion doesn't matter. It's always people that matter less in the fabric of society, the ones that can work and don't, just live off the goverment, the ones that just talk to incite violence or stupid fights and or comments, that have the most to say.

 

[Crimson Cade]

sure everyone has the right to free speech but that doesnt mean you MUST like what they say ya know?

EXACTLY! If someone says something you dislike, it is your RIGHT to say so, just like it is their right to say whatever the hell they want. There are laws for slander and misinformation, and that SHOULD be all the restrictions we have.

The attacks on free speech have gone too far already, like the attempts to outlaw criticism of religion. What would be our next step backwards in our social evolution? Women can't talk back to men?

 

[Nickolai77]

I'll give my two cents.

On topic, i imagine most people in western society value free speech and will uphold it. A few anti-facist's will inconstisantly deny the right for facists to express their views, but there just being stupid so we can ignore them.

I believe the BNP are racist, and their theory of preserving the white "indigenous" population is an attempt to rationaly justify their irrational racism.


As a side note the hype the BNP have been getting is ridiculous- yes, of course they where going to do slightly better than usual because the the Government expenses scandal and the economic crisis. However, we've had radical facist parties all through the 20th century, so why all the hype now? I'm just waiting for it to die down and people talk about something else.