I think any company has that subset. I've heard the same said about Bioware fans, Bungee fans, Team ICO fans, even IW fans... lol.AceAngel said:
Some actual real Half Life developments...
- Thread starter MiracleOfSound
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I've heard that said about Bioware fans sometimes (and, like the Valve fan accusation, it DOES have a basis) but Bungie and IW? Seriously?MiracleOfSound said:
I had imagined Valve was a game company producing some of the best characterised FPS.AceAngel said:
And hype?
I lol'd. You're the one who generates hype for yourself. No matter what somebody else's opinion might be, they don't make your opinion for you.
Not many Bioware fans make smart remarks about how Shepard is Jesus and the game is very biblical, nor do Bungie boys confront me about how the game is a delicious irony of humans being the homogeneous ones deep seethed genocide of their own species while an automation union of the aliens brought individuality and harmony to all the species under their control.MiracleOfSound said:
It's not bad that there are intelligent people in the industry and their favorite hobby, it's just perplexing when they think every-single-game of CoD (even the old ones, upto MW1) are piles of crap. Some of them good you know, just because a few bad apples were dropped here and there doesn't mean that suddenly Valve and HL2 are the only games worth paying 60$ for, there are other games.
Yes, Bioware has some bad case of people who protect at all costs (ME1 <-> ME2 comes to mind) but at least they don't act like hipsters, and say that I will die if I don't play their games. I love Valve, and I still somewhat have a soft-spot for Bioware, but acting all high and mighty?
Let me put this example, on 4chan, we have trolls everywhere, it's part of the course, and each topic is seethed with, for a lack of better terms, poison. On the Escapist, in a single a topic/thread, we can have such a hot debate, that metaphorically, it's equal to soo much bile and poison from 4chan that it's worth about 4 threads from there.
It's still exists, but the concentration is much higher for Valvites.
Depends on what you mean by characterized FPS's. If you mean the people you meet, yes, I agree. They all had a certain degree of feeling human, and actually felt like the world and characters are part of each other and reflected this well. However, the person who is a non-character here is Gordon Freeman, since he is a projection of persona on the player, but the reason the player feels so connected to Gordon isn't because of who he is, but because of how he 'moves' and animates.Trolldor said:
Think about it, in many games you see the arms and hands of your characters in complex animations, and they have that floaty feeling to them? That shoots you out of the feeling of playing the game and being yourself.
Yet in HL series, you don't have that issue, because the animation are simple and crude for the player, allowing his brain to, without rhythm or reason, connect the sensation of an activity as simulated identity rather then watching identity.
In movies, you watch the actor watching, in games, you watch THROUGH the character watching, and that is why complex animations feel alot less personal and simple ones more personal.
FEAR is a second contender for this place, and Mirror's Edge as well, (although I only played the demo, so my opinion for this one, should be taken with salt).
As for hype, no, I'm pretty sure people-based general consensus about a game is a pretty valid indicator of what to expect out of a game. I cannot trust reviewers easily, not even Yahtzee, and take general opinion about a game with a pinch of salt. Since I also have next to zero knowledge of market product, no amount of demo can help me decide if I want to buy the game. We're not talking about a new razor for my beard or a new shampoo I can buy and return back willy nilly or not mind the price tag, even a hair-dryer is more market knowledge then a game of Pac-Man, especially with the looming market.
Unless I pirate it, but we'll leave that alone for now...and isn't the whole industry based upon hyping up a game? Even Yahtzee loved Batman, and massive amount of accolade where thrown to it. This meant that I would ATLEAST enjoy it, which I did, but the hype build for it, I felt, was a tad too much, as the good parts were a stark contrast to the issues at hand.
So yeah, hype and favor for a game does lend a person to buying it believe it or not, because that's how the market functions...unless I pirate it.
If people are talking about how great a game is before it's come out, then why would you believe them?AceAngel said:
If they're talking about how great it is after it came out, what are they saying and have you agreed with them in the past? If no, why are you giving weight to their opinion now?
Buying in to hype is your fault.
As for your Batman nonsense - again, your fault. You assumed that what these people liked would be what you liked. You bought in to somebody else's opinion and applied it to yourself.
OK, you're reading too much into this or there is confusion in our conversation, let us clear up a few things before proceeding.Trolldor said:
-I never said I believe a game is good before it's out. I was talking about Post-Hype, where a game is lauded even after it's released a very long time. My fault I guess for not making this clear.
-I'm not sure what you're saying at the second sentence, but if I'm understanding correctly, my answer would be; source by association. How can I have an opinion about a product I don't own? Videos and other such 'looks' to a game doesn't explain much to me as a person, while with several million players across the world, a sample size, and such containing data is a very good gauge for one that might correspond to my needs and likes.
-Buying into Hype is not my fault since I don't have anything to compare it to nor own the product to know better, hence lack of "best knowledge of product" (which is marketing) while pre-release hype isn't something I indulge myself into, post-hype is a different story, also, if you noticed, I said I always take ANY hype or rave with a pinch of salt, even post-ones. However, my fault for not making this point clear.
Then how would I go about 'learning' about a game short of pirating it?
Videos? Playing it versus watching it is pointless.
Demo? There is a reason most demos are 'good' in MANY cases.
Reviews? Again, viable source, but pinch of salt.
Lets-Plays? Pointless.
Frankly, I'm a little bit confused for a lack of better terms as to why you're harping me on this very specific point. I didn't call Batman bad, just that the constant barrage of praise was skewed to give an example to one of my previous points, I could very well have created a different topic to stroke my ego about why Batman was bad or why was it soo loved.
I also gave an extremely passing nod to the review relation with a game in one of my previous points, but didn't expand it to full fledged point, just a quick mention of what Valve as ahead of themselves due to the delay of the game, and thus associated 'expectations' generated from the hype of the delay.
In either case, you should see where I'm coming from, and while you agree of disagree with me or not (maybe our definitions of hype simply don't coincide as to what it represents) I unfortunately cannot said discussion any longer since it won't lead us anywhere of fruition. I however would like to thank you for the debate, as it netted me some interesting discussion to which I can propose to other people I know.
Cheers and ciao.
There's a theory that in order to disorientate people in order to give resistance movements pause due to unknown terrain the Combine moved masses of population completely out of their comfort zones, swapping everyone around like a giant game of boggle. This would explain the american accent in an eastern-european town.OhJohnNo said:
That would make sense. Is it a fan-theory, or did Valve hint at it?Kjakings said:
The idea of the Combine suddenly relocating entire populations every few years to keep resistance from brewing is delightfully dystopian.
I'm not actually sure. I think it's just a fan theory, though people who believe in it would probably claim that the whole american accent-european town thing is the hint Valve dropped. I have a feeling Valve will (or have) stumble across this point and later retcon things to make it true.OhJohnNo said:
In the files, not in the game. I have a friend who pokes around and dissects every script and comment and there are a few. I think there is only one or so in the game but I can't remember where or what it was.poiumty said: