Space Marines: They're becoming wimpier with each generation (Now with added ORK!)
- Thread starter Kadamon
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Not everyone has spent significant amounts of time painting lead figures that do absolutely nothing.Kadamon said:
Yeah, killing Marines with las weapons is sweet but I know one thing that is better.Normeo said:Marine commander, on a hover board, with a D cannon.... I concede!WeedWorm said:
Still can't beat the feeling of taking a space marine out with a las gun!
Conscript Platoon in CC with a Space Wolf Terminator Lord with lightning claws and only 1 wound left (Lord charged and ripped the platoon apart leaving a single conscript alive). The single WS2, S3 conscipt stabs the Wolf Lord in the fucking face and kills him.
The space marines from Starship Troopers (book not movie) could wipe the floor with every other kind of space marine ever envisioned. This is simply fact, not least of all because they had tactical nukes and a suit that made master chiefs armour look like a Lycra superman outfit.
I think you missed the OPs point... 40K was the first marine in power armor. None of those listed above have a single 'soldier' (how the hell you derived marines from dune, even starship troopers doesn't have a freaking marine, THEY ARE MOBILE INFANTRY!!!) in power armor.hebdomad said:
And, simply, I do not see marines in other franchises becoming weaker as a bad thing. To me the 40K Marine IS the epitome of a warrior, much like Master Chief only better. 40K Marines are built for war, they are immune to poison, self-repair wounds, live in near to no oxygen environments, carry 80lb weapons and can live forever. Oh and did I forget that when they do die they pass all of their experiences to the next marine that receives their Geneseed.
Name one marine similar to this and I will call you a fan boy or just simply one of the missguided....
I have many more reasons, most of them good. But i do have a few stupid minor reasons.Fire Daemon said:
Well, the Fire Warriors are a definite plus against marines, especially combined with a good Markerlight barrage from Pathfinders.darkless said:
But I was not specifically talking about Fire Warriors. I was referring to the Vespids with their marine-killer guns, as well as Crisis Suits with their Plasma Rifles and let's not forget SNIPER DRONES! Marines are soooo easy to kill for Tau players.
As much as i love Starship Troopers, and the second of its runty children, The entire visual reference for the mobile infantry, and well, everything in those movies, is based on 40k. I know ST was based off of a book, but from what i have heard only loosely. Space Marines are armored brick shithouses one of which can do the job of a squad of regular men. My My that does NOT sound like halo at all...
Then you sir, have never fought a good marine player. A well written marine list will tromp tau. and vespid are a very silly choice. As much as the guns they carry can kill marines, the bolter is actually about twice as effective against them. Battlesuits and the like die under krak missiles. You have no idea how many commanders iv pot shotted with a good krak missile, and sniper drones die in the face of a scout unit with a power sword.Undead Dragon King said:
Space Marines were made a bit more believable that's all... If you look at the Marines from halo they are just men in body armor carrying guns. It makes the world more real and immersive when the player believes that what is happening on screen is something that could happen in real life. But don't get me wrong, I think the 40k space marines are great too. It's the other side of the coin, they're for the gamers that want a totally unrealistic and fantastic world to come to life for them... So both marines are good, they were just tailored for different tastes.
In other news, the complete reverse has apparently been occurring over the decades in 40k's father/brother/incestuous mother setting, Warhammer. I was reading around about WFRP first edition and discovered that the setting was much different back when 1st ed was made.There was a much bigger emphasis on the internal conflict that was tearing the Empire apart, whereas now, that oppressive mood of conspiracy and slow decay has been replaced by "ARCHAON IS COMING TO GETCHOO!" After a while the spikes and stakes get old; but grim and dark will never die.
For example, there was a fifth major Chaos god, Malar, who represented the paradoxically self-destructive nature of Chaos by, believe it or not, mostly killing other Chaos followers. Wicked!
Another example is the Empire was riven by internal dissent over a number of fault lines: an ancient druidic religion was still holding on in spite of persecution; the Electors were being just like their real life feudal counterparts by offering the Elector Count; Karl Franz, nothing more than lip service and feigned moral support. Awesome!
And while we're on the subject of Karl Franz, he was basically a wimp watching the Empire fragment under him, not an armoured warrior riding a griffon into battle against Archaon, alongside the resurrected embodiment of Sigmar. Fricking cool!
Of course all of this is setting wise awesome, and only for those who like fluff to put into their RP, not teenage powergamers who think Elector Counts on griffons are, like, so totally cool. I'm not averse to the biffo, but it sounds like Olde Worlde Warhammer was much cooler than Big Bad New Warhammer with extra Big and Bad.
PS: Old style Space Marines are still cool, though. I much prefer the treatment of a single CSM in the Eisenhorn saga (basically his presence alone makes Eisenhorn and buddies lose their shit out of pants-wetting fear) to the average 40k battle, in which a squad of Guardsman can easily expect to knock off a single marine.
PPS: Tau, SM, pushaw. PU. SHAW. My [insert unit here] has [insert weapon here] which will wtfpwn your [insert ideal target unit here]. Therefore, I win.
For example, there was a fifth major Chaos god, Malar, who represented the paradoxically self-destructive nature of Chaos by, believe it or not, mostly killing other Chaos followers. Wicked!
Another example is the Empire was riven by internal dissent over a number of fault lines: an ancient druidic religion was still holding on in spite of persecution; the Electors were being just like their real life feudal counterparts by offering the Elector Count; Karl Franz, nothing more than lip service and feigned moral support. Awesome!
And while we're on the subject of Karl Franz, he was basically a wimp watching the Empire fragment under him, not an armoured warrior riding a griffon into battle against Archaon, alongside the resurrected embodiment of Sigmar. Fricking cool!
Of course all of this is setting wise awesome, and only for those who like fluff to put into their RP, not teenage powergamers who think Elector Counts on griffons are, like, so totally cool. I'm not averse to the biffo, but it sounds like Olde Worlde Warhammer was much cooler than Big Bad New Warhammer with extra Big and Bad.
PS: Old style Space Marines are still cool, though. I much prefer the treatment of a single CSM in the Eisenhorn saga (basically his presence alone makes Eisenhorn and buddies lose their shit out of pants-wetting fear) to the average 40k battle, in which a squad of Guardsman can easily expect to knock off a single marine.
PPS: Tau, SM, pushaw. PU. SHAW. My [insert unit here] has [insert weapon here] which will wtfpwn your [insert ideal target unit here]. Therefore, I win.
Mobile Infantry (from the book!) are walking tanks that hot drop from orbit in pods, have jump jets, amplified sensors of all kinds, homing rockets as standard ammunition, and tactical nukes.Malidictuim said:
They are not guys walking around with a little body armor and an assualt rifle, they are guys in big fancy exoskeletons, with nukes, that blow up dams for no other reason than they 'feel like it'.
Also halo takes place in the year 2551, warhammer is in the year 40,000 right? well I'd say that explains the whole difference right there.xxcloud417xx said:
An armored Spartan weighs half a ton.Dommyboy said:
A Mongoose weighs 406 kg and has a top speed of 96 kph. Giving it a kinetic energy of 144,356 Joules. Enough to do some serious damage, and that doesn't factor in the weight of the driver.
Imagine something that weighs about as much as you crashing into you at 60mph.
And concerning the OP, it would be rather boring if every game with a space marine featured he-men clad in the entire iron production of a day in North America. Being badass among interstellar soldiers doesn't require that you look like a human tank, only that you are.