Star Wars VII - What if LUKE is the villain?

[DefunctTheory]

I have to question how a sequel could exist because Darth sidious was pretty much the "last" sith let alone how Luke could become a fallen Jedi.

Star Wars: Rebels, the new animated series that killed Clone Wars, gives us the answer - There are a bunch 'Inquisitors' that either Vader or Sidious trained to help track down the last of the Jedi. Presumably, by the time Rebels ends and A New Hope starts, most to all of the Inquisitors/Jedi are dead, besides the ones shown in the movies. It's likely the new big bad Sith is simply a relic of that time.

Besides the fact that Rebels is actually a good show (You should try it sometime, everyone), this is one of the things I like about it - There's at least three Jedi in it, one of them is a kid, and there's a 99% chance their all going to die. I wanna see some epic last stands!

 

[MASTACHIEFPWN]

I will amputate episode 7 from cannon if such a thing were to happen.

 

[the_dramatica]

That would be pretty insulting to the back story. He may have found the weakness in the death star but him turning around and soloing the rebel army? No sir. Star wars is about the lead protagonists, but they don't rule the world.

 

[gsilver]

The real reason is that Mark Hammil has aged horribly, so they don't want to plaster his mug all over the promotion materials. Have you seen pictures of him lately?

Though wild speculation is more fun.

He betrayed and murdered his father, as his father before him.

 

[SomeLameStuff]

Guys, remember this Moviebob episode?


This is JJ Abrams' schtick. And like always, nothing interesting will come of it.

 

[DefunctTheory]

The real reason is that Mark Hammil has aged horribly, so they don't want to plaster his mug all over the promotion materials. Have you seen pictures of him lately?

I saw him in The Flash the other day, and he wasn't that bad. He certainly looks his age, but so do Ford and Fisher.

Spoiler

EDIT: Also, for the record, Mark Hamill can do creepy just as well on camera as in a sound stage. Raised the hairs on my neck.

 

[Ygrez]

What I'm thinking is gonna happen is that with the balance prophecy, and since Luke is the last jedi, he goes into seclusion so that the Force can be truly balanced, no Jedi, no Sith, balanced force not being pulled one way or the other. But with some Sith reappearing he'll come back to train the new generation of Jedi.

 

[Silverbane7]

thats what i was thinking too.
just like yoda, luke is living in some backwater planet, one that likely has a high force background (like radiation, yes i know its not the same stuff, but if you were looking for someone that radiated the force would you be able to find them on a world that felt like even the trees were force masters?)

he might be hiding there so those enforcer guys cant locate him (the ones from the cartoon someone mentioned earlier) or so he just does not have to be around the rest of the 'verse (cause you know, non force folks and null's can get anoying if you have to explain everything to them, i bet) and to avoid all the cries of 'teach me!' and 'lead the new government!' that may (or may likely not have) been going around after the destruction of the emperor.

maybe he's still there now, because he felt shame when the rebel's leaders fell to the same sort of greed and power strategies that made the old republic corrupt. maybe the old leaders were too old, and the newer blood that took over didnt share their memories of the old republic or their moral point of veiws and well, thats where this new order empire want to be lot come in. cause you know he *could* have tried to lead em....then maybe he just figured he would have been just as bad.

he'll probably show up at the end, sighing and grumbling like yoda about being too old for this (lol) but being in no way to argue and refuse...

 

[Imre Csete]

Eh, why not go the whole way and have him travel back in time, and it was him that got Vader's mum magically pregnant?

And he also had a vision about the future, and saw how the Jedi failed to stop the Yuuzhan Vong invasion, so he made sure the new timeline - lead by the Sith - will be ready for them.

He was a good guy all along!

 

[DefunctTheory]

Eh, why not go the whole way and have him travel back in time, and it was him that got Vader's mum magically pregnant?

And he also had a vision about the future, and saw how the Jedi failed to stop the Yuuzhan Vong invasion, so he made sure the new timeline - lead by the Sith - will be ready for them.

He was a good guy all along!

I like where this is going. The Yuuzhan Vong are actually the military force of giant brains trying to gather all knowledge in the Universe, and Luke's special brain waves (Which he got from being his own grand father) are our only hope.

Make it happen, Abrams.

 

[Something Amyss]

Not really the same. The idea would be that everytime you see that person in the mask it's Luke. But the Kylo Ren character is still that guy we've seen in all of the footage. There'd be no fake scenes or fake actors. Just a different interpretation of those scenes.

Except you're still talking about an extraordinary expense in terms of deceptive shooting just to pull this off. Which was what I said before. That this would remain uncovered also strains credulity.

 

[Winnosh]

Not really the same. The idea would be that everytime you see that person in the mask it's Luke. But the Kylo Ren character is still that guy we've seen in all of the footage. There'd be no fake scenes or fake actors. Just a different interpretation of those scenes.

Except you're still talking about an extraordinary expense in terms of deceptive shooting just to pull this off. Which was what I said before. That this would remain uncovered also strains credulity.

How would it require any different shooting? Why would any extra footage be needed. People have been cutting trailers that change the meaning of a film for years without needing any new footage.

Such as the Ghost Buster trailer that makes it look like the movie is about Ernie Hudson. Or turning Steven King's "It" into a family fun classic.

 

[happyninja42]

Not really the same. The idea would be that everytime you see that person in the mask it's Luke. But the Kylo Ren character is still that guy we've seen in all of the footage. There'd be no fake scenes or fake actors. Just a different interpretation of those scenes.

Except you're still talking about an extraordinary expense in terms of deceptive shooting just to pull this off. Which was what I said before. That this would remain uncovered also strains credulity.

How would it require any different shooting? Why would any extra footage be needed. People have been cutting trailers that change the meaning of a film for years without needing any new footage.

Such as the Ghost Buster trailer that makes it look like the movie is about Ernie Hudson. Or turning Steven King's "It" into a family fun classic.

It would require extra shooting because Mark Hamill doesn't look anything like the actor playing Kylo Ren. He's short and pudgey, and Kylo is tall and slim. It would be unrealistic in the extreme, and would require, assuming they ever show Luke's face while doing action scenes, for them to CGI his head onto the younger actor's body. And we all know how bad that looked with Christopher Lee as Count Dooku in the Clone Wars fight scene.

So you would have to always be mindful of the way the body looks in a shot, and have to adjust accordingly, so that it doesn't suddenly seem like Kylo Ren lost half a foot in height, and gained 80 pounds around his stomach.

Also there's just not much narrative reason for it. Other than a "Duh duh DUUUUUUH!" kind of lame shocker, it makes no sense given the previous material. Luke has already had his crucible/trial by fire. He stood alone before the embodiment of evil, and his own father, and told them "No". There is no reason for him to suddenly go emo and all Sith at this point. It makes no sense.

He's most likely become a reclusive hermit, after becoming the only Jedi in the galaxy, which is why we don't see him, as nobody has seen him for 30+ years.

 

[Winnosh]

Ok I

Not really the same. The idea would be that everytime you see that person in the mask it's Luke. But the Kylo Ren character is still that guy we've seen in all of the footage. There'd be no fake scenes or fake actors. Just a different interpretation of those scenes.

Except you're still talking about an extraordinary expense in terms of deceptive shooting just to pull this off. Which was what I said before. That this would remain uncovered also strains credulity.

How would it require any different shooting? Why would any extra footage be needed. People have been cutting trailers that change the meaning of a film for years without needing any new footage.

Such as the Ghost Buster trailer that makes it look like the movie is about Ernie Hudson. Or turning Steven King's "It" into a family fun classic.

It would require extra shooting because Mark Hamill doesn't look anything like the actor playing Kylo Ren. He's short and pudgey, and Kylo is tall and slim. It would be unrealistic in the extreme, and would require, assuming they ever show Luke's face while doing action scenes, for them to CGI his head onto the younger actor's body. And we all know how bad that looked with Christopher Lee as Count Dooku in the Clone Wars fight scene.

So you would have to always be mindful of the way the body looks in a shot, and have to adjust accordingly, so that it doesn't suddenly seem like Kylo Ren lost half a foot in height, and gained 80 pounds around his stomach.

Also there's just not much narrative reason for it. Other than a "Duh duh DUUUUUUH!" kind of lame shocker, it makes no sense given the previous material. Luke has already had his crucible/trial by fire. He stood alone before the embodiment of evil, and his own father, and told them "No". There is no reason for him to suddenly go emo and all Sith at this point. It makes no sense.

He's most likely become a reclusive hermit, after becoming the only Jedi in the galaxy, which is why we don't see him, as nobody has seen him for 30+ years.

Ok I think you're misunderstanding what I mean. I'm not saying that Abrams is doing this. I think it would be one of the dumbest, most misguided shock moments imaginable.

And I'm not saying that Luke is Kylo Ren. I'm saying that what if Kylo Ren isn't the guy in the mask.

 

[BloatedGuppy]

It would require extra shooting because Mark Hamill doesn't look anything like the actor playing Kylo Ren. He's short and pudgey, and Kylo is tall and slim. It would be unrealistic in the extreme, and would require, assuming they ever show Luke's face while doing action scenes, for them to CGI his head onto the younger actor's body. And we all know how bad that looked with Christopher Lee as Count Dooku in the Clone Wars fight scene.

So you would have to always be mindful of the way the body looks in a shot, and have to adjust accordingly, so that it doesn't suddenly seem like Kylo Ren lost half a foot in height, and gained 80 pounds around his stomach.

Also there's just not much narrative reason for it. Other than a "Duh duh DUUUUUUH!" kind of lame shocker, it makes no sense given the previous material. Luke has already had his crucible/trial by fire. He stood alone before the embodiment of evil, and his own father, and told them "No". There is no reason for him to suddenly go emo and all Sith at this point. It makes no sense.

He's most likely become a reclusive hermit, after becoming the only Jedi in the galaxy, which is why we don't see him, as nobody has seen him for 30+ years.

I figure they'll just pull a rubber mask off Adam Driver at the end of the film, and it'll be Hamill underneath.

"Old Man Skywalker!" they'll shout in unified astonishment. "It was you all along!"

"Damn right it was me! And I would've gotten away with it too, if it wasn't for you meddling Jedi!"

And then everyone will look at the camera and laugh, before it goes to freeze frame and the credits roll.

Still an improvement on the prequels.

 

[happyninja42]

Ok I think you're misunderstanding what I mean. I'm not saying that Abrams is doing this. I think it would be one of the dumbest, most misguided shock moments imaginable.

And I'm not saying that Luke is Kylo Ren. I'm saying that what if Kylo Ren isn't the guy in the mask.

Ah, ok yes, I actually sort of agree that Kylo Ren isn't the guy in the mask, or that it is at least partially possible. I think the actress from Game of Thrones is going to be Kylo Ren. I mean she's tall, the modulated voice kind of sounds like hers to me, and she's already got sword training. I'm not sure if this is the case, but part of me hopes for it.

I figure they'll just pull a rubber mask off Adam Driver at the end of the film, and it'll be Hamill underneath.

"Old Man Skywalker!" they'll shout in unified astonishment. "It was you all along!"

"Damn right it was me! And I would've gotten away with it too, if it wasn't for you meddling Jedi!"

And then everyone will look at the camera and laugh, before it goes to freeze frame and the credits roll.

Still an improvement on the prequels.

xD That would make me giggle uncontrollably in the theater if it actually happened.