Student commits suicide after school refuses to do anything about bullying

[Fox12]

I don't think it's human nature at all. This stuff doesn't happen in the real world partly because it's not tolerated, and partly because it's counterintuitive to the welfare of our species. Why else would this behavior suddenly cease the moment people enter college or the work force? It's not like people suddenly become sensible human beings when they turn 18. I work with people I used to get in fights with. We get along great.

I think human behavior is partly dictated by their environment. There will always be people with bully like behavior, but we can create an environment that makes this behavior more or less likely to fester.

Well, I wouldn't say the behavior goes away, it just becomes less obnoxious and loud, since we grow up and become less obnoxious and loud. But even in the workplace people will still point at someone, laugh at them, or talk behind their back. I mean, when I see someone walking down the street that I find funny looking, and I'm with someone else, I generally call their attention to it and say something along the lines of 'Heh, look at that guy'.

Human behavior is partly dictaded by their environment (quite a lot actually), but that environment itself is created by that same human behavior. You can't force everyone to get along, and you can't stop them from gravitating toward some people and not others. And that's the source of bullying, but it's also what makes us individuals.

There's a huge difference between privately talking about some stranger walking down the street, or simply not wanting to be around someone, and being a bully. Yes, there were people I knew in highschool who tried to be my friend. Yes, I would sometimes avoid being around that person. Maybe our personalities didn't mesh, maybe they annoyed me, or maybe they did or said something that I disagreed with. I still tried to treat them with respect, and I never sought them out to hurt them. You can't force people to be friends. However, this is not what I think most people mean by bullying. Bullying is the intentional ongoing harassment of another person. It's a deliberate attempt to exercise some level of control or coercion over them. This is a choice that person must make, and it can be controlled and prevented. If the person is unable or willing to control themselves then they should be removed for the safety of the other students, and should perhaps be forced to seek help.

In the case of the boy in article, who exactly was a bully? A person wasn't a bully because they didn't want to be his friend. Yes, he was lonely, and yes, it sucks to be ostracized. I was quite heavy in early highschool, before I lost weight and started working out. I remember the feeling. But that's not all that this particular boy was dealing with. He was suffering both psychological and physical abuse, and no one was helping him. In my school it was encouraged, rewarded, or allowed to fester through indifference. Is it bullying not to intervene? Not necessarily, if you're a peer. However, if you're an authority figure and you know about it? Absolutely. And we know that they were told about this. I don't buy the narrative that this is just human nature, and that it can't be stopped. We ignore our animal instincts in favor of civility all the time. We're at least semi-rational animals, after all. Yes, certain people will always fester these negative impulses inside of them. We can simply mitigate this by creating an environment where this behavior is no longer accepted, and certainly isn't encouraged.

 

[Barbas]

May it be a mark of shame on that institution's record for evermore. That is assuming they can squeeze it in between existing awards for services to the busy field of child abuse.

Can't see it mentioned anywhere in the article that he was gay.

 

[Neurotic Void Melody]

That's a horrid situation to be in. He felt let down by everybody he was supposed to depend on, let down enough to not take the suffering any more. An uncaring system trundles on, obliviously trampling on more lives while insincerely apologising through obligation to observers and experiencers. I remember a particular moment/decision, well, multiple, early in childhood life that didn't succeed as well as him, i didn't know much at the time on workable methods though, too young and too stupid (no internet also). It could be any kid, anybody's child that endures their last forced day of hurt. People don't want to have to think or deal with these problems, it means they might have to change and try and maybe even worry for others. Too much effort.
Coincidentally had a disturbing nightmare last night about being bullied as a kid, was quite graphic and I remember it vividly, not claiming anything, don't believe in such things, but it is just one of those ones that are hard to brush off throughout the day. Will change occur? Catholic schools aren't exactly bastions of progressive change though, there is much to yet be done.
I hope his parents can find the strength to continue pushing for progress, their loss can be their catalyst for positive change; even a little is better than none. A little can still save a life and a mind.

 

[shrekfan246]

Did they refuse, or were they just pretty much powerless, like every other school? I know the first response after a tragedy like this is to blame the school for not having stopped it, but what can a school actually do against it that won't just paint an even bigger target on the victim?

Bullying is one of those issues for which there is no real solution, other than straight-up skipping or transfering schools (if we're talking bullying at school).

No, there are ways to deal with it. Its called punishing the bullies, and just the bullies. Its having the parents take responsibility for their kids. Its teaching kids to respect each other with basic dignity.

Again though, how is that not going to paint an even bigger target on the bully victim? I know that when I was bullied I didn't want the school to call attention to my being bullied by punishing the bullies for bullying me. That would just wind them up even more and take their anger out on me. And make me look like an even bigger "loser" in the process.

First of all, this seems like complete assumption on your part. You never spoke up because you felt it would be pointless and would just get you bullied even worse; in reality, that's kinda what bullies want people to think, because it lets them continue without any repercussions. They create an atmosphere of hopelessness for the victim, so that the victim doesn't feel like there's any way to escape.

Now, yes, unfortunately there are still a lot of "authority" figures who don't give a crap about actually combating bullying, so those feelings aren't always wrong. Victim blaming is a very real problem, and that's kinda why us "SJW" types get real frustrated about it. That still doesn't mean "shut up and take it" is the best course of action.

 

[Saelune]

You don't think the massively high rates of bullying and suicide the LGBT community faces might possibly have something to do with it?

But it's not a problem that's unique to that commaunity.

It didn't. It says "Although no media reports or family members identified Fitzpatrick as LGBTQ, his 17-year-old sister told the New York Daily News he was ostracized."

And it doesn't really matter if its for being this or that. He was bullied for being different, and that's enough. Its called empathy. Hell, I'm sure we all have being ostracized for being different. Sometimes for being gay, or trans, or black...but also perhaps for being a woman, or man, or too fat, too thin, a different religion, a different culture, a weird nose, a lisp, for liking something everyone doesn't, for not liking something everyone does.

People can easily relate to each other if they wanted to, but most don't want to.

Then why even mention it?

Because people might assume if they read it on an LGBT oriented site maybe?

 

[FalloutJack]

Snip

My opinion is that all schools are unwilling, not unable, because bullying is simply an unacceptable action that - if left unchecked - creates an unstable individual who believes this to be the correct way to act in society. If you cannot do anything, you have not actually tried. I don't like bullying OR suicide. This particular one had better be convicted of manslaughter, or there is no justice. And the school? Useless. Absolutely useless.

 

[Fox12]

You don't think the massively high rates of bullying and suicide the LGBT community faces might possibly have something to do with it?

But it's not a problem that's unique to that commaunity.

It didn't. It says "Although no media reports or family members identified Fitzpatrick as LGBTQ, his 17-year-old sister told the New York Daily News he was ostracized."

And it doesn't really matter if its for being this or that. He was bullied for being different, and that's enough. Its called empathy. Hell, I'm sure we all have being ostracized for being different. Sometimes for being gay, or trans, or black...but also perhaps for being a woman, or man, or too fat, too thin, a different religion, a different culture, a weird nose, a lisp, for liking something everyone doesn't, for not liking something everyone does.

People can easily relate to each other if they wanted to, but most don't want to.

Then why even mention it?

Because people might assume if they read it on an LGBT oriented site maybe?

The article mentions that "we don't know if he was LGBT." If the site is aimed at that audience, then I assume they were just clarifying that information for their viewership. It sounds like he was being bullied for his weight and for being socially awkward.

 

[Erttheking]

Snip

Because apparently there was a chance that he was being singled for being gay, and the article apparently didn't want to sweep it under the rug, because a problem does not need to be unique to a community to be reported on.

A kid is dead and you picked a pretty weird thing to get hung up on.

 

[stroopwafel]

Seems the problem here was more exclusion as other kids didn't want to play with him. Schools should provide a safe environment but I kinda agree with Shinji here that it's impossible to prevent this whole chain of social dynamics that happen when you put hundreds of kids either right before or during puberty in a single building. There will always be kids who can't stand up for themselves or who don't pick up on social cues or look 'different' and who become easy targets for bullies. The bullies themselves often being victims as well from either broken homes or abuse.

When kids are bullied then schools and parents definitely still have a responsibility but seeing how widespread bullying is at one time a person needs to become more self-assured and assertive lest you not waste your life in anxiety, missed opportunities and misplaced misanthropy.

Anyways it's heartbreaking for those parents that they lost their kid so early. It's human nature to always want to make sense of everything but really, often there isn't any. Kids are left out and have no friends everywhere and it's tragic this particular kid decided to take his own life.

 

[Casual Shinji]

Again though, how is that not going to paint an even bigger target on the bully victim? I know that when I was bullied I didn't want the school to call attention to my being bullied by punishing the bullies for bullying me. That would just wind them up even more and take their anger out on me. And make me look like an even bigger "loser" in the process.

First of all, this seems like complete assumption on your part. You never spoke up because you felt it would be pointless and would just get you bullied even worse; in reality, that's kinda what bullies want people to think, because it lets them continue without any repercussions. They create an atmosphere of hopelessness for the victim, so that the victim doesn't feel like there's any way to escape.

Now, yes, unfortunately there are still a lot of "authority" figures who don't give a crap about actually combating bullying, so those feelings aren't always wrong. Victim blaming is a very real problem, and that's kinda why us "SJW" types get real frustrated about it. That still doesn't mean "shut up and take it" is the best course of action.

I'm not saying people who get bullied should just deal with it, not at all. Just that monitoring and putting a stop to bullying that isn't straight-up physical abuse is extremely difficult.

Let's say everytime I walk my dog there's people in the windows flipping me off. Eventually this would have an effect on me, but there's very little I could do about it. People have taken a set against me and the only option left to me is to simply move away. A bit of a weird example I guess, but there's plenty of cases in my country where gay couples get bullied by the neighborhood they live in. Whenever they call the cops everyone would just cover eachother and claim ignorance, and then when the cops leave they'd go right back to bullying. It's horrible situations like that that unfortunately you just can't solve.

The only thing you can do in situations like that is leave the environment where it occurs, or confide in a family member or friend and hope they can support you through all of it.

 

[ObsidianJones_v1legacy]

My school never did anything about my bully because he was the son of one of the teachers. So he got away with everything, because all the teachers thought he was mamma's perfect little bear. And he was the type of kid that would stab me with pencils, like bleeding and scars and the whole thing.

I can't tell you how many times I got into fights with him. I eventually kicked him so hard in the ribs they bruised, and he stopped after that.

Sometimes you really do have to fight back because adults won't help.

Here's the thing, that won't always help.

As geeks before being a geek was cool, I think we all had our fair share of bullying. I had the misfortune of being a black boy in a predominantly white school district, and around 6'2 when I stopped growing.

No one would believe me. "Why would that kid start with you? He's half your size!"

I heard that a lot. My pleading for them to believe me wouldn't fly. One time, I eventually lost my cool and practically yelled out "Because everyone says that! No one would believe he would do it, so he could get away with it!"

That led to a call to my home.

The one time I saw red and was ABOUT to fight back was the one time a teacher was actually around. The clique that was always picking on me all took a defensive stance when I stood up from the table and got into the ring leader's face. The ring leader, obviously shocked and realizing that I finally snapped, went white. And that's when a teacher crossed into the courtyard. He was ready to suspend me on the spot.

The courtyard was the view of the library. The teacher was called in to break up bullying. But he did not think for one second I was the victim. The librarian opened the window and called for the teacher to come over. Once he came back, he told me he would talk to me later and looked at the kids and gave a half assed "So, you six against one kid. That's pathetic. Don't let me see you do that again."

He then turned to me and said that he gets it, but he would have to bust me if I ever fought. Something he didn't say to them. He never apologized. He never said he was going to keep an eye out for me. He just told me to go get a teacher.

And I still was in the middle of losing it. Not believing what was happening. I still managed to control myself, but I told him straight out that no one believes me, just like he didn't believe I was just defending myself.

I am pretty sure I let a tear go at that point. And I could honestly see that he knew exactly what I was going through at that moment... but still wouldn't let go of the belief that me, the scary looking black kid, had the right to defend himself against the obviously 'not as strong' white kids because it would be unfair to them.

All I got was that he now knows, and he would spread the word.

I'll admit that me snapping did stem the bullying. But I was probably about to be expelled because no one believes you if they are full of bias. And frankly, most people are.

Also, I was on the honor roll most semesters, president of the German Club, apart of AV club, and I never got into trouble. I never even seen my administrator except for one time. Because I was helping with our Senior Graduation. He looked at me and said I must have been a good student because he had no idea who I was by sight. So it wasn't like I was just some sort of hoodlum.

But that's mindset of a bully. They look not for weak people, but people who can't fight back. I was physically stronger than they were, but I knew no one would ever believe me.

 

[RaikuFA]

No one would believe me. "Why would that kid start with you? He's half your size!"

If I had a nickel for every time I had that said to me.

 

[Dizchu]

This is pretty typical. People are always saying "oh my god! If only I had known how hard things were for him!" and "people are so cruel!" after people commit suicide, but they don't give a damn beforehand. It's just such a taboo subject that nobody wants to address until they end up with no other option.

 

[Silvanus]

But it's not a problem that's unique to that commaunity.

Obviously, and nobody claimed it was. "High rates", which is completely true.

The article didn't "focus" on it; it made no claim about that either way. You made that up. I can think of no good reason why, other than an effort to discredit the source for some (poor) reason.

But they tell the currently known reason anyways "Her brother reportedly had been mercilessly bullied over his weight," so why not go just with that instead?

They did. They made no claim about his being LGBT, and you're the only damn one here interpreting it that way. They reported all they knew, and then clarified that it was unknown if this was related to the site's wider purview. That's entirely reasonable. You're the one not being entirely reasonable.

 

[Redryhno]

You don't think the massively high rates of bullying and suicide the LGBT community faces might possibly have something to do with it?

But it's not a problem that's unique to that commaunity.

Bullying as an overarching thing is not unique, but the quantity, consistency, and how the community treats it is.

After all, a large swath of conservative voters still thing it's okay to send gay kids to re-education camps to forcibly brainwash them into being straight because a book told them too.

And an increasingly large swath of "progressive" voters think it's a bad thing that their kid isn't on the spectrum of gender/sexuality abnormality(I don't mean this as a negative, just that average is normal, and the average in this case is overwhelmingly not confused with their gender or genital liking as they're brought up, people always talk about being normal is boring anyways). There's shit on both sides of the political divide, and we can both bring up assholes to make one side or the other look bad as many times as we want to.

OT:

I really have to ask, of those that insist that bullying is something school officials should deal with more often, how do you propose they go about it this time around where the kid doesn't get more shit? And let's be honest, he seemed to be a bit of a loner to begin with, nothing wrong with it, but if it's considered a negative, if the person doesn't want to at least attempt a change, then it's not the fault or responsibility of anyone else to make them change.

But this largely stems from me not really considering suicide such an awful option. Choice like any other and I personally choose to think that if it was a choice that was made or the situation bleak enough to do it, then there's probably another choice they can make later on down the line after making it. Or I may just be a heartless bastard.

 

[Silvanus]

Not really want to discredit, just that particular sentence bugged me the wrong way.

EDit: I'm referring to "Although no media reports or family members identified Fitzpatrick as LGBTQ, his 17-year-old sister told the New York Daily News he was ostracized.".

In that case, I'd suggest you heavily misinterpreted that sentence. There's no claim there; it's present solely because the site's wider purview is related to the LGBT community, and serves as a clarification.