Students suspended, expelled over Facebook posts

[agnosticOCD]

No, of course not, that's why I said I'd deal with it in a manner that won't harm the kids, and of course I'd make efforts for them to stop talking shit but not in any way that will get them into a tremendous amount of long term trouble. And most importantly, I'll make sure to do as much effort as I can to prove their statements wrong. I'm merely saying that I won't censor them, I won't harm them, I won't take away their education. I'll reason with them, I'll try to ask them why they had said those things in the first place, I'd make sure I'm not seen in a negative light for something that isn't true, but I would never impede on their lives in the way these teachers did. You're concerned about the job and the general social well-being of the teacher in question, I understand, and I am too, but why should you dismiss the kids just because they put the guy at risk? They don't deserve THIS HARSH a punishment, especially if their intent was never at all to get this guy into any harm.

Labelling someone a paedophile, and getting into trouble over it, is not a matter of censorship - or is the fact that it is illegal to yell "Fire!" in a crowded theatre censorship too?

It doesn't matter what the kids' intentions were - calling a teacher a paedophile is a very serious matter - I believe (though I may be wrong, I'm not an American so aren't so up-to-date on the laws there) that it is legally required for any allegation of the sexual abuse of children (which calling the teacher a paedophile would fall under) to be investigated. Such an investigation would warrant the suspension of the teacher until they are found innocent - which goes on the teachers' permanent record and thus would mean they would be extremely unlikely to be hired for any position involving working with children ever again. It may well be that the powers-that-be did not see that there was sufficient cause for a full investigation after talking to the students, and thus did not need to suspend the teacher in question - however they need to make the point that falsely accusing a teacher of being a paedophile/rapist is extremely serious and thus they need a serious punishment.

To say that it is harsh on the kids, as it affects their future, may well be valid - however the school needs to be harsh; to prevent other kids of accusing a teacher of being a paedophile due to annoyance or a grievance for getting a bad mark, given the aforementioned dire consequences for a teachers' professional career merely at getting such an accusation. It is showing the kids that their actions have consequences - what if next time one of the kids' (or their friends') parents sees the remark and goes to the police? Or one of the kids makes the comment on school premises? Like I said, if my kids accused a teacher, even on Facebook, of being a paedophile I would hope that the school suspends them. In regards to paedophilia and those working with kids regularly, to use the vernacular, that shit shouldn't be taken lightly.

It will be interesting to see how the tribunal pans out, in regards to whether it being on Facebook or not counts, and whether such falls under "Freedom of Speech" (which it should not, IMO, because it is defamation of character, already illegal, however you try to spin it).

Alright, you convinced me with this one. Whether or not it's illegal though is not my concern since I'm not a big fan of social norms, I'm convinced it actually IS bad. And I was speaking of getting expelled, not suspension. Suspension is, for me, a reasonable punishment to use in schools, it's keeping them from ever studying that was my concern. That would be beyond any kind of just punishment, even for something with such implications.

 

[agnosticOCD]

Am I the only one pissed off that someone is getting real life ramifications over a post on the internet?

I could easily make a facebook account as a coworker I dislike and post that my boss is an douche-bag who wants to screw sheep. You're telling me that person would get in trouble over it?

Absolutely ridiculous.

When the internet is a safe place where we're all BOUND to our names and no one can post things claiming to be us sure. But until then this is bullshit.

But an honor student who doesn't know how to lie and say someone else must have gotten access to her account and done it? Well she's obviously not going far.

Not going far indeed, but at least you've got one less smart person going into politics.

 

[Mylinkay Asdara]

What happened to detention? What happened to being put in charge of a crappy activity no one wanted to sign up for to learn better values? What happened to talking to students and saying "You are not being very smart about this Facebook thing, maybe you'd want to reconsider some of what you've been posting." ? I mean, honestly, this is just LAZY on the part of the school system to put it immediately to outside suspensions. There's a teaching opportunity here being thrown away to look and act tough.

 

[Superbeast]

Alright, you convinced me with this one. Whether or not it's illegal though is not my concern since I'm not a big fan of social norms, I'm convinced it actually IS bad. And I was speaking of getting expelled, not suspension. Suspension is, for me, a reasonable punishment to use in schools, it's keeping them from ever studying that was my concern. That would be beyond any kind of just punishment, even for something with such implications.

The suspensions are understandable. On the expulsion, I guess it depends on which of the 12 was expelled. I imagine it was the student who posted that the teacher was a paedophile, though the article cannot release any names so we cannot be sure. I think it was a bit harsh, but then depending on what the other 12 comments were I can't really say (for example if one of the other 12 students was saying that they should say to the head that they were abused or something in order to get the teacher fired, that would warrant an expulsion in my book).

 

[AMMO Kid]

That's why you don't complain about things, it always comes back to bite you

 

[azurawolf]

Thats why I dont say anything bad about my managers on facebook....

 

[Kortney]

Remember kids. If you make fun of your teachers on Facebook, be sure to avoid terms like pedophile and rapists. Nobody has a sense of humor about that kind of thing.

Why should they? Do you have any idea of how damaging claims of paedophilia and sexual assault can be to a teacher? They ruin their careers. It's not something to be joked about with.

 

[Astoria]

I think it's wrong to punish a student for things they do out of school. The school no longer had responsibility for them so it's none of their business what a student does. If they are offended by something a student posts about them then take it up with the student and discuss it with them but don't suspend them or anything like that. This reminds me of something that happened last year with my boyfriend. He and a few friends got dragged into the assistant principals office because they had laughed at a offensive comment someone had posted on facebook. They weren't suspended or anything but they got a 'offical warning' or something like that.

 

[Plurralbles]

My friend mad ea wikipedia article on my principle callin ghim a pedophile and it HAD HIS PICTURE ON IT.

He did not get suspended.

Teachers need to not get so butthurt, I mean... unless she's telling some authorities about it trying to get him in trouble for nothing... it's not a big deal.

 

[agnosticOCD]

Alright, you convinced me with this one. Whether or not it's illegal though is not my concern since I'm not a big fan of social norms, I'm convinced it actually IS bad. And I was speaking of getting expelled, not suspension. Suspension is, for me, a reasonable punishment to use in schools, it's keeping them from ever studying that was my concern. That would be beyond any kind of just punishment, even for something with such implications.

The suspensions are understandable. On the expulsion, I guess it depends on which of the 12 was expelled. I imagine it was the student who posted that the teacher was a paedophile, though the article cannot release any names so we cannot be sure. I think it was a bit harsh, but then depending on what the other 12 comments were I can't really say (for example if one of the other 12 students was saying that they should say to the head that they were abused or something in order to get the teacher fired, that would warrant an expulsion in my book).

Well, if it's purposely trying to get a teacher fired, or they're doing something along those lines, I think there should be a proper investigation first, because despite being harsh claims, there's always either truth to it, or there isn't. That needs to be investigated before any action on either party is taken. Of course, I do agree that if they're really doing it without any real basis, then expulsion is a reasonable punishment, but if they're not trying to harm the teacher in any way or were clearly joking about it, then I don't see a reason to punish them. It depends on how the claim was presented in the first place.

EDIT: without any real basis in order to get the teacher into trouble

 

[jawakiller]

I have an idea. Don't post shit on facebook! Do like I do, tell your friends in person. Then if shit hits the fan... No written record! Ah, old fashion common sense how I miss you.

 

[agnosticOCD]

I have an idea. Don't post shit on facebook! Do like I do, tell your friends in person. Then if shit hits the fan... No written record! Ah, old fashion common sense how I miss you.

Actually, there's still the risk of the teacher trying to weed out the student who said shit in class. A teacher of mine back in high school who once joked about our Academic Coordinator looking like a horse got into a shitload of trouble when one of his students spread the word about it, and he became strict towards all his classes, fucking over grades and sending students out for trivial reasons or not being able to answer a question. Some teachers can be total assholes when bad PR comes their way, so it's best to let it out on the net, so at least only those who said anything get into any trouble. Why let the blame spread to the entire class?

 

[aashell13]

My two cents:

1. the kids said some pretty dumb stuff. I excuse them for this, on the grounds that teenagers are known for doing generally stupid things.

2. the school VASTLY overstepped their authority by retaliating against students for comments made away from school and in a (ostensibly) private forum. I do not excuse them for this, because public schools generally seem to be under the mistaken impression that it is their prerogative to regulate what students say outside of school, particularly on Facebook.

It isn't like the kids went to the cops or otherwise initiated proceedings against the teacher in question. That would be a different story.

 

[theSovietConnection]

Alright, you convinced me with this one. Whether or not it's illegal though is not my concern since I'm not a big fan of social norms, I'm convinced it actually IS bad. And I was speaking of getting expelled, not suspension. Suspension is, for me, a reasonable punishment to use in schools, it's keeping them from ever studying that was my concern. That would be beyond any kind of just punishment, even for something with such implications.

The suspensions are understandable. On the expulsion, I guess it depends on which of the 12 was expelled. I imagine it was the student who posted that the teacher was a paedophile, though the article cannot release any names so we cannot be sure. I think it was a bit harsh, but then depending on what the other 12 comments were I can't really say (for example if one of the other 12 students was saying that they should say to the head that they were abused or something in order to get the teacher fired, that would warrant an expulsion in my book).

Actually, the one who was expelled called the teacher bipolar, which I don't get, as bipolar is, in my mind at least, a far less serious accusation than being a paedophile.

 

[twistedmic]

For those of you who don't know, this is the exact wording of the First Amendment of the Constitution of the United States of America (meaning it only applies to America)

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

It means that the U.S. government cannot pass laws against people speaking, nor can they arrest people for saying things they(the government) don't like. However, that doesn't mean you can say whatever you want, where ever you want without any consequences. There are laws against libel and slander and verbal threats against one's life.
Those kids who called their teacher a pedophile and a rapist were guilty of libel. Plus they could have endangered that teacher's career, reputation and even life with their (the students) posts.
They got suspended/expelled, but they haven't been punished by the U.S. government.
Those kids, and many other people, need to learn that what they say and write has consequences

 

[jawakiller]

I have an idea. Don't post shit on facebook! Do like I do, tell your friends in person. Then if shit hits the fan... No written record! Ah, old fashion common sense how I miss you.

Actually, there's still the risk of the teacher trying to weed out the student who said shit in class. A teacher of mine back in high school who once joked about our Academic Coordinator looking like a horse got into a shitload of trouble when one of his students spread the word about it, and he became strict towards all his classes, fucking over grades and sending students out for trivial reasons or not being able to answer a question. Some teachers can be total assholes when bad PR comes their way, so it's best to let it out on the net, so at least only those who said anything get into any trouble. Why let the blame spread to the entire class?

Yeah and thats why you own what you say. If you truly believe what you're about to say, accept the consequences. I once called a guy I knew a dick cuz he took advantage of a female friend. And we got into a fight. I won but I almost lost an ear to a knife. But I accepted my fate because I spoke the words. People need to learn how to take responsibility for their actions.

 

[Silent Biohazard Solid]

It's not libel or slander if all you do is insult someone in front of your friends. People talk crap about people all the time, and that's what Facebook is. It's social networking, it's not a news site.

 

[twistedmic]

Generally, where there's smoke, there's fire.

What's most likely going on is this teacher *IS* a pedophile, plausibly a rapist, but has friends in high places to protect him from being properly accused.

Your post shows just how dangerous accusations and allegations can be and why libel and slander laws are in place. You read the kid's posts and, with no evidence of any wrongdoing whatsoever, believe that the teacher is a pedophile and a rapist.
Those accusations could very well have cost the teacher his/her career, reputation or even life, all because a couple of kids were pissed off.