The appeal of Anime

[Cheery Lunatic]

I agree with your sentiment concerning teenage angst filled anime. They are annoying and far too prominent.

There are plenty of other shows like Cowboy Bebop and Samurai Champloo, which are pretty the definitive anime for people who generally don't like anime.

Totally agree with this.

Too many angsty teenagers in anime. Either that or they're moeblobs. It's annoying.
It also doesn't help that a huge chunk of the anime fanbase is really, REALLY obnoxious about their hobby. It's why I avoid talking about anime at almost all costs, unless I'm with good friends.

However, while OP is describing the majority of anime, there are quite a few that fall inbetween the cracks.

Cowboy Bebop, Samurai Champloo, and a few others (Twelve Kingdoms, Michiko and Hatchin, Ergo Proxy, Sword of a Stranger) go against anime norms, have good animation, and interesting characters (and development).

There are also some pretty good manga as well, but I won't mention 'em here.

 

[Mikeyfell]

I just don't see it. Aesthetically it all looks almost identical to me, the dialogue frequently seems overwrought, and poorly written, and the delivery is melodramatic at best, and cringeworthy at worst. The stories seem to never make sense to me, yet they almost always seem to feature some array of teenagers, each with their own flavor of angst. I suppose my overall attitude can be summed up with one word, namely stale. Then, perhaps I'm being close-minded. If anyone can sway my thoughts to the contrary, I would more then welcome it.

I'd say that's a fair account of what amime is like

Angsty teenagers in a convoluted confusing story

You talk about the delivery of the dialog sucking. Are you watching English dubs? Because that's your problem right there. The only "good" English Dub I've seen is Ergo Proxy

Personally I love it.
If you've seen enough of it to determine that you don't like it then there's nothing anybody can to about that. But if you want to give Anime one last chance to win you over (and you're hell bent on watching English dubs) give Ergo Proxy a chance

Mind you that Angst and weird story line aren't going anywhere

 

[FredTheUndead]

I just don't see it. If anyone can sway my thoughts to the contrary, I would more then welcome it.

First things first, I should mention that I got into anime in the mid 90s, heyday of shows such as Sailor Moon and Ranma 1/2.

At that time, anime was this strange, alien thing that was unlike any of the boring crap on American TV. My teenaged self was enraptured - particularly by shows featuring ass-kicking women doing cool stuff.

For me, anime peaked in 1997-2003, with shows like Revolutionary Girl Utena, Noir, Escaflowne, and a few others.

The last five years or so, I've only found a one or two that I like, and none as much as those shows from the previous decade. Also, many Western shows in the 2000s adopted the best, most interesting parts of anime (such as Joss Whedon, the creators of Power-Puff Girls, and others) thus eliminating the need for importing them directly.

I think it was just something different. As Movie Bob points out, the 90s kind of sucked. Very boring and drab compared to the decades surrounding it. Meanwhile, Japan was hopping with all sorts of cool artistic ideas. Now, ten years later, America, England, Canada, Australia (not to mention Europe) are producing interesting stuff, and Japan is, well, kind of dull. Much of the more recent animes are rehashes of older, better shows.

Also, back in the 90s, only the very best animes got exported to the west (based, of course, on the particular biases of those doing the exportation). Now, pretty much everything comes over, good or not.

So, while I'm still an anime fan, I don't watch much of the new stuff coming out. I stick to my older series and enjoy them, and I watch western shows inspired by anime, and... yeah.

tldr: I think Anime was better when it was new and different. Now that it's been incorporated into western culture, much of what made anime special has been subverted by western authors. Which is a good thing, because it attempts to preserve the best parts of anime while getting rid of the bad bits. Not that everyone agrees on which is which all the time....

Edit: if you actually want to get into anime, try something older. 80s or 90s older. You'll find some of the best stuff then (including fan favorites like Cowboy Bebop).

Ironically, the greatest anime tv series ever comes from 2007 and is about... Prohibition American gangsters.

 

[FredTheUndead]

Sound awfully defensive there, simmer down.

There's no denying that a lot of Hollywood movies are garbage, only difference is, I can generally tolerate them, (barring a few terrible exceptions who's names should never be spoken) whereas most anime I just can't sit through, at all. The dialogue, the ridiculous, comic book-esque plots, the over-exxagerated facial expression/reactions, these tropes drive me up a fucking wall, some people may find them endearing, but I certainly do not, and there's no changing that. And there's sure as hell no point in arguing with me about it. Some people have different interests, anime is not one of mine.

The thing is, when you say something like that it would probably help to say what shows you've seen. There are genres, demographics[footnote]Basically, any anime adapted from a manga will have been printed in a magazine intended for a certain audience. This doesn't necessarily define the show, but you'll see certain genres and tropes in some demographics that you won't see in others (and they will often have their own). There are exceptions, and it isn't all-defining unless it's Shonen Jump anime, in which case you probably really are watching the same thing happen an infinite number of times.[/footnote], subgenres and so on, so the things you're describing may be more common or exclusive to a specific type of anime.

For example, a common complaint is that whole "ZOMG THE POWER OF FRIENDSHIP! OH SHEESH Y'ALL" thing. This is something that will usually only pop up in Shounen anime. Okay, that's not completely true[footnote]Obviously fantasy shows and magical girl shows will feature that, even if there's a stunning lack of non-romance Shoujo right now.[/footnote] but I'll assume it for the sake of the argument. If you've somehow had the misfortune to only watch this type of show, or only had this type of show recommended to you, you can be forgiven for thinking that represents the entire medium. Okay, that's also not completely true, but it's understandable.

Simply put: Know what you're getting into, and realize there's a variety of anime outside of the most obvious mainstream shows. If those tropes annoy you, consider the possibility that there is anime that *gasp* doesn't feature it.

That was... A very informative and non fanboy-ish reply, thank you.

The extent of the anime I've seen is either the stuff I used to watch on Adult Swim, and the stuff I've seen as a result of my brother's puzzling recent obsession with anime, I'll list all the ones I can remember, if I can remember their names, if you'd like.

Ghost in a Shell, Akira, Cowboy Bebop, Berserk, Inuyasha, Dragonball Z/Dragonball, Bleach, some iteration of Gundam, ("Gundam Wing" maybe? Not sure) Blue Gender, Macross something or other, FLCL (I think thats what its called, it was really, really weird.) and thats about all I can think of off the top of my head.

I've seen Akira all the way through, but most of them, excluding Dragonball Z, I've only seen a few episodes of, but wasn't really impressed. Granted all of this I've seen just because I either caught it on TV or came upon a friend watching it and stuck around. Maybe there's some magnificent anime that seems almost as if it was made specifically for me, but I wouldn't know, as I haven't really gone out of my way to find it, you understand.

Also, there's Princess Mononoke, which I adore, one of my favorite animate films, easily. So I don't hate it all.

The key to making FLCL makes sense is remembering that guitars=penises.

I love that OVA for a wide variety of reasons, but I'll fully admit that something that blatantly stylized (save for the South Park bit in one of the episodes) could easily alienate someone.

The Berserk anime is really, really bland aside of the soundtrack, mostly because animating the art of the original manga would be nearly impossible due to the detail, but also due to story cuts they made.

But why am I selling you on fantasy when I could be selling you on vikings [http://www.mangafox.com/manga/vinland_saga]?

 

[Axelhander]

Emphasis mine.

How is that different from any other media in existence? Most music is shit, most film is shit, most television is shit, most games are shit, even most paintings are shit. In fact I think this could apply to anything. Most Soda is shit, most books are shit, the majority of computers are shit, and even most service providers of any particular service are shit.

What makes anime special here?

Um, nothing. What was your point, exactly?

With regards to the dialogue issue, bear in mind that unless you speak Japanese, you're seeing a translation. Whether it's dubs or subs, something will always be lost, just as if you translate from German or French or Italian. And also bear in mind you're dealing with a syllabary and completely different symbols used for letters and syllables than our own alphabet. Which simple exacerbates the problem.

Also, on the storytelling side of things, in general, you're looking at a different culture. They tell stories in a similar way to how they've told them for donkey's years, so what seems 'contrived' to us isn't the same to them, and symbolism is a staple of how they tell stories. There are significant differences, remember that you're looking at something originally created for a completely different audience and was only made for Western audiences as an afterthought, if you like. Besides, I personally quite like the 'meaningless symbolism'. You're looking at a guy who prefers the Matrix sequels to the original film, after all...

I understand there are cultural differences to consider. It is well *after* I've considered them that anime still comes up short.

Contrived is contrived, no matter where. If a character suddenly acts wildly out of character to fit into some plot arch the author of a particular work really, really has his heart set on, that's contrived, in Japan/America/Canada/Jamaica/wherever. "Cultural differences" do not excuse that, nor do they excuse robotic dialogue that doesn't respect context or setting.

As for symbolism, again, culture doesn't excuse symbolism that is thrown in without context or general uses of ambiguity without first forming a solid narrative basis from which the audience can thoughtfully speculate. The late Satoshi Kon (Paranoia Agent) was a *rare* example of a Japanese storyteller who did it RIGHT; he was like a Japanese Christopher Nolan, giving you enough to "interpret" while keeping just the right things unanswered.

How can you claim you "like the meaningless symbolism" immediately after saying the symbolism makes sense to the original Japanese audience? That's silly.

Liking the Matrix sequels is all fine and dandy. Attempting to claim they're actually better than the original is another matter entirely. And no, it isn't entirely subjective.

 

[MaxwellEdison]

This is similar to asking, "What's the appeal of western animation?" or, "What's the appeal of live action film?"

Not EVERYTHING has to have an appeal. Sometimes, people like something for the content, and not just the style of presentation.

 

[shiaramoon]

Generally, it's the storylines that I'm drawn to, not the fact that they are anime. Just because it's anime, doesn't mean I like it. I go based on each show. Some of my favs are the already mentioned Cowboy Bebop and Trigun. I will admit though, most of what's made it to America is the popular stuff, which is usually pretty good. Except for FLCL that was on Cartoon Network (it may have been part of the Adult Swim line-up though, I can't remember). That's just a random, and some-what scary show... >.>...

I also love pretty much anything by Hayao Miyazaki, though as far as I know, he's only ever done stand alone movies. Each is unique and interesting in a world all of it's own. Truly they are beautiful works of art and I guarantee that none of them have a generic angsty teenager. Every main character is well rounded and well-defined.

 

[kokoska]

i was with the OP until a year ago. anime to me was associated with naruto and bleach, and all that horrible and stigmatized (for good reason) crap. then i watched an anime called fooly cooly, and everything changed. you need to understand that like most mediums, 90% of its content is shit.

if you want to see an exemplary anime (only 6 episodes long) check out fooly cooly; otherwise, be careful to condemn an entire genre without due consideration.

 

[shiaramoon]

i was with the OP until a year ago. anime to me was associated with naruto and bleach, and all that horrible and stigmatized (for good reason) crap. then i watched an anime called fooly cooly, and everything changed. you need to understand that like most mediums, 90% of its content is shit.

if you want to see an exemplary anime (only 6 episodes long) check out fooly cooly; otherwise, be careful to condemn an entire genre without due consideration.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't Fooly Cooly also referred to as FLCL? If so, I fail to see the appeal to that show, granted I only watched a few episodes, but I don't get it. I didn't understand a darn thing that was going on or what laws of physics that girl (I have no idea what her name is, sry, she's the main alien(?) one) operates with.

 

[FredTheUndead]

i was with the OP until a year ago. anime to me was associated with naruto and bleach, and all that horrible and stigmatized (for good reason) crap. then i watched an anime called fooly cooly, and everything changed. you need to understand that like most mediums, 90% of its content is shit.

if you want to see an exemplary anime (only 6 episodes long) check out fooly cooly; otherwise, be careful to condemn an entire genre without due consideration.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't Fooly Cooly also referred to as FLCL? If so, I fail to see the appeal to that show, granted I only watched a few episodes, but I don't get it. I didn't understand a darn thing that was going on or what laws of physics that girl (I have no idea what her name is, sry, she's the main alien(?) one) operates with.

It's only 6 episodes. What's going on is A: it's a strange growing up story for the main character and B: the project was conceived as a lighthearted exercise for the artists that had working on End of Evangelion and were all exhausted and mildly depressed.

If you're that curious about it, just watch all 6 in a row with an open mind, but if you're not, I'd suggest titles a bit more off the beaten path, like Baccano (anime), Black Lagoon (anime/manga), Vinland Saga (manga), or Otoyomegatari (manga).

 

[Peteron]

I just don't see it. Aesthetically it all looks almost identical to me, the dialogue frequently seems overwrought, and poorly written, and the delivery is melodramatic at best, and cringeworthy at worst. The stories seem to never make sense to me, yet they almost always seem to feature some array of teenagers, each with their own flavor of angst. I suppose my overall attitude can be summed up with one word, namely stale. Then, perhaps I'm being close-minded. If anyone can sway my thoughts to the contrary, I would more then welcome it.

Well, not all of it is poorly written. I am not one of those kids obsessed with anime, like every other I have a few I enjoy, and many I do not. I really think your observation on anime applies to all things, movies, books, games, etc. And as for the teenagers observation, it seems you have your mind on shonen anime. There are tons you can watch without whiny teenagers. But hey, your opinion is you own, I barely watch any myself (excluding One Piece and FMA mainly) so who am I to talk?

 

[Ceil-Sama]

I'm gonna side with everyone saying that "Op question can be swapped with anything." Anime is basically animated cartoons that deal with all sorts of subject matter. Like seeing comedic school life? School Rumble. Like seeing bloodbaths and murder? Higurashi. Space cowboys? Cowboy bebop Like seeing guys screw each other? You're weird, but theres the Yaoi over there.

Anime is just another medium to view something. Theres good ones and bad ones. Like sitcoms, movies, cartoons, comics, games, theres always a variety to them. Any one of my suggestions(except maybe the yaoi thing) could easily be replaced with something western. Ie: bloodbaths with Slasher film. It all depends on what you prefer seeing and listening to. My poison is subbed animes. Yours can be different.

Personal Favorite animes? Cowboy Bebop, Inuyasha(for a while), The World God Only Knows, Fruits Basket(more manga wise, though).

 

[Extra-Ordinary]

Eh, whatever man. Say live and let die. I for one like anime just for the escapism; just to see a different world with different communities and different cultures without having to interact. Which would explain why I'm watching anime instead of traveling the world!

 

[Vibhor]

Aside from sexy women, huge knockers, over the top concept, hilariously bad writing, idiotic comedy, strange situations and the same but distinctive art style is what makes anime different from western animation.
I do not know the appeal of western animation almost all of them are the same (teenager gets superpower becomes badass). I prefer the obscure anime because almost all the mainstream anime is filled with filler.

 

[Kakashi on crack]

The thing about anime is that it spans from shows for young kids to age groups of adults. With this in mind, the main anime that get transported to America that you are likely to see are the ones for teenage audiences since that's where the largest demand for Anime lies. (well, unless we go into hen... Actually I'll just shut up now)

Another thing to note, is that shows that did well in japan usually take many years to transport to America, while the ones that didn't do very well are the first ones we get. (example: Pokemon, they stopped airing it on conventional channels in Japan after either the first or second season because people thought it was crummy back in Japan)

Keeping this in mind, you'll get about 10 bad anime shows for every 1 good one, so really its a matter of trial and error unless you have friends you can ask about it, another reason why there are more teenage fans because of said demands I discussed earlier leading to more people discussing it.

If you want a good example of Anime, its purely based on your choice, I for one think for instance, Code Geass ( http://www.youtube.com/show?p=_ibnU74o6y4&tracker= ) is a good anime show, but a lot of people would tell you otherwise.

 

[SenorNemo]

As a former huge anime fan, the appeal lied (notice past tense) in the aesthetics and the general covering of subject matter American animation stayed away from.

Some of my favorite works of fiction, even today, are anime, but as a whole, when scrutinized thoughtfully, anime is (mostly) terrible. Japanese storytelling in general is flawed; someone needs to tell them how real dialogue works, the meaning of the word "contrived," and how to thoughtfully use ambiguity instead of just shoehorning in meaningless symbolism (ala Evangelion).

I'm sure you're kind of tired of people responding to your post here, but in regard to Eva, it falls under almost all the criticisms of anime in general you gave...but here's why (almost) all of them don't actually matter to the integrity of the whole. I think a lot of the points here also apply to a defense of anime as a whole too.

First of all, the directors didn't intend the meaningless symbolism to be symbolism at all: they just were using it as a "cool and mysterious" visual motif. It was all no more or less than a recurring theme in the art. I've never given it a second thought, personally. Keep in mind, it was produced, written, and directed by Japanese people for a Japanese audience: an audience that wouldn't get hung up on the cross shaped explosions and sistema sephiroticas everywhere. The big symbolism here isn't religious: it's how piloting the Eva is a metaphor for facing life and its problems. In that way, I think the system of metaphor and interplay is quite fascinating in its critique of modern - especially Japanese - society, and on what it means to be human in the first place (and no, I don't count the half-assed pseudo philosophical babble towards the end as part of the symbolism either).

The story of the angels, Nerv, and Seele a prime example of what you're talking about in terms of bad storytelling. It's full of unelaborated plot threads, devices, and contrivances. However, that's not really the focus of Eva as a whole, and it's certainly not what drives the series forward. At its core, the draw of Eva is in its cast of characters, how they interact, and what becomes of them. The gradual dissection of the cast's psyche and motivations, and the development of their characters are all handled extremely well, and if I may go slightly off topic here, this is something anime in general does very well. Most anime is only 13 or 26 episodes long, exploring a single arc and a single cast of characters. Most western television shows (except for some miniseries) don't have enough focus to portray an arc without getting bogged down in filler: that's just now how they're structured or written. Most western movies are too short to explore an arc in as great a detail as a 13 to 26 episode anime can. Anime are like televised novels: each episode is like a chapter. Anyhow, Eva is exceptional because of how well it uses the interplay between the characters as they go about the business of the horribad story to illustrate them.

The dialog in Eva isn't horrible, though some performances in both the Japanese, English, and Spanish (the languages I've watched the series in) are pretty bad, especially in the beginning. I don't think the dialog is anything special either. It gets the job done, and when the requirements of the plot demand it, it usually rises to the challenge. I can't say this is the same case in many other anime though. I've laughed out loud who knows how many times at lines that were supposed to be in deadly earnest but ended up deadly stupid, but then again, bathos isn't the domain of anime either.

Anyway, I'm not trying to talk you into liking Neon Genesis Evangelion, or anime as a whole, but I think I've made the case that there are legitimate, intelligent reasons to love Eva and anime in general beyond the knowledge that yes, some elements are usually fairly awful.


tl;dr You're mostly right, but I like it anyway.

 

[FoOd77]

Sound awfully defensive there, simmer down.

There's no denying that a lot of Hollywood movies are garbage, only difference is, I can generally tolerate them, (barring a few terrible exceptions who's names should never be spoken) whereas most anime I just can't sit through, at all. The dialogue, the ridiculous, comic book-esque plots, the over-exxagerated facial expression/reactions, these tropes drive me up a fucking wall, some people may find them endearing, but I certainly do not, and there's no changing that. And there's sure as hell no point in arguing with me about it. Some people have different interests, anime is not one of mine.

The thing is, when you say something like that it would probably help to say what shows you've seen. There are genres, demographics[footnote]Basically, any anime adapted from a manga will have been printed in a magazine intended for a certain audience. This doesn't necessarily define the show, but you'll see certain genres and tropes in some demographics that you won't see in others (and they will often have their own). There are exceptions, and it isn't all-defining unless it's Shonen Jump anime, in which case you probably really are watching the same thing happen an infinite number of times.[/footnote], subgenres and so on, so the things you're describing may be more common or exclusive to a specific type of anime.

For example, a common complaint is that whole "ZOMG THE POWER OF FRIENDSHIP! OH SHEESH Y'ALL" thing. This is something that will usually only pop up in Shounen anime. Okay, that's not completely true[footnote]Obviously fantasy shows and magical girl shows will feature that, even if there's a stunning lack of non-romance Shoujo right now.[/footnote] but I'll assume it for the sake of the argument. If you've somehow had the misfortune to only watch this type of show, or only had this type of show recommended to you, you can be forgiven for thinking that represents the entire medium. Okay, that's also not completely true, but it's understandable.

Simply put: Know what you're getting into, and realize there's a variety of anime outside of the most obvious mainstream shows. If those tropes annoy you, consider the possibility that there is anime that *gasp* doesn't feature it.

That was... A very informative and non fanboy-ish reply, thank you.

The extent of the anime I've seen is either the stuff I used to watch on Adult Swim, and the stuff I've seen as a result of my brother's puzzling recent obsession with anime, I'll list all the ones I can remember, if I can remember their names, if you'd like.

Ghost in a Shell, Akira, Cowboy Bebop, Berserk, Inuyasha, Dragonball Z/Dragonball, Bleach, some iteration of Gundam, ("Gundam Wing" maybe? Not sure) Blue Gender, Macross something or other, FLCL (I think thats what its called, it was really, really weird.) and thats about all I can think of off the top of my head.

I've seen Akira all the way through, but most of them, excluding Dragonball Z, I've only seen a few episodes of, but wasn't really impressed. Granted all of this I've seen just because I either caught it on TV or came upon a friend watching it and stuck around. Maybe there's some magnificent anime that seems almost as if it was made specifically for me, but I wouldn't know, as I haven't really gone out of my way to find it, you understand.

Also, there's Princess Mononoke, which I adore, one of my favorite animate films, easily. So I don't hate it all.

The key to making FLCL makes sense is remembering that guitars=penises.

I love that OVA for a wide variety of reasons, but I'll fully admit that something that blatantly stylized (save for the South Park bit in one of the episodes) could easily alienate someone.

The Berserk anime is really, really bland aside of the soundtrack, mostly because animating the art of the original manga would be nearly impossible due to the detail, but also due to story cuts they made.

But why am I selling you on fantasy when I could be selling you on vikings [http://www.mangafox.com/manga/vinland_saga]?

I thought we were talking about anime, not the comic books? Sounds interesting, anyway, hard to go wrong with vikings. Though I don't much care for comic books, especially the ones that read backwards.

And... I'm not even going to ask about that FLCL show, all I know is, I saw a few episodes and thought it was the most mindnumbingly stupid thing I'd ever seen. I can't stand that whole "OMG RANDUM!!1!!1!!!" style, it's not funny.

 

[Nightshard]

I do like anime, but I'm really selective with my choices. A lot of stuff just doesn't appeal to me at all, while others have me jonesing for the next episode. Usually those types of shows are ones that break the usual mold and give a gratifyingly unique experience, some which have already been mentioned like Baccano, FLCL, and Evangelion. Others that I've taken a shine to would be Bakemonogatari, Eureka Seven, Mushishi, Durarara, Eden of the East, Welcome to the NHK, Gurren Lagann and Code Geass.
What tends to appeal to me are shows with substance and interesting characters; you can't just make a blanket statement saying all anime is bad, since that's like saying, say, all american-made movies are bad. There's a plethora of good stuff out there in many different genres, but I'll admit its buried under a lot of crap. Not saying the ones I listed are 'perfect' gods-gift-to-television shows either, but they appealed to me on deeper level than moe blobs, harems, magical girls and shounen heroes.

 

[FredTheUndead]

Sound awfully defensive there, simmer down.

There's no denying that a lot of Hollywood movies are garbage, only difference is, I can generally tolerate them, (barring a few terrible exceptions who's names should never be spoken) whereas most anime I just can't sit through, at all. The dialogue, the ridiculous, comic book-esque plots, the over-exxagerated facial expression/reactions, these tropes drive me up a fucking wall, some people may find them endearing, but I certainly do not, and there's no changing that. And there's sure as hell no point in arguing with me about it. Some people have different interests, anime is not one of mine.

The thing is, when you say something like that it would probably help to say what shows you've seen. There are genres, demographics[footnote]Basically, any anime adapted from a manga will have been printed in a magazine intended for a certain audience. This doesn't necessarily define the show, but you'll see certain genres and tropes in some demographics that you won't see in others (and they will often have their own). There are exceptions, and it isn't all-defining unless it's Shonen Jump anime, in which case you probably really are watching the same thing happen an infinite number of times.[/footnote], subgenres and so on, so the things you're describing may be more common or exclusive to a specific type of anime.

For example, a common complaint is that whole "ZOMG THE POWER OF FRIENDSHIP! OH SHEESH Y'ALL" thing. This is something that will usually only pop up in Shounen anime. Okay, that's not completely true[footnote]Obviously fantasy shows and magical girl shows will feature that, even if there's a stunning lack of non-romance Shoujo right now.[/footnote] but I'll assume it for the sake of the argument. If you've somehow had the misfortune to only watch this type of show, or only had this type of show recommended to you, you can be forgiven for thinking that represents the entire medium. Okay, that's also not completely true, but it's understandable.

Simply put: Know what you're getting into, and realize there's a variety of anime outside of the most obvious mainstream shows. If those tropes annoy you, consider the possibility that there is anime that *gasp* doesn't feature it.

That was... A very informative and non fanboy-ish reply, thank you.

The extent of the anime I've seen is either the stuff I used to watch on Adult Swim, and the stuff I've seen as a result of my brother's puzzling recent obsession with anime, I'll list all the ones I can remember, if I can remember their names, if you'd like.

Ghost in a Shell, Akira, Cowboy Bebop, Berserk, Inuyasha, Dragonball Z/Dragonball, Bleach, some iteration of Gundam, ("Gundam Wing" maybe? Not sure) Blue Gender, Macross something or other, FLCL (I think thats what its called, it was really, really weird.) and thats about all I can think of off the top of my head.

I've seen Akira all the way through, but most of them, excluding Dragonball Z, I've only seen a few episodes of, but wasn't really impressed. Granted all of this I've seen just because I either caught it on TV or came upon a friend watching it and stuck around. Maybe there's some magnificent anime that seems almost as if it was made specifically for me, but I wouldn't know, as I haven't really gone out of my way to find it, you understand.

Also, there's Princess Mononoke, which I adore, one of my favorite animate films, easily. So I don't hate it all.

The key to making FLCL makes sense is remembering that guitars=penises.

I love that OVA for a wide variety of reasons, but I'll fully admit that something that blatantly stylized (save for the South Park bit in one of the episodes) could easily alienate someone.

The Berserk anime is really, really bland aside of the soundtrack, mostly because animating the art of the original manga would be nearly impossible due to the detail, but also due to story cuts they made.

But why am I selling you on fantasy when I could be selling you on vikings [http://www.mangafox.com/manga/vinland_saga]?

I thought we were talking about anime, not the comic books? Sounds interesting, anyway, hard to go wrong with vikings. Though I don't much care for comic books, especially the ones that read backwards.

And... I'm not even going to ask about that FLCL show, all I know is, I saw a few episodes and thought it was the most mindnumbingly stupid thing I'd ever seen. I can't stand that whole "OMG RANDUM!!1!!1!!!" style, it's not funny.

Anime and manga (japanese comics) tend to go hand in hand, since most anime are adapted from manga anyway.

As for FLCL, it's actually not random at all, but as I said in a previous post, it was designed for the animators to lay back after End of Evangelion, so it's not terribly serious either.

 

[fulano]

I just don't see it. Aesthetically it all looks almost identical to me, the dialogue frequently seems overwrought, and poorly written, and the delivery is melodramatic at best, and cringeworthy at worst. The stories seem to never make sense to me, yet they almost always seem to feature some array of teenagers, each with their own flavor of angst. I suppose my overall attitude can be summed up with one word, namely stale. Then, perhaps I'm being close-minded. If anyone can sway my thoughts to the contrary, I would more then welcome it.

I have three propositions for you: Monster, GITS: SAC (Ghost In The Shell: Stand Alone Complex), and GITS: SAC--Second Gig (Ghost In The Shell: Stand Alone Complex--Second Gig), or Cowboy Bebop. Just give them a search.

What you seem to be complaining about is the whole Shonen subset of what anime is. I made it clear to myself that while I've enjoyed that in the past, I've grown out of it so I'm likely to watch something that is somewhat more adult from now on, and by that I mean picking and choosing form the whole of the seinen subset.

Only "anime" I ever enjoyed was Princess Mononoke by Hayao Miyazaki, but thats only because my love of film trumped my hatred of anime. It's a good movie, the plot is interesting, the acting is solid, the artwork is beautiful, and the soundtrack is amazing. I haven't seen his other films, so can't really speak for them, but Princess Mononoke is excellent, only anime I'd reccomend to anybody.

The rest of anime can fuck off though, it's all garbage.

That's, uh, broad, don't you think? Good stories are good stories, no matter where they come from. I'd suggest you give a go to the more adult, less generic choices, as you may well like them.