The KKK took my trooper away...

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Raven_Letters

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Nov 11, 2008
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Specter_ said:
True. But then I'm not on minimum wage. I negotiated my wage myself based on my performance.
Irrelevant, the fact that there is a a point at which you hit the level of a minimum wage buy which your employer is obligated to pay you, and those set minimum work conditions that are legally protected are a consequence of organized labour.

My working conditions suck. If anybody fought for THIS I'm gonna kill his ass. But the pay is good, so I carry on.
See above, also if your work conditions suck now, image how bad they would be without above laws in place.

And there is a difference between participating in these activities and posting on a messageboard to vent some anger.
So..you agree with me?

Yes. According to the nazi point of view the jews, homosexuals and gypsy were rodents. So they did it for the love of a pure race.
Al-Qaeda is a bunch of idiots, so I swap them for Taliban and Iraqi insurgents, if you don't mind. They, too, do their fighting and bombing for "love". The love of their country being free of invaders and foreign oppression. Another comparison: the french resistance during WW2 were deemed terrorists by the german occupants as much as the iraqi insurgents are deemed terrorists by the current occupants in the Iraq.
So basically what your saying is: So long as FROM YOUR PERSPECTIVE, the group in question can be relativized to just about any other group, i.e KKK compared to Trade Unions, what they do, no matter how horrific is "OK". So if tomorrow someone walks into your house with a automatic rifle, murders your family, shots you in the knees and then says he did it out of "love" for "<insert-race-ideology-religion-here>" you will be alright with it simply because by your own perspective, HIS perspective is as legitimate as yours. One would argue murder is murder, no matter what flavour it comes in.
 

Specter_

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Dec 24, 2008
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Raven_Letters said:
Specter_ said:
True. But then I'm not on minimum wage. I negotiated my wage myself based on my performance.
Irrelevant, the fact that there is a a point at which you hit the level of a minimum wage buy which your employer is obligated to pay you, and those set minimum work conditions that are legally protected are a consequence of organized labour.
True, there is a point. But then I know I'm good enough that should I ever hit that point with any employer, I'll get another, better paid job. So I still don't give a fuck about what a union did.

My working conditions suck. If anybody fought for THIS I'm gonna kill his ass. But the pay is good, so I carry on.
See above, also if your work conditions suck now, image how bad they would be without above laws in place.
See above. While I aknowledge that conditions can become so bad it's unbearable I strongly believe that some employers would advertize themselve by providing better conditions.

And there is a difference between participating in these activities and posting on a messageboard to vent some anger.
So..you agree with me?
Yes. I simply don't agree with someone being fired because of what group they "joined" (I still don't count registering on a messageboard and visiting a single event joining).

Yes. According to the nazi point of view the jews, homosexuals and gypsy were rodents. So they did it for the love of a pure race.
Al-Qaeda is a bunch of idiots, so I swap them for Taliban and Iraqi insurgents, if you don't mind. They, too, do their fighting and bombing for "love". The love of their country being free of invaders and foreign oppression. Another comparison: the french resistance during WW2 were deemed terrorists by the german occupants as much as the iraqi insurgents are deemed terrorists by the current occupants in the Iraq.
So basically what your saying is: So long as FROM YOUR PERSPECTIVE, the group in question can be relativized to just about any other group, i.e KKK compared to Trade Unions, what they do, no matter how horrific is "OK". So if tomorrow someone walks into your house with a automatic rifle, murders your family, shots you in the knees and then says he did it out of "love" for "<insert-race-ideology-religion-here>" you will be alright with it simply because by your own perspective, HIS perspective is as legitimate as yours. One would argue murder is murder, no matter what flavour it comes in.
I never said it's OK. All I said was that good and bad are purely subjective and as such deeming a group good or bad is subjective.
 

Xanadu84

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Apr 9, 2008
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ace_of_something said:
As a law enforcement official myself. I do believe he shouldn't been removed from active duty. At the same time there is no reason he couldn't be moved to say.... a tool and key department. Where his job would be maintaining radio equipment; not interacting with the public or at least letting him (see: forced him to) take his partial retirement; although I'm sure his dumb ass would've refused that.
Most reasonable solution by far. He can't safely deal with people, but he can at least have a job, without being totally kicked to the curb for a past mistake.
 

bad rider

The prodigal son of a goat boy
Dec 23, 2007
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SuperFriendBFG said:
bad rider said:
Okay people I give up I have been quoted out of my mind here, I give up, you win, lets start picking out minoritys and begin the social cleansing. Hal-le-lu-ja!
The Qu'Ran was never really changed since its original writing. For example I believe the Bible had some parts removed or changed to change the duty of Christians from spreading their religion to non-believers to accepting other religions not necessarily as fact but acknowledging that not everyone will believe what you do.

The fact that the Qu'Ran has remained largely unchanged to me is something pretty special. Yes it still contains the old messages of intolerance but most Muslim followers really don't view the Qu'Ran the same way Christians view the Bible. the Qu'Ran is more a historical reference in Muslim religion. The basis of the Muslim religion is really the Five Pillars.

"The shahadah, which is the basic creed or tenet of Islam: "'a?hadu 'al-l&#257; il&#257;ha ill&#257;-ll&#257;hu wa 'a?hadu 'anna mu&#295;ammadan ras&#363;lu-ll&#257;h", or "I testify that there is none worthy of worship except God and I testify that Muhammad is the Messenger of God." This testament is a foundation for all other beliefs and practices in Islam. Muslims must repeat the shahadah in prayer, and non-Muslims wishing to convert to Islam are required to recite the creed"

The oneness of God (tawheed) is to believe in Allah as one God with unmatched power and attributes, and admit to these unmatched powers of Allah by submitting to commands of Allah unconditionally. Tawheed teaches humbleness, human nature, humility, philanthropy, piousness, righteousness and doing the right thing and abstaining from all evil and sinful activities.

"Salah, or ritual prayer, which must be performed five times a day. Each salah is done facing towards the Kaaba in Mecca. Salah is intended to focus the mind on God, and is seen as a personal communication with him that expresses gratitude and worship. Salah is compulsory but flexibility in the specifics is allowed depending on circumstances. In many Muslim countries, reminders called Adhan (call to prayer) are broadcast publicly from local mosques at the appropriate times. The prayers are recited in the Arabic language, and consist of verses from the Qur'an."

Daily prayers (Salah) are five prayers evenly distributed throughout the day. Allah said in Quran that prayer protect from sins and unlawful activities: ?? and perform As-Salat (&#1608;&#1614;&#1571;&#1614;&#1602;&#1616;&#1605;&#1616; &#1575;&#1604;&#1589;&#1614;&#1617;&#1604;&#1614;&#1575;&#1577;&#1614;). Verily, As-Salat (the prayer) prevents from Al-Fahsha (&#1575;&#1604;&#1618;&#1601;&#1614;&#1581;&#1618;&#1588;&#1614;&#1575;&#1569; - i.e. great sins of every kind, unlawful sexual intercourse, etc.) and Al-Munkar (&#1575;&#1604;&#1618;&#1605;&#1615;&#1606;&#1603;&#1614;&#1585;&#1616; - i.e. disbelief, polytheism, and every kind of evil wicked deed, etc.) ...?

"Zakat, or alms-giving. This is the practice of giving based on accumulated wealth, and is obligatory for all Muslims who can afford it. A fixed portion is spent to help the poor or needy, and also to assist the spread of Islam. The zakat is considered a religious obligation (as opposed to voluntary charity) that the well-off owe to the needy because their wealth is seen as a "trust from God's bounty". The Qur'an and the hadith also suggest a Muslim give even more as an act of voluntary alms-giving"

Charity (Zakat) is due on all Muslim (based on financial ability). Zakat not only serves the purpose of welfare of citizens, but it also establishes relationship of kindness and love amongst various classes of the society. It reduces the love of material wealth in heart and increases the sense of helping other people in need.

"Sawm, or fasting during the month of Ramadan. Muslims must not eat or drink (among other things) from dawn to dusk during this month, and must be mindful of other sins. The fast is to encourage a feeling of nearness to God, and during it Muslims should express their gratitude for and dependence on him, atone for their past sins, and think of the needy. Sawm is not obligatory for several groups for whom it would constitute an undue burden. For others, flexibility is allowed depending on circumstances, but missed fasts usually must be made up quickly. Some Muslim groups do not fast during Ramadan, and instead have fasts different times of the year."

Sawm (fasting) is compulsory for Muslim in month of Ramadan. Fasting brings piousness and tawqa to Muslims. It not only teaches self control and abstinence from worldly desires but it also teaches the pain of others (who do not get enough food to eat).

"The Hajj, which is the pilgrimage during the Islamic month of Dhu al-Hijjah in the city of Mecca. Every able-bodied Muslim who can afford it must make the pilgrimage to Mecca at least once in his or her lifetime. When the pilgrim is about ten kilometers from Mecca, he must dress in Ihram clothing, which consists of two white seamless sheets. Rituals of the Hajj include walking seven times around the Kaaba, touching the Black Stone, running seven times between Mount Safa and Mount Marwah, and symbolically stoning the Devil in Mina. The pilgrim, or the hajji, is honored in his or her community, although Islamic teachers say that the Hajj should be an expression of devotion to God instead of a means to gain social standing."

The pilgrimage to Mecca (hajj) is a ritually obligatory on Muslims who can afford it (financially and physically). The hajj teaches attributes of self control, high morals, humility, modesty, brotherhood, kindness and caring.

The Five Pillars are pretty much the most important teachings of the Qu'Ran. In the strictest form of Muslim terrorists are outlaws because they are breaching one or more of the Five Pillars. The Muslim terrorists essentially believe historical reference should be taken literally.
Wait what are you quoting me on? I say I give up and you give me a lecture on the islamic faith. Can you quote the relevant information.
 

ace_of_something

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Sep 19, 2008
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Wow, this thread got way off track.

Seems from what I can surmise thus far more people are concerned with doling the maximum penelty to someone because of what the believe or 'could one day do.' Least that's the way it comes off.
 

Zer_

Rocket Scientist
Feb 7, 2008
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bad rider said:
Wait what are you quoting me on? I say I give up and you give me a lecture on the islamic faith. Can you quote the relevant information.
It was a purely informal post. I wasn't really quoting you on anything relevant.

And we label him a full-fledged, shaved head, white trash because that's what the KKK is. They are nothing more, and nothing less. He himself decided to join the KKK out of spite. What you seem to be arguing is that he is the ONE person who didn't join the KKK because he is racist. So why do you think he joined the KKK? Because he likes flowers? Give me a break.

Yeah his wife left him for a Hispanic, boo fucking hoo. I wouldn't give a flying crap if he said "Oh those damn Hispanics, stealing all our wives! Screw him!" out of spite. The thing is he joined the fucking KKK. By joining the KKK he relayed the message that he wants all Hispanics to be torched and killed.

You know I'd be on the cop's side had he been fired for getting into a fight with the Hispanic guy who took his wife. I'm NOT on the cop's side here because he knowingly joined the KKK.
 

KeyMaster45

Gone Gonzo
Jun 16, 2008
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I've said once, and I'll say it again, racism makes this dull depressing world of our so much more fun than it really is.

On topic though: If I were that man's superior I would be put in a rather lose lose situation. On the one hand I've got an (I'm assuming) good officer, but on the other I've got the public calling for his ass on a silver platter.

Now I wouldn't fire him, but since he is close to retirement I would just force him there to retire, the public gets their vindication and he doesn't have to start working at the local Wal-Mart for the rest of cognative life.
 

bad rider

The prodigal son of a goat boy
Dec 23, 2007
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SuperFriendBFG said:
bad rider said:
Wait what are you quoting me on? I say I give up and you give me a lecture on the islamic faith. Can you quote the relevant information.
It was a purely informal post. I wasn't really quoting you on anything relevant.

And we label him a full-fledged, shaved head, white trash because that's what the KKK is. They are nothing more, and nothing less. He himself decided to join the KKK out of spite. What you seem to be arguing is that he is the ONE person who didn't join the KKK because he is racist. So why do you think he joined the KKK? Because he likes flowers? Give me a break.

Yeah his wife left him for a Hispanic, boo fucking hoo. I wouldn't give a flying crap if he said "Oh those damn Hispanics, stealing all our wives! Screw him!" out of spite. The thing is he joined the fucking KKK. By joining the KKK he relayed the message that he wants all Hispanics to be torched and killed.

You know I'd be on the cop's side had he been fired for getting into a fight with the Hispanic guy who took his wife. I'm NOT on the cop's side here because he knowingly joined the KKK.
It's not that he's not racist (given he has a reason better than most)but as far as we can see he hasnt done anything wrong. If you really want to debate me on this go right ahead list me all the misdeeds he's performed.
 

Ionami

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Aug 21, 2008
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EnzoHonda said:
Police services, here in Canada anyway, take things like judgment and moral character very seriously when hiring officers (and they also keep the definitions very loose as to respond to different situations). I'm not sure what the rules are when firing someone, but I personally feel the rules should be the same.

Joined the KKK? Bad judgment, questionable moral character, inappropriate for police work.
Can't be that serious, where I live, several cops have raped young girls and had no repercussions.
 

incrediblegeek

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Feb 17, 2009
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bad rider said:
It's not that he's not racist (given he has a reason better than most)but as far as we can see he hasnt done anything wrong. If you really want to debate me on this go right ahead list me all the misdeeds he's performed.
#1: Joined the KKK.
 

L33tsauce_Marty

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Jun 26, 2008
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guardian001 said:
"I Hate blacks, hispanics, Jews, etc!"
Reminded me of a Pable Francisco standup to which his answer was a Jerry Springer immitation:" Well we just happen to have some blacks *beckens them forth* Mexicans, *punching noises* oh dear...here is a knife do something with the knife."
 

searanox

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Sep 22, 2008
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Don't you ever think that you have free speech. In fact, in Canada we have laws dedicated to preventing just that. Negative or anti- sentiment and speech is not the same as hate, but very few people stop to understand that when they themselves have been offended. For example, I have a very strong anti-Christian sentiment, but that doesn't translate into hatred for Christians, who I view as misguided individuals who may yet listen to reason. Such distinctions and "subtleties" usually go unnoticed. I have learned through experience that if you hold somewhat radical views, society will make it difficult for you to exist. That's how it works: those in power use that power to defend themselves; you and your ideas are the threat.
 

ace_of_something

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Sep 19, 2008
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Ionami said:
Can't be that serious, where I live, several cops have raped young girls and had no repercussions.
Umm wow, I would move. Our cops get sent to jail for having consensual sex with a prostitute while off duty.
 

bad rider

The prodigal son of a goat boy
Dec 23, 2007
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incrediblegeek said:
bad rider said:
It's not that he's not racist (given he has a reason better than most)but as far as we can see he hasnt done anything wrong. If you really want to debate me on this go right ahead list me all the misdeeds he's performed.
#1: Joined the KKK.
crime?