The Last Straw

[BoogieManFL]

The sad cold hard truth. All of it.

It's really a shame that my favorite developer, who made my favorite games, whose games I could buy simply by seeing BioWare on the box, is no more. The moment you gave your leash and balls to EA you were doomed.

 

[Souplex]

In Bethesda's defense, I liked the original ending of Fallout 3.
You took on the wastes from cradle to grave, and in the end you either died a hero, or were a selfish dick and made someone else die a hero. Or you took too long and everything exploded.

 

[Frostbite3789]

Snip

They fixed it for the low price of $15. And eight months later on the PS3. Yeah, if you want a comparison don't go for the company that releases broken games for a third of the platforms they release games for maybe.

Edit: I literally threw my controller on the ground and walked out of my room at the end of Fallout 3. I've not experienced that much rage at the ending of video game before or since. Not even ME3.

 

[DioWallachia]

http://www.forbes.com/sites/davidthier/2012/08/13/only-42-of-players-finished-mass-effect-3/

Well, since 42% of the people that played it finished it, it was a matter of time before those gave up their hopes and swallow their pride to continue their "videogamey" experience. Cant blame them, i would haven taken 9 months to endure all that too.

May i suggest for you to play the older games like Baldurs Gate? or have fun with the hero journey cliche on BW games?

Or how about even OLDER games that werent made by BW like Fallout 1 - 2 and Planescape: Torment? Maybe you can also check Star Control 2 to experience first hand the game that inspired ME? How about an Action RPG like Deus Ex, Sacrifice (RTS RPG), or IJI where your choices matter?

You know, stuff more productive that isnt something that we already know or wasnt already explained in sheer detail of why such endings suck. Like these articles did:

http://awtr.wikidot.com/long:this-is-not-a-pipe
http://doycetesterman.com/index.php/2012/03/mass-effect-tolkein-and-your-bullshit-artistic-process/

 

[Beautiful End]

I'll admt i didn't read all of your post, but i think i read enough.

So after all the games you mentioned like mass Effect 1 & 2, KotOR, Dragon Age 1(and to a lesser extent 2) and all the other ones you mentioned, but you're at your 'last straw' because of Mass Effect 3 and a failed MMO?

oooooooooookaaaaaaaaaay

Exactly my thoughts. I understand he's pissed at BioWare, or more like EA, but he mentioned a bunch of things he liked about BioWare and because of the ME3 ending and KOTOR, BOOM! They suck!

Nut you're entitled to your opinion, I guess. I mean, if someone asked me why I hate recent Capcom, I could give a very lengthy list that would back that up. Square Enix? see, they've screwed up like twice in my book so I give them the benefit of doubt because I know they're good and at least they're trying.

Anyway, this isn't anything new. Move along now.

 

[Batou667]

Dear Random Forumgoer,

Your impassioned rant has touched assholes our souls, and we have gone away and done some soul searching. We now realise the error of our ways. From this point forth, we are no longer in the videogames market to make money, but instead to pander to the whims of every "long time and dedicated fan" (aren't they all) who has a grievance.

Sincerely,

Bioware

ps, How did you correctly guess that the decision-makers of a multinational company had nothing better to do than scour gaming forums for non-positive feedback on their games? Another example of your genius!

Spoiler

Oh wait, that never happened.

 

[veloper]

That was cute. A bit late to the party I say.
I gradually lost interest in Bioware after Bioware stopped making games based on D&D. BG2 was Bio's high point.

Now with their founders burned out and retired and their best writer gone, how much time shall we give Bioware? A year or two?

 

[The Funslinger]

... Just another Mass Effect 3 Ending Thread...

On another note, was Sonic Dark Brotherhood any good?

I played about 2/3s of that game.

It was enjoyable. It was no Final Fantasy Tactics/Pokemon, etc, but I liked it for what it was and it had some interesting depth.

OT: Melodrama, melodrama everywhere!

Edit: I didn't stop because it became boring, but rather party-wise I ran myself into a bit of a brick wall on a boss battle. Then other things swept me away.

 

[Mojo]

God I love posting this.. Hehe. Although its not pandemic it gets the point across...

That was the best thing I saw concerning this topic in a looong time. Thank you.

OT: Opinions. Yes the ending was bad, the extended cut made it somewhat better for me.
Come on guys, its gonna be a year soon, let it go. I loved ME3 nonetheless, no one is forcing you to to so, but do we really need to force this debate so long?

 

[kingthrall]

No, this has nothing to do with the Dragon Age 2 quest of the same name.

BioWare... *Sigh* I'm at the end of the road with you.

I've been forced to defend myself from trolls, forumgoers on so many different places, and who knows what else to defend you after That Ending.

I tried, BioWare, I really did. But... I can't lie to myself any more.

I mean, our relationship started out so wonderful, with the shiny lights of the Citadel as we first met Shepard, the Mako, those frickin' elevators... I even dug up my Nintendo DS to try out Sonic Chronicles The Dakr Brotherhood, I loved Mass Effect so much!

When Dragon Age Origins came out, I was a little under the age cert, so I borrowed the Ultimate Edition, and loved all of it- the characters, the plot, all of it!

And then Mass Effect 2 happened- from strength to strength, you implemented cover shooting, a new system and great characters... and a mining system we all ignored when we got 50, 000 in each resource after beating the game. And then the DLC happened- Kasumi, Overlord, Lair Of The Shadow Broker, Arrival, that pack with the Mattock Rifle... pure excelence.

And then I went and played KOTOR. Sure, the Revan twist was ruined before I played it, but it introduced me to a club on DeviantArt where I met most of my friends on that website!

Sure, Dragon Age 2 was repetitive in its enviroments (Presumably since you only stopped making Origins DLC around half a year before DA2 came out), but you made up for it with the characters, from wannabe terrorist Anders, to Brooding Fenris, to Saucy Isabella... all lovable in their own right.

And then? Mass Effect 3 happened.

Oh, it was a great ride up to the end- Rannoch, Tuchanka, Thessia until Kai Leng showed up... it felt like it was all leading up to a massive drum smash- the finale we all wanted.

And then I reached the Starchild. And then after I picked my colour... I was disappointed with a BioWare game for the first time since I'd met you.

And all of the "Artistic Integrity," stuff? Really? I was happy when a rogue employee said that Casey appearantely hijacked the ending and wrote it himself- soem logic was available to salvage this, surely?

But then I looked back and forward- at The Old Republic's misarable Free-To-Play options, at the horror that was Mass Effect Deception, and Liara's status as a Creator's Pet that should just STFU... and I realised one thing.

Everything you've touched since Mass effect 2 has failed to satisfy everyone in the way your old games did.

And you know why?

E. ****ing. A.

You wanted a bigger paycheck at the end, right? Just wanted to take us for granted, lead us along with a Grand Finale while the puppetmaster played his sogn and dance, deliving a dagger blow to our hearts for the Deus Ex Machina that was The Ending, at how the Extended Cut merely made the endings bearable, at how Refusal was a slap in the face, at how Dragon Age 2 and ME3 were rushed, at how Priority Earth was cut in half when the game files made it sound magnificant, at how Kai Leng was pathetic both as a villian and as a character, at Liara's supposed "Plot importance," despite her not being there while Garrus and Tali were, at how I KNOW Dragon Age 3 will be rushed, and how I know that this time next year I'll just stop looking the other way and just stop lying to myself.

There are plenty of decent Sci-Fi authors out there who would have jumped at the chance to write Deception, yet you pick an idiot, while an author like Peter Watts would have been perfect for the novels after Drew left to piss on my dreams about what happened to Revan and Exile (Stabbed in the back by The New Guy? REALLY?), and you don't even have the balls to reference the Indoctrination Theory, despite it being better then YOUR ending.

I've had it BioWare. The only way I'd stay with you is if you actually make the Ending worthwhile, No Starchild, No cut elements from Priority Earth, No ****ing Red, Blue or Green. I'd only stay if you publicly apologised for the ending- not fire anyone, just say "Sorry" for making a bad ending to an otherwise fantastic game and for throwing a ****ing IGN reporter in there who couldn't emote if she was on fire.

What's that? EA won't let you? ****'em.

Obsidian proved that Kickstarter is worthwhile- if you used that, then you'd certainyl have enough cash to make your games.

Remember the glory days, BioWare? They were when you made money so you could make games, not when you made games to make money.

Look at what Dead Space 3 has become- nothing like the original. Battlefield? It's getting worse all the time to fight a brand that's just not worth talkign about anymore- I mean, Medal Of Honour died a long time ago.

If Bethesda made this mistake, they'd fix it- oh wait. They DID. Fallout 3 Broken Steel? They even added an entire new quest chain, new gear,characters- we'll be lucky if Shepard just gets to see everyone again.

I've just... I'm really sorry, BioWare. But you forced my hand.

If Dragon Age 3 is just another example of EA rushing you, that's it- I'm done, no more BioWare games shall be bought by me ever again.

So, might as well pack my bags then, if it's coming out next year.
-Gone Rampant.

PS: I copied this from BioWare Social, since I expect it to be pulled down. If I made spelling errors, my spellcheck program doesn't work there, strangely.

Get the baldurs gate Enhanced edition and support this semi-kickstarter to make a baldurs gate 3 hopefully, forget about EA entirely and move on. Ive stopped buying COD, Bioware and Blizzard games now cause ive yet to see anything decent from then in the past ten years. And I have reaped the rewards of having more to spend on better things.

 

[Erttheking]

Is it me, or is everyone in this thread being pretty rude?

 

[DioWallachia]

God I love posting this.. Hehe. Although its not pandemic it gets the point across...

That was the best thing I saw concerning this topic in a looong time. Thank you.

OT: Opinions. Yes the ending was bad, the extended cut made it somewhat better for me.
Come on guys, its gonna be a year soon, let it go. I loved ME3 nonetheless, no one is forcing you to to so, but do we really need to force this debate so long?

I think that is just the fact that the people who like it have a hard time saying WHY they like it because if they do then someone is going to point out the plot holes of their favorite scenes and will REFUSE to listen to reason.

For example, there was this one guy that said that ME3 is a good game because he didnt even care about the story and just played it like a normal shooter. I pointed out that in that case the game still fails because its "selling point" was the story and his opinion is the equivalent of saying that The Mona Lisa is good Art because the material it was made burns very well and keeps me warm during the cold night, and that he may as well have played Gears Of War 3.

 

[DioWallachia]

SNIP

Now, speaking as a souless monster of untold ugliness and greed, i am offended by EA. Not because their evil destroys more souls than mein good friend Cthulhu and Xenu COMBINED, but because they are so innept at exploiting even MORE the fans that its too amateur to join our club of hedonistic ponces. Think about it, they could have milked the franchize of ME DRY if they ordered BW to make the golden ending to be ONLY available for the people who had played the ENTIRE trilogy and had the saves with the best of the best choices, everyone else gets the bad ending 100% of the time. This will allow them to force more people (specially the COD drones that they brainwashed into playing the 3rd game with the marketing) to PAID for either the old games or a collector edition unless they want to be left behind by their friends who already played it and having fun.

"Everyone is doing it!! why dont you??"

Aaaah, Argumentum Ad Populum, what would be the world without you?

 

[Mojo]

I think that is just the fact that the people who like it have a hard time saying WHY they like it because if they do then someone is going to point out the plot holes of their favorite scenes and will REFUSE to listen to reason.

For example, there was this one guy that said that ME3 is a good game because he didnt even care about the story and just played it like a normal shooter. I pointed out that in that case the game still fails because its "selling point" was the story and his opinion is the equivalent of saying that The Mona Lisa is good Art because the material it was made burns very well and keeps me warm during the cold night, and that he may as well have played Gears Of War 3.

Possibly. That's still no reason to discuss why the ending was bad/whose fault it was for almost a year.
I liked ME3, no matter how many flaws you point out, Ill still love it. If that guy you mentioned said that ME3 was a great game for the shooter mechanics, then that's debatable. They were far better then the ones in the first two games, but than other third person shooters such as gears? I cant say. If he said he liked ME3 as a shooter and didn't care about the story, then that's a valid opinion. If he enjoyed the game then that's that. Also you cant say ME3 "failed" because YOU thought the story sucked. If I say the Modern Warfare games "fail" because the story/multiplayer/whatever sucks and they are always the same game, then that's a false statement. Modern Warfare 3 made 1 billion dollars throughout the world in 16 days. That doesn't sound like a fail to me.

 

[The_Waspman]

DA3 is coming out late next year and started development over a year and a half ago i believe. so it's not that rushed is it?

18 months? Thats how long Dragon Age 2 was in development. No, what Bioware are claiming is that it has been in development longer than Dragon Age 2 and mass Effect 2, aren't they? Considering the first Dragon Age was in development for six years prior to release, then no matter how you look at it, Dragon Age 3 is going to be rushed. I mean, it was only officially announced a few months ago wasn't it? About a year prior to release?

Don't get me wrong. I liked Dragon Age. I even liked the second one. And I defended it loudly and often. Then I went back and had a quick go at it this week. Ugh, what was I thinking? I was playing the DLC, and my party ran past a pile of skeletons, and one of them said 'Ugh, disgusting.' and my immediate thought was 'Ugh, low res textures.'

Honestly, the skeletons lying around in the first tomb raider were about on par with these.

I don't hold out much hope for Dragon Age 3, though I will still play it...

 

[Erttheking]

Is it me, or is everyone in this thread being pretty rude?

This thread was self-important and largely a waste of time. It's only natural that people who are sick of the site being taken up by posts like this would start to display hostility whenever it comes up.

No offense, but you say that like two wrongs make a right. They don't

 

[DioWallachia]

Possibly. That's still no reason to discuss why the ending was bad/whose fault it was for almost a year.
I liked ME3, no matter how many flaws you point out, Ill still love it. If that guy you mentioned said that ME3 was a great game for the shooter mechanics, then that's debatable. They were far better then the ones in the first two games, but than other third person shooters such as gears? I cant say. If he said he liked ME3 as a shooter and didn't care about the story, then that's a valid opinion. If he enjoyed the game then that's that. Also you cant say ME3 "failed" because YOU thought the story sucked. If I say the Modern Warfare games "fail" because the story/multiplayer/whatever sucks and they are always the same game, then that's a false statement. Modern Warfare 3 made 1 billion dollars throughout the world in 16 days. That doesn't sound like a fail to me.

Dude, arent you a bit of a grown up to use that kind of statement? by that logic i can say that Twilight is a good story because its a best seller along Scientology books and Mein Kampf.

Hell, lets not forget that there could be external factors to the success of MW3 like: 1)People are afraid of new things and change. Why choose another game series when i know this one and wont dissapoint my low expectations?
2)People want to keep shooting terrorist in the face in revenge of 9/11. Lets face it, these games series went on his high point went the catastrofe was happen, and while Hollywood was making more mature movies on the subject, the game industry said "HEY! here are some people you can shoot over and over!". And dont tell me that they WONT do that because, if you recall correctly, the Black Ops 2 trailer even had a mention of the "1% on Wall Street" . This series is ALL about cashing in on tragedies.
3)The series is the lowest common denominator of what a "game" is:

People like it? whatever, as long as they have played something ELSE (Painkiller or Serious Sam) and tell me WHY they still like it, of course. I believe that most likely, the reason of why games like ME get labeled as "the best game ever" is because people didnt play anything else in the past or just plain forgot 10 years of gaming history. Fortunately, the ending controversy allowed the series to be compared with other story based games around choice like: Baldur's Gate, Fallout 1 and 2, Planescape Torment, Sacrifice, Deus Ex (the ending seems inspired on it) and IJI. And demostrate the sheer diference in quality from back then and now.


ME3 controversy is just a segway into a bigger discussion. A more worthy one is the WHY changing one's vision will send the medium 20 years back. I am NOT going to repeat what i already wrote so here is a link of what i concluded on what MUST be discussed:

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/9.392512-I-liked-the-Mass-Effect-3-ending?page=5

Post 165.

 

[DioWallachia]

Possibly. That's still no reason to discuss why the ending was bad/whose fault it was for almost a year.

In the other hand, yes, there is ALL the reasons to do so. In the same way that people keep reminding other that Transformer 2 Revenge of The Fallen and Twilight are bad storytelling, the same is going to happen for the gamers. People WILL constantly remind us how EA fucked hard the last long lasting RPG series (9 titles) of Ultima and how BW that we have now is way too incompetent than the original.

Even developers keep talking about their own old mistakes since they need to learn from them in order to progress as profesionals