The Mech: Militarily Feasible?

[Lotet]

i believe that tanks themselves are things of the past.

nowadays the yanks have aircraft which can map out every single armoured vehicle in theatre in about twenty seconds, if won't be too long before some bright spark makes the B-1s carry homing missiles, so as far as i can see the enemie's armour will be destroyed in the first day of any future war with america.

and if there is no enemy armour there is precious little need to bring armour of our own. even if you can think of a reasonable reason to bring a challenger it is a massive logisitcal head ache (the main limiting factor for the american advance of the Gulf Wars was the fact their armour kept on out running its own fuel) as well as that you have countless blokes running around not well pacifified areas trying to keep it supplied.

there is nothing armour can do which air power can't do quicker, better, more accurately and safer.

(oh and before anyone says it, if you don't have air superiority your going to die. all your shiney armour vehicles (or boats) will be are targets, e.g. the falklands, gulf 1, and gulf 2)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FUUeqSseERo&feature=related

modern Anti-Air is NOT controlled manually, it's controlled by a computer and radar because it's impossible to hide when you're always out in the open, radars can spor Air Units from over 10 Miles away and that's just the small ones mounted on tanks, you think air units can blow anything apart from a safe height? and you also believe we wouldn't make a way to counter them?

a single round from that rapid fire cannon can rip a hole in an aircraft and at those speed that single hole will rip a wing off. and by the way, Fighter Planes cannot fly between continents, they need airports and aircraft-carriers to follow them where ever they go. aircraft-carriers are also often equiped with plenty of anti-air with huge radars to back up the defense

did I forget to mention that missiles can be blown out of the sky with this same technology?

 

[TheGreatCoolEnergy]

Well, there are pros and cons of mechs. A mech would be able to traverse difficult terrain a normal tread tank would be unable to cross, but at the same time, a well placed RPG to the leg could easily immobalize it.

 

[Hugh Mann]

Hello Escapists!
I think that exoskeletons will be the next evolution in warfare between 1st world countries
1 Cyber warfare attempts to disrupt enemy communications and intelligence
2 High altitude stealth air craft bomb military, and Infrastructure targets
3 Drones attack more precise targets, particularly enemy air defense and particular persons of interest
4 Air superiority achieved Vtol aircraft deploy exoskeleton clad infantry to capture major political centers and destroy any remaining threats
5 Troops 'compel' nations leaders to armistice

The reason that the troops mentioned would have to be exoed would be that these troops would have to by necessity have a great amount of shock value. These suits when augmented by the current Future Warrior program would have a great deal of tactical flexibility along with outstanding situational awareness. This all revolves around a lighting strike to end the war quickly and so no long term gear would be necessary and since they wouldn't be around long you don't need to worry about power supply. The result is the soldier performing at peak efficiency, they know were the targets are and the exos could carry a lot of armor and equipment. In essence its a hammer blow concentrated right where it hurts, like if a sledge hammer could hit your face crotch charlie-horse and gut all at the same time leaveing the country in general a twitching heap of defeatness

 

[Lotet]

Hello Escapists!
I think that exoskeletons will be the next evolution in warfare between 1st world countries
1 Cyber warfare attempts to disrupt enemy communications and intelligence
2 High altitude stealth air craft bomb military, and Infrastructure targets
3 Drones attack more precise targets, particularly enemy air defense and particular persons of interest
4 Air superiority achieved Vtol aircraft deploy exoskeleton clad infantry to capture major political centers and destroy any remaining threats
5 Troops 'compel' nations leaders to armistice

The reason that the troops mentioned would have to be exoed would be that these troops would have to by necessity have a great amount of shock value. These suits when augmented by the current Future Warrior program would have a great deal of tactical flexibility along with outstanding situational awareness. This all revolves around a lighting strike to end the war quickly and so no long term gear would be necessary and since they wouldn't be around long you don't need to worry about power supply. The result is the soldier performing at peak efficiency, they know were the targets are and the exos could carry a lot of armor and equipment. In essence its a hammer blow concentrated right where it hurts, like if a sledge hammer could hit your face crotch charlie-horse and gut all at the same time leaveing the country in general a twitching heap of defeatness

the country might give up 'on paper' but you'll find that a well co-ordinated battle plan only lasts until contact with the enemy and there are too many uncontrolable varibles and unknown defenses that will prove to be the most painful in your attack, in War, what you don't know will hurt you

unless you expect the enemy to do exactly what you want them to do. if so then you don't understand the chaos of the human mind. countries don't operate like in a strategy game, there is no guarantee that destroying key locations will get them down, and if you think your spies will give you enough intelligence on what the enemy has to offer then what makes you believe thier spies don't know what you have at hand and have set up counter measures?

man I love talking about War and Tactics, don't you?

 

[The Heik]

So help me, you better not have made this thread after seeing Avatar.

No worries, I had this thought way before the Holidays, and though I like the idea of the hand actuators, the AMP's overall design was pretty stupid, with a huge window in a poisonous atmosphere environment where the enemy shoots small trees at you.

I we have them then we need to make 'em for speed. give the Mechs roller skates like in Code Geass.

you folks know how it's easier to hit targets in video games than it is in real life? mainly because you're not actually fearing for your life. now, lets put a mech into you game of choice, think you can hit that fast and constantly moving targets joints with your rocket launcher? and by the way, if the joints were the weak spots then the entire thing would collapse under its own weight, this is a goverment funded vehicle, the elbow would NOT be a spinning hinge, nah, we can make waaay better stuff than that, I bet you could make a better elbow than that, couldn't you?

still think you can hit the joint before it reaches your position? sure, Mech are utterly useless compared to infantry for "holding ground". heck, Tanks get thier asses whooped without infantry to follow them around

we're not making a tank on legs, we're making a Mech, make it 15ft and it could smash a modern civilian building, back it up with Infantry to provide covering fire so the enemy will keep thier heads down

you think it's Untactical? then try using Tactics. no single military unit can win a war, not infantry, tanks, gunships or even Nukes, there's a counter for ALL weapons whether you know it or not, you need the other units to compensate for the weaknesses of the rest

Good Day Sir!

And to agree with Pendrageon9, DAAAMMN (needs the accent though)!

 

[Soggy_Popcorn]

High center of mass = fail, but if it retained a conventional tank-like shape and used 4+ legs for movement, it could work. I think mounting legs as auxiliary devices in addition to treads could be great.

Think more of the clone wars type walkers instead of the AT-ST type walkers.

 

[Athlumney]

We already have this mech built by an ex military engineer, it uses hydraulic pistons to move.

 

[rabidmidget]

The leg part is becoming more feasible as people are creating more realistic bipedal movement in robots, they can even be pushed and they can balance themselves and keep walking.

Even if they never become used in the military, if I ever become rich enough, I would sink my entire fortune to create a working one.

 

[Toaster Hunter]

Even if there is an effective desighn, there is no advantage that they would give that a normal tank can accomplish more cheaply and with better stability (I never heard of a tank falling over). There simply is no point. Also the legs would be more vulnerable (and more difficult to repair) than any tank tread.

Also any advantage they may have is nullified by two words: AIR STRIKE

 

[Singularly Datarific]

I'm thinking more along the lines of "How the hell do you control this?!?" then "Are they useful?". The only way I can think of is to put your legs in some sort of harness with sensors, and about 15 joysticks. That is for the larger ones.
I think the Avatar 'mechs seem the most feasible due to their relative small size and full body control system, so perhaps a less ugly version of that would be interesting.
Also, Exosuits seem pretty viable, compared to the other choice, due to them just being big armor.
EDIT: On the other end of the spectrum, what are the military uses for mechs? Tanks are far cheaper and can carry heavier guns, and better armor. As someone previously stated, anything running particularly hot will be targeted within 5 seconds with current technology.
Add that with a cluster bomb, and your whole squad is dead.
Maybe an opposite counterpart would be stealth infantry, unable to be targeted with any computer guided weaponry, acting as tank-hunters. Think about it, what weapons can be on power armor that cannot be used by infantry in some way? We have powerful anti-tank weapons already, there is no reason to have any more powerful guns than what is already in use.

 

[Lotet]

oh, I almost forgot, you need a visual of the target to get him. which is why urban warfare is great for hiding, even a mech, it won't take much of a talkin' to with your pilots to get them to stay near buildings that are taller than they are. plus we can graft an anti-aircraft gattling gun (or two!) to a mech with a built-in radar for computed precision targeting, great against flying units and lightly armoured ground forces, plus any missiles fired by fighter planes and gunships

personally, I believe the quick mechs should actually avoid tanks. yes, tanks have a simple purpose and they do it very well, they're tough with a big cannon and support guns. if I want a tank removed there are plenty of other units to do the job

like I said before, no single unit can win a war, so you mech supporters and haters shouldn't act like they should/n't because war ain't ever that simple

of course, you know war ain't simple, which is why you're here

 

[Soxafloppin]

Wheels > Legs.

So no.

 

[HotFezz8]

i believe that tanks themselves are things of the past.

nowadays the yanks have aircraft which can map out every single armoured vehicle in theatre in about twenty seconds, if won't be too long before some bright spark makes the B-1s carry homing missiles, so as far as i can see the enemie's armour will be destroyed in the first day of any future war with america.

and if there is no enemy armour there is precious little need to bring armour of our own. even if you can think of a reasonable reason to bring a challenger it is a massive logisitcal head ache (the main limiting factor for the american advance of the Gulf Wars was the fact their armour kept on out running its own fuel) as well as that you have countless blokes running around not well pacifified areas trying to keep it supplied.

there is nothing armour can do which air power can't do quicker, better, more accurately and safer.

(oh and before anyone says it, if you don't have air superiority your going to die. all your shiney armour vehicles (or boats) will be are targets, e.g. the falklands, gulf 1, and gulf 2)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FUUeqSseERo&feature=related

modern Anti-Air is NOT controlled manually, it's controlled by a computer and radar because it's impossible to hide when you're always out in the open, radars can spor Air Units from over 10 Miles away and that's just the small ones mounted on tanks, you think air units can blow anything apart from a safe height? and you also believe we wouldn't make a way to counter them?

a single round from that rapid fire cannon can rip a hole in an aircraft and at those speed that single hole will rip a wing off. and by the way, Fighter Planes cannot fly between continents, they need airports and aircraft-carriers to follow them where ever they go. aircraft-carriers are also often equiped with plenty of anti-air with huge radars to back up the defense

did I forget to mention that missiles can be blown out of the sky with this same technology?

russian anti air weaponary (sorry, modern russian anti air weaponary) didn't work so well in the second gulf war, or the first gulf war, or the falklands, or the arab israel wars... the best way to keep air craft from bombing the shit out of you is to have air superiority.

the yanks have these things you may have heard of: stealth aircraft

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-g5BTfhzgZU

 

[The Austin]

Mechs are very feasible, but economically stupid. Why build a multi-billion dollar Mech only to have it blown to bits by a platoon of tanks?

 

[HotFezz8]

i believe that tanks themselves are things of the past.

nowadays the yanks have aircraft which can map out every single armoured vehicle in theatre in about twenty seconds, if won't be too long before some bright spark makes the B-1s carry homing missiles, so as far as i can see the enemie's armour will be destroyed in the first day of any future war with america.

and if there is no enemy armour there is precious little need to bring armour of our own. even if you can think of a reasonable reason to bring a challenger it is a massive logisitcal head ache (the main limiting factor for the american advance of the Gulf Wars was the fact their armour kept on out running its own fuel) as well as that you have countless blokes running around not well pacifified areas trying to keep it supplied.

there is nothing armour can do which air power can't do quicker, better, more accurately and safer.

(oh and before anyone says it, if you don't have air superiority your going to die. all your shiney armour vehicles (or boats) will be are targets, e.g. the falklands, gulf 1, and gulf 2)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FUUeqSseERo&feature=related

modern Anti-Air is NOT controlled manually, it's controlled by a computer and radar because it's impossible to hide when you're always out in the open, radars can spor Air Units from over 10 Miles away and that's just the small ones mounted on tanks, you think air units can blow anything apart from a safe height? and you also believe we wouldn't make a way to counter them?

a single round from that rapid fire cannon can rip a hole in an aircraft and at those speed that single hole will rip a wing off. and by the way, Fighter Planes cannot fly between continents, they need airports and aircraft-carriers to follow them where ever they go. aircraft-carriers are also often equiped with plenty of anti-air with huge radars to back up the defense

did I forget to mention that missiles can be blown out of the sky with this same technology?

sorry, almost forget, a) ground based AA has a visual range of 3 miles for anything lower than 50 feet. seeing as modern jets measure their speed by the speed of sound and have perfected nap of the earth approach (that is to say, flying very low) 3 - 5 miles gives you about twenty seconds to locate, target, and fire.

b) shoulder launched AA missiles (famously the stinger) are not massively useful. they are over hyped, period. the taliban have them in afghanistan and have for 6 years, but nowadays even attack helicopters have chaff and counter measures aboard, and if you can't shoot down a helicopter you have no chance against a jet.

c) re. your comment on a bullet going straight through a jet. yes, it would, but 1 piece of AAA has (sorry, anti air artillery) has no chance of hitting anything. in the falkland islands when the invasion fleet was offloading their materials the argentine jets flew low enough to be shot at with rifle rounds (also powerful enough to take it apart) and still, with 3,000 paras and commandos and the combined weaponary of 10 + ships aircraft were still getting in and out safely.

d) ok, lets say you have a magic AA grid. just like gulf 1 and 2 the enemy (assuming he is technologically superior, i.e. US coalition) puts in SF (special forces), who direct in Tomahawk missiles from submarines, which fly at 50 feet and 500 miles per hour. a giant hole is blown in you AA coverage, stealth aircraft fly in, you country is gutted.

 

[Slash2x]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mlbJCwWsJEk

Did everyone forget heavy gear? NEVER EVER watch the anime though it is why people make fun of anime.

 

[Faulty Turmoil]

I think mechs are tactically retarded and they should stick to Sci-fi.

 

[ad5x5]

tanks, mechs, APCs - all on the way out

when that link I posted earlier gets working, it'll be infantry all the way.

powered infantry, but still infantry