The reason I hate Michael Bay
- Thread starter cuddly_tomato
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But that slot's been reserved for Rosie O'Donnell- ah fuck it, always room for one more, even with that blubberguts on the shortlist...Furburt said:
Very few people are bashing his films for being dumb action. They're bashing them for being BAD dumb action.Hardcore_gamer said:
The thing about Transformers 1 is this - it had Spielberg as co-producer. During some of the scenes you could almost imagine him on set, standing behind Bay with a copper mallet in his hand, saying "if you shake that camera one more time Michael it's lights out for you". Transformers 2 was Bay all on his own, being handed the reigns to do with as he pleased, Spielberg presumably having gone to aid George Lucas in assassinating Indiana Jones. We saw the result.SideburnsPuppy said:
A parallel can be drawn between Batman Forever and Batman and Robin. Both films were directed by Joel Schumacher. However, Batman Forever was produced by Tim Burton, and as a result you could see some of his attempts to keep the film actually reasonable. Without Burton watching over Batman and Robin, the film descended into a shit heap that put the franchise on ice for years (I could drop a Mr Freeze quip in there but I shall resist the urge).
The difference is Schumacher was never trusted with another big budget film again. Bay is being given the task of making Transformers 3. This is why he is such an ass, and must be stopped by any means necessary.
As Spoony said, Michael Bay is an attack dog. He's given movies that with craptacular plots, told to make some 'epic' fight/destruction scenes and then go home and bathe in money. He does exactly what he is told and in doing so creates movies that are fairly poor yet sell well as eye candy. Issues with his camera work or lens flare are trivial as even without these the movies would be terrible. Give Transformers 2 or Armageddon to any other director without allowing them to influence or change the script and maintain the same level of producer pressure and you wouldn't have a good movie, no way in hell would you have a good movie.
Steve Spielberg produced Transformers 2, don't ya know. Now I'm sure that had he wanted to make a good movie than the plot would have been good. Everything wrong with that script could have been removed if he had wanted it to be so but he didn't, instead he gave a shitty story to Bay and Bay was told to turn that into a movie. Roberto Orci, Alex Kurtzman and Ehren Kruger were responsible for the script and Speilberg was all to willing to let that script fly, if anything they should be held responsible for the travesty that is Transformers 2. Orci and Kurtzman are also responsible for The Island, Mission Impossible 3, Transformers 1 and the new Star Trek. They as well as all the other writers and producers behind Bay deserve more criticism than anyone else. They create shitty stories and they fund shitty movies, Bay just controls the the speed of the swirling camera.
Bay is a shithouse director and I doubt that he ever tries to make a movie in any other way than how he is told to made, but it is poor form to not look past him and claim that he is the sole reason for a movie being terrible. If he completely funded, wrote and directed his own movie than it would probably suck and you'd have reason to criticize him.
EDIT:
Steve Spielberg produced Transformers 2, don't ya know. Now I'm sure that had he wanted to make a good movie than the plot would have been good. Everything wrong with that script could have been removed if he had wanted it to be so but he didn't, instead he gave a shitty story to Bay and Bay was told to turn that into a movie. Roberto Orci, Alex Kurtzman and Ehren Kruger were responsible for the script and Speilberg was all to willing to let that script fly, if anything they should be held responsible for the travesty that is Transformers 2. Orci and Kurtzman are also responsible for The Island, Mission Impossible 3, Transformers 1 and the new Star Trek. They as well as all the other writers and producers behind Bay deserve more criticism than anyone else. They create shitty stories and they fund shitty movies, Bay just controls the the speed of the swirling camera.
Bay is a shithouse director and I doubt that he ever tries to make a movie in any other way than how he is told to made, but it is poor form to not look past him and claim that he is the sole reason for a movie being terrible. If he completely funded, wrote and directed his own movie than it would probably suck and you'd have reason to criticize him.
EDIT:
There was well a year and a month (roughly) between Indy 4 and the release of Transformers 2 so I think it unlikely that he was still working on that while Transformers 2 was being filmed. I think that if anything, Spielberg would have been absent from Transformers 1. Putting this to aside however, as Producer Spielberg has more control over the film than Bay to level that he could choose director so even if he did give Bay free reign (which I doubt) for Trans2 he is still responsible for that being a bad movie, a long with the writters.cuddly_tomato said:
Exactly, the producer has a greater control over the movie than the director. Because of this, they should take part in the blame for a bad movie. Of course you can never know for sure how much influence the Producer had so you can never fully blame them but in the case with Spielberg he would have made Trans 1 & 2 good if he wanted to. He didn't and as a result the movies suck and Bay gets the blame.
Michael Bay isn't a terrible director. He just doesn't want to pull his weight. Script sucks? Let's try to work with it. Special effects inserted dumb humor? Well, maybe no one will notice.
The shaky camera is all him, don't get me wrong. But contrary to popular belief, a director is just that. They direct people to do this or that. They don't write scripts. They don't edit. They don't do special effects work. They just direct. The problem with Michael Bay isn't that he's a terrible director. The problem is that he's an apathetic one.
The shaky camera is all him, don't get me wrong. But contrary to popular belief, a director is just that. They direct people to do this or that. They don't write scripts. They don't edit. They don't do special effects work. They just direct. The problem with Michael Bay isn't that he's a terrible director. The problem is that he's an apathetic one.
But a part of directing is controlling the final output, e.g., if the script sucks he needs to take it up with the writes. If the editing is bad, he needs to take it up with the editor, it's his responsability to oversee all that. In that sense, I think apathy and failure are one and the same.thebobmaster said:
He did make the 'got milk?' commercials though, that's gotta be worth something.
"I miss you more than Michael Bay missed the mark,
When he made Pearl Harbor,
I miss you more than that movie missed the point,
And that's an awful lot, girl,
And now, now you've gone away,
And all I'm trying to say's,
Pearl Harbor sucked, and I miss you."
Team America-Pearl Harbor.
When he made Pearl Harbor,
I miss you more than that movie missed the point,
And that's an awful lot, girl,
And now, now you've gone away,
And all I'm trying to say's,
Pearl Harbor sucked, and I miss you."
Team America-Pearl Harbor.
Thought it was the producers who were supposed to control the final output. As for the "got milk" commercials, well, he gets this to go along with it:vivaldiscool said:
No, he gave us a high school rom-com with a nice dollop of juvenile humour and racial stereotypes on the side. Then, after realizing that the film was titled, "Transformers," he apparently added in some robots fighting at the end. I couldn't tell; the camera wouldn't hold still long enough for me to discern what was happening.SpireOfFire said:
This was seriously my reaction when I walked out of Transformers. I wanted to see a movie about giant robots kicking the ever-loving shit out of each other. Instead, I got to see some kid chase his cardboard-cutout love interest for a while before rushing through some incomprehensible fight scenes involving a couple of poorly designed robots.
Now, I liked The Rock. It felt to me that there was someone babysitting Bay for most of the shooting, slapping his wrist every time he attempted to do something boneheaded. It also helped that Cage and Connery were allowed to play off each other. Sure, it didn't have much of a brain, but at least it wasn't horribly offensive or juvenile. There were some Michael Bay-ish moments (slow-motion gunfights, helicopters at sunset, and hammy, unimportant subplots), but I had fun watching it. Transformers, not so much.
I looks like a documentary, so i can't see any problem with directing here... its not suppossed to be a action-packed movie...
From all the David Attenbourough and other Doc.s I watch, Im pretty sure Doc. are supposed to have:
For a directer who makes action packed, explosion filled, OTT films to make a realistic documentary against his style, is pretty impressive... So in effect you made me like Micheal Bay more in your post...
Note: My internets goin slow as a brick, so i didnt watch the video...
From all the David Attenbourough and other Doc.s I watch, Im pretty sure Doc. are supposed to have:
Y'know like real life....cuddly_tomato said:
For a directer who makes action packed, explosion filled, OTT films to make a realistic documentary against his style, is pretty impressive... So in effect you made me like Micheal Bay more in your post...
Note: My internets goin slow as a brick, so i didnt watch the video...
This image alone could easily sum up why I hate his movies. There's just so much completely unnecessary crap like that side by side with some of the most hard-to-follow action sequences of all time. It's a 1-2 punch of awful.EspirituExterminatus said:
Watch it. It's a docu-drama, so in effect is a film. There is music played over the scene, but it is poigniant and soulfull, not bombasic orchestra telling the viewers how incredibly exciting it is.Spacefly said:
You can say more with an intelligent whisper than you can with a guttural scream.
If only, if only..Daedalus1942 said:
On the topic at hand though, my other posts on this matter are more than sufficient to go into detail, but I'll simply say this - Substance, not gimmicks in a movie, or GTFO of my cinema.
http://www.nndb.com/people/904/000025829/ShadowsofHope said:
Michael Bay is surely guilty of crimes against humanity.