The Rise of the "Man-*****"

[Hagi]

you know what, im going to bed now - because it is half 11, and i am bored. you bore me.

oh and btw i have done the reading, you sound like you have only encounterd feminist critiques of feminism. i suggest you look outside the movement for an objective view. goodnight.

Apparently the suggestion that gender inequality is a bad thing isn't an objective viewpoint. Who knew?

I wouldn't take him too seriously, other points aside I find the claim that he has "done the reading" while still being incapable of proper capitalisation, spelling and punctuation questionable at best.

Dude trashing someone for using poor grammar on an internet forum is one of the pettiest arguments in existence.

So you think using poor grammar whilst still claiming to be highly educated and well read makes for a convincing argument?

He can write as poorly as he wants, but he shouldn't expect me to regard him as either educated or well read if he does so.

If you're going to make claims without argumentation, like his (what has he read exactly? He's just claiming he's "done the reading"), then the least you can do is make sure you're using proper grammar. If you fail even that I'm not going to take you seriously, and I advise everyone not to do so as well.

 

[Hagi]

It's a fucking internet forum. It's the least formal communication method in the world aside from text messaging and distress signals. And you should judge an argument on it's actual merits not on petty bullshit. If they don't have an argument then just pointing out their bad grammar isn't a counter it's wasting everyone's time.

Grammar is a merit. It's not a huge one. But it's a merit.

Someone who took the time for proper grammar is much more likely to be patient and educated. Whilst someone lacking proper grammar is less likely to be either patient or educated, a spelling-checker isn't hard to use nor is capitalisation or punctuation.

And who's wasting time? Is anyone forcing you to read my posts? If you don't care about grammar then just ignore it and everything relating to it. I do care about grammar so I won't ignore it.

A post worth reading is a post worth writing properly.

 

[Hagi]

It's a fucking internet forum. It's the least formal communication method in the world aside from text messaging and distress signals. And you should judge an argument on it's actual merits not on petty bullshit. If they don't have an argument then just pointing out their bad grammar isn't a counter it's wasting everyone's time.

Grammar is a merit. It's not a huge one. But it's a merit.

Someone who took the time for proper grammar is much more likely to be patient and educated. Whilst someone lacking proper grammar is less likely to be either patient or educated,

You cannot tell if someone is educated by the grammar they use on the internet.

Please stop bullshitting yourself and others. You sound like the people who insist that people who use profanity can't possibly have something valid to say.

Do you know what the word likely means? You might want to use a dictionary, although seeing your previous efforts at that I'm not entirely certain that's a good idea.

 

[EllieRyan]

You cannot tell if someone is educated by the grammar they use on the internet.

Please stop bullshitting yourself and others. You sound like the people who insist that people who use profanity can't possibly have something valid to say.

A good sense of grammar and punctuation are signs that someone has received a higher education, yes. Grammar is, after all, one of the subjects taught, and if someone is tested on it regularly, they're more likely to use it in everyday life to avoid slipping up. Granted, there's no causation, but there's definitely a correlation.

 

[Colour Scientist]

You cannot tell if someone is educated by the grammar they use on the internet.

Please stop bullshitting yourself and others. You sound like the people who insist that people who use profanity can't possibly have something valid to say.

A good sense of grammar and punctuation are signs that someone has received a higher education, yes. Grammar is, after all, one of the subjects taught, and if someone is tested on it regularly, they're more likely to use it in everyday life to avoid slipping up. Granted, there's no causation, but there's definitely a correlation.

Not necessarily, just because someone is poor at grammar and spelling it doesn't mean that they're not clever. Higher education doesn't equal clever either. If you want credibility you should focus on someone's argument. To me, the person who rests on solely grammar and spelling to dismiss someone's argument isn't savvy enough to form their own, comprehensive argument. In critiquing someone's point on that point alone exposes that person as lacking themselves.

 

[AngloDoom]

Some 'feminine' attributes are considered more attractive by a lot of women then they used to be. The very fact that I can cook is considered attractive by some, when I imagine forty-years previous it would have been 'poncy'.

In all honesty, if we can ever get rid of gender-roles then I'd be all for it. I hate the idea that kids are born into a way of thinking and acting and have to struggle to be anything else but that. I don't like the fact that some people feel threatened to dress how they want, or act how they want simply because there were born in Category 'A' not 'B'. It's stupid, it's useless, and in the end if everyone was free to pick and choose what they want to do and how in life we'd probably end up with a more productive, happier future.

On a side-note:

If you're going to make claims without argumentation, like his (what has he read exactly? He's just claiming he's "done the reading"), then the least you can do is make sure you're using proper grammar. If you fail even that I'm not going to take you seriously, and I advise everyone not to do so as well.

I don't mean to be a dick, but when making this kind of point it really will come out dickish.

*Ahem*

The use of a full-stop in brackets is against the use of UK-English, which I believe you use when discussing the 'colours' of the rainbow in a discussion about zombies vs. werewolves vs. vampires, or something similar.

Using your logic, you shouldn't be taken seriously and your argument has fallen to pieces.


This is how petulant your argument is - do you really want to be seen like this?

 

[Hagi]

If you're going to make claims without argumentation, like his (what has he read exactly? He's just claiming he's "done the reading"), then the least you can do is make sure you're using proper grammar. If you fail even that I'm not going to take you seriously, and I advise everyone not to do so as well.

I don't mean to be a dick, but when making this kind of point it really will come out dickish.

*Ahem*

The use of a full-stop in brackets is against the use of UK-English, which I believe you use when discussing the 'colours' of the rainbow in a discussion about zombies vs. werewolves vs. vampires, or something similar.

Using your logic, you shouldn't be taken seriously and your argument has fallen to pieces.

[youtube]qSpWvodDlJI[/youtube]

See? This is how petulant that argument is. Do you really want to come across as this?

1. Color is correct spelling. UK-English is not the only English.
2. If full-stop in brackets is not allowed you should take my point slightly less seriously. No need to dismiss it outright, but if it fails on other points as well then no need to give it a second chance.
3. Your youtube video won't load, so can't reply to that. Will try to do so later.

 

[Custard_Angel]

Yeah... There's a reason for all this stuff happening and I can't really talk about it without facing the banhammer.

It involves a failed generation of parenting that felt that the only way to make children feel good about themselves was to undo everything their parents did for them.

Not exactly bannable material, but when I get to the part where I discuss how that same failed generation looked at the issue of prejudice and decided to remedy it by taking reverse prejudice to the ridiculous extreme.

The waves of this are everywhere from social welfare programs (not a bad thing but universally abused) to media censorship (not a bad thing but universally retarded) to fashions on the street (not a bad thing but FUCK your man-skirt) to cultural attitudes (not a bad thing but 99% of alternative medicine is a crock of shit).

I won't type out a full argument on my opinions on these matters because I am acutely aware that the argument makes me seem bigoted and narrow minded.

Then again the fact that I may seem bigoted and narrow minded kind of makes my point valid. Not necessarily agreeable, but certainly it adds proof to my point.

 

[Hagi]

You cannot tell if someone is educated by the grammar they use on the internet.

Please stop bullshitting yourself and others. You sound like the people who insist that people who use profanity can't possibly have something valid to say.

A good sense of grammar and punctuation are signs that someone has received a higher education, yes. Grammar is, after all, one of the subjects taught, and if someone is tested on it regularly, they're more likely to use it in everyday life to avoid slipping up. Granted, there's no causation, but there's definitely a correlation.

Not necessarily, just because someone is poor at grammar and spelling it doesn't mean that they're not clever. Higher education doesn't equal clever either. If you want credibility you should focus on someone's argument. To me, the person who rests on solely grammar and spelling to dismiss someone's argument isn't savvy enough to form their own, comprehensive argument. In critiquing someone's point on that point alone exposes that person as lacking themselves.

Nobody is arguing that posts should be judged on grammar alone. I do however argue that grammar is a part, a minor part, of what a post should be judged on.

A post with great argumentation but bad grammar makes a better point then one with bad argumentation but good grammar. But it makes a worse point then a post with both great argumentation and great grammar.

A post without good argumentation might still carry some strength if it's properly structured and spelled, it won't ever carry a lot of weight. But it's still a lot better then an unstructured, badly spelled, incoherent wall of text.

You shouldn't dismiss anyone's argument. But neither should you dismiss anyone's grammar.

 

[AngloDoom]

1. Color is correct spelling. UK-English is not the only English.
2. If full-stop in brackets is not allowed you should take my point slightly less seriously. No need to dismiss it outright, but if it fails on other points as well then no need to give it a second chance.
3. Your youtube video won't load, so can't reply to that. Will try to do so later.

1. No, but you used the word 'colour' is what I'm saying. Therefore I assumed you are using UK English. If not then you have spelt incorrectly in US English and your point falls down in exactly the same way.
2. No, that's totally illogical. Just then you forgot the 's' in full-stops. Now you're apparently totally worthless in any discussion anywhere at any time. That's actually shockingly bad.
3. Video adjusted, should be working now, but it's a little bit of immaturity and isn't actually the crux of the argument in anyway. It is, unfortunately, how you seem to portray yourself right now.

You own logic has defeated you. Part of me wishes I could gloat, but it's way too petty a victory to enjoy that.

Evidence of the use of the word colour:

Sigh....

When will people realize that 101 comes after 100 and not 'all'?

There are some girls into Vampires and Werewolves.
There are some guys into Zombies.

In the meantime there's just as many, likely more, people who still think 'Twilight' refers to the time between dawn and sunrise or dusk and sunset. Who think Vampires, Werewolves and Zombies are downright silly and not worth spending time on. etc.

Exactly the same there's some girls, likely younger ones, who like to think they have to make a choice in their partner between a bad guy with sex appeal, and a strong and protective type.
And there's some guys who like to think everyone is against them, and are able to take out their violent fantasies without repercussions or guilt on fictional enemies?

And then there's just as many, likely more, with all kinds of tastes which come in more varieties then a rainbow has colours.

Ghastly, isn't it?

EDIT - Edited to clarify points with underlines.
EDIT - Added the post using 'colours' as evidence, in a pre-emptive strike.

 

[EllieRyan]

Not necessarily, just because someone is poor at grammar and spelling it doesn't mean that they're not clever. Higher education doesn't equal clever either. If you want credibility you should focus on someone's argument. To me, the person who rests on solely grammar and spelling to dismiss someone's argument isn't savvy enough to form their own, comprehensive argument. In critiquing someone's point on that point alone exposes that person as lacking themselves.

Agreed, but if someone's vying to be taken seriously, they should at least make an effort in their grammar.

 

[shootandshiver]

ill save a whole lot of time with my metal and boomy-things and paranoia soaked brain. enjoy the funny or whatever of it all. this one aint a concern. ton of other things we cant destract from

 

[Colour Scientist]

Agreed, but if someone's vying to be taken seriously, they should at least make an effort in their grammar.

Maybe they should but I think it's really petty thing to pick up on in an argument.

 

[Hagi]

1. Color is correct spelling. UK-English is not the only English.
2. If full-stop in brackets is not allowed you should take my point slightly less seriously. No need to dismiss it outright, but if it fails on other points as well then no need to give it a second chance.
3. Your youtube video won't load, so can't reply to that. Will try to do so later.

1. No, but you used the word 'colour' is what I'm saying. Therefore I assumed you are using UK English. If not then you have spelt incorrectly in US English and your point falls down in exactly the same way.
2. No, that's totally illogical. Just then you forgot the 's' in full-stops. Now you're apparently totally worthless in any discussion anywhere at any time. That's actually shockingly bad.
3. Video adjusted, should be working now, but it's a little bit of immaturity and isn't actually the crux of the argument in anyway. It is, unfortunately, how you seem to portray yourself right now.

You own logic has defeated you. Part of me wishes I could gloat, but it's way too petty a victory to enjoy that.

EDIT - Edited to clarify points with underlines.

You seem to be missing the point.

I'm not claiming to have perfect grammar myself.

What I'm saying is that while argumentation shouldn't be dismissed in any way or form neither should grammar be dismissed.

If a post has less then perfect grammar then it becomes less credible, like my own. Less credible does not translate to 'not credible'. There's many more points on which a post should be judged. I'm just arguing that grammar is a minor point that posts should be judged upon.

If you make a coherent, well-structured and well argued post that has a few spelling errors then you've made a great post. You've however not made a perfect post.

Likewise if you make a post that's badly structured and provides no argumentation but is at least spelled properly then you've made a horrible post. You've however not made an atrocious post.

Most posts however aren't that extreme. They're somewhere in the middle. Their argumentation is decent, but not great. Their structure is okay, but not really worth noticing. At that point grammar can provide a minor influence that can tip the balance for the credibility of your post.

The initial point I made was this: A point that clearly provides no argumentation and doesn't even have proper grammar is not to be taken seriously. If it at least had proper grammar it would've shown the author had put some effort into it, so it might be worth replying to that author. But if, besides all the other flaws, it doesn't even have proper grammar then it's not worth taking seriously.