To those people calling us "Entitled" (Dark Souls PC)

[drednoahl]

I signed the initial petition to hopefully get the game made for PC so I'm still going to buy it. What worries me more is if NamcoBandai choose Origin - a deal breaker imo. I've never managed to get a GFWL game to work on my PC - the reason why I didn't buy Gotham City Imposters was just because it had GFWL.

The whole "entitled" thing is a bit of a strawman for me, especially on PC. Unlike console gamers, PC gamers have (or should have at least) choice in many things, so if I don't like the browser I'm using now for example I can choose another. It's not entitled of PC gamers to want a different choice than the ones devs make, but in the case of Dark Souls I think it's probably too late for change.

 

[malestrithe]

Goody, another thread where like minded individuals looks for vindication of their opinion. It's almost like the other dozen or so of these threads don't matter somehow because someone else needs to voice their opinion about this issue.

PC gamers 20 years ago had a better attitude about this issue than modern ones. If a game was on the console and not on PC, it did not exist to them. They did not worry or cry about equal not getting a fair shake in the world. They did not have to bolster themselves with asinine arguments about their superiority. They did not have to because they were better than lowly console gamers and acted that way. Modern PC gamers do not do that. They place themselves lower than console gamers because of go around the Internet proclaiming their superiority. They also have to demand equal time and getting certain games on the PC, which is something no PC gamer 20 years ago would have done. I wish modern PC gamers would hold to that same conviction and start acting better than console gamers.

Beyond that, it is your right to complain about it, much like it is mine not to give a rats ass about the issue. If you can get FromSoftware and Namco-Bandai to change their minds in the next 4 months and put it on a different program, more power to you. If they are not going to do that, please stop complaining and find something else to kvetch about. The argument is over once they change their mind or choose to follow this path.

If you are going to say that you are not buying Dark Souls if its on GFWL, then don't. Stick to that pledge 100 percent. Don't say that you are doing this then buying the game anyway because you want to play with your friends. Don't even pirate that game. Pretend like it does not exist. The only place where you can hurt a company like this is through their pocket book.

 

[Squidbulb]

I used Games for Windows Live to download Age of Empires 3 once (it wasn't on Steam, though I think it's on there now) and it was terrible. It was slow and hard to use, not to mention having to go through the horrible Microsoft website.
Then again, I already have Dark Souls on PS3 so I'm not too bothered. I do see where they're coming from though.

 

[AmrasCalmacil]

I played GTA4 and DoW2 on GFWL and managed not to tear my own kneecaps off and scream like a monkey whilst I was doing it.

So this really comes down to two things.
Either you want Dark Souls and want them to release more on PC, possibly on Steam. So you'll buy it.

Or you don't care about Dark Souls and don't want any future incarnations on PC, so you won't.

 

[Sifer2]

I played GTA4 and DoW2 on GFWL and managed not to tear my own kneecaps off and scream like a monkey whilst I was doing it.

So this really comes down to two things.
Either you want Dark Souls and want them to release more on PC, possibly on Steam. So you'll buy it.

Or you don't care about Dark Souls and don't want any future incarnations on PC, so you won't.

Yeah that was TotalBiscuits interpretation of the situation. That there is no hope of them dropping it so you just have to "grin and bear it". I don't necessarily agree with it though. I think GFWL should be fought tooth an nail until its clear that its either GFWL or no port at all.

And what's funny is that people call you spoiled or entitled for doing this. Why? In a way were HELPING Namco/Bandai. If they drop GFWL an used Steamworks they would sell FAR more copies. Oh but were brats for pointing that out to them? Ridiculous really. TB himself admitted that GFWL is going to drive up piracy rates just due to the fact people in unsupported countries can't legally buy it.

What I would like to see is more interaction here from Namco/Bandai. Discuss with us the reasons for choosing GFWL. And possibly work with us here on changing it. For example a pre-order campaign or even kickstarter campaign. To raise money to extend the dev cycle it would take to rewrite the netcode. This is very possible considering how big of a community interest there is in this game. It could be done if they were smarter enough to try.

 

[JochemHippie]

Entitled the word of the month of April on The Escapist.

OT: It sucks and it sucks bad, there is no reason whatsoever to want to put customers through that hellhole that is GFWL

 

[ResonanceSD]

Apparently beggars CAN be choosers.

My gaming set up cost around $5,000. I'm yet to see a beggar with that kind of money.

OT: What's wrong with steamworks?

Also OT: Why do people, when seeing gamers acting like consumers of other products, decide that they're entitled? If you don't fully understand the issues, like most people calling gamers entitled, don't comment!

 

[DarkishFriend]

Here is how I feel; from doesnt need to make the port, but I don't need to buy it either. When I signed the petition I signed believing it wasn't gonna use a shitty service like gfwl. Dark souls multiplayer is drop in drop out type and connections errors would cripple the game as the console multiplayer is already lackluster due to them using direct peer to peer connection

 

[ThePS1Fan]

Love him or hate him totalbiscuit brings up some good points on the whole issue of GFWL and dark souls in his mailbox yesterday.

People don't like TB? And here I was thinking everyone had cynical sarcastic British people listed as number 1 on their list of things they like. Seriously if you don't I can't even begin to think of what went wrong in your life.

 

[Woodsey]

It's well known that GfWL is a piece of shit. This is asking for the game to function properly, so unless people take issue with others wanting their games to work as intended, there should be no issue.

It's like the FOV issue. "What, you don't want motion sickness when playing a game? Whiny bastard."

However, TB makes a good point in the video he's released on the topic (I think someone's posted it in the thread already). I have zero interest in the game, and it's not like 95% of other developers haven't gotten the message regarding GfWL yet, so it doesn't really affect me.

 

[ResonanceSD]

If you've had previous experiences with GFWL you would be an idiot to pay full price for a product with it attached.

Totally true, anyone who pays full price for a game bundled with GFWL is a sucker.

 

[Gorilla Gunk]

Apparently beggars CAN be choosers.

My gaming set up cost around $5,000. I'm yet to see a beggar with that kind of money.

Was that suppose to impress me?

And LOL that you spent $5,000 on a gaming PC when you can build one that's just as good for a quarter of that.

 

[ardias014]

Love him or hate him totalbiscuit brings up some good points on the whole issue of GFWL and dark souls in his mailbox yesterday.

Basically saying that gfwl is a necessary evil if you want a port of dark souls since gfwl and xbox live net code is very similar so it won't cost from software more than however much namco bandai sanctioned them to get the port up and running.

he also says that even if you don't like gfwl you should still buy this port so publishers and devs can't turn around and say the pc market really isn't viable when they gave us what we wanted, he also brings up the point that any future "souls" titles may get released on pc using a better digital distribution service if this port succeeds like how fallout 3 had gfwl but new vegas had steamworks.

Except you didn't need to use live for Fallout 3 it was completely optional.

 

[Corven]

Except you didn't need to use live for Fallout 3 it was completely optional.

The point still stands that there have been games that used gfwl and then used a "better" digital service later due to public feedback.

 

[ResonanceSD]

Apparently beggars CAN be choosers.

My gaming set up cost around $5,000. I'm yet to see a beggar with that kind of money.

Was that suppose to impress me?

And LOL that you spent $5,000 on a gaming PC when you can build one that's just as good for a quarter of that.

Why would I need to impress you?

Contrary to popular (your) opinion, no one is out to impress you.

$3,000 PC,

$2,000 accessories. Screens (4), sound system, etc.

It's a home-movie theatre, but compact =D With the added benefit of being able to play games.

 

[ResonanceSD]

Don't even pirate that game.... The only place where you can hurt a company like this is through their pocket book.

Are you seriously suggesting that piracy doesn't affect the bottom line of companies?

 

[Dansen]

Apparently beggars CAN be choosers.

My gaming set up cost around $5,000. I'm yet to see a beggar with that kind of money.

OT: What's wrong with steamworks?

Also OT: Why do people, when seeing gamers acting like consumers of other products, decide that they're entitled? If you don't fully understand the issues, like most people calling gamers entitled, don't comment!

It all comes down to net code. Namco Bandai must have thought time was of the essence and by using GFWL they wouldn't have to worry about net code, ensuring that the game would come out earlier. Nothing Malicious is going on.

You guys got exactly what you wanted, a PC port of Dark Souls. Now when the use of GFWL is announced people claim they won't buy it, pirate it, or get it at reduced price. Seriously, is it really hard to see why people are calling PC gamers "entitled"?

 

[ResonanceSD]

Apparently beggars CAN be choosers.

My gaming set up cost around $5,000. I'm yet to see a beggar with that kind of money.

OT: What's wrong with steamworks?

Also OT: Why do people, when seeing gamers acting like consumers of other products, decide that they're entitled? If you don't fully understand the issues, like most people calling gamers entitled, don't comment!

It all comes down to net code. Namco Bandai must have thought time was of the essence and by using GFWL they wouldn't have to worry about net code, ensuring that the game would come out earlier. Nothing Malicious is going on.

You guys got exactly what you wanted, a PC port of Dark Souls. Now when the use of GFWL is announced people claim they won't buy it, pirate it, or get it at reduced price. Seriously, is it really hard to see why people are calling PC gamers "entitled"?

I'll buy it, I agree with TB, the fault is with microsoft, not NB or From Software. "calm the hell down, do what we did 10 years, ago, blame microsoft for everything"

 

[synobal]

Apparently beggars CAN be choosers.

To be fair, if I offer a beggar a cake, then tell him that I'm going to mix some shit into the cake, he's well within his rights to say, 'actually, I'd prefer it if you didn't mix fecal matter into my cake' without being called entitled or dismissed as a whining nerd.

Basically, GFWL is a giant turd.

That and we aren't exactly begging. We are saying 'make dark souls for the Pc and we will give you money!' then they were like 'okay and lets use game for windows live' and now we are like 'no game for windows live if you want my money'