Trailers: Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3 - Spec Ops Survival Trailer

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JohnDoey

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Everyone is entitled to their opinion but if you know you aren't interested in a game why do you bother to take the time to comment and if you do comment why call someone an idiot or sheep for liking something you don't enjoy it's childish.Not to say you can't bring up legitimate problems but more often then not it's just trolling.

Edit: Also not liking a popular game doesn't somehow give you a moral high ground.
 

JoesshittyOs

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Treblaine said:
So... so much. Where to start.

The fans of the series are being ripped off. This may be good, but it is so freaking similar to MW2 this should be $15 DLC, NOT a whole new $60 game!
An entirely new set of multiplayer maps, another single player, a brand new Spec Ops mode, and different guns? Sorry, that's worth more than a 15$ price. I know enough to realize when I am getting ripped off, and I know before hand that I am easily going to put about 3 full days into each CoD game. That's almost more than any other game I own combined.

That is a 60$ price to me.
I don't think you understand the term "sheep". To be a sheep is just do what millions of other people do without individual critical thought. Sephren here is being an individual not swayed by the crowd and thinking critically about this product on their own.
I understood it perfectly well. And that was also why I retorted in the same way. You are as much a sheep as I am for succumbing to the same hate that happens for each Call of Duty game almost 4 months before it comes out, based on the sheer popularity of the titles.[/quote]
"It's an FPS for christs sakes, what the hell do you expect?"

Better than this! FPS games are not so creatively bankrupt that it can coast on just this.
People seem to forget that this series set the bar for FPS's.

I stand by what I said. First Person Shooters are a very fun thing to meddle with, but there really isn't much you can do with it. Why would they change the formula for (unless I am mistaken) the best selling game of all time?
I've played over 100 hours of Black Ops though I didn't buy it till it was at quite a low price and the thing about MW3 is this looks like a DOWNGRADE going back from Black Ops' standard to MW2.

I follow COD and wouldn't call myself a fanboy but not a hater either. I'm just annoyed the games are so rushed and don't seem to be trying any more. I like the franchise enough to expect a high standard, I don't love it so unconditionally that I will tolerate any amount of backsliding.[/quote]

And now, I actually agree with you. I'd much prefer it if the two companies (Treyarch and IW), would just team up and develop the game over the lifespan of 3 years.

But then again, they still manage to continue to outdo themselves, so they're doing something right.
 

JoesshittyOs

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Sephren468 said:
I do not "hate" CoD. What I hate is the yearly expansions called new games. CoD 1,2, and 4 are great games. MW2 and Black Ops...not so much. MW2 was a buggy broken mess with no dedicated servers. So no MW2 does not play better than any console fps its actually one of the worst on the market...
You clearly don't understand what I meant by play the best. Ignoring the weird thing on how you would stoop so low to say it's one of the worst games on the market (seriously, quit bullshitting yourself. You don't like it because it's popular. I don't care what game it is, if it's the number one selling videogame of all time, it's not bad).

No, it's one of the best games on the market because it has the smoothest controls of any FPS to ever touch a console. That is one pretty much the sole reason why it has done so incredibly well. Because of the sheer responsiveness and well designed controller scheme.

Quit complaining about dedicated servers. With this argument, people act like it's a mandatory thing for any game with multiplayer. Peer to Peer works better on the CoD series than most any other games. Sure, it would be better with dedicated servers, but that absolutely cannot count against a game.
 

Warmoose

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Looks like a copy paste of MW2, not that that's bad, I just expected more from Infinity Ward. Probably won't be buying this one, and if I do, it won't be until long after it's been released. I didn't like the art stile in MW2 so I don't really like this one either, I just hope the story and multiplayer actually bring in something new otherwise this game really will just be a large DLC.
 

Treblaine

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JoesshittyOs said:
Treblaine said:
So... so much. Where to start.

The fans of the series are being ripped off. This may be good, but it is so freaking similar to MW2 this should be $15 DLC, NOT a whole new $60 game!
An entirely new set of multiplayer maps, another single player, a brand new Spec Ops mode, and different guns? Sorry, that's worth more than a 15$ price. I know enough to realize when I am getting ripped off, and I know before hand that I am easily going to put about 3 full days into each CoD game. That's almost more than any other game I own combined.

That is a 60$ price to me.
I don't think you understand the term "sheep". To be a sheep is just do what millions of other people do without individual critical thought. Sephren here is being an individual not swayed by the crowd and thinking critically about this product on their own.
I understood it perfectly well. And that was also why I retorted in the same way. You are as much a sheep as I am for succumbing to the same hate that happens for each Call of Duty game almost 4 months before it comes out, based on the sheer popularity of the titles.

"It's an FPS for christs sakes, what the hell do you expect?"

Better than this! FPS games are not so creatively bankrupt that it can coast on just this.
People seem to forget that this series set the bar for FPS's.

I stand by what I said. First Person Shooters are a very fun thing to meddle with, but there really isn't much you can do with it. Why would they change the formula for (unless I am mistaken) the best selling game of all time?
I've played over 100 hours of Black Ops though I didn't buy it till it was at quite a low price and the thing about MW3 is this looks like a DOWNGRADE going back from Black Ops' standard to MW2.

I follow COD and wouldn't call myself a fanboy but not a hater either. I'm just annoyed the games are so rushed and don't seem to be trying any more. I like the franchise enough to expect a high standard, I don't love it so unconditionally that I will tolerate any amount of backsliding.
And now, I actually agree with you. I'd much prefer it if the two companies (Treyarch and IW), would just team up and develop the game over the lifespan of 3 years.

But then again, they still manage to continue to outdo themselves, so they're doing something right.
Sorry buddy, but on PC this is NOT a $60 iteration, this is the typical evolution you would expect from 2 years of patches, updates, expansion packs and mods - that certainly doesn't add up to $60. Look at most Valve games, especially Team Fortress 2.

90% of the guns in the video we have not only seen before but are the exact same model. It is easy to come up with a new mode, modders do it all the time, it's a simple matter of changing a bit of code to spawn thing X at moment Y.

Don't bullshit me, I am not hating "based on the sheer popularity of the titles" but because this is by all appearances a really bad rehash.

"But then again, they still manage to continue to outdo themselves"

It's easy for them to outdo THEMSELVES (they can hardly release a worse game than previous year) but IW here have taken a tiny step forward from 2009 while the rest of the games have taken bounds ahead.

For example CoD isn't the only console game on the market embracing 60fps, so too is RAGE which has a much more interesting setting. And of course, every PC game treats 60fps as standard, I'm speaking from the perspective of a PC gamer.

COD has so much more it could do:
-greater and meaningful teamwork interaction
-improve the controls in terms of flexibility
-fundamentally improve the spawn system from the way the maps are used
-more varied weapons (i.e. too many full auto hitscan weapons with 30 round mags)
-end the "straight upgrade" model of levelling up, every weapon new with huge pros and cons but none wholly superior. i.e. i'd have made the M16 in Black Ops with ACR accuracy, but only 18 rounds capacity (as was in Vietnam). AK47 a 2 hit kill but give it severe recoil. Give Machine Guns similar damage profile as sniper rifles (they fire same 7.62mm cartridge) but much much less accurate and severe movement penalty.
-Dedicated servers on console and ESPECIALLY ON PC
-end the overpowered killstreaks that are so much more annoying to suffer under than to see used against your opponent. Limit Killstreak bonuses to assisting features like Spyplane, Radar jammer, Blackbird, supply crate, sentry gun, RC-XD, death-machine, Juggernaut-suit. No more chopper gunner, that just means everyone carries a strela/stinger and shoots it down instantly or they forget it and the game stagnates for 60 seconds.
-balance melee. For the love of god. Insta-kill WITH a any amount of lunge! It doesn't even work like a melee, more like having a shotgun as alt fire. Something more like L4D's melee = so-lung bash that stuns (blurred vision), disorients (throws perspective off) and forces them back in a predictable direction. 3-4 bashes needed to kill, the intention is your gun does the killing, the melee is just to line them up.
If you want quick draw knife put it in grenade slot and have it insta-kill only for stabbing head or back/spine. Otherwise two stab/gouges to kill

But these would fundamentally change the game and I don't think they want that, I don't think they even know how. COD4 was a damn good game but every year they just remake it with remixed elements only this year it is much less remake and much more remix.

I'm not keen t pay $60 for a game than is a mish mash of elements from the past 4 games.
 

Treblaine

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JoesshittyOs said:
No, it's one of the best games on the market because it has the smoothest controls of any FPS to ever touch a console. That is one pretty much the sole reason why it has done so incredibly well. Because of the sheer responsiveness and well designed controller scheme.

Quit complaining about dedicated servers. With this argument, people act like it's a mandatory thing for any game with multiplayer. Peer to Peer works better on the CoD series than most any other games. Sure, it would be better with dedicated servers, but that absolutely cannot count against a game.
Well I play COD on PC where 60fps is standard, and 60fps is the growing standard on console, though it matters far less there where the gamepad necessitates slower panning speed and reliance on aim assist. Mouse aim where you literally are making dozens of tiny twitch adjustments the frame-refresh is hugely important.

And We have a right to complain about the lack of dedicated servers as it is the leading cause of 90% of the glitches that have been plaguing COD of recent years. Face it, peer-to-peer user-hosted matches have huge lag that you cannot control for, the only solution is lag-compensation which creates a world of paradoxes, no one is where they appear to actually be. Because everyone is connecting a quarter of a second out of sync.

I'll tell you what peer-to-peer is: cheap and easy

That may be fine for some B- game, but COD is supposedly the best AAA+ game it deserves the best. At least as an option. Use the PC model, allow people to rent slot reservations on their favourite servers using micro-transaction model.

Again, after playing Black Ops on PC with the complete lack of the typical glitches that plague 360/PS3 versions, I can testify how much of a difference it makes.

"people act like it's a mandatory thing for any game with multiplayer."

Well, it is. Gears of War is adopting it even.

Only possibly reasonable exception is 2-player co-op.
 

MiracleOfSound

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Treblaine said:
My point about the importance of graphics is not pushing the technical envelope but the artistic potential. MW3 does not have the inspired art design that is expected. MW2 is not that amazing in terms of appearance to get away with some slight barely noticeable improvements.
Watching the video I did notice some clear upgrades:

1. Better non-scripted animations on character models (running, falling etc)

2. More impressive dynamic lighting (the helicopter explosion while the character looked at the sky was very pretty)

3. Improved explosive and fire effects

True, the guns look and sound similar to MW2.

There are also some low resolution textures, but I'll happily take those in order to have a game that runs at a smooth 60 FPS on my XBOX - something no other recent shooter does.
 

Treblaine

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MiracleOfSound said:
Treblaine said:
My point about the importance of graphics is not pushing the technical envelope but the artistic potential. MW3 does not have the inspired art design that is expected. MW2 is not that amazing in terms of appearance to get away with some slight barely noticeable improvements.
Watching the video I did notice some clear upgrades:

1. Better non-scripted animations on character models (running, falling etc)

2. More impressive dynamic lighting (the helicopter explosion while the character looked at the sky was very pretty)

3. Improved explosive and fire effects

True, the guns look and sound similar to MW2.

There are also some low resolution textures, but I'll happily take those in order to have a game that runs at a smooth 60 FPS on my XBOX - something no other recent shooter does.
Wow, those sure are some thick rose-tinted-glasses you've got on.

Those are utterly subjective comparisons hugely coloured by bias. The explosions, lighting and animation/AI are IDENTICAL! (point 2 and 3 are identical points) Or at least so damn similar it makes no difference at all. I've looked at footage side by side, it really does look EXACTLY what MW2 DLC/expansion-pack would look like: Same engine, same assets, just a new map and a couple new guns/names.

"smooth 60 FPS on my XBOX - something no other recent shooter does."

Forgetting all the 60fps Racing games and how Xbox 360 is not the only gaming platform around (ahem*PC*ahem) there is ANOTHER game for the Xbox 360 which offers 60fps on Xbox 360 without sacrificing either graphical fidelity or native resolution that comes out a whole month before MW3:


I can't believe people are defending what Activision is doing. To the extend that I know great games like these will be marginalised simply because they don't have the COD brand name.
 

Platypus540

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Packie_J said:
So they're changing Spec-Ops to a horde mode with killstreaks?

I liked the Spec-ops Set-piece style in MW2. Playing the stealth missions with my brother was an absolute blast. Meh, I'll borrow it from a friend, play it for a weekend and forget about it.
There are also regular spec-ops missions this is another mode.
 

Platypus540

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This looks really awesome. Definitely seems better than zombies.

Also, to all the people who complain about CoD games being all the same, the appeal of the new games is really to people who already like CoD (such as me) and enjoy having a similar but more polished and re-balanced game. Battlefield 3 does look better, no denying that, but MW3 looks like a GOOD GAME and for a CoD fan that's what matters.

Edit: Why are all the people here complaining abut MW3- if you have no interest in it just don't watch the trailer.
 

Treblaine

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Platypus540 said:
This looks really awesome. Definitely seems better than zombies.

Also, to all the people who complain about CoD games being all the same, the appeal of the new games is really to people who already like CoD (such as me) and enjoy having a similar but more polished and re-balanced game. Battlefield 3 does look better, no denying that, but MW3 looks like a GOOD GAME and for a CoD fan that's what matters.

Edit: Why are all the people here complaining abut MW3- if you have no interest in it just don't watch the trailer.
Everyone here DOES have an interest in Modern Warfare 3.

It's just what we seem to be getting is merely Modern Warfare 2.1!

This doesn't seem to be a significant improvement on least years Black Ops but a marginal improvement on 2009's modern Warfare 2. Jesus, 2009, last decade, back when Halo ODST came out, remember that?

We shouldn't really be surprised after how Activision buttfucked almost the entire IW staff so that they didn't start the new game till well into 2010 and had to quickly restaff the studio with a priority of publisher loyalty, not talent.

And look they're basically releasing a stand-alone expansion pack for MW2. I've seen this before on PC back in the day, but they wouldn't charge full price for this shit! They certainly wouldn't act like it was something wholly new.
 

Angry_squirrel

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Hmm. I wasn't even remotely exited for MW3, what with Battlefield and all.
But this actually looks really, really good.
 

MiracleOfSound

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Treblaine said:
Forgetting all the 60fps Racing games and how Xbox 360 is not the only gaming platform around (ahem*PC*ahem) there is ANOTHER game for the Xbox 360 which offers 60fps on Xbox 360 without sacrificing either graphical fidelity or native resolution that comes out a whole month before MW3:


I can't believe people are defending what Activision is doing. To the extend that I know great games like these will be marginalised simply because they don't have the COD brand name.
Calm down there man. No need to blow a gasket. So you don't enjoy the COD games much, that's cool with me. I do.

I said 'shooters', not racing games. I'm also looking forward to Rage in a big way, it looks amazing. But there's no deathmatch multiplayer, which is why most people play COD. There is no other 60FPS multiplayer shooter on console as far as I am aware, and to me and anyone I game with, COD has the best feeling controls and gameplay.

I don't give a shit really about graphical upgrades... I'd still be playing COD4 if it wasn't hacked to shit and abandoned by IW. If MW3 is like COD4 balance wise with some mildly prettier graphics, post-launch support and another fun campaign I'm sold.
 

Sephren468

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JoesshittyOs said:
Sephren468 said:
I do not "hate" CoD. What I hate is the yearly expansions called new games. CoD 1,2, and 4 are great games. MW2 and Black Ops...not so much. MW2 was a buggy broken mess with no dedicated servers. So no MW2 does not play better than any console fps its actually one of the worst on the market...
You clearly don't understand what I meant by play the best. Ignoring the weird thing on how you would stoop so low to say it's one of the worst games on the market (seriously, quit bullshitting yourself. You don't like it because it's popular. I don't care what game it is, if it's the number one selling videogame of all time, it's not bad).

No, it's one of the best games on the market because it has the smoothest controls of any FPS to ever touch a console. That is one pretty much the sole reason why it has done so incredibly well. Because of the sheer responsiveness and well designed controller scheme.

Quit complaining about dedicated servers. With this argument, people act like it's a mandatory thing for any game with multiplayer. Peer to Peer works better on the CoD series than most any other games. Sure, it would be better with dedicated servers, but that absolutely cannot count against a game.
I could careless if a game is popular or not that has no effect on the fun factor. But for me yes MW2 is one of the worst games this gen. The Mp is pretty much unplayable IMO it has no balance at all and is super buggy. And IMO dedicated servers are pretty much required for me to purchase a MP shooter. P2P just makes games a lot less fun.
 

Treblaine

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MiracleOfSound said:
Treblaine said:
Everyone here DOES have an interest in Modern Warfare 3.

It's just what we seem to be getting is merely Modern Warfare 2.1!


Forgetting all the 60fps Racing games and how Xbox 360 is not the only gaming platform around (ahem*PC*ahem) there is ANOTHER game for the Xbox 360 which offers 60fps on Xbox 360 without sacrificing either graphical fidelity or native resolution that comes out a whole month before MW3:


I can't believe people are defending what Activision is doing. To the extend that I know great games like these will be marginalised simply because they don't have the COD brand name.
Calm down there man. No need to blow a gasket. So you don't enjoy the COD games much, that's cool with me. I do.

I said 'shooters', not racing games. I'm also looking forward to Rage in a big way, it looks amazing. But there's no deathmatch multiplayer, which is why most people play COD. There is no other 60FPS multiplayer shooter on console as far as I am aware, and to me and anyone I game with, COD has the best feeling controls and gameplay.

I don't give a shit really about graphical upgrades... I'd still be playing COD4 if it wasn't hacked to shit and abandoned by IW. If MW3 is like COD4 balance wise with some mildly prettier graphics, post-launch support and another fun campaign I'm sold.
Bold text for the inconsistency. I DO like the COD games, I just don't love them so unconditionally that I am fine with them doing a half assed job... and especially not to the point of exclusion of so many other games.

Yes, publishers are afraid of the COD behemoth, one game taking in so many sales and so much gaming time, it's clear way too many people are giving COD more of a chance than it deserves.

"If MW3 is like COD4 balance wise (but MW2 graphics)"

Paying another $60 for balanced version? When with any other game the balance should be a freaking given from patches/updates? Like all the other great multiplayer games? I guess Bobby Kotick could do with ANOTHER private jet. It's not like there are dozens of other developers out there slaving away making solid gold quality games and you just want to pay for the same shit over and over again from the same money grubbing company?

Get real! Support the developers or you'll find more devs end up like Team Bondi forced to animate straight-to-dvd kids movies about tap dancing penguins.

Your hive mind attitude of "doing it because my friends do it" is thinking EXACTLY LIKE A SHEEP! You cannot think for yourself, a game that you yourself like unless all your friends make the same decision at the same time.

Also I just plain do not understand this statement:

"on console... COD has the best feeling controls and gameplay."

Wanting the best controls but limiting yourself to consoles: I do not buy this logic.

It is a scientific fact and accepted industry wide that mouse + keyboard are the best feeling controls in terms of speed, responsiveness and flexibility.

I play call of duty, I have 100 hours in on Black Ops, but I do NOT buy it unconditionally first opportunity at launch price and I am mad as fuck about the map-pack bullshit FOUR SEPARATE PACKS!! THAT is their "post launch support". You know it'll be 6 packs for MW3 and a shit-load of maps from previous games.

See I LOVED COD4, but I hate what Activision is doing to this series, running it into the ground with such shitty practices. They are milking it... so much... and you all don't seem to give a fuck. It's like you lack ALL critical faculties and just accept everything they serve you.
 

JoesshittyOs

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Treblaine said:
-improve the controls in terms of flexibility
I'm not sure what this means. In terms of actual gameplay, CoD is one of, if not the most, smoothest games on the market. Are you talking about actually making custom control set ups? Because I'm pretty sure PC has fully customizable controls.
-more varied weapons (i.e. too many full auto hitscan weapons with 30 round mags)
-end the "straight upgrade" model of levelling up, every weapon new with huge pros and cons but none wholly superior. i.e. i'd have made the M16 in Black Ops with ACR accuracy, but only 18 rounds capacity (as was in Vietnam). AK47 a 2 hit kill but give it severe recoil. Give Machine Guns similar damage profile as sniper rifles (they fire same 7.62mm cartridge) but much much less accurate and severe movement penalty.
I'm going to stop you right here.

This would completely destroy what little balance CoD games have. You say have no wholly superior weapons, but then you make severe impacts like that? Having an AK with a 2 hit kill? Just put steady aim on it. You've now made it worthless to aim.

Machine guns where you severe penalties are made for moving and will have one shot kills? Guess whose gonna be sitting in at the choke points with their gun pointed straight ahead the entire game?

No, that wouldn't work. The guns are fine the way they are, just an overpowered one slips through the cracks.
-Dedicated servers on console and ESPECIALLY ON PC
You seem to assume that Dedicated servers are a must in a games, whereas not realizing that they are purely a bonus. I'm down for it, but I will never expect it.
-end the overpowered killstreaks that are so much more annoying to suffer under than to see used against your opponent. Limit Killstreak bonuses to assisting features like Spyplane, Radar jammer, Blackbird, supply crate, sentry gun, RC-XD, death-machine, Juggernaut-suit. No more chopper gunner, that just means everyone carries a strela/stinger and shoots it down instantly or they forget it and the game stagnates for 60 seconds.
RC-XD? The C4 on wheels that is impossible to hit and sustained after only three kills?

No thank you.
-balance melee. For the love of god. Insta-kill WITH a any amount of lunge! It doesn't even work like a melee, more like having a shotgun as alt fire. Something more like L4D's melee = so-lung bash that stuns (blurred vision), disorients (throws perspective off) and forces them back in a predictable direction. 3-4 bashes needed to kill, the intention is your gun does the killing, the melee is just to line them up.
As you've notice, I've cut off a few of the points you have stated because they may have in fact been done in this game. Melee is fine, and it has been fixed for this game like they have stated a couple hundred times. It is believed to now be two consecutive hits to kill someone.
I'm not keen t pay $60 for a game than is a mish mash of elements from the past 4 games.
Then don't buy it. One less person complaining about it would sure help.
 

JoesshittyOs

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Sephren468 said:
I could careless if a game is popular or not that has no effect on the fun factor. But for me yes MW2 is one of the worst games this gen. The Mp is pretty much unplayable IMO it has no balance at all and is super buggy. And IMO dedicated servers are pretty much required for me to purchase a MP shooter. P2P just makes games a lot less fun.
Yet again, it plain just is not.

Sure, it's imbalanced. But trying to say it's the worst game of this generation is ridiculous. I'll repeat, if a game that is 60$ sells the most copies world wide, it can kind of exclude itself from being a bad game. The test for this? I'm sure if you had never heard of the game you would have been all over it.

You wanna know a bad game? Iron Man 2, the video game. That's a bad game, because it's legitimately bad.

Quit with the P2P bullshit. You're acting like it's a 3 second delay from when you shoot someone.

You're just being melodramatic
 

Treblaine

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JoesshittyOs said:
Treblaine said:
-improve the controls in terms of flexibility
I'm not sure what this means. In terms of actual gameplay, CoD is one of, if not the most, smoothest games on the market. Are you talking about actually making custom control set ups? Because I'm pretty sure PC has fully customizable controls.
Yep, PC does, but Consoles could do with that at the very least. Just ask this guy:


-more varied weapons (i.e. too many full auto hitscan weapons with 30 round mags)
-end the "straight upgrade" model of levelling up, every weapon new with huge pros and cons but none wholly superior. i.e. i'd have made the M16 in Black Ops with ACR accuracy, but only 18 rounds capacity (as was in Vietnam). AK47 a 2 hit kill but give it severe recoil. Give Machine Guns similar damage profile as sniper rifles (they fire same 7.62mm cartridge) but much much less accurate and severe movement penalty.
I'm going to stop you right here.

This would completely destroy what little balance CoD games have. You say have no wholly superior weapons, but then you make severe impacts like that? Having an AK with a 2 hit kill? Just put steady aim on it. You've now made it worthless to aim.

Machine guns where you severe penalties are made for moving and will have one shot kills? Guess whose gonna be sitting in at the choke points with their gun pointed straight ahead the entire game?

No, that wouldn't work. The guns are fine the way they are, just an overpowered one slips through the cracks.
Well you gave this a chance, you completley skimmed over the part of weapon BALANCE!

MW2 was full of guns that were 2-hit kill, but took no penalty in controllability or rate of fire (how quickly you can deliver those two fatal hits).

The idea here is if you want a 2-hit kill assault rifle then you have to take the "foil" of a low fire rate (550rpm vs 850rpm), wide hip spray, and Aiming-down-sights is hard as it kicks up obscuring your target. Abuse of Steady aim is offset by a lethargic reload, highly inventive for sleight of hand. Though I would go further.

See this is BALANCE. Big pros, big cons. Counterstrike is balanced this way with AK47 being much more powerful though harder to control.

Instead, all the assault rifles in Black Ops are made vanilla and with such trivial differences that aren't really balanced at all, the FAMAS was slightly superior to all the others and that makes all the difference.

Oh and machine gunners camping... that is what you are SUPPOSED TO DO WITH A MACHINE GUN! Just like snipers are supposed to "camp", it's your fault for rushing off to get kills and running into a trap. Why don't you stick together and advance with caution? Someone who camps behind a corner would get mullared by your comrade, then the only way to defend with an MG is from a head on position hard to flank but where you or several have a fighting chance.

PS: by "similar damage profile" I didn't mean all 1 hit kill, I mean each bullet does 70hp damage with a 1.5x multiplier to the head. So it CAN kill in one hit but only a GOOD hit, most of the time it is like the M60 (OR ALL the machine guns in MW2 with stopping power): 2-hit-kill. Anyway, it's ridiculous to survive a 7.62x51mm bullet through the head, the most powerful cartridge in the game. Sniper rifles would get 1.5x damage profiles for chest/abdomen/arms, etc

Frankly the "create a class" system utterly buttfucks balance as everyone combines weapons, attachment and perks to be MOST deadly without engineering in any "foils" to balance their class. Foils like in TF2 how the Heavy has a really powerful gun and Huge HP, but is a big, slow target that will get a lot more hits.

The idea is to tie as much as possible into the gun itself, with pros and cons inherent. I played Black ops with M60-grip, lightweight, marathon and steady aim and it was ridiculous - because a fully loaded M60 weighs 30lbs yet I was sprinting around like Usain Bolt! People called hax!

Weapon progression introduces new WAYS of playing, not steadily slightly superior weapons. So unlock Ak47
"yay, 2-hit killer with 30 round mag... aw but it's inaccurate as hell! Hmm, M16 or AK47?"

But in Black Ops the Commando and AK47 are statistically IDENTICAL, the Commando being just slightly better.

There will always be an overpowered gun until the COD teams realise they must balance benefits with costs, one will always end up marginally more powerful

-Dedicated servers on console and ESPECIALLY ON PC
You seem to assume that Dedicated servers are a must in a games, whereas not realizing that they are purely a bonus. I'm down for it, but I will never expect it.
They ARE a must. You just don't realise how much bullshit glitches and out-of-sync nonsense is caused by high lag, the community just blames "teh netcode". That's plain ignorance. I have extensively used BOTH setup and once you go Black Dedi, you'll never go back.

-end the overpowered killstreaks that are so much more annoying to suffer under than to see used against your opponent. Limit Killstreak bonuses to assisting features like Spyplane, Radar jammer, Blackbird, supply crate, sentry gun, RC-XD, death-machine, Juggernaut-suit. No more chopper gunner, that just means everyone carries a strela/stinger and shoots it down instantly or they forget it and the game stagnates for 60 seconds.
RC-XD? The C4 on wheels that is impossible to hit and sustained after only three kills?
No thank you.
Not as bad as chopper gunner, it doesn't matter how many kills it takes it just buttfucks the game when one of those turn up. Either you brought a launcher and its easy to destroy, or you forgot one and everyone has to hide inside. Same for all air support.

Killstreaks need to have the balance of satisfaction, not assume power is inherently satisfying. They need to be designed to bring maximum enjoyment to the user with minimum frustration to other players; RCXD is fun for one zooming towards the enemy, and pisses off another for just one second. Chopper gunner pisses of the entire opposing team paralysing the game.

Maybe RCXD could come from higher kill but you have to admit it's VERY fun to use and you do have a fighting chance as you hear it coming to shoot it if quick enough. You don't have such a defence from snipers?

The juggernaut idea is a package is dropped that gives you a juggernaut suit to wear and a heavy machine gun, it has large but non regenerating health and is chipped away by enemy fire. The balance is you are ALWAYS on radar and easy to hear so you cannot lurk, if you don't charge right into the enemy they'll pick you off. This is a personal killstreak where you are basically a walking tank.

Dogs I would change too, they should not be dozens charging off and kill the enemy off screen. That is a pointless death the player cannot appreciate yet frustrates the target. Dog killstreak gives you a faithful companion who guards your back and helps you hunt down enemies, he stays with you. I think this personal touch means a lot and will unite people around you.

I would get rid of all killstreaks that kill the enemy impersonally. Zooming in with a sniper rifle is personal. As a chopper gunner firing at a red outline - so far you can't even actually see them - is not personal. Especially automated killstreaks like attack chopper, they annoy the opposing team far more than they satisfy your own.

Sentry gun I'd keep, but I'd engineer it to need lots of maintenance so you can't leave it.

I would replace claymore with a boobytrapped flashbang that launches like bouncing betty. So YOU have to finish them off if you need to cover your arse, no planting them at distant choke-points for easy kills that frustrate, yet you get no thrill of the kill, just a number.

-balance melee. For the love of god. Insta-kill WITH a any amount of lunge! It doesn't even work like a melee, more like having a shotgun as alt fire. Something more like L4D's melee = so-lung bash that stuns (blurred vision), disorients (throws perspective off) and forces them back in a predictable direction. 3-4 bashes needed to kill, the intention is your gun does the killing, the melee is just to line them up.
As you've notice, I've cut off a few of the points you have stated because they may have in fact been done in this game. Melee is fine, and it has been fixed for this game like they have stated a couple hundred times. It is believed to now be two consecutive hits to kill someone.
I heard it was being changed... I can find NOTHING to confirm anything solid. It could be as little as the lunge being removed.

The thing with melee at the moment is having it a single button away that gives a sudden short range lunge to an insta-kill but with a significant recovery time, that is not conducive to a two-stab setup. The lunge is disorienting and if that doesn't kill then the target has the advantage to hipfire spray for an easy kill. Knife slashing has to be slow unless the weapon is drawn separately as the animation has to be like drawing the knife from your belt and then re-sheathing it.

I am very keen on melee with a bash from your gun butt, as it looks right to animate it as a very quick action and also works to chain them together in a series of bashes. It also follows logically that melee bash at the peak of sprinting would deal more damage. Also it does impress even on the bashee sending them stumbling with double vision, it functions like an instant-personalised-concussion-grenade.

And it just makes sense, if your gun isn't raised or out of ammo, lash out and crack their skull. Don't:
-take hand off your weapon
-reach down to your belt to find knife
-grasp knife and draw it
-lunge and stab into them with enough precision and force to instantly incapacitate them

Knife. A knife so powerful it can kill with one stab should be treated as equipment, we accept the throwing axe in a grenade slot, put the knife there. I suggest taking a queue from the sniper rifles which is region based, so stab to head, neck or torso insta-kills, but not the legs or arms. You actually have to aim.
Also, 'lunge' can go to hell. That only encourages knife runners as every stab they teleport so their comrades have too hard a time shooting the knifer. There can still be knifers, but the must sacrifice a nade slot and depend purely on their movement.

I'm not keen to pay $60 for a game than is a mish mash of elements from the past 4 games.
Then don't buy it. One less person complaining about it would sure help.
Don't you get why I say that? That is your queue to defend your position not just be like:

"I don't care what you say or do, I'm buying COD on launch like I have every year."
 

Treblaine

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Jul 25, 2008
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JoesshittyOs said:
Sephren468 said:
I could careless if a game is popular or not that has no effect on the fun factor. But for me yes MW2 is one of the worst games this gen. The Mp is pretty much unplayable IMO it has no balance at all and is super buggy. And IMO dedicated servers are pretty much required for me to purchase a MP shooter. P2P just makes games a lot less fun.
Yet again, it plain just is not.

Sure, it's imbalanced. But trying to say it's the worst game of this generation is ridiculous. I'll repeat, if a game that is 60$ sells the most copies world wide, it can kind of exclude itself from being a bad game.
That's a black-and-white argument. It's either worth buying or the worst game in the world.

How about it's just not good enough to be worth $60!?

The amount of money Nintendo shovel-ware and Transformers movies makes show that making money has NOTHING to do with being the best.

He is being hyperbolic (perhaps he means the worst game he has PLAYED this generation) but it's hardly much of a defence to say;

"well at least I'm not as bad as a shitty movie-tie in game like Iron Man 2"

That's a very low bar.

Very.

COD fans should demand more from Activision, and not wave your $60 begging to buy their cobbled together scraps of previous games. You know they will extract another $60 with 4 map packs, may even be as bold to release SIX map packs, each $15

"huuuh, it's only $15, it's worth it for time spent"

This is could add up to $150! For ONE GAME! A game that is too cheap to give you dedicated servers, when even Gears of War is adopting dedicated servers. Back in the day map packs used to be free as the devs would NEVER want their user base divided by who bought which packs/maps. Valve have it right today but the publishers - who have no love for gaming - only see an easy buck.
 

Grabbin Keelz

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Jun 3, 2009
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I love how most of the screentime consists of the guy looking down his sights and shooting people, like I've never seen THAT before.