Transgender People and Attraction OR The Inherent Homophobia in Society

[Chicago Ted]

And I have to agree with most of what this guy is saying as well.

Metanar, I know you'll read this post as well, so I'll also add on the fact that in over 95% of these cases, something looks 'off' to me about the transwoman. The main thing I'm seeing is a nose that looks too big, and a jaw that seems too wide. But those are broad observations.

*Don't take this as absolute though. My field of knowledge other than one individual I know personally, comes mostly from some time spent surfing through Google Images and a couple websites.

On top of that as well though, I do understand how you could go through several surgeries to make it as close to possible, but then a different issue would be raised with me. I'd be turned off by the fact that they went through all the surgeries to look that way.

That's a reasonable opinion based on the information you've seen, and there's nothing wrong with choosing a mate based physical appearance.

Your figure of "95%" made me want to raise a point, which is that for obvious reasons many transwomen who pass completely choose to live in "stealth", breaking ties with contacts that knew their old identity and not telling people about that part of themselves.

Estimates that include these women (based on medical statistics) put the prevalence of post-op TS women in the US at 1:500 - 1:2500, and transition without SRS at 1:200 - 1:1000. Since you can't see genitals in public, this means at least as many as 1 in 1000 "females" is a TG transitioner, and as many as 1 in 200 have that status. Reference.

I'll admit, at this point I'm kinda hopping back on here between studying and breaking and am kept awake by caffiene by this point. Was more on the point that sometimes it can seem really obvious, hence why there isn't attraction, and with others if they've had to go through large amounts of surgeries to get the look, I'm turned off in the same way I'd be turned off of a normal woman who went through a ton of surgeries to achieve that look.

Point is, if I know anyone changed themselves from surgery like this:

Spoiler: Surgery Image

I'd almost always feel off when being around them.

 

[Chicago Ted]

Accidents in infancy and early childhood can also result in reassignment, particularly for boys who lose a significant length of their penises somehow.

Just going to respond to this part right now, but this sent me back to my Grade 11 Psychology class.

Spoiler: David Reimer

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Reimer

This incident shows how badly that can go.

 

[chaosyoshimage]

I am a gay American male, and I would be intimate with a Trans-person of either gender, so long as I can relate to them on an emotional basis and they are genuinely nice and fun to be around. I feel that Homophobia and Trans-phobia are irrational fears, as Humans are, by nature set up to be Bisexual in nature. See the Kinsey Scale and most other works done by professionals in this sort of area.

Basically this guy's post would be how I feel about it. I would rather pursue the companionship of a natural man because that's what I'm most attracted to sexually, but if I had a connection with a trans women or man (Or natural woman for that matter) I could see it working.

 

[isometry]

And I have to agree with most of what this guy is saying as well.

Metanar, I know you'll read this post as well, so I'll also add on the fact that in over 95% of these cases, something looks 'off' to me about the transwoman. The main thing I'm seeing is a nose that looks too big, and a jaw that seems too wide. But those are broad observations.

*Don't take this as absolute though. My field of knowledge other than one individual I know personally, comes mostly from some time spent surfing through Google Images and a couple websites.

On top of that as well though, I do understand how you could go through several surgeries to make it as close to possible, but then a different issue would be raised with me. I'd be turned off by the fact that they went through all the surgeries to look that way.

That's a reasonable opinion based on the information you've seen, and there's nothing wrong with choosing a mate based physical appearance.

Your figure of "95%" made me want to raise a point, which is that for obvious reasons many transwomen who pass completely choose to live in "stealth", breaking ties with contacts that knew their old identity and not telling people about that part of themselves.

Estimates that include these women (based on medical statistics) put the prevalence of post-op TS women in the US at 1:500 - 1:2500, and transition without SRS at 1:200 - 1:1000. Since you can't see genitals in public, this means at least as many as 1 in 1000 "females" is a TG transitioner, and as many as 1 in 200 have that status. Reference.

I'll admit, at this point I'm kinda hopping back on here between studying and breaking and am kept awake by caffiene by this point. Was more on the point that sometimes it can seem really obvious, hence why there isn't attraction, and with others if they've had to go through large amounts of surgeries to get the look, I'm turned off in the same way I'd be turned off of a normal woman who went through a ton of surgeries to achieve that look.

I see your point, but keep in mind that many of those who take hormone treatments at the onset of puberty don't need facial surgery because they don't develop masculine features in the first place. I don't have a good reference for this, but consider that it might be true. And sure, most "professionally out" TS models have had facial surgery, but so do many genetically female models, and again that data is biased towards transsexuals who don't pass.

Transwomen that transition smoothly in early puberty who never need surgery will pass easily and put the whole TS thing behind them, the successes become invisible.

 

[SillyBear]

So now for the discussion, if you're one of those people who wouldn't sleep with a transperson, what's your reasoning?

First of all, I'll start with the fact I am female if that gives any context.

Reasons why I would not even be with a transgendered person:

- I want to have more children.

- I am uncomfortable with the whole idea of it.

I don't dislike transgendered people. I don't hurt them. I don't abuse them. I don't infringe upon their rights. I treat transgendered people the say way I treat everyone else.

I just am uncomfortable with the whole rhetoric behind transgenderism - and I would be put off knowing that my sexual partner used to have different organs.

I'm allowed to think that right? Like I said, there is no malice behind it - it's just a straight up turn off. Just like how long hair is a turn off. I don't hate men with long hair - but I don't find them sexually attractive either.

There you go.

 

[geK0]

My thoughts at first:
"I'd be able to tell, and that would just put me off"

My thoughts after a little research:

"hmmm not bad"


I guess it depends on the quality of the transition. Hell I've even seen some guys with somewhat of a girlish charm that i thought looked alright : \.

 

[WolfThomas]

I'm a straight Australian male, I would probably have sex with a male to female transperson if I was sexually attracted to them, I would probably be a little freaked out if they were pre-op, and I might get weird in a relationship, but I'd probably give it a shot. The key thing is that I'd have to be attracted to them in the first place, which is unlikely but not impossible.

 

[Helmholtz Watson]

Why cant you guys just accept me as the narwhale I so urge to be?

Its phobic to do otherwise!! You nazies!!!!

This type of thing is incredibly offensive from the eyes of someone suffering from a recognised medical condition.

The problem with a lot of you is that you see some kind of additional idea of sex; there's sex, your actual physical form, your gender, the sex that you identify as and then a lot of you are creating this brand new spiritual permanent variable that determines, in your minds, what sex a person actually is. If a person looks like a woman and identifies as a woman (and trust me, it's not just "acting" like some of you are crudely putting it, these people including myself are far beyond the realms of acting like the gender we identify as) then why are you so opposed to the idea of being with them? Children? You can adopt? Sex? Works just fine, trust me on that. Looks? This one is pretty obvious.

Of course a lot of people will go all scientific and say "well biologically you're X, not Y which you identify as", except that's a load of shit and anyone can see that because the only defining thing that you could possibly be referring to once a transsexual has undergone HRT and SRS is DNA, and when the fuck did people start caring about the DNA of the person they love? Oh no, you've got the wrong chromosomes, not touching you with a 50 foot pole!

But do you know what, referring back to the post I quoted, I don't give a fuck if you are too immature to accept people as the gender they identify as, but at least have the respect and courtesy to refer to them as their chosen gender. Just because you can't deal with the idea that someone identifies as a different gender to the sex they were born as doesn't mean you should go around offending people who do. Grow up.

I have a better idea, you acknowledge that you just have a difference of opinion and leave it at that, because what you are doing right now is making ignorant guesses about how the person "deals" with this subject. As for people being offended, if you have been on the escapist for a while, then you know this video....

OP While I don't mind a limited amount of plastic surgery, doing something (by that I mean cutting up your genitals) that makes me think of past "surgical" practitioners/events like this* [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dr._Josef_Mengele#Human_experimentation] or this* [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unit_731#Activities], which causes me to be not attracted to such a person. They have the right to do what they want with their body, and I have the right to form an opinion on them when they do so (that opinion being that they are people who I'm not attracted to).

*It should be noted that I'm not suggesting that getting a sex change is the exact same thing as the events that took place in the links I gave, just that my previous exposure to hearing about such extreme forms of surgery have been dark, so as a result the first thing that comes to mind are the subjects on the links I provided

 

[Metanar]

First off, even though I state that I supposedly have low standards, you really have no idea what I do or do not find attractive, nor how many transgender people I have met. I will give you that this city is not exactly a haven for transgender people, so my selection is quite low (and mostly FtM).

Second, my use of the word "vagina" may have been the wrong word, if you insist on being precise, I am referring to the entire female reproductive system in general. Including ovaries, uterus, etc. Can a transwoman reproduce? No. Do they menstruate? No. Different? Yes. And I stick to my belief that medical science has not yet progressed enough for convincing surgical enhancements/modifications. I've seen some plastic surgery nightmares, I'd be amazed if an internalized penis could look convincing enough for me to get it up.

Again, I'll state that I have no disrespect for transgender people, I just don't want to screw them. You can respect that or continue being an ass, I don't really care either way.

You can't see ovaries while you're having sex with someone, as far as you're concerned the vagina created in SRS is almost exactly the same as a real one. And of course you go back to the reproduction thing as well which I love since I've already countered this issue. It's an imaginary distinction you're making here, it looks the same, you can stick your dick in it like a real vagina, there's no real difference as far as you can tell.

The whole point of this thread is asking if you would date a trans person IF you found them attractive, so bringing up plastic surgery nightmares and all of that crap that so rarely actually happens in these cases is totally irrelevant, thank you for not paying attention.

And I'll continue "being an ass", since your opinion is transphobic by definition.

I have a better idea, you acknowledge that you just have a difference of opinion and leave it at that, because what you are doing right now is making ignorant guesses about how the person "deals" with this subject. As for people being offended, if you have been on the escapist for a while, then you know this video....

OP While I don't mind a limited amount of plastic surgery, doing something (by that I mean cutting up your genitals) that makes me think of past "surgical" practitioners/events like this* [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dr._Josef_Mengele#Human_experimentation] or this* [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unit_731#Activities], which causes me to be not attracted to such a person. They have the right to do what they want with their body, and I have the right to form an opinion on them when they do so (that opinion being that they are people who I'm not attracted to).

*It should be noted that I'm not suggesting that getting a sex change is the exact same thing as the events that took place in the links I gave, just that my previous exposure to hearing about such extreme forms of surgery have been dark, so as a result the first thing that comes to mind are the subjects on the links I provided

Just because the escapist has lots of little children who like to shout their childish, malformed opinions doesn't mean that behaviour should be encouraged. If you set out to offend someone, and you do, well done, you're an ass hole. Thanks for this pointless addition to the thread.

You've posted a bunch of completely irrelevant experiments there, which doesn't add anything either. SRS is a refined, well documented procedure. The people who do this surgery aren't mad scientists switching peoples' genders in some hair brained scheme to push the bounds of medical science, no, they're doctors doing surgery to help people feel comfortable with their exterior appearance in regards to their gender identity.

I really don't get where you're going with this weird surgical experimentation line of argument, it doesn't actually add anything to the thread in any way. The fact that weird surgical experiments happened puts you off trans people? What?

Now, not at once did I say that "DNA is more important than how a person identifies", I said that's how I define it. To me, a transwoman is not the same as a real woman because of the biological differences that still exist. No matter how much you want, on a biological level, it is impossible to currently make that change. And as I said, if that changes, so may my view on the issue, but until it does, they will stay set.

Also, my rationality does not come from a hatred or fear of the subject. It comes from a scientific perspective on it. No matter how much kicking and screaming is done on it, there is no denying that the biological differences still remain, and because of that, it is a different classification to me.

Say you took two lizards, a red and a green, each with different sets of genes that make them what they are. No matter what you do to the red lizard to make it green, change the pigment of its skin, make its tail match the other, whatever, to me, it's still a red lizard that has been made to look green unless it is able to be changed from the core. (I know this may not be the best example, but I'm sleepy and have an exam tomorrow that I've been fried studying for)

My view boils down to only that.

Now, why I wouldn't date an individual such as this boils down as well to the part on children. If and when I want to have kids, I want them naturally with my partner. I would not like to have to jump through hoops or go through a variety of alternative methods to have them. Also, it's based on the fact that honestly, I don't think I could even see myself hook up with one regardless if your reaction to this situation is anything to go by. If someone were to jump down my throat like that based only for a view I held, they would not be the type of person I believe I would want to spent large amounts of my time with.

And also, yes, I may have mistaken the terms, sorry, this isn't an area that I'm completely familiar with.

And fine, go ahead and call me a transphobic or whatever if you want. Go ahead and slander me more for the views I have and the arguments I make. You know what I hope?

I hope you're happy with your lifestyle choices and the decisions you make. I that wherever you identify, it is where you feel you belong and where you feel like you should be. I will not stand in your way, or call you a freak or anything because of them.

Just know that if you ask me out, I'll turn you down. Same as I would for a guy, or even a girl that for example, had tattoos on her faces or something. I'll let you make your choices without comment, now let me make mine.

You define sex as the DNA someone has? DNA interacts with you on a visible level precisely 0 times every day, you don't approach women and ask "what chromosomes do you have I need to figure out if it's safe to have a boner over you or not" so why are you applying this logic here?

Thanks for the little analogy with the lizards, it really helps me to understand how attached you are to the idea of DNA being the most important thing in existence. A green lizard painted red is a green lizard painted red, purely because there's still a green lizard under there. A green lizard that has had surgery and hormones to permanently alter their colour to red is quite clearly a red lizard, as they will never again be a green lizard. It's the same case here. If you take a man with gender identity issues and give him hormones and he has the SRS, guess what, she's a woman, because there's nothing man left in there. Her gender was never male, she always identified as a woman, that's why she took the change. Her sex is now female, she's had the sex change, you can SEE that she is a woman. What else is there, oh yeah, DNA. Refer back to above, it's entirely irrelevant.

This is quite clearly a debate. If you post an opinion, don't you dare expect people to be okay with it, I'm going to jump down your throat because I think your opinion is stupid and that's how it's meant to be. And yes, you are transphobic by definition, I've already explained that to you. It's not slander, it's evident prejudice.

I wouldn't date you either, so don't think that that little addition makes a difference.

 

[orangeban]

Snip

Wow, you've answered them far better than I ever could. Thanks very muchly.

 

[Neuromaster]

Adoption is a thing. Just sayin'.

I had a feeling that point might come up.

Adoption would be an option for a trans-person and their partner, but it's far harder than birthing your own child. You can't just go down to an orphanage and pick a child. In the UK at-least, you and your partner first have to under very detailed checks that often take between 1 and 3 years to complete. The social workers judging can look at everything... money, your house, your job hours, your medical history... and reject you without even giving a reason. I'd gander a guess and say that while they aren't meant to, a large number of social workers might not consider a transwoman/man up to standard. If you make it through that, then they try to pair you with a suitable child... which again can takes years to find and finalise the adoption through court. Once you've finally adopted your child, you've often got to learn how to care and control a child who's been neglected or abused by their previous carers, certainly tougher than raising a kid from scratch.

My long and rambling point is that the assumption that adoption is an equal alternative to having your own child is mistaken. To those who fight their way through the red tape and successfully adopt, the greatest respect, but it's not for everyone. Anyone who wanted children and was with a trans-person would have to think long and hard about whether they could go through with that or not.

Not even beginning to claim it's easy, equal, fair, or pleasant. Just something that deserves consideration. Claiming that one can't build a family with a transperson seems all kinds of not-OK to me. Any argument to that end seems... weak. Even a cursory search would turn up evidence to the contrary.

 

[Lil devils x_v1legacy]

I would never be attracted to a transman, or even a transwoman because of their emotional hangups. I do not like self absorbed, overly emotional people to begin with, and someone who would be so self conscious, self absorbed to go through the trouble to have actual surgery in order to be happy with themslves is way way too emo to me. It is a matter of priorities, personality, interests, and values that determine whether or not I am attracted to someone. If they are that hung up on things that, in my mind, do not matter in the whole of life, then they are definately not someone I want to hang out with little lone have any kind of relationship with whatsoever. I don't like most people to begin with, so they would just fall into that catagory as well. Most people are too worried about vanity to begin with, and they take that to the extreme.

 

[Terminal Blue]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/David_Reimer

This incident shows how badly that can go.

Emphasis on the can.

The guy was pretty much sexually abused by his psychologist who treated "being a girl" and "desiring men" as the same thing and sought to perform what was basically a violent attempt at conversion therapy on a functional male personality.

Other, better managed cases of infant sex reassignment have gone far better. As I said, it's not a hugely uncommon practice. The existence a few "failed" examples, however highly hyped as evidence of some true and immutable gender identity, is not terribly surprising or indicative.

I oppose the sex reassignment of children on grounds of consent, but it still happens frequently and there's really no evidence for half the stuff people say about cases like David Reimer's. There's no real evidence that beyond their sexual desire humans have this innate sense of "who they are" present from birth. People look for it incredibly intensely, desperately one might even say, but I've seen no evidence for it.

That said, and before someone twists this logic, there are many reasons to want to transition which aren't dependent on the idea of an innate or "true" gender identity. The difference it can make to people is very, very real.

I'd gander a guess and say that while they aren't meant to, a large number of social workers might not consider a transwoman/man up to standard.

I'm not saying it's impossible, but they could be taken to court for it and certainly lose their job.

Once someone has undergone a legal transition and had their birth certificate changed, they are a man/woman in the eyes of the law. To treat them differently or deny service to them any more than to any other man or woman is unfair treatment under the Equality Act 2010.

If you undergoing a medical transition (for example, are still taking high doses of hormones or awaiting surgery) that can be a quantifiable problem, but if you have transitioned before the adoption process starts then it's illegal to make that an obstacle.

 

[Metanar]

I would never be attracted to a transman, or even a transwoman because of their emotional hangups. I do not like self absorbed, overly emotional people to begin with, and someone who would be so self conscious, self absorbed to go through the trouble to have actual surgery in order to be happy with themslves is way way too emo to me. It is a matter of priorities, personality, interests, and values that determine whether or not I am attracted to someone. If they are that hung up on things that, in my mind, do not matter in the whole of life, then they are definately not someone I want to hang out with little lone have any kind of relationship with whatsoever. I don't like most people to begin with, so they would just fall into that catagory as well. Most people are too worried about vanity to begin with, and they take that to the extreme.

Transgender =/= Emo insecure whiny people who can't deal with themselves

Trans people are suffering from a medical condition, it's not some self esteem issue where they feel changing sex is the only thing that will make them feel better. They (we) literally feel like a member of the opposite sex and are confident enough about this feeling in order to push ahead with it and go on to have a sex change. It's big deal, not some tiny thing they're "hung up" over, as you so eloquently put it. And it definitely isn't about vanity (and I actually laughed when I read that). And furthermore why would someone insecure have the confidence to do all of this? What you're saying doesn't make sense.

 

[Lil devils x_v1legacy]

I would never be attracted to a transman, or even a transwoman because of their emotional hangups. I do not like self absorbed, overly emotional people to begin with, and someone who would be so self conscious, self absorbed to go through the trouble to have actual surgery in order to be happy with themslves is way way too emo to me. It is a matter of priorities, personality, interests, and values that determine whether or not I am attracted to someone. If they are that hung up on things that, in my mind, do not matter in the whole of life, then they are definately not someone I want to hang out with little lone have any kind of relationship with whatsoever. I don't like most people to begin with, so they would just fall into that catagory as well. Most people are too worried about vanity to begin with, and they take that to the extreme.

Transgender =/= Emo insecure whiny people who can't deal with themselves

Trans people are suffering from a medical condition, it's not some self esteem issue where they feel changing sex is the only thing that will make them feel better. They (we) literally feel like a member of the opposite sex and are confident enough about this feeling in order to push ahead with it and go on to have a sex change. It's big deal, not some tiny thing they're "hung up" over, as you so eloquently put it. And it definitely isn't about vanity (and I actually laughed when I read that). And furthermore why would someone insecure have the confidence to do all of this? What you're saying doesn't make sense.

Funny, I graduated medical school and no, that was not taught to be a medical condition. I disagree with your opinion on this matter. It is not the same thing to be born a hermophrodite as it is for a physically healthy individual to put themslves through surgery to change their bodies to fit what they think they should be, to put yourself through surgery to change youself means that you were not comfortable in your own skin to begin with. I don't even like to wear makeup or wear earings, and have a great deal of respect for nature. I am one of those who feels that unless it is life threatening, life should run it's course. I have dealt with a great many people who have had actual serious issues, and I find the entire premise that something as petty as whether or not you "feel like a boy or feel like a girl" is insignificant in the whole of life. We have a great many more things to worry about in this world than whether or not we should put people under the knife for petty issues such as this when we cannot even get a surgeon into the regions where we need surgeons to save lives, but have an abundance of physicians available for these things instead, which frankly disgusts me.

Now would I have sex with someone of the same sex as me? Yes, Of course, I have already. This is an issue of priorities and what is important to them, so yes, for someone to put that much emphasis on them " being trapped in the wrong body" would make them wayyy too emotional for my tastes, and I would see their priorities in conflict with my own, which I happen to find a very unattractive aspect of ones personality.

 

[Metanar]

Funny, I graduated medical school and no, that was not taught to be a medical condition. I disagree with your opinion on this matter. It is not the same thing to be born a hermophrodite as it is for a physically healthy individual to put themslves through surgery to change their bodies to fit what they think they should be, to put yourself through surgery to change youself means that you were not comfortable in your own skin to begin with. I don't even like to wear makeup or wear earings, and have a great deal of respect for nature. I am one of those who feels that unless it is life threatening, life should run it's course. I have dealt with a great many people who have had actual serious issues, and I find the entire premise that something as petty as whether or not you "feel like a boy or feel like a girl" is insignificant in the whole of life. We have a great many more things to worry about in this world than whether or not we should put people under the knife for petty issues such as this when we cannot even get a surgeon into the regions where we need surgeons to save lives, but have an abundance of physicians available for these things instead, which frankly disgusts me.

Now would I have sex with someone of the same sex as me? Yes, Of course, I have already. This is an issue of priorities and what is important to them, so yes, for someone to put that much emphasis on them " being trapped in the wrong body" would make them wayyy too emotional for my tastes, and I would see their priorities in conflict with my own, which I happen to find a very unattractive aspect of ones personality.

I don't know what medical school you graduated from, but: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender_identity_disorder

In a lot of countries it's recognised as a mental disorder, in the UK it's recognised as a medical condition.

You truly do belittle how severely impacted the life of a transgendered person is. Feeling that you are "trapped in the wrong body" as you put it is soul-shattering. It's led me to the brink of suicide numerous times so I'll just tell you now that it's not 'petty' and the very idea that it is is insulting.

This is a high priority, and it makes a huge impact on peoples' lives, anything that makes someone want to kill themselves is a big red flashing neon sign that emphasises massive importance.

But okay, if your basis for not dating someone (key word: someone, not 'a trans person) is because they're too emotional, fine. That's absolutely fine, but don't you dare start stereotyping transsexuals as emotional, insecure people hung up about tiny things.

 

[Lil devils x_v1legacy]

Funny, I graduated medical school and no, that was not taught to be a medical condition. I disagree with your opinion on this matter. It is not the same thing to be born a hermophrodite as it is for a physically healthy individual to put themslves through surgery to change their bodies to fit what they think they should be, to put yourself through surgery to change youself means that you were not comfortable in your own skin to begin with. I don't even like to wear makeup or wear earings, and have a great deal of respect for nature. I am one of those who feels that unless it is life threatening, life should run it's course. I have dealt with a great many people who have had actual serious issues, and I find the entire premise that something as petty as whether or not you "feel like a boy or feel like a girl" is insignificant in the whole of life. We have a great many more things to worry about in this world than whether or not we should put people under the knife for petty issues such as this when we cannot even get a surgeon into the regions where we need surgeons to save lives, but have an abundance of physicians available for these things instead, which frankly disgusts me.

Now would I have sex with someone of the same sex as me? Yes, Of course, I have already. This is an issue of priorities and what is important to them, so yes, for someone to put that much emphasis on them " being trapped in the wrong body" would make them wayyy too emotional for my tastes, and I would see their priorities in conflict with my own, which I happen to find a very unattractive aspect of ones personality.

I don't know what medical school you graduated from, but: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender_identity_disorder

In a lot of countries it's recognised as a mental disorder, in the UK it's recognised as a medical condition.

You truly do belittle how severely impacted the life of a transgendered person is. Feeling that you are "trapped in the wrong body" as you put it is soul-shattering. It's led me to the brink of suicide numerous times so I'll just tell you now that it's not 'petty' and the very idea that it is is insulting.

This is a high priority, and it makes a huge impact on peoples' lives, anything that makes someone want to kill themselves is a big red flashing neon sign that emphasises massive importance.

But okay, if your basis for not dating someone (key word: someone, not 'a trans person) is because they're too emotional, fine. That's absolutely fine, but don't you dare start stereotyping transsexuals as emotional, insecure people hung up about tiny things.

University of Texas Medical Board. That is a controversial issue in Phsychology, and not an actual physical medical condition. We have terms for everything, regardless of it is an actual physical condition or if it is a mental condition. It is one of those issues that the majority of physicians * rolls their eyes at* simply because it is not an actual physical ailment, instead it is a psychological issue. As most are aware, Many physicians are more often than not in conflict with Psychiatrists when it comes to physical health vs mental health, as the treatments and medications that are prescribed by Psychiatrists are often very bad for your physical health. There has always been great conflict between medical treatment and psychological treatment, as they do not see eye to eye on many issues. Neurologists and Psychiatrists both have to deal with many of the same issues but disagree more often than they agree.

My opinion on the matter is this: If we do not have enough surgeons to ensure everyone access to life saving surgery world wide, it is shameful for capable surgeons to be spending their time doing these operations instead of actually saving lives. Even more disgusting is they do it for the money, and that people spend money on this crap when think of all of the lives that could have been saved with that time and money. It is truly shameful.

I do and will sterotype them as overly emotional for my tastes, but so are many non transexuals. Many are obsessed with their self image rather than just trying to solve the primary issues facing this world. I am personally disgusted by that. But then again, I am disgusted by hollywood, commercialized sports and materialism as well.

 

[Metanar]

University of Texas Medical Board. That is a controversial issue in Phsychology, and not an actual physical medical condition. We have terms for everything, regardless of it is an actual physical condition or if it is a mental condition. It is one of those issues that the majority of physicians * rolls their eyes at* simply because it is not an actual physical ailment, instead it is a psychological issue. As most are aware, Many physicians are more often than not in conflict with Psychiatrists when it comes to physical health vs mental health, as the treatments and medications that are prescribed by Psychiatrists are often very bad for your physical health. There has always been great conflict between medical treatment and psychological treatment, as they do not see eye to eye on many issues. Neurologists and Psychiatrists both have to deal with many of the same issues but disagree more often than they agree.

The University of Texas Medical Board? That explains a lot.

Anyway you ignored the main point of my post so I'll just quote it so you can read it again.

You truly do belittle how severely impacted the life of a transgendered person is. Feeling that you are "trapped in the wrong body" as you put it is soul-shattering. It's led me to the brink of suicide numerous times so I'll just tell you now that it's not 'petty' and the very idea that it is is insulting.

This is a high priority, and it makes a huge impact on peoples' lives, anything that makes someone want to kill themselves is a big red flashing neon sign that emphasises massive importance.

But okay, if your basis for not dating someone (key word: someone, not 'a trans person) is because they're too emotional, fine. That's absolutely fine, but don't you dare start stereotyping transsexuals as emotional, insecure people hung up about tiny things.

 

[Lil devils x_v1legacy]

University of Texas Medical Board. That is a controversial issue in Phsychology, and not an actual physical medical condition. We have terms for everything, regardless of it is an actual physical condition or if it is a mental condition. It is one of those issues that the majority of physicians * rolls their eyes at* simply because it is not an actual physical ailment, instead it is a psychological issue. As most are aware, Many physicians are more often than not in conflict with Psychiatrists when it comes to physical health vs mental health, as the treatments and medications that are prescribed by Psychiatrists are often very bad for your physical health. There has always been great conflict between medical treatment and psychological treatment, as they do not see eye to eye on many issues. Neurologists and Psychiatrists both have to deal with many of the same issues but disagree more often than they agree.

The University of Texas Medical Board? That explains a lot.

Anyway you ignored the main point of my post so I'll just quote it so you can read it again.

You truly do belittle how severely impacted the life of a transgendered person is. Feeling that you are "trapped in the wrong body" as you put it is soul-shattering. It's led me to the brink of suicide numerous times so I'll just tell you now that it's not 'petty' and the very idea that it is is insulting.

This is a high priority, and it makes a huge impact on peoples' lives, anything that makes someone want to kill themselves is a big red flashing neon sign that emphasises massive importance.

But okay, if your basis for not dating someone (key word: someone, not 'a trans person) is because they're too emotional, fine. That's absolutely fine, but don't you dare start stereotyping transsexuals as emotional, insecure people hung up about tiny things.

What exactly does that explain? It is a top notch school, and I am proud to have made it through. " I will belittle it, as in my opinion, they are more concerned about being trapped in a healthy body and do not appreciate the health they do have. They do not appreciate that they were given legs to walk, or sight to see the beautiful world we live in. Instead they focus on one aspect they are not content with and allow it to consume them. That is why I take issue with this, because they are too self absorbed to be grateful for the gifts they were given and to appreciate how lucky they are. Working in my field and dealing with children with real disabilites and seeing how happy they are with themslves and not wanting to be anyone else makes you realize that it isn't what happens to you in life it is completely how you choose to deal with it. A child born without legs and being content that way, gives you a different perspective on what is really important in life.

This one little girl who had was dealt a terrible hand by nature, yet cared nothing for herself or her condition, but was more concerned about those around her, and helping make a real difference in this world probably made the biggest impact on my life and my perspective on these things. Yes, she helped show me how all of these other things really do not matter, as it isn't about how we feel, it is a matter of what we do in the end.

"soul shattering"- they do not even understand what that means if they think that being dealt a healthy body regardless of gender is a bad thing.

 

[Metanar]

What exactly does that explain? It is a top notch school, and I am proud to have made it through. " I will belittle it, as in my opinion, they are more concerned about being trapped in a healthy body and do not appreciate the health they do have. They do not appreciate that they were given legs to walk, or sight to see the beautiful world we live in. Instead they focus on one aspect they are not content with and allow it to consume them. That is why I take issue with this, because they are too self absorbed to be grateful for the gifts they were given and to appreciate how lucky they are. Working in my field and dealing with children with real disabilites and seeing how happy they are with themslves and not wanting to be anyone else makes you realize that it isn't what happens to you in life it is completely how you choose to deal with it. A child born without legs and being content that way, gives you a different perspective on what is really important in life.

This one little girl who had was dealt a terrible hand by nature, yet cared nothing for herself or her condition, but was more concerned about those around her, and helping make a real difference in this world probably made the biggest impact on my life and my perspective on these things. Yes, she helped show me how all of these other things really do not matter, as it isn't about how we feel, it is a matter of what we do in the end.

"soul shhattering"- they do not even understand what that means if they think that being dealt a healthy body regardless of gender is a bad thing.

Texas isn't exactly the most progressive American state, and to have qualified in medicine from it frankly doesn't give me much confidence in your knowledge about LGBT matters. Doctors are meant to be compassionate and understanding - something you have yet to demonstrate towards people suffering this condition.

I don't care about your medical experience, your patients, what you've seen, any of it; don't go on about your experience as a doctor, it's irrelevant.

You just don't understand the feeling, since, guess what, you've never felt it before. You're just a bigot who refuses to accept things you can't perceive yourself. So why don't you stop making assumptions about how transsexualism affects people and deal with it.

It's not a waste if it saves a life, and if I knew I couldn't finish my transition, I would kill myself.