But isn't succesful the same as good? :O If it wasn't good then it wasn't successful...Squilookle said:I said successful, not goodThe other two are certainly better with melee though, especially Warband.
Ways to Combine Shooting and Melee in 3rd Person and Make it Fun?
- Thread starter DBLT4P
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Successful means it works. Good means it's especially enjoyable. Not always -but quite often- the same thing.daveman247 said:But isn't succesful the same as good? :O If it wasn't good then it wasn't successful...Squilookle said:I said successful, not good
GTA 4 added counter attacks along with timed hits doing more damage, it made the early game much more fun.daveman247 said:
Resident Evil 4 / 5's knife could be useful for breaking boxes or killing zombies without wasting ammo, its not a giant leap but it is a good thing.
Actually this a pretty easy thing to implement.DBLT4P said:
First, it's important to establish the basic things that each type of combat need in order to function smoothly and enjoyably
Melee: wide visual angle, controllable camera, convenient buttons for combat moves
Ranged: aiming reticle, zoomed mode, ability to strafe, trigger buttons.
In practice these needs would go something along the lines of:
Melee is much like god of war with the hack-slasky fun, but the player is given a dynamic controllable camera (centre point on the player) so they can focus on what they deem important whilst moving and fighting in any direction they please. Melee attacks would be set to the X, Y and B buttons (assuming that we're working off of an Xbox controller), and jump would be A (I'll talk more about this later). Each button type activates a different type of attack type (light, heavy, special etc) and can be combined with the jump and other attacks at any time to make combo attacks (some pre mapped, but most are freeform). The overall distance from the placer character is a good distance away, ensuring the any player can get a good sense of the battlefield's flow, better visual displaying, and more importantly won't be cheaply snuck up on by an enemy they couldn't see (a factor that leads to a lot of frustration in melee-oriented games).
Now comes ranged combat which is going to require a different dynamic to work. The most practical way to implement it's activation is to use a control scheme much like most modern shooters. The left trigger button activates ranged mode (I find holding the button down works best in this situation) which suddenly zooms and moves the camera to a static position over the player character's shoulder. The static position is slaved to the players aiming reticle, which starts of wherever the player was roughly looking at in melee mode, and provides three major traits: First it allows for strafing, which the player could not do in melee, allowing for some differing combat styles and maneuvering. Second it zooms the player's view, which gives a lot more capability for selective fire on specific targets. Finally, it narrows the player's sight angle, making is easier for enemies to flank them. This ensures that there is a balance between melee and ranged (ranged gives more reach and precision, while melee gives more situation awareness and maneuverability), so the player must swap between both combat types in order to get the best bang for buck in battle. The right trigger activates the ranged weapon's primary attack, while the shoulder buttons are reserved for alternative attacks (grenades, alternative fire etc.)
The jump as previously mentioned is the A button (and for bonus points) pressing A again whilst mid air activates short term flight (using wings, jetpack, whatever suits the game's setting). Flying can be done for a few seconds, but the longer it is used the longer it takes to recharge. The length of recharge time increases on a rising scale depending on how much the player has used the charge (4eg using it for a quick burst to reach up to a ledge would only take a second or two, but using up the whole charge may take somewhere along the lines of 15-20 seconds). This ensures 2 things: 1) that in a multiplayer match people don't abuse it like the Halo Jetpack was and 2) it isn't abused by players looking to find a place where the boss can't reach them and spam the ranged attack until they're dead (though this can be mitigated by ensure there are no places like that in the map for the player to abuse, but redundancy is a good thing). Depending on which combat type is being used at time of flight activation, it will behave differently. Melee flight starts out with a quick acceleration (functioning much like a dodge roll for the first moment) leveling out to decent speed, while ranged flight is a far smoother affair, allowing for smoother tracking (strafing run style)
Now you'll notice that I've left very little over lap between buttons for ranged and melee. This is intentional, because I've found that multi-mapping buttons tends to get very confusing in the heat of battle. a lot of people who tend to use one combat type of the other may instinctively press a button because they're preinclined to think does one thing when suddenly their character does something completely different, which in games where your enemy is on an equal footing as you can be disasterous.
So there you have it; a smooth blend between ranged and melee combat, with a bonus of style specific flight. Now let me note that these designs are only what you would call the rough draft, as most of the work in implementing this would be in the honing down of fine details to ensure that the game is a tight as it can get, and that is something that would need to be done early on to prevent it clashing with any other developments (seriously, you do not want your major features in conflict with each other. That is a textbook example of a mechanics disaster). However as it stands this would still be some solid ground work for a game. Hope this helps.
Aside: I know that is may seem a bit dickish, but my lawyer would kill me if the appropriate situation arised and I hadn't explicitly stated this, so here goes:
I am already fully intending to utilize these specific features in a game (of which the inital premise was formed in April 2012 C.E.), as such I reserve all rights and privileges regarding the stated data in this post. Anyone wishing to use these specific features in a product of theirs must first contact me and gain my explicit and written permission to use them.
There, my butt is roughly covered. Now that legalish statement being said, I'm a pretty easy-going guy. If you have the resources necessary to make a game that would use these features and want to, I'm most likely going to give you the go ahead. I'm just making sure that I don't get sued if my game and someone else's game are overtly similar. (though I know this isn't technically a legal document, but I'd rather have have it stated and not needed than needed and and not have it stated)
