What do you Define as "Cheap"?

[DerangedBeing]

I'm not sure what is "Cheap" anymore. I was playing Marvel vs Capcom 2 in a public location, and I got a 28 Win Streak against people who joined in. I use Hayato, Megaman, and War-Machine, and was called out for being cheap due to the spaming of Megaman and War-Machine's Projectiles to cover Hayato while he engagued the enemies. I decided to ignore the allogation of being cheap myself, and went online, just to see if I can find a community that would be a bit less critical of how I played, not to mention I thought I had improved in my game play. BIG MISTAKE. Everyone laughed at me for my inferior character choices, and simply Infinited me with Magneto, while their Storms and Sentinal laughed from the sidelines.

Maybe I'm just a scrub, but I'm not seeing myself as cheap compared to the freaks online that simply sell their souls to learn the Infinites of the Top Queer Characters (usually just damning all sense of origonality and mirroring Magneto, Storm and Sentinal) and Robotically launch them at enemy after enemy after enemy. The game doesn't even seem like one of skill; just whoever uses their infinite first wins, like a long as hell quick draw.

What do you think? What do you guys definite as "Cheap"?

 

[Christemo]

i´d define cheap as:

1. overpowered/ too powerful.
2. able to execute extremely long unfair combos.
3. has a 1 hit KO move.

i have a character in fighting games for each of those:

1. Snake from SSBB.
2. Meta Knight from SSBB (honorable mention goes to Reapermon from Digimon Rumble Arena).
3. Paul from Tekken (not a 1-hit KO, but it takes you down to 1% health. and when i used to play it, i didnt know how to block, so my friend killed me a second later.)

 

[theultimateend]

I'm not sure what is "Cheap" anymore. I was playing Marvel vs Capcom 2 in a public location, and I got a 28 Win Streak against people who joined in. I use Hayato, Megaman, and War-Machine, and was called out for being cheap due to the spaming of Megaman and War-Machine's Projectiles to cover Hayato while he engagued the enemies. For some reason, I got a bit of a swelled head, and went online, just to see if I can find a community that would be a bit less critical of how I played. BIG MISTAKE. Everyone laughed at me for my inferior character choices, and simply Infinited me with Magneto, while their Storms and Sentinal laughed from the sidelines.

Maybe I'm just a scrub, but I'm not seeing myself as cheap compared to the freaks online that simply sell their souls to learn the Infinites of the Top Queer Characters (usually just damning all sense of origonality and mirroring Magneto, Storm and Sentinal) and Robotically launch them at enemy after enemy after enemy. The game doesn't even seem like one of skill; just whoever uses their infinite first wins, like a long as hell quick draw.

What do you think? What do you guys definite as "Cheap"?

If your MvC2 team does not consist of Magneto, Sentinal, and anyone else you are not cheap.

Period. I don't give a crap what anyone says. They can kiss my ass. That is the only way you are cheap on that game. Because that is the ONLY way you can always win every match against anyone unless they too are playing that setup.

I went through at least 9 tournies for that game in a few different places. Every single time that was the winning setup.

Oh...fuck me...I just saw you say it on your post. I didn't read far enough. I'm as bad as those Yahtzee firsters...

Anyways.

I think cheap is when you do something just to win. Sure people say that for some folks winning IS the fun. But I'm not willing to accept that. I'm cold and heartless like that. Just like I won't except that some people find their only joy in skinning people while they are alive and wearing it in front of them as they die. Just because some people might only find fun in it doesn't mean it is acceptable.

Yes...I just put people who can only find joy in winning in the same group as people who butcher and wear other people.

That magneto+sentinel+one other is an example of that. There is no skill or joy to be gained from the infinite combo, it takes MAYBE 15 minutes to master and then it is just a matter of getting it off first.

 

[hypothetical fact]

Anything without a real weakness that renders other options moot simply because it is always the best choice. Anything that can't be defended against. Such as sticking a frag grenade to a wall in GOW2 since it blows anyone up the instant they get in range, can be hidden behind door frames and can't be escaped.

 

[Booze Zombie]

There is no "cheap" for me, just the point at which I realise the people I'm playing with don't care about fun, just pointlessly winning something that in the long run, will never effect their real life.

 

[RUINER ACTUAL]

"cheap" can also be defined as "noob." anything that everyone knows is cheap and easy, but use it anyways. thats cheap.

 

[Booze Zombie]

"cheap" can also be defined as "noob." anything that everyone knows is cheap and easy, but use it anyways. thats cheap.

So "cheap" is the option that causes you the least bother?

Strange...

 

[DerangedBeing]

i´d define cheap as:

1. overpowered/ too powerful.
2. able to execute extremely long unfair combos.
3. has a 1 hit KO move.

i have a character in fighting games for each of those:

1. Snake from SSBB.
2. Meta Knight from SSBB (honorable mention goes to Reapermon from Digimon Rumble Arena).
3. Paul from Tekken (not a 1-hit KO, but it takes you down to 1% health. and when i used to play it, i didnt know how to block, so my friend killed me a second later.)

Strangly enough, I completely agree with Snake (no fucking way a downthrow that gently sets your character on the ground deserves fucking 10 damage, and his tilts are about as strong as half the casts combined), and I've grown out of touch with Tekken, but I disagree with Metaknight. I dunno, something about me doesn't find him cheap, except maybe the fact that his recovery is unstopable (due to his many options) and his Infinite Cape Glitch (which is usually banned in Tournaments). Long Unfair Comboes are usually associated with Chain Grabs from say Pikachu, Ice Climbers, King Dedede, or from the Jab Locks that anyone with a Rapid A can do.

If your MvC2 team does not consist of Magneto, Sentinal, and anyone else you are not cheap.

Period. I don't give a crap what anyone says. They can kiss my ass. That is the only way you are cheap on that game. Because that is the ONLY way you can always win every match against anyone unless they too are playing that setup.

I went through at least 9 tournies for that game in a few different places. Every single time that was the winning setup.

Oh...fuck me...I just saw you say it on your post. I didn't read far enough. I'm as bad as those Yahtzee firsters...

Anyways.

I think cheap is when you do something just to win. Sure people say that for some folks winning IS the fun. But I'm not willing to accept that. I'm cold and heartless like that. Just like I won't except that some people find their only joy in skinning people while they are alive and wearing it in front of them as they die. Just because some people might only find fun in it doesn't mean it is acceptable.

Yes...I just put people who can only find joy in winning in the same group as people who butcher and wear other people.

That magneto+sentinel+one other is an example of that. There is no skill or joy to be gained from the infinite combo, it takes MAYBE 15 minutes to master and then it is just a matter of getting it off first.

To people who say that it's all about the end of the day pay, I know a friend who will pay them 5000 dollars a day to shoot them in the crotch instead of playing just to win. I have no problem with Winning, but things that people do that your chances of combating are just as high when playing as they are when (you chuck your controller out of the building, go use the restroom, go outside and retrieve your controler, and come back and plug it in again), things like this, I find unacceptable.

 

[RUINER ACTUAL]

"cheap" can also be defined as "noob." anything that everyone knows is cheap and easy, but use it anyways. thats cheap.

So "cheap" is the option that causes you the least bother?

Strange...

In a sense yes. Otherwise it wouldnt be cheap. examples: M16 in CoD4, 1887s in MW2. Thats all i can think of right now.

what are you getting at anyways??

 

[Low Key]

Unless it is called beforehand (like "no Ryu"), then nothing is cheap. You just know how to play the game better than those people. Besides, in my experience, if the other person doesn't win, everything is cheap.

 

[sigma83]

Cheap often gets used to describe actions which are difficult to counter or are seen as too effective relative to their difficulty to perform.

E.g. Perception of snipers is that they 'sit in one place and get free kills.' Anyone who's ever tried to sit in one place and get free kills on any kind of well balanced map will know that it just doesn't happen that way.

I _personally_ draw the line at exploiting glitches (again glitch can be hard to define; I go with 'if the developer says it's a glitch, and attempts to patch it out, it's a glitch' Also, things which do not appear to be intended behavior i.e. mages suddenly being able to fire guns.)
but do not consider things like sniping and TF2's spy to be cheap.

If there is such a thing as a 'cheap' combination, then the game is not balanced. If the game is not fixed, then it is fatally flawed and will never go places.

 

[Booze Zombie]

In a sense yes. Otherwise it wouldnt be cheap. examples: M16 in CoD4, 1887s in MW2. Thats all i can think of right now.

what are you getting at anyways??

Just seems odd to call something cheap, to me.

If it was truly cheap, could you not simply counter it?

 

[HardRockSamurai]

"Cheap" is when:

A: something/someone uses a repetitive yet effective method to enable a quick, guaranteed victory, taking all the fun out of the game
B: someone uses the sword in Halo
C: someone uses the rocket launcher in Halo
D: someone uses grenades in [insert game here]

 

[hypothetical fact]

Unless it is called beforehand (like "no Ryu"), then nothing is cheap. You just know how to play the game better than those people. Besides, in my experience, if the other person doesn't win, everything is cheap.

You clearly haven't had someone run around a tight corner then stick a grenade to the wall; or had a subterranean apc full of engineers pop up in your base because you didn't pave over EVERYTHING in C&C Tiberian sun.

In a sense yes. Otherwise it wouldnt be cheap. examples: M16 in CoD4, 1887s in MW2. Thats all i can think of right now.

what are you getting at anyways??

Just seems odd to call something cheap, to me.

If it was truly cheap, could you not simply counter it?

Cheap is when the counter takes much more work than the technique (or there isn't a counter) and you may as well just use the cheap action as well. This is when the game becomes incredibly dull because everyone does the exact same thing every time.

 

[Dusty Donuts]

In a dragon ball z game, when someone picks an easily spammable character with an unblockable attack. Doesn't stop me from picking an equally spammable character with 'illegal' abilities to counter it.

 

[RUINER ACTUAL]

In a sense yes. Otherwise it wouldnt be cheap. examples: M16 in CoD4, 1887s in MW2. Thats all i can think of right now.

what are you getting at anyways??

Just seems odd to call something cheap, to me.

If it was truly cheap, could you not simply counter it?

some things cannot be countered. the only way to counter it is to not play the game at all.

if you want to know this feeling, jump on MW2 and try to go against someone using 1887s. dual-wielded shotguns that have retarded range for a shotgun, and are a 1 hit kill at any range.

 

[Low Key]

Unless it is called beforehand (like "no Ryu"), then nothing is cheap. You just know how to play the game better than those people. Besides, in my experience, if the other person doesn't win, everything is cheap.

You clearly haven't had someone run around a tight corner then stick a grenade to the wall; or had a subterranean apc full of engineers pop up in your base because you didn't pave over EVERYTHING in C&C Tiberian sun.

Sure, I have had dumb shit like that happen to me. The thing is, it's part of the game. When it happens, you learn what to look for, and you avoid it from the get go. Don't follow an enemy down a tight corridor and pave everything over. Seems easy enough to me. I mostly play FPS's and the biggest trouble I have is with snipers and campers. Thanks to killcams, I know exactly where they are and I go a different way. They end up dead when I respawn.

Just because someone doesn't play the exact same way you play doesn't make it cheap.

 

[hypothetical fact]

Unless it is called beforehand (like "no Ryu"), then nothing is cheap. You just know how to play the game better than those people. Besides, in my experience, if the other person doesn't win, everything is cheap.

You clearly haven't had someone run around a tight corner then stick a grenade to the wall; or had a subterranean apc full of engineers pop up in your base because you didn't pave over EVERYTHING in C&C Tiberian sun.

Sure, I have had dumb shit like that happen to me. The thing is, it's part of the game. When it happens, you learn what to look for, and you avoid it from the get go. Don't follow an enemy down a tight corridor and pave everything over. Seems easy enough to me. I mostly play FPS's and the biggest trouble I have is with snipers and campers. Thanks to killcams, I know exactly where are and I go a different way. They end up dead when I respawn.

Just because someone doesn't play the exact same way you play doesn't make it cheap.

For the C&C example those apcs could tunnel into ground that was on a steep slope which you couldn't pave over. This meant you would always have a weak point to your base paricularly since artillary (which could fire over a quarter of the map) created craters which could never be patched up or paved over and could again be an entry for apcs.

When you stuck a grenade to a wall in Gears of war 2 it did not disappear until the match was over so it could be stuck behind any doorway and be a reliable kill. There is no way you could play the game without ever walking through a doorway, particularly since the grenade would only blow up on your team and couldn't detonate when they walked by.

For fps the homing rocket launcher was guarenteed to get kills on Timesplitters 2 since the rocket could follow you for up to a minute and if you tried to dodge it the rocket would turn and orbit you so you couldn't move until it blew up next to you.

 

[FallenJellyDoughnut]

Cheap is not letting your nephew have seconds at an all-you-can-eat buffet because you think they are secretly going to charge you for it later. I hate my uncle.