What is wrong with the internet?

[Blue_vision]

That shit doesn't work, man - it just doesn't. There's no way around it, okay? Get your head around it. If a bully is bullying someone, they're not going to stop because they're given a few detentions, or suspended from school, okay? They just won't, because more often than not the bully is the sort of person who doesn't care about that stuff. I would love to see you try that, I was bullied heaps in primary school, we used to tell the teachers and other schools staff, they tried, it did shit all. So don't act all high-and-mighty by saying "violence is never the answer, we should deal with our problems respectably through the proper procedures", that's all bullshit. It just doesn't work.

I don't appreciate you acting like you're better than everyone else because you're "more moral" because you don't believe in violence. And yes, you are acting like that. We're talking about what actually works, and what is effective, not about trying to keep an arbitrary "moral high ground" which only makes things worse. You HAVE to play by their rules, and if you don't, you lose. Simple as that. Understand that this is how school works before you act like you have the solution. It has been tried and failed over so many years.

Punching the bully out doesn't bring about any good. Okay, maybe the bully is a little less quick to pick on that particular kid. But does the bully necessarily stop being a bully? A huge majority of the time, bullies are only bullies because of other issues that cause them to project their power. That doesn't get solved by being punched out. Either the bully's just gonna pick on other kids, or they're gonna resort to craftier means to beat down on other people.

And all the same time, the "victim" either gets hailed as a hero for punching some guy out (I wouldn't call that a good situation,) or they just get further degraded. It could turn into "oh, that guy's so creepy. didn't you hear? he incapacitated this one guy." I've seen it happen plenty of times.

And what happens when we bring these same values into adult lives? Is it a good thing to have adults beating the crap out of each other because they feel like they've been wrong done?

Perhaps this kid had a right to defend himself. But basically everyone here is taking that as a strike against bullying, a "yeah, that'll show 'em!" which is the totally wrong type of mindset to have, let alone encourage. If he was getting beat up and there was nobody around to help, you should probably give a few wallops to the guys who are doing it to get them to let off. But taking violence as a solution to bullying isn't just immature, it's unjust, dangerous, and may well not even be a solution in the first place.

 

[steph01a]

Most have you have probaly heard / read the story of Casey the kid who got bullied and pile drove the bully into a sidewalk. There is a thread about it on this site, but on that thread and throughout the entire internet people are congratulating Casey
Casey nearly killed another child in a fit of rage, this is not a good thing! The bully wasnt right at all and should be punished but what about Casey? What is next time he goes into a rage fit he pile drives or pushes a kid and accidently kills them like he almost did already?

I would almost bet that the 'bullies' leave Casey alone now ... But, if another 'bully' goes after him and Casey defends himself, I see nothing wrong with Casey. In My State it's called "Self-Defense".

"And what happens when we bring these same values into adult lives? Is it a good thing to have adults beating the crap out of each other because they feel like they've been wrong done?"

That's why we have "castle laws", "right to carry" laws and "self-defense" laws. And .. why do you think that these 'values' are always carried over from childhood? Most people (even bullies) mature and mellow as they age.

 

[Alleged_Alec]

Punching the bully out doesn't bring about any good. Okay, maybe the bully is a little less quick to pick on that particular kid.

So, how is that not a good thing?

But does the bully necessarily stop being a bully?

This sends out a very clear signal: bullying == a world of hurt. Negative reinforcement works, so why should it not be used?

A huge majority of the time, bullies are only bullies because of other issues that cause them to project their power. That doesn't get solved by being punched out.

Tough luck for the bully. Everyone has issues, and yet he's the being a complete fucktard, not the bullied kid, who snaps after years of bullying with a single counterattack. And every bully I've met bullied because of a single reason: they love to see the pain and distress in the eyes of their victim.

Either the bully's just gonna pick on other kids, or they're gonna resort to craftier means to beat down on other people.

Could be. Or he learns his lesson and stops being something that's less than human.

And all the same time, the "victim" either gets hailed as a hero for punching some guy out (I wouldn't call that a good situation,)

Please, get this into your head: we hail him for standing up to a bully.

or they just get further degraded. It could turn into "oh, that guy's so creepy. didn't you hear? he incapacitated this one guy." I've seen it happen plenty of times.

False dichotomy. It could just as well be that other kids will flock to him because, yeah, he stood up for himself, and that's something to be admired.

And what happens when we bring these same values into adult lives? Is it a good thing to have adults beating the crap out of each other because they feel like they've been wrong done?

I already addressed this in my previous post.

Perhaps this kid had a right to defend himself. But basically everyone here is taking that as a strike against bullying, a "yeah, that'll show 'em!" which is the totally wrong type of mindset to have, let alone encourage.

Why so? He made sure that kid couldn't bully him for a while. Again: when you're being bullied, that alone is worth it. I don't know if you've seen the interview with Casey, by the way, but it shows the OP was totally wrong about what kind of person he is.

If he was getting beat up and there was nobody around to help, you should probably give a few wallops to the guys who are doing it to get them to let off.

Which is what he did.

But taking violence as a solution to bullying isn't just immature, it's unjust, dangerous, and may well not even be a solution in the first place.

But that's the point: violence is an option to consider, even though we'd rather not. Children tend to respond a lot better to negative than to positive reinforcement. Getting your ass kicked by the person you've been bullying for years is definitively negative reinforcement, and has the potential to work. Sure, other options need to be considered first, but if those do not work, I have no problems with using violence against bullies.

And how is this unjust?