What role should player skill have in RPG combat?

[Lunar Templar]

why is this a question? last i checked there's room for both types of RPG

 

[Xaryn Mar]

Depends on what type of an RPG you want. And since the term 'RPG' means a lot to different people, you're probably not going to get a great deal of consensus on the whole skill-based vs stat-based gameplay argument.

Someone who mainly plays turn-based RPGs or RPGs with pause and play mechanics would probably be opposed to skill-based gameplay, since they'd feel 'true' RPGs were the ones they played way back on the PC in the 90s and early noughties

Try late 80s and early 90s and all the way up till today.
Remember, that kind of games were not that different from the tabletop rpg's of the time (with the glaring obvious difference of having a GM). Both were (and are) essentially number crunching/optimising systems and the roleplaying part came from imagining that you were playing another person/race/whatever and not necessarily playing in an optimal way if your character would not behave that way.

So in essence you wrote your own story of your character(s) into the overarching plot of the game (whether the crpg kind or the work of a GM and the rest of your rpg-group).

 

[somonels]

The point of RPGs is they use the character's skill instead of yours.

So, just out of curiosity, do you intentionally make mad decisions when a character has low intelligence or a similar stat?

So, out of my curiosity, is intelligence a skill? I might be from a bizarro-world, but intelligence has always been a stat, a stat that I don't consider having anything to do with making decisions more or less mad, unless the gap is VAST and in favor of the maker. Perhaps you mean a wisdom stat, if there is no madness or insanity mechanic in place. Consider yourself nerd-schooled, frat boy.

As for making decisions on behalf of the character, well, there is the consideration that a player cannot wholly ignore his own much more extensive knowledge in regards to the game, plot, mechanics and how these actions may affect it. In D&D the GM, as far as my experience goes, does sometimes interrupt and say, 'Dude, you have 9 intelligence, how the hell can you determine the volume of a statue? And, no, I do not mean the loudness.' Video games do implement this, conditional choices based upon stats has been implemented in many of them, 'Fallout' games for instance, are supposedly hilarious to play through with a dimwit character.
The lack of skills or stats HAS to limit a character. Giving the player a chance to apply their OOC knowledge is a GM or game designer failing to uphold the game's integrity. So, yes, I would make character decisions based on my own knowledge, *strokes epic hobobeard* I am an opportunist.

 

[Something Amyss]

So, out of my curiosity, is intelligence a skill? I might be from a bizarro-world, but intelligence has always been a stat

that's rather pedantic, since a lot of games do not distinguish the two, or treat things like your skill with a weapon as a stat as well.

a stat that I don't consider having anything to do with making decisions more or less mad, unless the gap is VAST and in favor of the maker.

Was supposed to be "bad," so I'll ignore the future comments on madness and just address this:

Perhaps you mean a wisdom stat

Often, the definitions of "intelligence" within games are used interchangeably with "wisdom."

Again, pedantry.

Consider yourself nerd-schooled, frat boy.

I can see why "school" would be used here, since that's about the only place pedantry has any real value.

As for making decisions on behalf of the character, well, there is the consideration that a player cannot wholly ignore his own much more extensive knowledge in regards to the game, plot, mechanics and how these actions may affect it. In D&D the GM, as far as my experience goes, does sometimes interrupt and say, 'Dude, you have 9 intelligence, how the hell can you determine the volume of a statue? And, no, I do not mean the loudness.'

But intelligence =/= knowledge!

Sorry, that was pedantry. You should probably consider yourself "schooled."

Video games do implement this, conditional choices based upon stats has been implemented in many of them, 'Fallout' games for instance, are supposedly hilarious to play through with a dimwit character.

You mean like Fallout 3, a game where you can be a master marksman without taking the relavent SPECIAL stat?

I mean, sure, there's VATS, but it's optional and finite.

Sure, they offer a few, limited dialogue options, but they don't really impact how you see the world. They even have a shooter system set up that greatly benefits even the clumsiest character if their player is skilled.

The lack of skills or stats HAS to limit a character. Giving the player a chance to apply their OOC knowledge is a GM or game designer failing to uphold the game's integrity. So, yes, I would make character decisions based on my own knowledge, *strokes epic hobobeard* I am an opportunist.

So you're okay with metagaming intellectual situations, just not physical ones. Gotcha. That's what I was trying to determine in the first place.