What would a female power fantasy character look like?

[BigFish]

I think we need more Woman power Characters like this, http://d1vysxeuvhmuuc.cloudfront.net/tear_sheets/image/337047/scroller_9b2a8499f7f4ebdfd101b99a83a261c99edcdf5c_page0138.jpg

I think that a " Handsome" woman would be a good change. It would be nice to see the gaming industry make a woman wear a pant-suit and have her kick ass while still being alluring.

 

[Odoylerules360]

Finished reading Why Men Are The Way They Are by Warren Farrell. A female empowerment fantasy character, for traditional roles, is one who can use her beauty, sexuality, charisma and other traits to be sought after by the most successful men.

If we add modern roles, she also gains the strength, skill, knowledge, wisdom, willpower, etc to provide for herself and others. While she still attracts the best men, they are an option, not a necessity.

This post will come back to bite me hard on the ass. Probably because I wrote like I know what I'm talking about, and I really don't. Good God please correct me because I know I'm wrong somewhere.

 

[VanQ]

When was there a rule written that power fantasies have to be gender specific? What's stopping a girl from enjoying beating the shit out of the Gods as Kratos or me beating the crap out of monsters as Millia Maxwell in Tales of Xillia?

 

[Camaranth]

The female power fantasy is the same as a male power fantasy with less grunting.

Physically fit and attractive. Effective in combat, inspiring to others and intelligent (as in able to out think a situation or enemy, also they tend to have wealth of random knowledge to be able to manipulate said situation/enemy) There have been plenty of examples already listed. Jack or Samara from Mass Effect are two I could add.

The only difference I can think of between the genders is perhaps a larger portion of women would find a Machiavellian streak more appealing. (well I can really only speak for myself there, it's definitely a characteristic I love in villains. It's hard to find a Machiavellian hero)

"Why bloody my own hands when I can convince you to wield the blade yourself?" I paraphrased that from somewhere but it's one of my favorite phrases.

Examples: Lady MacBeth, Daenerys Targaryen

 

[Kopikatsu]

Er, wrong thread.

 

[Gethsemani_v1legacy]

Finished reading Why Men Are The Way They Are by Warren Farrell. A female empowerment fantasy character, for traditional roles, is one who can use her beauty, sexuality, charisma and other traits to be sought after by the most successful men.

If we add modern roles, she also gains the strength, skill, knowledge, wisdom, willpower, etc to provide for herself and others. While she still attracts the best men, they are an option, not a necessity.

This post will come back to bite me hard on the ass. Probably because I wrote like I know what I'm talking about, and I really don't. Good God please correct me because I know I'm wrong somewhere.

It should be noted that Warren Farrell is regarded as a not very cool fellow by many feminists due to some of his statements about dating behaviour and sexual activity after dates. I don't want to open that can of worms again so I won't be more specific (there's a thread in the backlog on R&P if you are really interested, PM me and I'll link you) than that. Warren Farrell supports equality, but over the years his idea of supporting equality gradually shifted from feminism to gender neutral over to men's rights. If you want a good position regarding women I wouldn't go to Farrell (but he's undoubtedly one of the best if you want to talk about inequalities facing men, despite the occasional misstep like the one mentioned above).

As a few other people have already said though, the idea of a power fantasy doesn't differ terribly much between the genders. The basic concept is an attractive and capable person that can achieve what he or she wants through use of wit, force or guile. One might note that the definition of attractive for women means they want to look pretty much like the modern beauty standard for women while for men it means they want to be musclebound and bulky.

 

[Gatx]

I think most of the examples that have been mentioned already are female versions of the male power fantasy - muscles, guns, but also with breasts. I mean that's not to say that women can't fantasize about that sort of thing, but whose to say that a power fantasy has to inherently be violent, and I don't think it's sexist to say that it's possible that women fantasize about different things than men, so POSSIBLY a female power fantasy doesn't exist per se in accordance to what males would consider a power fantasy.

Plus, they're also the same examples touted as strong female characters. A male power fantasy isn't necessarily the same thing as a good role model, if you were a parent you wouldn't want your kid acting like Marcus Fenix or Kratos, but you would want to indulge in their fantasy of being able to rip everything apart. With that in mind I think boag's got it down pretty close.

This is the only indicator we have right now.

A Perfectly normal girl, that is loved by everyone, has an unmatched skill set and is incredibly popular.

http://images.sugarscape.com/userfiles/image/JULY2010/Martiena/2nd/bellaswangtl.jpg

Aside from her, I havent seen any other character that might be unilaterally claimed as a Female Power Fantasy.

We all know Bella isn't a positive role model for young girls, but obviously a lot of girls want to induldge in her fantasy.

 

[Luca72]

Outside video games, Starbuck from the (newer) Battlestar Galactica series was fabulous.

This was my first thought. Also, Ellen Ripley and Samus Aran are great examples (if we can all agree that Other M was just a bad dream). The point is that they are still recognizable as women, with feminine traits, but still excel at what they do. They're women, but they're self-motivated to the point that they aren't confined by gender roles. Starbuck is one of the best pilots in the fleet, and she knows it. She's full of flaws, but they help define her character. Ripleys' gender is almost irrelevant to her story - there is an alien/a bunch of aliens, so survival instinct is way more important than following some gender role. And Samus Aran is basically like if Boba Fett took off the helmet and turned out to be a girl.

Again, none of these characters were designed to be unattractive. But their appearances are totally secondary to the traits that make them strong.

 

[felbot]

i think ash from killing floor might fit in to this category, she was tempted to become a crimelord but chose the righteous path and became a feared army officer, then the zeds came and ruined it.

damn zeds.

 

[piinyouri]

I would say Ripley and Female Shepard, Ripley far more so.(Before Resurrection, cause that never happened anyway)

This is probably not going to be popular buuuuuuuut....
Sister Hannah (Hammer) from Fable 2 always struck me as a pretty positive strong female character. Physically and mentally strong, but still in touch with her femininity without letting it define her with a body size most would argue is not in line with traditional beauty.

Hannah was easily my favorite character I'd encountered in some time in any game. I only wish she would have been given more time to be explored as a character and flesh her out further.

 

[Gethsemani_v1legacy]

Well, I'm a guy, so my opinion shouldn't be 100% accurate.
On the other hand, I'm a guy, so I've seen first hand what a lot of women aspire to.

The closest character in gaming to come close to "female power fantasy" would be:
[Image of Miranda]

Yup, all the traits are there:
-very high status both socially and in her field of work.
-self-confident
-competent in her skills to achieve stuff whilst still being hot enough to get ahead just on her looks
-superficially bitchy, and good enough to actually afford to act this way.
-assertive
-never proves herself to other characters, and in fact, makes others prove themselves to her.


It's not incidental that she's among the most hated characters in Mass Effect, and that a lot of people have compared her to a "cheerleader". Actual strong female characters (not men with boobs like that chick in Aliens) come off as dis-likable or intimidating to your average male nerd. Also no coincidence that Tali is the most likable character, since a lot of her traits are directly opposed to Miranda's.

That's an interesting theory and I certainly agree with you, in part at least, and so does several studies that have been done on how people react to womens assertion of authority (Cordelia Fine brings most of them up in Delusions of Gender, 2010]. As you say: When a woman is assertive and confident both men and women are put off by her behaviour, even if she only behaves in the same way as a man in the same position would.

I would also like to suggest, however, that a part of the reason Miranda was disliked (just like Jack) was because she was a strong female character that had to have some daddy issues to "explain her", Jack had the exact same thing with her Broken Bird childhood and "insecurities". Tali, meanwhile, never had a silly "emotional" and "tragic" background to "explain" her, which also meant she felt like a more fun character to interact with, because she wasn't crying about how hard it was to be as awesome as her.

Am I bashing ME2 squaddies? Yeah, I am. Mostly because I feel that the writing team wasted very good potential for strong female characters (Miranda and Jack) by unduly emphasizing their tragic backgrounds. It ain't hard to tell it was done so that they'd be more appealing as "love interests" for the male audience. Whatever this speaks badly of the writers, the audience or both I don't know.

 

[Angelowl]

Well, I'm a guy, so my opinion shouldn't be 100% accurate.
On the other hand, I'm a guy, so I've seen first hand what a lot of women aspire to.

The closest character in gaming to come close to "female power fantasy" would be:

Yup, all the traits are there:
-very high status both socially and in her field of work.
-self-confident
-competent in her skills to achieve stuff whilst still being hot enough to get ahead just on her looks
-superficially bitchy, and good enough to actually afford to act this way.
-assertive
-never proves herself to other characters, and in fact, makes others prove themselves to her.


It's not incidental that she's among the most hated characters in Mass Effect, and that a lot of people have compared her to a "cheerleader". Actual strong female characters (not men with boobs like that chick in Aliens) come off as dis-likable or intimidating to your average male nerd. Also no coincidence that Tali is the most likable character, since a lot of her traits are directly opposed to Miranda's.

Heh, as a bisexual girl I actually liked Miranda. She considers herself the main character but not in the bitchy way that Bastila did, instead she actually treats Femshep as an equal. She would make a great main character tbh and yes I would say that she fits my own power fantasy with a small change, she needs a bigger gun . Honestly if I met an equivalent IRL I would probably date her.

But as people have said: Femshep, FemHawke, Lightning, Fang (*squeel*) are all examples of serious female characters. As people have mentioned before, they are essentially the same as well written male characters. I really liked Femshep as I played through Mass Effect, both as a player avatar and a character. More of that please!

Tali was kind of cute but the "weakness" seemed forced and she acted like a stereotypical schoolgirl at times, but still one of the better characters of the series.

I may be a bit biased as I have a thing for strong, serious & good looking women.

 

[Trollhoffer]

OP presents an interesting question, but I think the different could, in some cases, be arbitrary.

As young children, we're generally handed our roles by a variety of different influences. We get to decide what we like and dislike, and we get opportunities to break from those expectations, but what we consider to be a positive influence is in part defined by what we're told from up above -- even if that means doing the exact opposite of what we're told. The stereotypes are breaking, but the ideas of a woman as a housekeeper and a man as a breadwinner are still fresh in our minds, and these are still the kinds of influences teenagers and young adults today were fed as children.

While neither gender is as strictly dominated by the roles of a previous era today, it could be true that both are biased in their power fantasies towards what they see as a source of power. For men, especially young men, this is usually martial prowess. I'm a gentle sort of guy and not the kind to initiate violence, but even I can't escape the allure of martial proficiency -- which is why I took up martial arts (historical ones, just to be a bit nerdy about it). That kind of power may not necessarily be appealing to all women, though, because female protagonists tend to be defined less by their martial strength. Instead, female protagonists are often very socially powerful, with lots of strength when it comes to the exchange of ideas and persuasion. Their battles don't have as much to do with swords and guns as they have to do with complex interpersonal relationships and conflicts within those.

Whether this difference is natural or learned, I leave to better minds. As for now, though, I choose to believe that it's mostly learned and that the two gender psychologies are only slightly different or identical, with both mostly being formed by the influences they grow up with and are taught to cherish. Not that either case makes a difference to what the recent paradigm has been -- male power fantasies are martial and authoritative, and female power fantasies are social and persuasive. Obviously, this isn't a strict rule, but if you look at media aimed specifically at women and compare it with that aimed at men, this tends to be the case.

So when we take a female power fantasy in context of video games and the preference demographic therein (that is, someone who's into video games probably likes swords and battles and stuff to a certain degree), I guess we ought to find the in-between that embodies the "standard" female power fantasy while allowing her to be on even footing with her male equivalent. So we're looking for a martially accomplished woman who has considerable skill at solving problems socially, using reason and persuasion.

On the other hand, I'm not a woman and I could be speaking directly out of my arse here. If any female gamers want to correct me or otherwise comment on my thoughts, I'd appreciate it.

 

[southparkdudez]

Gonna have to say someone like Lightning Farron from FFXIII

 

[gazumped]

Firstly, as someone who was obsessed with Nightcrawler so much as a teenage girl I actually managed to convince all of my friends and family that I had an elusive German boyfriend called Kurt Wagner just so I could talk about him and be taken half-seriously... him being acknowledged as a sexual fantasy pleases me greatly.

OT: Problematically, female power is commonly thought to lie in their sex appeal. 'Feminine wiles' are about using beauty to make men want to do things for you. 'Femme fatales' use their sex appeal to trick and manipulate men.

And I guess I totally bought into that because the kind of power I aspire to have is the sexy sexy kind.

I mean, I kinda fell flat on that because I'm just too dorky and awkward to be the highly sexual domme I wanted to be when I was young, but it does mean that when you say 'female power fantasy' I'm thinking Bayonetta, Catwoman, and Samus out of her armour rather than in it.

I mean, much respect to Hammer from Fable II, I absolutely adore her, but bursting with muscles and wielding a heavy blunt object is not an identity I aspire to.

Having said that...

I don't know if it's a British phenomenon or something which exists elsewhere too but over here we have something called the Battleaxe - Intimidating women who do not have to resort to physical strength to be effective. Examples include Professor McGonagal, Molly Weasley, Granny Weatherwax, Ma Lillywhite and Margaret Thatcher. Women like Anna Wintour may also fit. They don't need to be muscular, gun-toting martial-arts experts to be powerful.

As I get older and out of the mindset that I ought to be a sexy young thing, this is more the kind of woman I aspire to be like when I'm older. Heck, Granny Weatherwax was the first character I ever role-played... when I was eight years old. Still not bursting with muscles, though... I guess will power or intellectual power appeals to me more than brute strength.

 

[Karoshi]

My power fantasy would be someone like my Imperial Agent from Swtor. Snarky, smart, independent and kicking ass. Beautiful woman who is good at lying and manipulating for the greater good of the world (or the Empire), and of course charming the pants of any attractive men in close vicinity.

I have much love for the double agent trope and love tricking people (at least in games). Might have something to do with the fact that I am horrible at lying in real life and a pretty blunt and direct person.

Fem!Hawke and Fem!Shepard come pretty close to female power fantasies as well. There's a good reason while the polls on Bioware forums consistently show at least 40% female players.

 

[ObsidianJones_v1legacy]

I've stated it before, and I'll state it again.

Different people have an idea of what power is. Stereotypically, men go for might makes right, so they design their characters like that. Women, stereotypically, might have a have a different idea. So of course, that design will be different.

From what I've heard from the women in my life who did want sexy portrayals of themselves if they were to be a hero, there seems to be a consensus of the liberation of the display. All their lives, women were taught to hide what they have because you never know who will have the wrong idea. It seems that if you have the power to flaunt what you have and no one can do anything about it, why not? It's an extra 'fuck you' to those who you're up against.

But again, those are just the women in my life.