When will game developers realize there are female players too?
- Thread starter DarkHuntress
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I am a male and I rather play with a female character than with a male one. Especially if they look nice and some armor look a lot better on females than males. Also if I would have to play a game for like a year, let's say WoW, I'd rather play a female character because as a male I wouldn't want to stare at a another males ass for one year!!
Why:
1. Prejudices and "tradition" (It is so because it has always been so).
2. Making characters with two different genders would mean that large amounts of (pointless) voice acting and story aspects would have to be doubled. Games have become so expensive and unflexible that any kind of variation or dynamicity is too expensive.
As for me:
I'd like if there were more games that aren't driven by ANY stereotypes. Neither male, nor female, nor that stupid good/evil, egoism/altruism, bleh/blah dualisms. This stuff bores me to death.
1. Prejudices and "tradition" (It is so because it has always been so).
2. Making characters with two different genders would mean that large amounts of (pointless) voice acting and story aspects would have to be doubled. Games have become so expensive and unflexible that any kind of variation or dynamicity is too expensive.
As for me:
I'd like if there were more games that aren't driven by ANY stereotypes. Neither male, nor female, nor that stupid good/evil, egoism/altruism, bleh/blah dualisms. This stuff bores me to death.
To be completely honest i'd rather see them write better stories and characters than shove a woman in a game and say "Oh lookie here, female protagonist, buy please".
Seriously, it wouldn't matter to me what sex my character is if they've been written well, some of my favourite characters in books are women and im sure if they wrote better characters some of yours would be men.
But yeah, anyways, I don't want a tick box asking me what sex I want to be, that would just take away from the game in the end.
Seriously, it wouldn't matter to me what sex my character is if they've been written well, some of my favourite characters in books are women and im sure if they wrote better characters some of yours would be men.
But yeah, anyways, I don't want a tick box asking me what sex I want to be, that would just take away from the game in the end.
I think that'll be an important tipping point, but it'll take time after that, plus there's the problem that whilst games are so explicitly catering to men, it can be hard to convince women to want to take an interest, which only helps perpetuate the cycle. I'm not saying 'we need to make games for women' because that tack has been tried, and it pretty much gets the 'paint it pink and add ponies' treatment and then hurled out the door, which is probably even more alienating, but also because the idea of 'games for women' is a little patronising. Women can enjoy blasting aliens/zombies/flavour of the week, or exploring the land on an epic quest, or all that stuff just fine, as you obviously know. I think it's more just reducing the level of testosterone saturation, and making games seem a bit more meaningful instead of the (in its way insulting to men) fairly immature plots that apparently (and I know this is untrue) men dig just fine.Aylaine said:
I believe I answered this thread earlier, but I'll have a whack at it again.DarkHuntress said:
Because most games tell a story and it's extra work to "duplicate" that story to give the choice of both a male and a female character. When you go to the movies, you don't ask "why isn't there an alternative version of this movie with female protagonists?". Not sure here, but I think movies have a higher percentage of male protagonists as well.
So if it's a really (single-)story-driven experience, like say, Mafia 2, a female protagonist doesn't make sense and adding the option would really butcher the game's spirit in my opinion.
I do understand your concern in general though, but on the bright side, it is getting better, most RPGs have the option to play as a female character. FPSs should step up too imo, though again, in reality, women are much more rare among combatants, so it's not hard to understand why they don't. Also, I haven't really met many girls that are into FPSs and I do know a fair share of female gamers. Also, with a gun and a pair of hands in front of you, there's not much you can really change, the protagonist is often silent anyway in a FPS.
The looming question which then opens is: If he/she doesn't overly behave like A or like B... then what is the protagonist like? When designing characters, it's easy to just draw from a long list of stereotypical dualisms: Is it agressive XOR submissive? It it power-focussed XOR more perceptive? Is it strong XOR agile? Is it a loner or a socializer? Is it a protector or a rebel? etc. etc...Aylaine said:
In what we have now, one can just pick from the list, and then ask oneself "what would that person be like?" - and you immediatelly get answers.
But designing something that is "neither"? Or perhaps even both? This for example can result in characters, that make reasonable decisions (the horror) and are quite efficient... characters that lack the typical flaws. But if a character isn't critically flawed in one way or another, then how to design a story around that? How to create challenges and character growth? There are answers to this, but traditionally, humans don't even ask themselves "what then?" - they just take for granted that its some kind of boring heaven where you're at the "goal" and there's nothing else to do anymore.
Oh dear, i made the same mistake again - i wrote a long wall of text, and while doing so, my "point" became vague. Well, what i tried to explain was that by taking stereotypes away, a quite big void opens up, and we see that we don't really have much experience with things beyond those stereotypes. I really wish this would be explored more, but in this industry where any risk may cost millions, i can understand why designers stick to something boring, but safe.
There have been way to many of these threads already.
OT: They have to make a new skin for the lead, possibly hire a new lead voice actor, and recreate scenes with different dialogue which will amount in more production costs. It is simply a waste of money to cater to an audience who will possibly not buy the game in the first place if only on the premise of it.
OT: They have to make a new skin for the lead, possibly hire a new lead voice actor, and recreate scenes with different dialogue which will amount in more production costs. It is simply a waste of money to cater to an audience who will possibly not buy the game in the first place if only on the premise of it.
1. There are many female gamers, but how can you know the gamer population? Do people poll for this kind of thing? My girlfriend loves the God of War and Grand Theft Auto series. I doubt she's all that weird.
2. Markets go where the money is. Games tailored for mature females aren't going to me mainstream until mature females start buying games.
3. Our idea of "female games" is sadly the same as the Japanese: children's games vamped up for housewives with a little spare timme for minigames.
4. I'm sure there are a lot of gender-neutral good games, or female-centric games already in existence that are good. Fable. Heavenly Sword. Final Fantasy, you have to admit, is becoming quickly far more genderr-neutral. Heck, Metroid. Must I explain why?
A lot of our thoughts about whether a game is for males or females is the presence of violence. Yet I have seen it true that women like these just as much as men. The over-the-top machismo of, say, Duke Nukem, I could see as off-putting, but not Halo.
2. Markets go where the money is. Games tailored for mature females aren't going to me mainstream until mature females start buying games.
3. Our idea of "female games" is sadly the same as the Japanese: children's games vamped up for housewives with a little spare timme for minigames.
4. I'm sure there are a lot of gender-neutral good games, or female-centric games already in existence that are good. Fable. Heavenly Sword. Final Fantasy, you have to admit, is becoming quickly far more genderr-neutral. Heck, Metroid. Must I explain why?
A lot of our thoughts about whether a game is for males or females is the presence of violence. Yet I have seen it true that women like these just as much as men. The over-the-top machismo of, say, Duke Nukem, I could see as off-putting, but not Halo.