Why all the hate on FFVII?

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mythgraven

No One Is Special
Mar 9, 2010
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ShatterPalm said:
If there's one thing I've learned over the last couple months, it's that people don't seem to like FFVII as much as the game's massive popularity might suggest. Across the internet on places like FaceBook, deviantART, Youtube, Newgrounds, 4chan, even rare sites like The Choas Theatre, people just flat out hate the game. Naturally, as a guy that actually likes the game, I get comfused and ask why. Politely, of course. The Answer is always the same: "Because Cloud's emo and Sephiroth is a mama's boy."

Okay, before I start ranting here, I suggest you take a minute and ask yourself:
What do I think of the game?

Please also note that while I like FFVII, I don't exactly think it's the best game under the Final Fantasy Label. The winner of that award goes to eiterh FFVI or Crystal Chronicles. Can't decide which. So no spam saying I'm a fanboy, alright?

Okay, rant starts here. *Ahem*
1st point: NO. HE. ISN'T.
Cloud is not in the slightest bit emo, angsty, or even remotely depressed. There are a lot of things I would use to describe Cloud, and emo sure as HELL isn't one of them. Stoic, bored, uninterested, serious, angry, confused, proud, those are all words I'd use to describe Cloud. Not only that, he has a sense of humor. The number of things that you're given the option to have him say or do throughout the game proves that. Playing Tifa's piano in the memory sequence near the begining, Smart Mouthing Barret by saying he looks like a teddy bear wearing a marshmallow while he's in the sailor's suit, things like that. There is litterally one spot in the game that I'd call him depressed or sad: right after Aeris dies.

Now Sephiroth is, of course, a harder goal to defend, but face it folks: he's a pretty good villain. He has the plan, motive, means, and mindset to make the plan happen. He's not a mama's boy for this reason: he's attempting to destroy the world BECAUSE of Jenova, not for her. He discovers the truth in his past, goes insane, finds what remains of Jenova, takes it, then goes off to plot. Besides, he's also one of the only Villains I've seen who's constantly on the front lines, always doing everything he wants done himself. There isn't anything that he ever needs help with. He just kicks everyone's butt and gets back on his way.

Okay mortals, state your possitions on the game and clarify them. Feel free to say that you just don't like the game, because quite frankly that's your opinion. But if you disagree with my rant, prove it. Either one of them. I expect thurough, well thought out reason for why you think Cloud cuts his wrists and Sephiroth's a mama's boy. Go ahead.

First off: Hey look! A title with FF7 in it! Im guarenteed to get lots and lots of hits. And so you have. Good job. At the time of writing, this boring bait thread has netted 98 replies. 98 fishies. Good haul.

And Second: People are generally sick of hearing about FF7. It came out over a decade ago. It was a fun game, but much like WoW, over-saturation has given it a "who the fuck cares?" outlook.


You want people to stop hating on FF7? Stop bringing it up.

Whiskey Echo!!
Mythgraven
 

Redtiebear

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May 29, 2008
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I happen to love FFVII, but I can still understand why there's a lot of dislike, considering the endless remakes, making it what is a cheap cashcow for Square these days. Endless sequels of a game meant to stand alone drag down the original. Imagine X-2 and (ugh) FFXIII-2 coming out. Plus, the fanbase for it is pretty.....obnoxious sometimes. Okay, a lot of the time. A dumb fanbase can really ruin a good thing.

That being said, I try to keep my affection for FFVII reasonable and have plenty of other favorite games in similarly fashioned franchises, such as the Tales Series and Star Ocean. If you love a game, just don't be stupid and don't let stupid people ruin it for you. And if you hate a game, you have every right to do so and avoid the people who love it.
 

Dexiro

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Dec 23, 2009
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ShatterPalm said:
The Answer is always the same: "Because Cloud's emo and Sephiroth is a mama's boy."
Since when has that been the only answer? I've been involved in many a rant involving FF7 and I've actually never seen that response.

Personally I tried playing FF7 to see what the hype was about and felt like I got treated to 5 hours of depressing cutscene. I lowered my expectations and had to make a conscious effort to try and enjoy it but after like 5 or 6 hours I still really wasn't enjoying myself.

Maybe it just hasn't aged well because one of the main problems was immersion, it looks like lego characters layered over a bad quality jpeg image. In a game as story heavy as that immersion is really important.
 

mythgraven

No One Is Special
Mar 9, 2010
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[/quote]

Well you're a dick.
First off: I posted the thread as a simple curiosity, not to see how many views I could rack up. If I were to do that, it would go against my standards. If you want to say that I'm just trawling for posts here, go ahead; just know that you're being an asshole to the tenth degree.

Second: If people are sick of it, then why do so many people I know both online and off profess their love of the series as a whole on a near daily basis? Why do people still discuss Star Wars? or indeed, World of Warcraft?

Simple: because there is still merit to be found in scrutenizing the details. Yes, it came out a decade ago, but Mario 64 came out at the same time, give or take a few years, but people still like ot talk about that.[/quote]



Im not a dick for having an opinion on your post, Shatter. Also, I didnt make any assumptions on your character. I calls em like I sees em, and posts that are "bound" to rack up hits with any of the million "key" words in them, are usually made specifically for that very purpose.

I dont know why your online and offline friends talk about FF7 on a daily basis... have you considered asking them? The jist of my post was not your perceived attack on you, but was, and remains, a statement about the over-saturation of certain games/movies/music/themes in the entertainment industry.

Why does every male between the ages of 18-28 feel that they need to quote Office Space, Top Gun, and the lyrics to "Every Rose Has Its Thorn"?

Why are gamers still talking about FF7? And why do they hang and salivate on any and every mention or denial of a possible remake?

I dont know. Do you? Over-saturation leads to disgust. Disgust leads to hate. Hate leads to the Dark Side.

Still, tangent aside, you posted that you were sick of all teh hates to FF7, but then you retort that you hear positive things about it on a daily basis. Thats sort of confusing.


Whiskey Echo!!
Mythgraven

I seem to have hosed up the Reply Function.
 

Cheesepower5

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Dec 21, 2009
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Because it has flaws and when everyone ignores them for 10 years some people like to push it around. It's still a great game though, and it baffles me why the hater group is still so vocal.

I just hope 6 and Tactics never get vocal haters, my heart would be broken.
 

Xenomemphate

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Jul 16, 2010
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I loved all the Final Fantasy games up until 12.

Thats where it went downhill. Don't get me wrong, I completed it, but it wasn't as good as the others. In a similar vein 13 failed to match up to the likes of 7, 8, and 9 (all three of which I loved)

But then I don't compare 13 to them, compare it to 12 and you will see that they have improved on 12. Okay, maybe not to the extent we may have liked, but hey, its an improvement. Rebuilding takes time.
 

Chibz

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Sep 12, 2008
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Oh, another reason I dislike it is because FF7 has a lot of news for a remake despite the sheer mediocrity of it, despite my FAVOURITE of the series (FF3 FTW!) only ever having ONE remake and not being on virtual console.

I am sad, so very sad.
 

Soviet Heavy

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Jan 22, 2010
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http://www.g4tv.com/videos/37041/your-childhood-sucks-final-fantasy-vii/

Sessler says it like it is. The overhyping by the extremist fans, coupled with the bad english translation and the fucking annoying random encounters put a lot of people off.
 

Azure-Supernova

La-li-lu-le-lo!
Aug 5, 2009
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I like Final Fantasy VII.

It was my introduction to the series (as a kid I didn't get to choose which games I got for the NES and SNES). So upon getting a PlayStation my first interaction with a real RPG was Final Fantasy VII. It was fresh, new and I'd seen nothing like it. And now I've explored the series fully I can say I still like it, but I've found that other titles are better in terms of gameplay, usually the pre-VII ones.

Final Fantasy X was the last game I completed thoroughly and I didn't enjoy it. Yet I can return to any other FF title and play instantly, mostly VII because it holds nice memories for me. I can associate stages in the game to the times in my life I played them.
 

justforonethread

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Feb 27, 2011
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Hi. Made an account and wrote the following for an hour and a half.

I really, really don't like FFVII. After thinking long and hard, it just boils down to: it was no good compared to the FF I played before that, III/VI.

I haven't played either game since they each originally came out, so here's what I remember:

Music:

VI had orchestral tunes. So many different styles and varieties. Beautiful and each character had a recognizable tune.

With VII, we'd jumped to CD technology and the music became very simple MIDI with all-synth. No variety. Not even decent MIDI instruments! It was like Nobuo Uematsu decided he'd already done his best work, so decided to take a nap. (And yet I hear people bother to make SoundFonts to make the PC version sound exactly as crappy as the PSX version.)

Graphics:

VI had beautiful, lush colors everywhere. SD characters were a standard since you could only have so many pixels in a sprite at that resolution.

VII: Washed-out backgrounds. It was confusing where you were sometimes, so they even had a little arrow to show you where you were.

Character models were awful. Since it was 3D, there was no real need for SD.

Characters:

VI had a huge roster of characters, and each was easily recognizable from the other by color, music, and attitude. In combat, everyone had their own special abilities that differentiated them. Sabin had his Street Fighter-style attacks. Relm painted, Edgar had his sword charges, etc.

VII: A handful of characters who play about the same except for summons (whatever they were called). I remember when I got Yuffie, I gave her a try to see what she could steal and she kept failing to steal over and over and over.

Story progression:

VI was epic. You slowly build up your party, gaining in strength, then when you get to the big boss, bang, he goes and destroys the world. I thought that was a pretty mean thing to do.

VII: Well, I don't remember very much about it. Something about Soldiers? Avalanche being a scrappy band of rebels. Jenova, Sephiroth, something something. I actually didn't finish because after putting in I don't know how many hours, my third-party card ate my save. (Hey, I didn't buy 3rd party memory cards after that!) I was already on Disc 2, so I figure I gave it a fair shake.

Other bits:

VI: 4 character party
VII: 3 character party

VI: 2 player mode!
VII: No.

VII made HP virtually meaningless. Back in the day, playing D&D or older FF and having double digit HP was fantastic. Then VII came with its over-the-top "You don't start at level 1" and "Here's a few hundred HP." Then soon there were bosses where you'd blast them with what, 9999 damage and it would kind of yawn at you? Or meters that didn't move when you hit them? What's the point of HP counters or meters?

But one of the most irritating things about FFVII? The loading. Square went on to make quite a lot of PlayStation games that took forever to load, some of which even took ages to simply show the menu?But to sit there and have the screen go fuzzy and swirl about, then queue the music, then slowly load each character?before finally letting you beat up on even the simplest enemy?
Imagine going from instant map to fight transitions to that! Also, since FF has been so random-combat heavy, there were times when you spent longer waiting for combat to load than you did actually fighting. >_<

It was so boring.

Yeah, I was not very fond of it after a dozen or so hours.

So, I played II/IV and it was cool. Then I played III/VI and it blew II/IV away in pretty much every aspect. I was shocked both of those games could have been released on the same system; there was such a jump.

We went from the pinnacle of the genre, finely tuned in all aspects on the Super NES?to a slow, sloppy mess.

I was really excited when FFVII came out. I got home from the shop and started playing immediately, but gradually, I began to realize I'd blown my money and I was most unhappy.

Ah, forgot to mention cut-scenes. Those was neat. But FMV in games never impresses me.

I notice a lot of people who glowingly refer back to FFVII talk a lot about story and er, Tifa. Some people point out how poignant Aerith's death was, but on that point, that didn't hit me nearly as hard as Palom & Porom's sacrifice or Tellah's death in II/IV.

But in the end, games are games and no amount of sparkly FMVs will cover up the fact that coming from III/VI, I was disappointed by production values overall and most importantly, didn't have any fun sitting around waiting to mash a button for samey-playing characters over synth music repeatedly.

On the plus side, it did change Sony's mind about not allowing RPGs stateside but that has nothing to do with FFVII as a game.
 

Osaka117

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Feb 20, 2011
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Ive never played it or any FF game, and I probably won't because of my large dislike of JRPGs...however if for some reason it just falls on my lap and I have literally nothing else to do, I might check it out just to see what the big fuss is about.
 

mkg

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Feb 24, 2009
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I liked FFVII. But the mother complex is pretty heavy-handed with Sephiroth.
 

dWintermut3

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Jan 14, 2010
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I think FFVII was the pinnacle of the series (well Tactics was close but it wasn't in the same genre so I'll punt on picking one or the other).

It was very... different though. The Materia system, the introduction of sometimes interminable cutscenes, a plot that was a lot more complex than any game in the series before. It was also not really set in a fantasy world. It was set in some sort of dystopic cyberpunk-meet-steampunk-meet-high fantasy mess that never really felt that coherent even if it was visually stunning and a heck of a lot of fun to play around in.
 

Akihiko

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Aug 21, 2008
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I don't hate it, but I do believe it's over-rated. People seem to put it on a pedastool, and I don't think it deserves it. I'm not singling out against just FF7 either, it's the same with OOT. Neither of them deserve the popularity. By no means am I saying they're bad games, just not as great as they make them out to be.
 

Ickorus

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Mar 9, 2009
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I liked FF7 when it came out but it wasn't nearly as great as the fanboys would make it out to be.

It's the same as with anime really, you get some people that claim anime is the most superior form of show around and will constantly annoy everyone else about it and so those people that are outside of these circles don't want to even be remotely connected to those people that annoy the fuck out of them.

Fanboys - Bane of their own love.
 

Defense

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Oct 20, 2010
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justforonethread said:
Hi. Made an account and wrote the following for an hour and a half.

I really, really don't like FFVII. After thinking long and hard, it just boils down to: it was no good compared to the FF I played before that, III/VI.

I haven't played either game since they each originally came out, so here's what I remember:

Music:

VI had orchestral tunes. So many different styles and varieties. Beautiful and each character had a recognizable tune.

With VII, we'd jumped to CD technology and the music became very simple MIDI with all-synth. No variety. Not even decent MIDI instruments! It was like Nobuo Uematsu decided he'd already done his best work, so decided to take a nap. (And yet I hear people bother to make SoundFonts to make the PC version sound exactly as crappy as the PSX version.)
It shouldn't matter what was used to make it, just as long as it actually sounds good.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KF32DRg9opA
Would you call that bad just because the number of sounds were limited?

Graphics:

VI had beautiful, lush colors everywhere. SD characters were a standard since you could only have so many pixels in a sprite at that resolution.

VII: Washed-out backgrounds. It was confusing where you were sometimes, so they even had a little arrow to show you where you were.

Character models were awful. Since it was 3D, there was no real need for SD.
The move from 2D to 3D is a large one. Not many other console games did it at the time so doing it was difficult.


VI was epic. You slowly build up your party, gaining in strength, then when you get to the big boss, bang, he goes and destroys the world. I thought that was a pretty mean thing to do.

VII: Well, I don't remember very much about it. Something about Soldiers? Avalanche being a scrappy band of rebels. Jenova, Sephiroth, something something. I actually didn't finish because after putting in I don't know how many hours, my third-party card ate my save. (Hey, I didn't buy 3rd party memory cards after that!) I was already on Disc 2, so I figure I gave it a fair shake.
Confusing&#8800;bad. Final Fantasy VI had a very basic plot of "kill the emperor with your rebel base because he's a dick", but it did a spectacular twist to "kill god because he's a dick".

VI: 4 character party
VII: 3 character party
Agreed, but Final Fantasy IV had a 5 character party.

VI: 2 player mode!
VII: No.
wat.

Osaka117 said:
Ive never played it or any FF game, and I probably won't because of my large dislike of JRPGs...however if for some reason it just falls on my lap and I have literally nothing else to do, I might check it out just to see what the big fuss is about.
Final Fantasy VI has a much more likable cast than Persona 3, from what I've played. But I'm only in December. Not gonna say anything about VII myself.