Why do Vegetarians get so much hate?

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ErGo

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Feb 25, 2009
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Geez you unleashed hell just by making a thread about vegetarians, this thread should be closed!
Now we have all learned to never make threads about vegetarians ever again, EVER.
 

Samurai Goomba

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Silva said:
Samurai Goomba said:
Hey, I'm well aware you're not in favor of the diet, I'm just disproving the idea that even THAT diet can avoid killing animals. Point is, it can't. In a way, all diets cause the death of animals. After that, it's a matter of degree or method. Is it better to kill a cow and feed many people, or kill many mice to harvest different vegetables to kill a few people? And what constitutes "relatively intelligent?" Where's the line? If it's any animal, then shouldn't we focus on saving the most animals, rather than the largest ones? In that case, kill the cow and leave the mice alone.
Okay, cool.

I wouldn't say "any animal", but rather prioritise in order of estimated intelligence. If we are to consider humans above animals for our intellect, then we must do the same on a staircase going down the levels of intelligence.

Or maybe there's some substance in an ecological approach. In such an approach, if you're going to have to kill something for meat, you'd kill a thing which, in dying, will remove some kind of other harm from the environment. In this sense, in your example, the cow would be a better choice than the mice, because of the harmful causes of released biogases, i.e. global warming and its potential ramifications. Because killing the cow might save other species in the long run, presuming that energy would not be used otherwise. However, if that cow's going to be replaced by industrial breeding, then that changes the equation.

It's very difficult to find a solution to all of this. But that's all the more reason why it becomes a personal solution for most people.

In any case, no matter how relatively ethical killing different animals is, I would view killing plants as more ethical. There's no known perception of pain, and no real emotion or consciousness (that we really know about, anyway) in plantlife. Finally, if we are pragmatically inclined here, a plant can reproduce in much greater number on average than any animal. That means less direct harm.

Killing plants may endanger other lifeforms, but that depends on the plantation. Some are cut off from the outside world, thus preventing greater harm, and some are not. These practices are ecological issues, and should not be defining factors in choosing a diet or measuring how ethical it is. Besides, while killing plants or putting poison on them in agricultural practice may harm wild animal life, neither of these are typically supported gardening methods for the demographic that vegetarians often fall into, so the relevance to this topic is close to nil.

I don't like it when animals are raised in their own feces for their entire lifespan or made to eat foods they weren't intended to (like cows eating meat/corn), but they don't have to be raised that way. There are alternatives. One doesn't have to become a vegetarian or preach to others about eating soy or whatever in order to reduce the suffering of animals. In a way, the best method to ease the suffering of animals is to hunt them yourself with a gun. Bullets kill faster and with less pain than arrows, and the animal gets to live its entire life up to that point in the wild, running free.
A bullet is as easy a thing to screw up on aim with, though. And if you hit the wrong spot at the wrong time, you'll cause massive pain to the animal AND lose your target, depending on where you're doing this.

Eating free range is a great start for anyone concerned for animal rights, but I don't think that necessarily needs to be a replacement for the vegetarian approach. This is still a lifestyle choice here, and most natural deficiencies resulting from the diet can be supplemented or completely removed in some form or another. Plus, there's the chance to do both, and probably save more intelligent lives.

I also don't think we can reasonably compare the killing of animals with the killing of people.
Of course not.

Especially not the traditional "food" animals.
This is where we differ. As far as I'm concerned, tradition shouldn't matter squat in defining what is ethical. Maybe in what's practical, but that is another ballgame.

Besides, some animals would kill and eat me. There's a point at which arguing morality takes a backseat to survival. Dump somebody in the wilderness with almost nothing and see how long they stay vegetarian.
That logic doesn't make sense to me. Humanity is at a point of power in its survival at the moment - there are 6 billion of us, and the changes in light and sound we have made can be seen from outside our world - a perspective which we ourselves can see through the power of our luxurious and exuberant technologies. In a context like that, I would say that we, in the rich nations at least, can afford to make choices based on morality. What an animal would do in your shoes is irrelevant. You have the higher intellect. Shouldn't you use that to take a higher choice?

Meat is an easy source of protein and fatty acids which our bodies need. Lots of people eat more meat than they need to, or eat poor-quality meat mass-produced in industrial slaughterhouses, but that doesn't mean meat is without nutritional merit.
An easy source, but not the only source. Besides which, the possible replacements are mostly more nutritious. In the obesity crisis as the media keeps calling it, I think we could use a lot more of that kind of comparatively fatless nutrition.
I guess we're seeing the issue from two different perspectives. You see mankind as having advanced all this ways and made so much progress. You believe mankind shouldn't be beholden to old ways or traditions when there are alternatives that work as well (note that I do NOT say "better"). We shouldn't cause pain and suffering when we can avoid it, it's "beneath" us. Fair enough.

I see mankind as being a few dozen EMP missiles away from the early 1800s. You know that movie "The Hunted?" I think that's sort of how I see the world. It's not that we've advanced beyond our predatory nature, it's that we've concealed it, forgotten it, swept it under the rug. Now reliant on WW2 leftovers and a broken Agricultural system, our way of life is so heavily indebted to factories and industrialized farms (vegetarian or not) that we've left behind the more primal predator/prey relationships that have been common between man and animal from the beginning of our existence right up until very recently. We've exchanged the way of the hunter for convenience, but I can't help but feel we've lost something valuable. Maybe a loss of reverence for the life we take? Could be why "sport" hunting is so popular.

Point is, I still think of animals as food. If I were in charge, yeah, I'd find a way to kill animals more humanely, but I'd definitely still have them killed for food.

As for the "fat generation," it has more to do with High Fructose Corn Syrup and meat fed on poor feed laced with growth hormone than any innate problem with meat. Wild meat is much leaner and good for you than the industry-grown stuff.

Regarding the whole "missing with a bullet," well, yeah. Obviously it's bad if you miss. It's also bad if your knife slips, or your arrow doesn't kill and the animal runs itself to death. My point is that you can fire bullets a lot faster and more accurately than arrows (most people can, anyway). There's less suffering for the animal because they die faster. Even a killing blow with an arrow often doesn't kill right away, and the animal runs off and gets to bleed to death.
 

CrustyMedic

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Meh, live and let live. A vocal vegatarian is a piece of work, almost cult like the way they try convert. Seems to be little or no middle ground. Please don't give me lectures about animals. I have 4 dogs, a cat and 4 parakeets atm. My family has even taken in a couple stay baby racoons, raised and released them into a more wild environment.

All I can say is, you get what you preach.

Respect's to all
 

bushwhacker2k

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I'm not a vegetarian but I don't have anything against vegetarians, it's a belief, hey!

I have an excuse not to be a vegetarian: plants that make vegetables you eat are ALIVE TOO! Thus I eat everything! >:D
 

Scary_Bob

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Sep 24, 2008
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Bob will explain it to you:
http://www.weebls-stuff.com/wab/hams/

Seriously though, there's absolutely nothing wrong with being vegetarian in the way you do it. It's only when people use it as an excuse to feel better than everyone else that I have a problem with it.
 

Mattersmasher

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bushwhacker2k said:
I'm not a vegetarian but I don't have anything against vegetarians
This answer does fine for me.

The good thing with plants is they always grow back...unless my cat sits on them.
 

Pezzer

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Feb 15, 2009
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They don't 'get hate'. We mearly think you are silly not to eat meat.

mmm... Meat.
 

saejox

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Mar 4, 2009
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You dont eat meat? Beacuse animals are being sacrificied for our own leisure. (I get your point, and respect your decision)

You dont drink milk or Eat egss? Now thats what dont understand. Sorry dood but thats just INSANE
 

dwightsteel

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VitalSigns said:
Not sure whether this has been done before, I have been a Vegetarian for 3 years now Because I find it is a healthier diet (yes I get protein) and I do not want to be apart of animal cruelty at all. And I find when a lot of people find out i'm a vegetarian they go for the throat so to speak. I am constantly told why i'm wasting my time and how I must be a drag to go out to dinner with, Basically told I'm stupid for my diet choice. I have never once preached to anyone, complained at a restaurant about having no food or put my health at risk. So I must ask Why all the flack? Is it so wrong to truly have a problem with cruelty? (whether it be towards animals of humans) and don't we have better things to judge people on than something as unimportant as what a person chooses to consume. My personal belief is that when someone finds out i'm Veg they immediately figure i'm going to preach to them, or that I feel i am an elitist who thinks I am better than them. But I have never done either of these things. I would be very interested to hear peoples thoughts on this, and just vegetarianism as a whole. Also any Vegetarians have the same experience?

(this applies to not eating Any Meat whatsoever non of that "Flexitarian" stuff)
Dude, people are dumb. En Masse, people assume because of a lifestyle choice that is, in the majority sense, different, that you are either a) elitist or b) a naive follower. From the sounds of your post, you don't seem to be either. You can try to explain yourself, but you shouldn't have to feel obligated. If people are gonna be intolerant, or at least a little judgmental, then just say c'est la vie and explain to them "it's a choice I made" and leave it at that.

The fact is, that there is a stereotype regarding the types of people that vegetarians tend to be. That's not to say there isn't a kernel of truth to them. As a matter of fact (and don't worry, I attribute this to chance) the majority of the folks that are vegetarians that I've met have been more than a little preachy, often times making arguments that set back the lifestyle because they were, in fact, naive followers. I've met just as many "geeks" who were basement dwellers, anti-social, and for the life of them, will probably never get laid. As a self proclaimed geek, I joyfully don't fall any where near that group. Regardless, to paraphrase Dr. Sam Gosling, stereotypes can have their proper place in society, if used in the proper context. Gotta take the good with the bad.

Personally, I don't have it in me to give up meat. I like it too much. I enjoy it as a good source of protein and other nutrients that most naturally occurring plants can't give. While I'm totally against cruelty to animals, I have found a peace with the meat industry. Anyway, there is my stance on the subject. I have nothing against vegetarianism as a whole. It's clearly not a bad choice. Many vegetarians live incredibly happy, healthy lifestyles. Hopefully, life will introduce me to more vegetarians like you, who realize it's not a religion to be preached, but a lifestyle to embrace for oneself.
 

hypothetical fact

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Because they think they are being kind to animals when thousands of moles and insects are killed in vegetarian farms. I hate hypocrisy damn it!
 

D.C.

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Oct 8, 2008
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Im not against vegetarians, its your choice your lifestyle. Ive just got Aggro for the annoying loudmouths who don't know the whole truth about being a vegetarian and still try to push it.

Example: my sister claims to be a vegetarian and pushes it at me because its "better for you" (Its not, a meaty diet can be better for you, it just depends on exactly what you eat) and yet she still has gravy on her mash potato at every meal.


VitalSigns said:
I do not want to be apart of animal cruelty at all.
I dont accept this arguement for two reasons. There is a Global law about animal rights with a more than adaquate for a decent living and a human death (more human than human executions are).
My second counterpoint to this is from my personal experience. I work at a vets and deal with both farmers, pet owners and horse owners and Farmers treat their animals far better than the average pet owner, so if you want to stop animal cruelty start with the higher amount of offenders actual pet owners.
 

bushwhacker2k

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Mattersmasher said:
bushwhacker2k said:
I'm not a vegetarian but I don't have anything against vegetarians
This answer does fine for me.

The good thing with plants is they always grow back...unless my cat sits on them.
:)

On another note, why does your cat sit on plants? :O
 

El Poncho

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May 21, 2009
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I don't have any bother with vegetarians but not eating the meat won't stop them being killed other people are always eating meat and places are treating animals to a good life before they die now. Humans have been hunting and killing animals forever and so do other animals thats why they are there to get eaten.
 

Ciarang

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Dec 4, 2008
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Mr.Tea said:
It's sad, but you're only getting all that because of the vegetarians who are loud, obnoxious and preachy. Also because they're a little ignorant of your choice (like "How do you get protein then??" Idiots... Meat isn't the only protein food source in the world).
^

I have been a peskitarian (Someone who eats fish but not meat) for all my life and I have been on the receiving end of a lot of people arguing "you eat fish but not meat ....why?" and im a bit fed up I usually respond saying something like im only 13 I still havent made a lot of choices yet ect but by then they lose intrest and my hatred for most people rises a bit more
 

Galletea

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Sep 27, 2008
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Well I think the hate is the same as toward religion, people get defensive because they think you're going to try and convert them and vilify them for eating meat. And judging by how this thread has gone I might well be right.
 

Biek

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Mar 5, 2008
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Im sure this has been said many times before in this thread: Blame it on PETA.