Why is France suddenly so Gung-ho

[Throwitawaynow]

World War I
- Tied and on the way to losing, France is saved by the United States [Entering the war late -ed.]. Thousands of French women find out what it's like to not only sleep with a winner, but one who doesn't call her "Fraulein." Sadly, widespread use of condoms by American forces forestalls any improvement in the French bloodline.

Oh, please, you quote this crap as a reliable source?

Of course not, that is why I said "completely factual" who says that unless they are being sarcastic? We both know that Germany didn't invade France and probably gave the biggest military push of all the allies while giving everyone a good place to set up camp with out a need to take a place first. Why have some kind of massive assault to free another country when they could just go to France who were already single-handedly winning the war.

 

[Exocet]

I'd like to point out to all the ignorant people out there who seem to think France just spread it's cheeks to the German invaders in 1940 that France did fight back.In fact,more German airplanes were destroyed during the Battle of France then the Battle of Britain,and the intensity of tank fighting would only be matched a few years later on the Eastern front.
It's said that if French high command got their shit together,they could have taken the fight to Germany,but the sheer their sheer incompetence lost them the war.

As for after the surrender,well,let's just say look at Red Dawn,now multiply the scale by 10.
Personally,I don't call a dozen of guys who sabotage German armored trains cowards to their faces,nor do I call cowards the men who sacrificed their sugar ration to mix it with the cement in the Atlantic Wall,at the risk of being caught.


As for more recently,the French have been in those types of conflicts for years now.This one just has an international participation,so more spotlight on it.

 

[nipsen]

..so.. one-sentence sound bites actually /don't/ describe the entire world history, nor replace going to school, or reading books? And in fact isn't a good basis for setting world policy, or going to war?

Goodness. This is just too much to take in all at once. I think I'm going to go and have a crisis now, before forgetting about all the bullshit again..

 

[Arqus_Zed]

Ugh...

Seriously, why does every idiot born in America believe France is full of cowards and snooty people? I live in Belgium, right next to France, I've visited the country regularly, the statement. Is. Bogus.

Maybe you've all been watching to much Hollywood diarrhea?

 

[Sanglyon]

Is it just me or has France suddenly decided they're sick of people calling them cowards and that shooting up a few countries should stop that stereotype

Actually, 90% of French doesn't even know about this reputation. The only one who do are those fluent in english and using non-french speaking web site for other reasons than work. It's like the stereotype of English eating only boiled meat with mint sauce, or American not able to show their own country on a world map.
So it really isn't to restore a reputation no one is aware of.

 

[Smokej]

As a German speaking i'm glad to see the two most sophisticated countries in middle europe being allies for so long now and everybody here knows that France is contributing alot for the benifit of the EU. But come on national stereotypes shouldn't be taken that serious (there are alot about us as well) as long as they aren't really misanthropic...

So in that sense i present you

 

[Redlin5_v1legacy]

The French have been war-crazy ever since their foundation. They participated heavily in the crusades, The Italian Wars, The Seven Years War, The Napoleonic Wars, The Franco-Prussian War, WWI, WWII, etc..

On that note, Have you ever heard their national anthem?

Spoiler

"And the bloody standard is raised!"
"The baying of these ferocious soldiers!"
"They come into our arms to slit the throats of our sons!"
"To arms citizens! Form your battalions!"

That's a pretty Gung-ho anthem.

Mmmhmm... I propose we shift the military surrender jokes to the Italians. Oh wait, they're worse! They switched sides in both World Wars!

/kidding

In anycase, the French are a lot tougher than people give them credit. There is a reason everyone knows about the French Foreign Legion.

Ugh...

Seriously, why does every idiot born in America believe France is full of cowards and snooty people? I live in Belgium, right next to France, I've visited the country regularly, the statement. Is. Bogus.

Maybe you've all been watching to much Hollywood diarrhea?

I think this stereotype originates from American soldiers returning home after World War II who were either furious at the French because of the loss of a comrade during the liberation or just because of the standard world power "they needed us, the wimps" posturing.

My history teacher used the joke too but we all knew it was a joke whereas some people seem to think the French really will surrender at the first sign of trouble. In a few RTS's the French are my preferred nationality.

[sub]As a Canadian I just sit back and watch the military history contest with amusement.[/sub]

 

[The Gnome King]

Is it just me or has France suddenly decided they're sick of people calling them cowards and that shooting up a few countries should stop that stereotype I'm not saying I think they shouldn't be helping, it just surprises me that they are essentially leading the charge in a lot of these situations.

Heres some links in case your not clued up with whats happening.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-12795971

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/africaandindianocean/cotedivoire/8441674/Ivory-Coast-UN-and-French-helicopter-gunships-attack-Laurent-Gbagbo-residence.html

As an American I have this to say:

At least it's not us. Let it be anybody but us.

 

[rednose1]

People keep saying the French were in no way to stop the Germans after WWI, but i gotta ask, in what shape were the germans after WWI? Didn't the treaty of versailles and the demilitrization of the Rhineland, put Germany over a barrel? If this is the case, how'd they wind up overpowering France so well?

Not trying to be sarcastic, actually asking the question. It would seem to me if you are on the winning team in the first war, you should be in a better position than the losing team come round 2.

 

[Griffolion]

Winning battles, the French have a decent track record. Winning wars, not so good a record.

Does it really matter anyway?

 

[MrJKapowey]

People keep saying the French were in no way to stop the Germans after WWI, but i gotta ask, in what shape were the germans after WWI? Didn't the treaty of versailles and the demilitrization of the Rhineland, put Germany over a barrel? If this is the case, how'd they wind up overpowering France so well?

Not trying to be sarcastic, actually asking the question. It would seem to me if you are on the winning team in the first war, you should be in a better position than the losing team come round 2.

Aha! GCSE History textbook to the rescue!

The policy of appeasement by the British and French allowed the German to breach certain aspects of the Treaty of Versailles and when they began invading countries they re-designated the subjugated nations armoured vehicles (a large proportion of tanks invading France were Czech). They also bypassed the French primary defensive lines by invading a seperate country in a pretty large flanking manouver which meant the French needed to reposition their troops. They split the Anglo-French forces in half and pushed on towards the capital, forcing surrender as the two seperate armies were unable to best the new German army.

Basically Frances defeat was the fault of French and British foreign policy, and the CCCP's alliance with Germany. Though that was only to gain time before Hitler invaded to Stalin could increase the Soviet military might

Wrong! Look at this completely factual record of France as a military force http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/text/france.html. Even now, they're not doing the brunt of the work. They just screamed firsties and let everyone else do what was needed.

Both quoted from the article:

Please note that the Web designer is not American and blaming the Web designer for America's history is illogical.

World War I
- Tied and on the way to losing, France is saved by the United States [Entering the war late -ed.]. Thousands of French women find out what it's like to not only sleep with a winner, but one who doesn't call her "Fraulein." Sadly, widespread use of condoms by American forces forestalls any improvement in the French bloodline.

Oh, please, you quote this crap as a reliable source?

Yeah, it was primarily British and French forces who won it, the Americans were just that person who joins in on a tug of war to tip the scales.

I think they've always been gung-ho, we just have a more international community now so we hear about it more often.

Besides, Britain is awesome in terms of military history. You guys agree right?

[small]Right?[/small]

 

[Griffolion]

People keep saying the French were in no way to stop the Germans after WWI, but i gotta ask, in what shape were the germans after WWI? Didn't the treaty of versailles and the demilitrization of the Rhineland, put Germany over a barrel? If this is the case, how'd they wind up overpowering France so well?

Not trying to be sarcastic, actually asking the question. It would seem to me if you are on the winning team in the first war, you should be in a better position than the losing team come round 2.

The countries involved were still economically recovering from WW1 and assumed the treaty of Versailles would afford them some ability to focus on rebuilding the country rather than maintaining an army, so it went on the back burner. When Nazi Germany began breaking the treaty and building an army, they were already way ahead of any response the French or other countries could give. That's why they effectively walked into Poland and relatively easily took France. By the time they got to England, we had mustered a bit of strength to begin the defence and subsequent counter-assault. Also consider in that Hitler was a brilliant tactician and had some pretty strong generals leading his armies.

Sorry for DP.

 

[4li3n]

Well this is hardly new, if you'll recall the sole reason the US revolutionary war turned out in favor of the Americans was massive support from the French.

Basically this. They got their butts kicked in World War II, and they didn't support President Bush's illegal invasion of Iraq. The rest of their record as warriors? Pretty much spotless. France actually has a pretty violent history, once you get into it.

Wrong! Look at this completely factual record of France as a military force http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/text/france.html. Even now, they're not doing the brunt of the work. They just screamed firsties and let everyone else do what was needed.

And that still qualifies them for being gung-ho...

I mean hell, the fact that they helped the US in the revolutionary war was a big factor in bankrupting them and starting their own revolution (and they didn't even stop at one revolution).

They just screamed firsties and let everyone else do what was needed.

Cote d'Ivore says Hi!

 

[Smooth Operator]

They woke up and smelled the oil...

 

[Thaluikhain]

Mmmhmm... I propose we shift the military surrender jokes to the Italians. Oh wait, they're worse! They switched sides in both World Wars!

I second the motion. On the other hand, possibly we shouldn't condemn the Italians too much for not supporting the Nazis very well.

In anycase, the French are a lot tougher than people give them credit. There is a reason everyone knows about the French Foreign Legion.

I'm not sure if you meant that to be funny, but I snickered.

I think this stereotype originates from American soldiers returning home after World War II who were either furious at the French because of the loss of a comrade during the liberation or just because of the standard world power "they needed us, the wimps" posturing.

I heard it was due to the French politics during the latter Cold War. Much the same with "Freedom Fries", I guess.

[sub]As a Canadian I just sit back and watch the military history contest with amusement.[/sub]

So, if I was to say that Vimy Ridge wasn't an important battle, you'd not bludgeon me?

 

[4li3n]

Also consider in that Hitler was a brilliant tactician and had some pretty strong generals leading his armies.

Only the second part of that statement is true... i'm pretty sure most people agree that if Hitler was better at the whole war thing or at least didn't stop listening to his generals the war would have been very different (of course with the British cracking Enigma and dominating in intelligence and the nukes they couldn't have won).

Wrong! Look at this completely factual record of France as a military force http://www.albinoblacksheep.com/text/france.html. Even now, they're not doing the brunt of the work. They just screamed firsties and let everyone else do what was needed.

Both quoted from the article:

Please note that the Web designer is not American and blaming the Web designer for America's history is illogical.

World War I
- Tied and on the way to losing, France is saved by the United States [Entering the war late -ed.]. Thousands of French women find out what it's like to not only sleep with a winner, but one who doesn't call her "Fraulein." Sadly, widespread use of condoms by American forces forestalls any improvement in the French bloodline.

Oh, please, you quote this crap as a reliable source?

Yeah, it was primarily British and French forces who won it, the Americans were just that person who joins in on a tug of war to tip the scales.

I think they've always been gung-ho, we just have a more international community now so we hear about it more often.

Besides, Britain is awesome in terms of military history. You guys agree right?

[small]Right?[/small]

I know it's the internet, but that was pretty obvious sarcasm right there...

 

[4li3n]

Mmmhmm... I propose we shift the military surrender jokes to the Italians. Oh wait, they're worse! They switched sides in both World Wars!

Nah, they have immunity because their Dad conquered half the known world once...

 

[Griffolion]

Also consider in that Hitler was a brilliant tactician and had some pretty strong generals leading his armies.

Only the second part of that statement is true... i'm pretty sure most people agree that if Hitler was better at the whole war thing or at least didn't stop listening to his generals the war would have been very different (of course with the British cracking Enigma and dominating in intelligence and the nukes they couldn't have won).

Yeah I agree, obviously the allies played a big part in Germany eventually losing and Hitler did make some grave errors like starting a second front with Russia that split his forces way too much. However he did make some decent moves alongside his generals. If he was a weak leader and co-ordinator in war I don't think he'd have gotten as frighteningly far as he did.

 

[Daveman]

Well this is hardly new, if you'll recall the sole reason the US revolutionary war turned out in favor of the Americans was massive support from the French.

Basically this. They got their butts kicked in World War II, and they didn't support President Bush's illegal invasion of Iraq. The rest of their record as warriors? Pretty much spotless. France actually has a pretty violent history, once you get into it.

Hardly spotless. They've lost most of the wars they've fought and France was repeatedly occupied by the English. In fairness they did have it kind of tough by being right in between Germany, England, Italy and Spain which were basically everyone that mattered for good while.

 

[MrJKapowey]

Mmmhmm... I propose we shift the military surrender jokes to the Italians. Oh wait, they're worse! They switched sides in both World Wars!

Nah, they have immunity because their Dad conquered half the known world once...

When? If you mean the Roman Empire, they conquered half of Europe. The British Empire ruled over India, America, Canada, Falklands -), Australia, Indonesia (bits), Africa (bits) and New Zealand. The Mongols (I think) pretty much smashed 70% of Asia.

just a question to your other post (when you quoted me), did you mean that you thought I was being sarcastic when I suggested Britain had an impressive military history? Or were you referencing one of the sections I had quoted/the comparison between tug of war and American involvement in WW1?