Women of the Escapist: Keeping up appearances in order to reach "perfection"

[Blow_Pop]

Mid Question: Can someone explain to me what this "American standard" of female beauty is? Is there such a thing or something that society kind of portrayal of what women should work towards? I sound may ridiculous but I am curious because my friend isn't the first person to say that.

American standard of beauty:
White
Usually blonde
large boobs
small waist
larger arse
Basically THIS LIST [http://www.maxim.com/hot100/2013]. Or any one who has been in Maxim, Playboy, or really any magazine.

So going back to the main point, do you, women of the Escapist, often feel pressured, or often times overly pressured, into looking "perfect" and fitting some sort of status quo. That you are told too often that you have to be a certain way in order to fit this thing or trend. That being a certain "standard" of beautiful will get you far in life. That it's more about looks that actually talent and personality. This actually applies to all ages from kids to teens to adults. You may have felt image conscious when you were a teenager and not any more when you are an adult or the other way round.

Let me give you a story.

Growing up, I had(still have but we haven't talked in 11 years, seeing them soon and dreading it)a rich aunt and uncle. Because one of my cousins on that side of the family was really into fashion and makeup and perfume growing up, ALL I GOT FOR BIRTHDAYS AND CHRISTMAS(which were often combined due to them being 2 weeks apart)WAS MAKEUP, JEWELRY, PERFUME, AND CLOTHES. NO MATTER HOW MANY TIMES I ASKED FOR BOOKS.

Because they couldn't grasp the fact that I WAS NOT interested in anything they gave me. Never mind the fact that my mum has fairly severe asthma as does my brother(and I do now but that's irrelevant to this story as I developed it late in life)and I couldn't wear any of the perfume. And there is no way I was going to wear expensive as hell jewelry to school. This started (perfume, makeup, and jewelry) at age 12. I was a full fledged tomboy. More interested in climbing trees and playing sports with the boys and getting good grades in school than my appearance. In fact, I was shunned by most of the girls I went to school with because of this. And was the subject of torment from them for years.


I was a blonde haired hazel eyed petite girl. All the way up to age 20. Metabolism finally slowed down at that point and I stopped looking like I had an eating disorder. I was accused by other girls all through school of being anorexic/bulimic. Despite the fact that the only time I threw up was when I was sick. And I ate as much if not more than our quarterbacks for football(and they ate A LOT).

I got teased AND bullied for not being "girly". Or in other words, not caring about cute boys(though I have been boy crazy since grade 1)-how I looked-makeup-clothes. I was shy up until I was 14/15. Tried fitting it from age 12 til 15. Stopped caring as much. Now? I couldn't care less how I look. Long as I am presentable enough to not be arrested I'm happy.

And let me tell you, not caring about my appearance has made me infinitely happier than anytime I've ever tried caring. Also, it is DEFINITELY true out here that if you look a certain way you will get farther in life no matter how much or little you know(I've lost jobs to girls who flaunt their boobs and arses for interviews who couldn't figure out how to open a door that I was more qualified for the job than them because I dress more professionally and refuse to stop). Not to mention that it is shoved in our faces and down our throats DAILY that we should look and act certain ways. Mostly by Hollywood. Look at the girls cast in movies. Look at the girls in ads. Look at the girls in tv shows. It is all a subtle way of saying "Hey! You should definitely look like this or else you won't get anything in life no matter how hard you work".

I've had boyfriends cheat on me for girls who they deemed "prettier" than me. I've been dumped for that same reason. Let me tell you, society sucks. Oh and the fact that EVERYTHING is our fault. Guy cheats on us? Our fault. We get raped? Our fault. Not successful enough? Our fault. We make less? Our fault because we can't/won't do the jobs that men do. When in fact, that last one, a lot of us are willing to do and get told we can't because of our sex/gender. Even in the same position as a guy doing twice the work we get paid less. And told we're not working hard enough. (I've had this told to me and all the things the guys did wrong were blamed on me even on days I wasn't even scheduled to work.)

I don't feel pressured anymore because I basically say fuck you to societal norms. I am perfect as is and anyone I date who can't handle that doesn't deserve me. That said, I still occasionally get a little self conscious when wearing shirts that show off my boobs as they don't feel big enough sometimes. And shopping is a ***** as girls jeans are a pain in the arse to find ones that fit. Especially as a size 10 in this style is a size 14 in this style and so on. Which is why I don't own any girls jeans.

Also, my mum has recently gotten on this kick of telling me how fat I am and occasionally how undesirable others will find me when I start dating again (IF I ever do again) and how I should diet and stuff. So even as an adult I can't escape it in my own house.

[sub][sub]Disclaimer: Blow Pop identifies as gender fluid and uses the pronouns they/them/their. They do not always identify as female even though that is what they were determined to be at birth. Please respect this fact by not using female pronouns (she, her) for them[/sub][/sub]

 

[Ihateregistering1]

I think you might be jumping to conclusions claiming an "American Standard" of beauty. I've lived in both Europe and the US, and the women on the covers of European magazines looked pretty much the same as the women on the covers of American magazines.

 

[lacktheknack]

I feel like a lot of the guys who say they prefer natural women really mean they prefer naturally pretty women. You better already have flawless skin because if you use makeup you're cheating.

This isn't true.

For instance, there was a girl in high school who always wore makeup. One day, she woke up late and had to come to school "without her face". Everyone's first statement: "Wow, you look tired. You sleep OK?"

She hated it.

Eventually, she ditched the makeup entirely, partly as a "screw you" to society in general and partly because she didn't like it. You know what happened? She got prettier. As we got used to the "new" her, we all started noticing qualities that were covered up before, things like her smile suddenly feeling more genuine.

OT: Dude here.

Women with meat on them desired. Can present herself as she wishes. All my bros agree on this.

That is all.

 

[Thaluikhain]

I feel like a lot of the guys who say they prefer natural women really mean they prefer naturally pretty women. You better already have flawless skin because if you use makeup you're cheating.

There is a strong element of this, yes. Women are supposed to magically fit standards, having to use makeup or cosmetic surgery to achieve it doesn't count or something...very annoying when this is claimed as a progressive attitude.

 

[WWmelb]

Oh, absolutely.

The quote (think Tosh said it), "Being an ugly woman is like being a man. You're going to have to work" rings very true. Ugly women don't typically become actresses no matter how good they are. They don't become models or dancers. Beautiful ladies can be thick as shit and still earn a hefty wage with modelling. I'm not saying they all are stupid, but from my point of view, attractive females get it much better. They typically have an easier time at school too.

Fortunately the men I'm interested in do not like that sort of "beauty" and prefer someone who looks more natural. Being, uh... "visually challenged" has never stopped me finding a man before but I do still feel incredibly self concious with all the constantly photoshopped models we're bombarded with.

A recent (and personal) example is bra shopping. I always end up thinking, "my boobs don't look like theirs and their hips don't curve outwards as much as mine, is there something wrong with me?"
My spine curves over, my upper arms, thighs, hips and bum are huge. For years I haven't received a single insult regarding any of this, but I can't help compare myself to other women and feel inadequate.

It means less, the older you get. The people who date others based entirely on looks and because society deems their partners something to be proud of dating will rightly so probably end up miserable.

I have no idea how this is going to come off, but hey, wanted to say something nice.

You posted pics in the coolest thing you own thread, and if that is indeed, you are superfuckingcutegorgeous.

I really hope that you don't feel self conscious forever, as that would be such a shame.

Chin up. You are beautiful!

And that goes for everyone here (myself included) that has issues with their appearance.

Chin up. You are beautiful!

 

[Bara_no_Hime]

During their conversations he often brought up how hot those girls were, sexy, fit, banging, gorgeous, she's just perfect etc. She stated that she never had those compliments towards her from him apart from, "you're cute". I see why she was upset.

Yeah! I do too! What a massive jerk. /rage at someone I've never met about his treatment of someone else I've never met on principle

Mid Question: Can someone explain to me what this "American standard" of female beauty is? Is there such a thing or something that society kind of portrayal of what women should work towards? I sound may ridiculous but I am curious because my friend isn't the first person to say that.

There was just an episode of South Park of all unlikely things on that very topic. It's called the Hobbit and I haven't in years thought an episode of South Park was so amazingly on target and relevant as that one.

The issue with the "American standard" is that not only are real women forced to compete with paid models, but the pictures of those models are then photoshopped to an insane degree. Just do a google search about fashion models and photoshop and you can see examples of how insane this is.

So yeah, the fashion and advertisement industry has taken an already high standard and basically launched the bar into orbit. It's really messed up.

So going back to the main point, do you, women of the Escapist, often feel pressured, or often times overly pressured, into looking "perfect" and fitting some sort of status quo.

Sort of?

I mean, you see pictures of these women, and even if you know in your brain that those pics are fake, you still think "wow, my butt doesn't look like that - I wish it did."

On the other hand, I keep in pretty good shape and am fairly attractive.

On the other other hand, I'm a size six... and because the fashion industry is insane, size six models are now considered "Plus Size" models.

I tried to find a size chart on google image to demonstrate how insane that is, but I ended up with British sizes which work differently.

I am the skinniest woman in my group of friends (or equal to other similar sized women). I have a flat stomach (which I fucking worked for) with no gut, but I'm not showing ribs either (which is kinda gross, IMO). I have some muscle on my legs (from using my exercise bike) that means I have to wear a slightly larger size of jeans.

And according to the American fashion industry that controls what women see in fashion, being a size fucking six (which I fucking worked for after my pregnancy) makes me a fat-fat-fatty.

**seething rage at the fashion industry**

...

I seem to have wandered off topic slightly. Hopefully my ranting about that will give you some perspective on the issue.

Edit: So yeah, I posted and then realized that when I said "sort of" I was obviously wrong about my own feelings since I worked up to a rage minutes later. Clearly it does bother me... more than I realized.

 

[ObsidianJones_v1legacy]

Women, I have a follow up question.

Whose ideal of beauty matters more to you? The culture you're born into, or the culture you choose?

Speaking as a black american male, I get some focus and even attraction from 'ideal' women as it were. But since they aren't who I'm into, I don't really pay attention to it that much. But given that my phenotype isn't what's normally portrayed as hot in our Geek culture, I tend not to get the same attraction from geek women. It leads to the sad.

 

[Sack of Cheese]

I think if you dress for yourself, make yourself look good in your standard, it'd increase your confidence. Getting checked out is always flattering.

Even if you're not superbly beautiful or a man, keeping yourself looking nice and clean will leave better impressions on others, good for both romantic life and professional life.

 

[EeveeElectro]

-snip-

Aw, why thank you very much! *glows*
I'm a bit of an oddball because like many ladies here, I was bullied horribly at school no matter I did. I was chubby, awkward, quiet, nerdy, never wore make-up, never stood up for myself. I literally could not go a day without hearing some variant of fat/ugly/*****/slag/freak thrown at me. After years of that, hearing a compliment still sounds weird to me despite many men from different walks of life have found me attractive and currently having a boyfriend who constantly compliments me.
The most recent one being one my my friends telling me how stupidly high his standards were then admitting to really fancying me. Made the rest of the conversation awkward, haha.

I started to take care of my appearance more, at first to stop people saying shit about me but then I felt good about myself after a while so I kept at it. I sorted my hair out (I'm not one to brag but my hair is awesome LOL. I try really hard to keep it looking nice and get loads of compliments on it. That's all I'm really vain about. Bad hair day = bad mood.)

I only wear make-up when I go out but I LOVE to dress up. I adore wearing and buying pretty dresses and putting make-up on and doing my hair all nice and then I look in the mirror and think, "girl, you've done good. Those fuckers at school were wrong about you." It's the only time I've ever got a lot of confidence, apart from when I cospaly.

So yeah, weird how our brains work.

"Tell a woman she's beautiful a thousand times. Call her ugly once and she won't forget it."

Thank you for the compliment though, and for complimenting the other lovely ladies in this thread.

-snip-

You sound like a yummy mummy! ;D
Haha, my body type would simply not allow for me to be a size 6. I'd look like an addict :| but when I see slim girls who work for it in bodycon dresses, I'm like "You go for it girl! You worked hard for that body, show it off!"
Similar reason as to why I don't mind low cut tops. In the right clothes, I love my boobs. Boyfriends have always loved them too. I'm sure as shit gonna show them off if I'm lacking a lovely slim figure.

As for the plus size issue... I'm not sure if this is correct but I heard it from someone who worked with models.
Apparently, fashion designers will send examples of their clothes for the models to wear on the catwalk for example. They don't ask for any of the models measurements and just send in a sample that typically only fit the models who are size 2-6. Apparently because of that, the other models are considered plus size.

Plus sized in the UK starts at size 14, which I believe is a US 10 so I don't know what it is over there. You're not plus sized in the slightest, it's just the fashion industry being stupid.

Women, I have a follow up question.

Whose ideal of beauty matters more to you? The culture you're born into, or the culture you choose?

Speaking as a black american male, I get some focus and even attraction from 'ideal' women as it were. But since they aren't who I'm into, I don't really pay attention to it that much. But given that my phenotype isn't what's normally portrayed as hot in our Geek culture, I tend not to get the same attraction from geek women. It leads to the sad.

Going on what I said earlier, the fact anyone finds me attractive is still an alien concept. I've flat out and rudely turned men down or laughed in their faces when they've asked me out/offered to buy me a drink because I think he's doing it for a dare to make his mates laugh. I think I may as well laugh along with them if they are.
It's never happened to my knowledge so my brain needs to stop being so stupid.
But as I was saying, anyone fancying me is good enough. I suppose if I were model-like I would be sick of certain types of attention but damn I'll take any compliment I can get haha.

Another thing is that I get a LOT of attention from black gentlemen. A weird amount.
It might be because I have more meat on me than a lot of other girls my age/skin colour or some other reason, but I always found it strange how many black men have asked for my number. Not a bad thing at all, I'm just usually taken, haha!

 

[Saetha]

To be honest? No, not really. Why? I'm not so sure. I know that the two other women I interact with on a daily basis (My sister and my roommate) both put on make-up regularly, one keeps up with latest fashion trends, and they both seem rather cowed by the idea of being considered ugly.

But me? I don't know why, maybe I'm an exception or maybe they are, but I've never felt any particular pressure to be beautiful, or conform to standards. I've felt no particular desire to be ugly or defy standards as some sort of rebellion against society, either - such things genuinely never played into my decision making. I never wear make-up beyond chapstick, I eat what I like and don't go out of my way to exercise (I'm rather chubby as a result, but ah well) and most of the time I do my clothes shopping in the men's section - I detest all the flashy patterns and too-bright colors of women's fashion, not to mention how most of the material's light and clingy, and meant to be layered with several articles of clothing - as opposed to men's or unisex shirts, with subtler patterns and a more comfortable fit and material heavy enough that you don't see everything beneath it.

Do I feel out of place sometimes? Absolutely. I still get a little awkward when I veer off to the men's section instead of staying in the women's. And I've gotten a few comments about how preferring baggier, heavier clothing makes me a closeted lesbian, but such comments are few and far between, and I'd rather spend an awkward hour rifling through men's shirts if it means I'm comfortable in my own clothing. I've gotten comments of having no fashion sense, or had friends of mine beg me to give me a make-over, but again, they're just words. There's no reason to get upset over them. I sometimes feel down on myself for my larger weight or some other flaw of my being, but I figure every one does. Grass is always greener and all that. And as for make-up, well, I'm not going to slather chemicals on my face for the next fifty or so years to please some guy. If he can't stand me without make-up on now, he's definitely not going to be able to put up with it when I'm a wrinkly old prune. So why bother?

As for WHY I'm seemingly immune to all this societal pressure other girls bang on about... dunno. Maybe it's because I developed a thick skin after being picked on for things that had nothing to do with my beauty (In elementary, it was my dyslexia. In middle school, it was the fact that I was one of a few white girls at a school with a primarily Hispanic student body) Compared to that, some jerk in the locker room calling me a fat ass was small potatoes - I mean, lady, I've been punched in the face just because I dared to talk someone without their permission. An uncreative slur based on the most easily recognized of attributes is nothing.

And once it was established that, no, I didn't conform to those standards, that I didn't care to conform to those standards, and you'll have to try a lot harder if you want to make me feel bad about that... well, people stopped trying to make me feel bad about that. I know it's cliche, but it really is easy to get rid of bullies if you simply ignore them and keep your head up high - they're looking for a weak target and easy entertainment. Simply don't give it to them.

Women, I have a follow up question.

Whose ideal of beauty matters more to you? The culture you're born into, or the culture you choose?

Neither, but that's just a natural extension of my answer. And to be honest, I'm not too fond of the... "meet and greet" style of dating so many other people to seem to advocate. I'd rather go out with a boy I've been friends with for a few weeks or months rather than some random dude I ran into at a bar. A romantic relationship is a lot of trust to put on some you've literally just met.

 

[Snowbell]

The concept of 'beauty' is a socially created and ingrained one. It stems back to evolutionary principles; we find people with nice teeth, smooth skin and young complexions to be more attractive because it indicates a healthy gene pool, and blonde hair is a rarer gene set and thus more likely to attract a mate and continue to ensure your line's survival. However, society has taken that to the next level, praising people who are 'perfect' and shunning those who aren't.

Even I feel and occasionally buckle under the immense pressure to be 'beautiful' or 'pretty', but more and more I'm stepping out without makeup and fancy hair because you know what? I'm really ill and I don't need the hassle that getting 'pretty' entails.

I have to say, if a guy told me I wasn't pretty or sexy enough for his standards I would walk the other way. Personality is much more important when it comes to forging a lasting intimate relationship. Beauty is, literally, skin deep.

I am super proud to say that I have found a man that also bucks the trend! He is naturally handsome, but doesn't feel the need to encourage me to 'improve' the way I look through artificial means - he genuinely loves me for who I am, not what I look like, and I wouldn't have it any other way.

Even here on the escapist you get people saying they like 'sexy' 'pretty' 'beautiful' girls/men, and it shames me that even in a community of intellectual pursuits we still hold such artificial concepts so dear.

But on the flipside; being pretty is fine if that's what makes you happy! But if you're going to go after someone who puts time and effort into being considered globally attractive then you had better be ready to put in just as much effort as them or be ignored for not being 'pretty' enough.

 

[Saetha]

I started to take care of my appearance more, at first to stop people saying shit about me but then I felt good about myself after a while so I kept at it. I sorted my hair out (I'm not one to brag but my hair is awesome LOL. I try really hard to keep it looking nice and get loads of compliments on it. That's all I'm really vain about. Bad hair day = bad mood.)

Oooh, yeah, okay, that one I get - I'll admit to being ridiculously vain about my hair. Long, thick, naturally straight and naturally highlighted. It gets in the way, is constantly plagued with split ends, and it'll tangle if you so much as look at it funny, but I just can't bear the thought of cutting it short again. Besides regular trimmings to keep the ends neat, I haven't gotten my hair cut in years.

 

[WWmelb]

Snip of the century

You are very welcome, and the more i read what you write you sound even more of betterer!

Take care! And it's great to read you finding happy in yourself!

And speak the grammar well do i!

 

[Parasondox]

@OP in particular, you may want to check out the latest South Park episode. I like the show, but their latest episode, "The Hobbit" is probably one of the most profound, if not the most profound, episode they've done yet, and the particular episode definitely comes off as a more serious show with occassional comic relief than what South Park really is. The whole episode is about body image, and really I think it may be their best episode to date. You can watch it here for free, only interrupted by a few acvertisements that'd you'd similarly get on television:
http://www.southparkstudios.com/guide/episodes

I did see that episode a few months back and did get a feeling of a serious satire. South Park is known for pointing out things and they did well pointing that out. I was on Wendy's side the whole time showing the damning nature of photoshopping (especially when it's mostly done on social media) and how the boys in her school look at the "hot" pictures more instead of the actual girl. I felt bad because she was pressured to give in. That episode didn't leave me laughing at the end at all. Great episode though.

 

[Lieju]

Well, I was called fat in school a lot, and my aunt makes remarks about it, and I am not overweight.

To be honest, I always had more problems with identifying as female at all, I was always told my interests and personality wasn't feminine enough, and eventually I figured I was sexually attracted to women.
I don't think I was bothered by the idea of feminine beauty ideal at all, more by what kind of behaviour was acceptable.
If anything I would have preferred to look totally asexual, and I always liked it when people mistook me for a boy.

I just always dressed comfortably, and have never worn makeup.

(And I was still called a whore in highschool because my best friend was a guy)

 

[Illesdan]

36 year-old female. Have I ever worried about my looks: Never.

At a young age, being a tomboy and actively NOT interested in anything that was remotely 'girly', I figured 'why bother?'

I'll explain.

I have a very 'male' body-type. So much so, that 99.9 per cent of women's clothes DO NOT fit me. I've never much cared for make-up, and thanks to having eczema and cystic acne, I never have to worry about it. I'm mostly Native American with a good helping of Heinz-57, so I can pass for anything. I guess when I dye my hair blonde, I look European. Makes me laugh.

So, yeah, when you grow up your whole life hearing 'You're not desirable/cute/sexy/worthwhile unless you're an anorexic twig with an unhealthy amount of over-styled hair and breasts so large you'll throw your back out if you spin around too quickly, you kinda just take a look around you, take a look at what you got to work with and say; 'Well, this is what I am; if they don't like me, they can fuck off.'

Perceptions about this unattainable standard of beauty will never go away for one simple reason: It sells clothes, make-up, movies, plastic surgery, music and everything else under the sun. The media tells us every minute of every day that if we throw our money at the product of the day, we'll 'fit in' and, even though we weren't born 'perfect'; we can be closer TO perfect if we buy what they are selling. Personally, I'm happy with who I am, so, never needed what they were peddling.

 

[Roofstone]

If I am to speak very bluntly.. I am an A cup, american beauty standard is impossible and unachievable for me.

I do however try my best to look good, not by anyone else's standard, but by mine. I don't wear a lot of makeup, but I dress up nicely.

So no, I am not really that pressured, I just don't care.

 

[Yuuki]

Even here on the escapist you get people saying they like 'sexy' 'pretty' 'beautiful' girls/men, and it shames me that even in a community of intellectual pursuits we still hold such artificial concepts so dear.

Those "artificial concepts" are something very real that all humans have ingrained into them...it's a side-effect of natural selection.
Almost everyone is happy (or content) in seeing the idealized human. Putting aside that the idealized human is a perfect person in terms of behavior, knowledge, personality, etc...appearance is also part of that puzzle.

Yes, in current society that notion has been taken to extremes and we've strayed too far from our natural roots. But the notion of sexy/pretty/beautiful is absolutely not artificial, and merely praising/appreciating such things doesn't make a person any less intelligent.