XboxONE Criticisms...System, Gamers, and Media
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I'll just leave this video here.
Honestly, I don't like anything I've heard about the Xbox One. I'm mainly a PC gamer, but I do like to have consoles for exclusives. But I think if I bother with any next gen consoles I'll just go for the PS4.
Honestly, I don't like anything I've heard about the Xbox One. I'm mainly a PC gamer, but I do like to have consoles for exclusives. But I think if I bother with any next gen consoles I'll just go for the PS4.
Lucky for you, you won't be able to play any of them on the new Xbox, so you don't have to worry about that. Isn't that great?FoolKiller said:
I don't think that's how it works. Once you "own" it, you own it. In that scenario, both people would now have the game to play.
From what they said, it'd be tied to one account, and you'd need to deactivate it for someone else to use it. Then again, they're backtracking on that, so who knows how it'll go.Easton Dark said:
Oh no that'd be too ridiculous. Giving up the rights you had to play a game because someone else payed to take it away from you?KarmaTheAlligator said:
On one hand, this would make stealing games from people impossible, as microsoft could find it easily. On the other hand, fuuuuuuck that.
"You must plug in the Kinect and keep it on"
I currently have a kinect already (Paid $150 for it, thus never buying xbox products again, though have gotten it's use out of it and modded with it on pc for my indie company.)
Last night it picked up on my conversations, and when i tried bing searching "bismuth" it couldn't understand.
"look at my xbox, oh shit, oh shit it binged search shit, oh shit it won't quit searching bing search shit!"
type thing starts happening and takes up 5 min of your lifetime due to search errors.
I tried searching google, nothing came up, intentionally too by M$, interesting how it spelled it correctly though.
So if, and a big if, you are the fool to purchase this "upgrade", don't mind the heart beat monitor and big brother listening in to what you want to buy...so they can tax you for it.
I currently have a kinect already (Paid $150 for it, thus never buying xbox products again, though have gotten it's use out of it and modded with it on pc for my indie company.)
Last night it picked up on my conversations, and when i tried bing searching "bismuth" it couldn't understand.
"look at my xbox, oh shit, oh shit it binged search shit, oh shit it won't quit searching bing search shit!"
type thing starts happening and takes up 5 min of your lifetime due to search errors.
I tried searching google, nothing came up, intentionally too by M$, interesting how it spelled it correctly though.
So if, and a big if, you are the fool to purchase this "upgrade", don't mind the heart beat monitor and big brother listening in to what you want to buy...so they can tax you for it.
M$ plans on selling sexual voyeur videos to xvideos from everyone's kinect and xbox one's "always on to play" systems.
If I had a penny for every time I heard the graphics argument, as if it's something that EVERYONE cares about.McMindflayer said:
Good in theory, not always good in practice. Dilbert had one or two things about this. [http://dilbert.com/strips/comic/1994-04-24/]McMindflayer said:
Not dumb for having it, dumb for forcing it down people's throats.McMindflayer said:
When you HAVE to use the the voice or hand gestures instead of the remote, I assure you that the inability to use the remote will not be pleasant when your voice activation fails. You have a lot of faith in technology don't you?McMindflayer said:
Not everyone says it is easy, but thank you again for demonstrating why again computer is more preferable.McMindflayer said:
The 360 did have backwards compatibility when it came out, it was just limited until they could update it.
Don't see the point of your comment on the PS3.
When Microsoft lets a guy say effectively say "Only 5 percent of our customers care about Backwards Compatibility, so we aren't going to consider them" [http://blogs.wsj.com/digits/2013/05/22/microsoft-and-sony-diverge-on-gaming-cloud] and doesn't let them directly answer on the question about the Kinect being required. [http://www.penny-arcade.com/report/article/the-kinect-is-mandatory-and-cant-be-turned-off-welcome-your-new-motion-sens]
Something is VERY wrong with their PR.
This is still a major problem. They are making a video game system. It is important to show this functionality in a big way. If I am going to buy a Xbox One it will be for its ability to play next gen games. I already have something that can do everything else just as well. And even if I did not, it would be much cheaper to get another solution.Brockyman said:
Once again, I already have a solution in place for watching TV. It is called a TV. And guess what? I can, right now, leave my xbox on and go do something else and it will still be at the exact place I left it. All I need to do is change the input. I can already stream movies, I can already play movies, etc. The only thing the Xbox One will do that I cannot already do is play Xbox One games.
I get that these are nice additional features, but no one is going to buy the Xbox One for the ability to play TV. Everyone already has a highly effective solution in place. These highly effective solutions come free with a cable plan. It is a good feature to have, but it will not sell a $400+ system. It is not a good thing to base your entire reveal around.
And for people who can only afford one console the Xbox One is the worst possible console to buy, based on the current knowledge. Think about it: everyone already has a solution to do all these other things in place. The only thing a console really offers that everyone does not already have is the ability to play games. And by the look of it Microsoft is focusing elsewhere.
What possible reason can Microsoft have for not answering this question yet? It is simple. Presumably they know the answer and every day people get angrier about this issue. In fact, there are three major possibilities.
One (and least likely): They do not care about our concerns or opinions. We have made it known to them in no uncertain terms that this is important to us. But they respect us so little that they wont even bother to answer a single, simple question.
Two: Microsoft knows the answer to the question, but they also know that we will hate the answer so much that they are afraid to give it to us. In this case, they will try to build up excitement for the Xbox One before announcing the bad things like this.
Three (and what I think is most likely): Microsoft is testing out the water. They want to have the benefit of always online (strict DRM, the ability to crack down on used games, the ability to lock down the platform more effectively, etc.) but they are not sure what they can get away with. So they are throwing out the idea of connect once a day without being clear about it. That way if it looks ok, they can go ahead with it. If it looks bad, they can cancel the "feature" and claim it was never in the cards.
If possibility one or two is correct, our bitching is completely justified.
If possibility three is correct, our bitching and whining might actually have a positive effect on the system.
Basically, the smartest thing we can do about this is ***** and whine as loud as possible right now. By the time this is clarified it will be too late.
I will agree that this isn't a huge deal, but it does present two significant problems.
First, If the kinect breaks so does the rest of the system. Adding a new major point of failure is a big deal, especially for people with kids around. All it takes is for a two year old to wonder what the shiny black bar is while no one is looking and your system becomes a brick. Or maybe it will just break on its own. Microsoft has a very poor record when it comes to hardware failure rate.
Second, including a kinect will drive the price up. For those of us who do not care for kinect, we must pay extra for a feature we do not want.
Targeted advertising. Selling off the information on the fact that you said Mountain Dew 10 times to telephone marketing companies so they can pester you with their "great deals" incessantly. Basically, my current complaint isn't the 1984 scenario but the fact that such technology will result in even more bloody advertisements shoved down our throats, and no I do not for one second believe the industry is above it.McMindflayer said:
And no, it's not just inconvenience. Advertising is such a big business because it works. You may not be as susceptible for it, I may not be as susceptible for it, but it still makes people fork over money they don't have, buying crap they don't need, to impress people they don't even care about.
And sense all that vague "emotion" talk. MS picked up that "Graphics is emotions" thing and ran like it stole it >.>
See, I'm either too old or to practical to care about "Ooooo shiny new tech!". And besides, it's good for you to get off your ass sometimes, if only to throw a light switch.
Back in days of yore: "Shit, where's that guy again? Well, I suppose I better look hard for him, and who knows what exciting adventures I can get distracted by on my way!"
But hey, if you want your Xbox to play your game for you, that's your prerogative of course.
Win98 and Win7 are software. And with the right software, you can get those two games play on 7, anyway. You can get pretty much any game that ever existed on any platform play with the right software. Right the current gen emulation maybe isn't all that feasible immediately, but pretty much everything else.
Now when you're developing hardware for your next console, you're likely developing and improving upon something you already have. I'm inclined to believe that with that in mind, you have to go out of your way to exclude backwards compatibility.
You lost me as soon as you assumed that people who hate the Xbone's TV and Kinect focus are just out for the blood of casual gamers.
I have no problem with casual gamers, they've generated a lot of much needed income for the industry. I have a problem with motion controls because they never work precisely as advertised; no matter how good they become, you will never get the same perfect input from motion controls as you do from traditional handheld controllers or mouse and keyboard set-ups.
Even if the technology becomes perfect, people aren't, and as I believe was pointed out in ZP many moons ago, it takes a lot more focus to precisely move your entire arm in the desired motion than it does to press a button with your thumb. So, with that in mind, telling me I'd need to have a Kinect connected to this new console --implying it will be an integral part of the system-- instantly cost them a sale from me.
As for the TV part...I can pick up a freeview box for about ten to twenty quid. It has absolutely nothing to do with holding benefits for consumers on a budget, because if you don't have the money to spend on a set-top box you definitely don't have the money to spend on a $500 console and you also probably don't have the money to spend on an internet subscription and line rental all year round that you'll also need for the Xbone, (but which you don't need for TV boxes).
Microsoft are spreading themselves ridiculously thin across the board in an attempt to appeal to as many different people as possible and, while it may work in the short term, ultimately people buy consoles to play games on them and if you shut those people out or sideline them in any way, they're going to initially get pissed off but ultimately look for other alternatives.
I have no problem with casual gamers, they've generated a lot of much needed income for the industry. I have a problem with motion controls because they never work precisely as advertised; no matter how good they become, you will never get the same perfect input from motion controls as you do from traditional handheld controllers or mouse and keyboard set-ups.
Even if the technology becomes perfect, people aren't, and as I believe was pointed out in ZP many moons ago, it takes a lot more focus to precisely move your entire arm in the desired motion than it does to press a button with your thumb. So, with that in mind, telling me I'd need to have a Kinect connected to this new console --implying it will be an integral part of the system-- instantly cost them a sale from me.
As for the TV part...I can pick up a freeview box for about ten to twenty quid. It has absolutely nothing to do with holding benefits for consumers on a budget, because if you don't have the money to spend on a set-top box you definitely don't have the money to spend on a $500 console and you also probably don't have the money to spend on an internet subscription and line rental all year round that you'll also need for the Xbone, (but which you don't need for TV boxes).
Microsoft are spreading themselves ridiculously thin across the board in an attempt to appeal to as many different people as possible and, while it may work in the short term, ultimately people buy consoles to play games on them and if you shut those people out or sideline them in any way, they're going to initially get pissed off but ultimately look for other alternatives.
That's not what entitlement means.Brockyman said:
What you're describing is Discrimination, which is not interchangeable with "entitlement".
People, please, stop using "Entitlement" as this catch-all argument and shame-tool.
Yeah...some of this isn't entirely clear yet.
But some of it is.
Now, I'm with you on the 24 hour check thing in one way; calling a once-a-day check "always online" (as I've seen in some other topics) is foolish.
However, the Always-On or "Cloud processing" (this is the same thing dressed up in different terminology) is less ambiguous. We know how that's going to work.
http://www.wired.com/gamelife/2013/05/xbox-one-analysis/
To clarify and summarize:Wired Article said:
-The CONSOLE ITSELF is not Always Online. You can watch TV and play DVDs without needing a net connection
-Actual Games on the Xbone COULD BE Always Online at the whim of their publisher and Microsoft has provided the means to let them accomplish this innately on the Xbone.
This WILL lead to Always Online games on the system; Publishers have been clamoring for a feature like this for market control purposes, and now they have it. Microsoft didn't develop it just for yucks.
I'm reserving judgment on this until we know what relevant privacy settings (if any) are included with the Kinect 2.0 package.
This is important, because the Kinect RECORDS EVERYTHING YOU DO (audio and visual) as part of its functionality.
It's easy to see how that could be abused; especially if you cannot turn the fucking thing off.
Apart from that issue, yeah. I don't see the big the deal; whether it's "gimmicky crap" or not.
If you can ignore it, ignore it. If you can't, well, then you might be onto something.
That's not piracy.
Software Piracy is specifically about the creation of copies, not the sharing of copies.
Yes, there is a difference (an enormous legal difference at that). Yes, it does matter. No, there isn't a technicality you can use to argue for equivalency, and no, Similarity is not interchangeable with Equivalency.
So don't bother.
As for Used Games and Sharing...
This is one place that Micro$oft has been unclear about or have contradicted themselves on. They at least recognize this and say that information will be "forthcoming".
The article I linked says that the fee is for games that are installed. However, it's unclear as to whether all games will require installation and linkage to the account (based on how the rest of the system is arranged, I'm guessing all games need to be installed and Microsoft just doesn't want to admit that yet).
Backwards Compatibility is not guaranteed to be economically or technologically feasible depending on how hardware develops. You may have to end up "reinventing the wheel" every generation.Vegosiux said:
This is the reason why the PS3 is such an odd duck and why the PS4 is basically going to be a glorified PC (which runs on x86 architecture, like PCs).
Compared to the Wii, which has been aptly described as "Two Gamecubed taped together"; it uses the same architecture as the Gamecube did and was much closer in performance to the Gamecube than it was its competition.
(Every iteration of the Gameboy does this too, but in better controlled steps)
What is so hard to understand about how the economy works? Nothing is free. Ever. There is always a cost associated with extras. The required Kinect will cause the price of the "One" to be higher than it would have been without it. Your response betrays your ignorance of how prices work, and just makes your other points seem weaker and less solid to me.Brockyman said:
To play Devil's Advocate; while what you say is true, the console market works in part through pseudo-subsidy.TK421 said:
That is, it's a loss-leading scheme: Microsoft or Sony takes a hit on each console sold under the assumption that they will make up the difference quickly through software sales royalties and markup sales in secondary hardware (sometimes practically essential hardware labeled as "secondary', i.e., Sony's price-gouging for SD cards for the Vita and PSP).
The Kinect is essentially useless for core gamers, as it has proven to be a total dud for everything but silly dance games.
But it's unclear if Microsoft is throwing it out there by jacking up the price innately, or if they're taking the hit and including it to try and push more Kinect titles down our throat.
There's a compelling argument for either scenario because we don't know exactly how much the full unit costs from Microsoft's end.
Ultimately, it doesn't actually matter: If the market thinks the offered price is too high, regardless of what M$ has paid for it already, then they will suffer the same fate as the PS3 did during its first two years.
Congrats on the shit storm, OP. Glad to see that you are willing to dismiss and condescend people while opting for a "mature discussion".
So you ask why I'm not getting the Xbox One? I'll answer:
I borrow a lot of games from people; I buy games off of Amazon and eBay; I enjoy waiting for several months for $60 games to drop to $30 (the exception, of course, is when the game is so good that it deserves to be bought at full price). I doubt that I will be able to do any of this on Microsoft's new console. Not only will I have to pay a $60 fee for buying used games, but I doubt that the prices of these games will ever drop under this new system. Supply and demand: the supply is now infinite... what does that do to this economical system? Steam, Good Old Games, and many other online retailers handle it logically by having ludicrous sales, but I don't have faith that Microsoft will follow suit. I believe that they will go the Origin route and have everything be at full price all the time. That's my reason; Microsoft is highly likely to ignore microeconomics with this used games fee.
Why are other people upset?
-Some people don't like mandatory voice activated software. Many people prefer precise definitive and analogue commands to a potentially accidental voice command. Personally, I don't mind it as long as it is either perfected or if I have the option to shut it off and use analogue commands. One of those statements is not an option and the other one is highly unlikely.
-What if the Kinect breaks? What's its lifespan? How much does a new one cost? When your addon doesn't work, and your fully functional console is now useless, is that fair?
-We want specific and definitive answers on the required internet checkup. First we thought that it was going to have always online DRM; it took them until recently to disprove that claim. But now they vaguely stated something about daily check-up. What happens if I miss that checkup? What if I don't have an internet connection for three months? They answered a question with something that raises even more questions.
Why was the big reveal terrible?
-People buy gaming consoles for games. Other apps are nothing more than a side thought in the eyes of most gamers. This is because we already have appliances that utilize these other apps more cheaply and efficiently. The only advantage that an Xbox One has over my laptop and my television is that it runs Xbox One games. They should have gotten us excited about that but failed miserably.
-They missed their target audience. The target audience for a gaming console is gamers. The first thirty minutes excluded them entirely. And I'm not even going to touch upon how these features are going to work internationally.
I hope that satisfies your curiosity, OP.
Not sure if this has been mentioned anywhere, but i'm a little miffed that most of those people speaking on the stage have probably already seen the Xbox One Slim 1TB version, the only reason for it to be so huge is either ventilation (doubt it) or so they can sell a slim version later down the road.
Don't forget the unlucky people who were plagued with the constant 360 hardware failures. Sure someone may quote me stating their launch 360 works fine even today, but to me that means squat as I had to buy the 360 twice after the warranty faded and had 4 wireless controllers fail on me. 2 of those being from the limited edition gears of war console. We will not forget or forgive you for your shoddy merchandise microsoft. Ever.