15-year old Stabs Bully 11 Times at Bus Stop, Gets Away With It

[Arakasi]

The fact that he had the knife suggests either pre-meditation or knowledge that he was going to be attacked.
Technically, with that knowledge he should have contacted the relevant authorities

However, under the circumstances (i.e. him attempting to avoid the fight), based on souly the information provided, I believe the act was justified.

 

[SoetSout]

well i think all bullies need to see this thread and article.

Well I don't hold anything against you, I think that you probably did the right thing. The issue here is that people are saying that the 15-year old KID deserved to die, that is FUCKED UP. Sure, I can buy the argument that the 11-year old kid paniced and didn't know what he was doing. Sure, but why do people forget that there is a corpse laying on the ground and a mother crying at his gravestone. That's apperently not a problem to some people. Read assholes.

While i agree he doesnt necessarily deserve it, i don't feel pity. since he did keep pushing it. this wasnt something that started a week ago, it had to come a few months. But another thing is parents should know if their children are being bullied or are bullies. and intervene where necessary. not just for the other childs safety but for their own child safety.

Quickly look at the actual article.

In a nine-page document released Tuesday by the State Attorney?s Office, Brodie stated that by getting off the bus several stops before the location where the fight was to happen, Saavedra ?demonstrated that, with or without a knife, (he) had no desire to fight with Dylan Nuno.?

That is trying to avoid conflict, this kid didnt want a fight. he didnt seek it out. he just prepared for worst case and tried his best to prevent it from getting to that point.

Accompanied by several students, Dylan Nuno, a junior, followed Saavedra, a freshman, off the bus. He then punched him in the back of the head, according to court documents and testimony.

So the bully followed him while he was trying to avoid the fight, and punched him from behind. Which would make most people panic and cause a quick reaction.

The judge also highlighted that Saavedra would skip school or find other ways home to avoid the bus.

This was happening over a long period of time.

and another thing where does the 11 come from? the article says 12. wonder how many people actually read the article instead of just posting regarding comments.

Ive been bullied once and know how it can affect you. So from my personal experience i almost want to say he deserves it, but there are not just 1 side to a coin.

 

[Shycte]

well i think all bullies need to see this thread and article.

Well I don't hold anything against you, I think that you probably did the right thing. The issue here is that people are saying that the 15-year old KID deserved to die, that is FUCKED UP. Sure, I can buy the argument that the 11-year old kid paniced and didn't know what he was doing. Sure, but why do people forget that there is a corpse laying on the ground and a mother crying at his gravestone. That's apperently not a problem to some people. Read assholes.

While i agree he doesnt necessarily deserve it, i don't feel pity. since he did keep pushing it. this wasnt something that started a week ago, it had to come a few months. But another thing is parents should know if their children are being bullied or are bullies. and intervene where necessary. not just for the other childs safety but for their own child safety.

Quickly look at the actual article.

In a nine-page document released Tuesday by the State Attorney?s Office, Brodie stated that by getting off the bus several stops before the location where the fight was to happen, Saavedra ?demonstrated that, with or without a knife, (he) had no desire to fight with Dylan Nuno.?

That is trying to avoid conflict, this kid didnt want a fight. he didnt seek it out. he just prepared for worst case and tried his best to prevent it from getting to that point.

Accompanied by several students, Dylan Nuno, a junior, followed Saavedra, a freshman, off the bus. He then punched him in the back of the head, according to court documents and testimony.

So the bully followed him while he was trying to avoid the fight, and punched him from behind. Which would make most people panic and cause a quick reaction.

The judge also highlighted that Saavedra would skip school or find other ways home to avoid the bus.

This was happening over a long period of time.

and another thing where does the 11 come from? the article says 12. wonder how many people actually read the article instead of just posting regarding comments.

Ive been bullied once and know how it can affect you. So from my personal experience i almost want to say he deserves it, but there are not just 1 side to a coin.

The bully did wrong and there is absolutly no denying that, bullying may be one of the worst things that someone can do, but the thing is that bullies don't need to be bad people. People here is making the truth simpler than what it's, and I wonder what they would say if it was their kid who got knifed to death.

 

[Treblaine]

I think if you had just been stabbed enough times to leave you dying on the floor, you have enough energy to say that.

I really don't understand a law that allows you to kill someone and get away with it with no consequences.

Well it's a logical fallacy to say "I can't understand" as an argument that something is wrong or incorrect. Creationists don't (won't) understand evolution, that's because they have dogmatic thinking. You cannot use the "Chewbacca Defence" of acting like this is impossible to understand when it is quite clear.

It's quite simple: why should the law punish those who try to prevent criminal harm from being inflicted on them? Criminal harm in confrontation they did not provoke nor seek and tried to avoid. It is too much for the state to limit victims of violent crime to only defend themselves with non-lethal force.

This is NOT a licence to kill! Death is merely the often unavoidable result of the Necessary Force to defend oneself.

Even the Dali Lama has recognised and defended the right to use lethal force if someone is trying to maliciously harm you, as long as the intention is not to kill (though it may be an inevitable result of the force required). Others who understand and recognise the right to self-defence include the likes of Mahatma Gandhi and Nelson Mandella.

 

[kinapuffar]

One less bully in the world.

Decent human beings: 1
Pond scum: 0

This can be a good lesson for other bullies. "Bully someone and they can stab you to death without consequence. Want to avoid that? Stop being a fucking asshole."

 

[Use_Imagination_here]

Not self defense, as I doubt the guy was still standing and an active threat somewhere halfway. Neither do I subscribe to the silly American logic that you can just kill anyone who gets in your way. Besides, he brought along a knife with the explicit and only motive of committing murder upon that bully. It was pre-meditated

Don't assume I'm trying so imply anything other than what im saying, but doesn't the story clearly state that not only did he not want to fight him, he tried to run away after he attacked him?

Read the OP before posting.

 

[Use_Imagination_here]

So a bully assaults a someone, and he uses a knife to defend himself?

...Why is there an argument over this? If someone attacks you and your not a fucking black belt and you have a knife or any other means by which to defend yourself, is it not lawful and right to do so?

What should you do, let him beat the living shit out of you?

 

[zentario]

What should you do, let him beat the living shit out of you?

I think the most people can't imagine this type of needless escalation. They seem not to live in areas where this type of behavior is "usually" happening.

Why did the school, the community allow a 15y a) to "gang up" and b) to start harassing 11y olds? Where were the families here? I'm sure, there is now a wide discussion in this community how this escalated to this point. The mother of the dead boy is now big in victimization, as they always are, when their "good kid" got "a way too strong" reaction from people they harass for month, even years. Where was her judgment before?

It seems the 11y old had nobody to talk to, because its assumed that if you are bullied you have to take it out yourself? I would understand a 1:1 fight between seemingly fair built "fighting partners". But bullies never use this logic, because they "get it on" creating fear and spreading hate. They select someone who will not fight back, or, expecting no serious reactions. 2:1 or even 3:1 has started to have criminal implications in some countries. So I don't get the escalation.

I see the community, their families, at major fault for this escalation. Where I live, you do that "gang up thing" exactly one time. When you have to get up 2 hours early because no school in 2 hours range will take you with this attitude. Some kids start to think about their behavior, even the most sociopaths bully becomes "tame" when he returns from a two weeks stint at that "reception camp" (only cynics call it a school).

Knifing someone to a 2:1 or 3:1 is not much extreme. He had to expect long term damage. If the community can't give any other means to resolve this, then the judge was right: he applied the "logic" this community told the young boy to solve this.

 

[samaugsch]

Here's what I think:

I'm mostly siding with the kid here. Sure, he went overboard, but hey, the bully kind of had it coming. It probably would've been better if he had threatened the bully with the knife first before resorting to force, but people do irrational things when they're angry enough. I certainly wouldn't put what he's done in league with a killer who actively looks for innocent, defenseless bystanders. Just give the kid some counseling.

 

[gwilym101]

This is clearly a case of battered person syndrome. The bullied person could not comprehend when they were out of danger so just kept attacking in percieved self defence. People have done far worse than this under this syndrome.

 

[Griffolion]

There's so many unknown factors regarding the mental state of Jorge and how the bullying had affected him. Either way, something in him caused him to snap and act how he did.

Ultimately this situation is just so sad.

 

[wooty]

I would say going all out to kill someone over bullying is a tad extreme really, but I cant speak as to what extent the bullying went to.

Stabbings not the answer, but having been bullied in the past before and dealing with it in a slightly extreme way, even I dont really look forward to the day when I have to brandish this baby at scumbags again

Weapon of choice:-

[http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/221/cricket02.jpg/]

 

[senordesol]

Chill the fuck out. Go outside and take a sip of air, there isn't any reason to start getting worked up about it so take it easy okay? First of all, you don't know a fuck about me and please don't think you do. Okay? Stop jumping to conclusions about me, because this is the internet, and the thing about the internet is that you don't know shit about anyone.

Thing is, I'm not going to judge if it was self-defence or not, I don't think it's logical to stab someone 11 times because I'm pretty sure that the 15-year old kid who died wasn't exactly making much recistance after the tenth time. A judge in Florida said that according to U.S law it was self-defence so I guess we have to buy that. What I think should count as a reasonable amount of violence is another thing, don't mix those two up.

Here is the thing I'm annoyed by, people that said that the 15 year old kid deserved to die or that he had it coming. I'm not saying that you've said, but several people have. Somewhere in this world a mother is crying because her son were stabbed to death, I want people to remember that side of this coin.

I am one of those people who says he had it coming and I have a pretty specific reason why. If you go out of your way to terrorize a boy, particularly when he is trying to avoid you, and then assault him; you are demonstrating a very particular malice of forethought and willful disregard for your victim's soundness and safety. If this had been a bobcat he had backed into a corner, no one would have been the least bit shocked if he got mauled.

He not only sought a confrontation, he FORCED a confrontation, and if things had gone just a tad differently it could have very well been the victim's mother shedding tears for her dead or critically injured boy. There was no reason to attack the kid. NONE. There was no reason to chase him off the bus. There was no reason to punch him in the back of the head. Had he decided against any of that, he'd still be alive today. He made a series of senseless, violent, evil choices and wound up bearing the ultimate consequence of those choices.

If only the universe were so just in every case.

 

[Imperium9990]

Man I love justice. The most satisfying feeling ever. That kid killing the bully has made the world a slightly better place. I know my day has brightened because of it.

 

[TheVioletBandit]

I fully agree with the judges ruling. One must have a right to defend themselves against the threat of physical violence. In my high-school some bullies jumped a kid in the hall way, and during the struggle the victim's head hit the floor with enough force that it killed him instantly. There is no logical reason to assume you will not be killed or hurt during a fight, and so you have a right to meet your attackers with deadly force if necessary. This boy obviously tried to avoid the confrontation and when this failed he used the only weapon at his disposal to defend himself. I don't mean to sound callous but the bully sought out a physical confrontation and he got one.

 

[Negatempest]

Hmm. So Forest Gump being chased by a vehicle by a group of individuals with the sole purpose of doing bodily harm do not deserve retaliation if possible? The kid was 1 vs a group. It's already a handicap against his favor. We boo such moments when they appear on movies, books, and TV and are happy when they get their come-up-ins.

"He stabbed 11 times." And? What did you expect him to do being chased out of the bus by a group of individuals. Stab the guy once and "hope" he doesn't get the **** beat out of him by the other guys? Some of you tend to forget that the bully was not alone.

"But momma is gonna cry." Well I see a mother who did not pay attention to her child when he was an obvious douche to class mates in a physical way. So why pity a mother who seemed to not care about what her son was doing behind her back?

 

[BrassButtons]

But I personally would say 12 stabs is excessive for any fight.

Based on what?

Based on my personal opinion.

Yes, I got that this was your opinion. I'm asking why I should think your opinion is correct. If you don't have any data to support it (and at this point I think it's safe to assume you don't) then aren't you basically just making stuff up? You're declaring 12 stabs to be excessive, because you've decided, based on nothing, that it is. That's like if I declared that in my opinion snakes are mammals. Calling something an opinion does not make it correct.