70% of people in England hate their health care!
- Thread starter Crowser
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Last time I checked, the NHS is the most popular Government set up "thing" (the terminology escapes me) in Britain. Problem with the NHS is that it NEEDS MORE MONIES!!!!
France!?! Your having a laugh there. They've got one of the greatest health care systems in the world, the NHS is good, but the French system's in a whole other league! I seriously don't believe the french hate it.
I hate fox news...makes me sick to my stomach
France!?! Your having a laugh there. They've got one of the greatest health care systems in the world, the NHS is good, but the French system's in a whole other league! I seriously don't believe the french hate it.
I hate fox news...makes me sick to my stomach
I think British Comedian Marcus Brigstock summed it up perfectly with the NHS-bashers:
"People who complain that the NHS is a waste of money just...haven't been as sick as they would have liked to be. They haven't seen where their "hard-earned" taxes have gone, because they HAVEN'T been to hospital that much. And so, in this new year, I hope that each and every one of these ridiculous oafs get their money's worth down to the last penny by being as violently sick as the human mind can imagine, good night"
"People who complain that the NHS is a waste of money just...haven't been as sick as they would have liked to be. They haven't seen where their "hard-earned" taxes have gone, because they HAVEN'T been to hospital that much. And so, in this new year, I hope that each and every one of these ridiculous oafs get their money's worth down to the last penny by being as violently sick as the human mind can imagine, good night"
As an Englishman I've got to ask, where the hell are they getting their information from? An American writer once claimed if Stephen Hawking was British he'd be dead because he'd be left to the NHS but the thing is, he is British and says he owes his life to the NHS.
Weeell, when three people you know almost die of appendicitis, not because of complications but because they got to the hospital and had to wait 20 hours (minimum) on a bloody trolley, you can see why the healthcare system has a leetle promblem...
Wow. You watch Fox?
Anyway, that's BS. I know that's not your opinion and I agree that the media's portrayal of a dictatorial society in which nobody can work where they want (in other words, Socialism) is completely unrealistic. This is why everyone hates the American Government.
Anyway, that's BS. I know that's not your opinion and I agree that the media's portrayal of a dictatorial society in which nobody can work where they want (in other words, Socialism) is completely unrealistic. This is why everyone hates the American Government.
Just to clarify for that earlier poster, Cuba is communist, not socialist.
Socialism:The economic policy of having a government control certain sectors of the economy for the good of the people or having workers own the means of production.
Marxism:A worldview, not a form of government.
Communism:The total control of all economic policy by the government, usually taken over by a totalitarian dictator.
Fascism:The control of economic policy by corporations, usually involving racial hatred,nationalism, and extreme hatred of socialists and communists.
Socialism:The economic policy of having a government control certain sectors of the economy for the good of the people or having workers own the means of production.
Marxism:A worldview, not a form of government.
Communism:The total control of all economic policy by the government, usually taken over by a totalitarian dictator.
Fascism:The control of economic policy by corporations, usually involving racial hatred,nationalism, and extreme hatred of socialists and communists.
You beat me too it! YES, we Australians have a problem with our health care system but we don't want it scraped. We want it FIXED! We would NOT have this problem if health care funds, on all levels, where not being diminished to pay for other pet projects such as very long and expensive vacation for ministers, luxury vehicles and yet another pay rise. Not to even get into details about the wasteful 'military upgrade' plans and other crap Howard forced down our throats to please his foreign masters. Nor the stuff Rudd will force down our throats to do the same.Knight Templar said:
Without this funding hospitals couldn't expand to meet the population, hire more doctors without using third world rejects, or upgrade their equipment like they should of been doing. It should really say something when you live in a nation with world class medical research and training facilities, some even world leading, but you can't give any rewards for doctors to take jobs in rural areas, with much of Australia being rural, let alone stop them from going overseas to find more profitable places to work... such as Britain!
Then the politicians who caused this mess all use the devastation results as evidence that we need to scrap the system. Australians don't want it scraped as everyone who has looked at the US knows very well what system would go into place. We do NOT want our health industry owned by HMO's. Who would! We know it wouldn't fix the problem, just make another 'unofficial tax' we would have to pay on top of all the other taxes. One where we would have to pay, even if we can't afford to, or... well die.
Not the other American ones no.ffxfriek said:
I admit that the British NHS has it's flaws, but most of them lie with the people running the damned thing, surgeons in Britain work less that those from anywhere else in the world, and yet they get paid more. It's not a problem with the system, it's the people working in it. The NHS is the third largest employer in the world, and nearly 65% of those employees are admin staff, just purely paid to push papers. If the govornment stopped focusing on 'Employing more people' and more on 'Giving us a better standard of care, we might have more luck convincing other countries that it's a good idea.
You surely can't say that 'Free and equal healthcare for all.' is a bad idea in principle can you? It's a great idea, just poorly executed.
It shouldn't be the government and the taxpaying population to pay for an individuals lack of personal responsibility. Most medical problems are preventable by personal responsibility, and most medical problems can be treated by getting insurance. If you can't be responsible for your own health, or you don't pay to get healthcare, noone else should have to pay for it. The Government exists to protect against external threats and to enforce legal contracts, period. It does not exist to protect people against themselves, it's asinine to think that it's a magical entity than can fix any problem. If you're dying of cancer in a hospital due to your 3 pack a day habit, that's your own fault. There's no reason the government, which is funded by taxes, to pay for that. The Constitution guarantees the rights to life, liberty, and the pursuit of property, changed to happiness. Nowhere does it mention health, or wealth, or power. Everyone is in control for the most part of their own destiny, it's not the burden of the state to heal people who can't provide for themselves.
And honestly, have you ever waited in line at the DMV, or the Post Office? These are the people that will be in charge of the health care system. They get a government paycheck, they get very generous retirement, and they have the protection of the federal government. It's a bad idea. Universal healthcare will raise the cost of healthcare to the people already paying for it, who deserve it, and raise the cost to employers to offer it. If you can't afford it, you don't get it. Even in healthcare, it's not a universal guarantee, and it shouldn't be. A person shouldn't expect society to bear their burden.
And honestly, have you ever waited in line at the DMV, or the Post Office? These are the people that will be in charge of the health care system. They get a government paycheck, they get very generous retirement, and they have the protection of the federal government. It's a bad idea. Universal healthcare will raise the cost of healthcare to the people already paying for it, who deserve it, and raise the cost to employers to offer it. If you can't afford it, you don't get it. Even in healthcare, it's not a universal guarantee, and it shouldn't be. A person shouldn't expect society to bear their burden.
What this guy said. We British hate everything that's not perfect. And if everything was perfect, we'd be complaining how everything shouldn't be perfect.Spineyguy said:
You seem to be making some pretty erroneous assumptions here:Vern said:
1) Cancers are caused by people not living healthily. This is totally bogus. Smoking, drinking, using tanning salons, all these things INCREASE your chance of developing cancer. But, it's perfectly possible to develop cancer without doing any of these things. Background radiation, living or working in a building with asbestos (not such a problem any more, but still), passive smoking. You might smoke once and get lung cancer. Or drink once a month and get mouth, throat or any other type. You can't blame people for that kind of thing or say, "it's your fault, your problem, YOU deal with it".
2) Most medical problems can be treated by insurance. Ok, this is true. But even you point out that it only covers "most problems". So those people who slip through the cracks? **** 'em? They don't matter? Insurance companies do everything they can to avoid giving people treatment. They charge excesses for things that aren't covered if they deem them unnecessary: ambulance rides, for example. If someone gets severely ill and has to give up work, even if they had insurance their inability to pay premiums and excesses will pretty soon mean that their insurer will abandon them.
Essentially, your argument boils down to: it's not my problem. Don't ask other people to help solve your problems. Sick people screwed up. People without health insurance are irresponsible idiots.
None of these things is true. One day, it might be your problem. Most US citizens without health insurance have applied for it and been denied, often on flimsy ground. A lot of people get sick through no fault of their own, or single mistakes of the kind that everyone makes. Finally, insurance companies don't exist to provide healthcare, they exist to make a profit. That, more than anything else, is why the American system is morally abhorent and broken. The US is the only country in the western world having a serious debate about overhauling their medical system, because everyone else's works fine enough for them.
And this is why private health care is a false echonomy. The private sector only covers the people who get sick the least and shun those with problems. Thus, the people with the biggest need gets the worse, or no service compared to the part of the population that doesn't need as much healthcare.gh0ti said:
And, as far as I see it, thats why private health-care should be abolished since it can only lead to corruption, alienation and misery.gh0ti said:
Fox news apparantly did not conduct this sort of thing scientifically. And what's worse is that there are gulliable fools who believe them.
And for those of you interested, I even created a poll to see what Escapist members thought of their health care system. Most of the negative responses were from the US, wehreas no one in England, Australia, France, Germany or Canada said their health care system was bad.
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/18.136538?page=1
And for those of you interested, I even created a poll to see what Escapist members thought of their health care system. Most of the negative responses were from the US, wehreas no one in England, Australia, France, Germany or Canada said their health care system was bad.
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/18.136538?page=1
Dawwwwwwwwww!Chibz said:Crowser said:
My fox news says the complete opposite, and it is far more reputable, and reliable a news service.
Honesty, like the last hundred people on this thread have said, don't trust Fox! It's political propaganda because they fear a better 'socialist' world.
Anyway, here's a thought. Many people hate their police force. I wonder how people would feel if it was dismantled?
No. Extreme conservative ideology says the government exists to protect against external threats and to enforce legal contracts, period.Vern said:
In reality, democratic governments exist to enforce and support the things their population gives them a mandate to.