A few questions about Square-Enix

[oregondonor]

There's been a general consensus that the Final Fantasy series has, for a long time, been in decline, starting with FFX (this is particularly evident with the public opinion on FFX-2, FFXII, and FFXIII). Meanwhile, the games that came out on the Nintendo consoles are seen as timeless classics. So my question is this: do you think Sony has ruined Square-Enix?

Personally, I see Square-Enix's recent moves as an attempt to distance themselves from the company that's at least partially responsible for their downfall. They have yet to produce a PS3 exclusive, yet they HAVE made 360 and Wii/DS exclusives. Versus will likely be multiplatform and KH3 will probably be Wii exclusive. What do you think?

A final question, which is similar to my earlier thread about SE: could Nintendo or MS buy SE and make it a first-party developer? Both SE and either MS/Ninty would see it as a good move, in my opinion.

 

[Amnestic]

There's been a general consensus

The majority is not always right.

do you think Sony has ruined Square-Enix?

If that were the case, why would FFVII continue to be erroneously heralded as TEH BEST FINAL FANTASY EVARRRRRR!!!111!11?

KH3 will probably be Wii exclusive.

Bwahahahahahaha!

No.

Just...no.

 

[Miumaru]

Or maybe they just need to be more than pretty?

 

[Alakaizer]

Wow. Where to begin?

OK, first Square(soft) and Enix were two different companies, Square having FF I-IX, Chrono Trigger, Chrono Cross, and a few other things which I can't remember or don't know about. Initially Square was Nintendo exclusive until FF VI, when they switched to Sony exclusive for a while because Sony was using disc-based media.

Enix did games like Star Ocean and Act Raiser and more that, while good games, were never the behemoths that Square was pumping out.

Then, after FF X Square bought Enix (I think, don't have many facts here) and they shat out FF X-2, which is when the series' quality had officially dropped off a cliff.

These are of course a few facts dosed liberally with opinion, if any facts are wrong, feel free to let me know.

 

[SnootyEnglishman]

Do you something personal vendetta against Sony because now that your precious Halo has gone down the toilet and Final Fantasy is going strong?

People still bought the hell out of X, X-2, and XII because they like the story and the gameplay. It was the characters the brought upon the hate.

and don't even get me started on the success of VII the most iconic game of the series.

 

[PopeJewish]

Basically the deal is that after Enix bought out Square, nearly all of the talent left Square. People like Sakaguchi Hironobu (the guy who started and headed up nearly all of the pre-FFX final fantasy games) left to start Mistwalker Studios (Blue Dragon, Lost Oddysey, ASH, etc), and took a lot of people. Takahashi Tetsuya (xenogears guy) left to do Monolith (Xenosaga) and HE took a bunch of people. Finally Matsuo Yasumi (of Final Fantasy Tactics, Tactics Ogre, and Vagrant Story fame) left to do his own thing. There have been several other departures that slip my mind. But basically the only really talented Squaresoft person (as far as key guys) left at Squeenix is Nomura Tetsuya, who is famous for directing the Kingdom Hearts games and is currently working on FFvs13.

They all left for various reasons, but mostly because they were unhappy with how Enix was managing the company.

Wow. Where to begin?

OK, first Square(soft) and Enix were two different companies, Square having FF I-IX, Chrono Trigger, Chrono Cross, and a few other things which I can't remember or don't know about. Initially Square was Nintendo exclusive until FF VI, when they switched to Sony exclusive for a while because Sony was using disc-based media.

Enix did games like Star Ocean and Act Raiser and more that, while good games, were never the behemoths that Square was pumping out.

Then, after FF X Square bought Enix (I think, don't have many facts here) and they shat out FF X-2, which is when the series' quality had officially dropped off a cliff.

These are of course a few facts dosed liberally with opinion, if any facts are wrong, feel free to let me know.

couple mistakes here. First off, Chrono Trigger was Squaresoft AND Enix working together on a game.

Enix's biggest game series, Dragon Quest, wipes the floor with Final Fantasy in terms of sales.

Enix bought Square, not the other way around. And this is because as I said before, Dragon Quest is bigger (both back then and now) then Final Fantasy ever was or will be. (to put it in perspective, Dragon Quest 9, a DS title that's been released so far only in Japan, has nearly as many sales as FF13 sold worldwide on both X360 and PS3)

Squaresoft's first game on a Sony platform was FFVII, not VI.

 

[Alakaizer]

Squaresoft's first game on a Sony platform was FFVII, not VI.

That was a simple mistype, I know that FF VI was a SNES game. For the rest of it, I bow before greater research.

 

[Zetsubou-Sama]

FFX-2 still has the best gameplay of the series as turn based go.

 

[LightspeedJack]

Nah VII, IX and X are my favourite in the series.

 

[Steppin Razor]

Enix's biggest game series, Dragon Quest, wipes the floor with Final Fantasy in terms of sales.

Yeah, no. Just no.

Dragon Quest was last estimated at about 56 million or so copies and Final Fantasy was at 96 million. Final Fantasy is still very much the top of the food chain when it comes to JRPGs.

 

[More Fun To Compute]

They should do another game with the Last Remnant battle system.

I don't know what this platform warrior stuff is about. It makes more sense for them to release a title on PC/360/PS3 rather than any one of those at the moment.

They should also make a turn based Deus Ex game to irk the purists and because turn based RPGs sell much better than Deus Ex games.

 

[RivFader86]

If that were the case, why would FFVII continue to be erroneously heralded as TEH BEST FINAL FANTASY EVARRRRRR!!!111!11?

Because you could shit in a paper bag bag and they would still buy it and go "OMFG look at the graphics and it smells so awesome everthing else SUCKS" as long as you draw a face with big round eyes and spikey hair on it

 

[reg42]

Wait, if that's the general consensus then why are they still selling a fuck ton?

 

[Gindil]

If that were the case, why would FFVII continue to be erroneously heralded as TEH BEST FINAL FANTASY EVARRRRRR!!!111!11?

Because you could shit in a paper bag bag and they would still buy it and go "OMFG look at the graphics and it smells so awesome everthing else SUCKS" as long as you draw a face with big round eyes and spikey hair on it

Someone has been reading VG Cats. [http://www.vgcats.com/comics/?] XD

Well, we'd better get it together and answer seriously on the FF 7 question.

It came out when a lot of people were new to gaming. Having a console hit was needed for the PSX, and there's usually two things that move units. RPGs is usually one of them. So the first 3D experience with games fell to the new Final Fantasy series.

In the end, there will be massive debate on whether FF6 was better than FF7. Personally FF6 still rocks but that's another debate for another day.

Just some minor things:

Wow. Where to begin?

Enix did games like Star Ocean and Act Raiser and more that, while good games, were never the behemoths that Square was pumping out.

Correct. However, you also forgot to mention that Enix chose to keep their main series (Dragon Quest) reserved for Japan only. It worked for a time, but Square is the main influence in a lot of RPGing lives here in the US.

Then, after FF X Square bought Enix (I think, don't have many facts here) and they shat out FF X-2, which is when the series' quality had officially dropped off a cliff.

These are of course a few facts dosed liberally with opinion, if any facts are wrong, feel free to let me know.

Square made one HUGE mistake: Final Fantasy: The movie [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Final_Fantasy_(Movie)]

It flopped. It's also something that caused them to run to Enix's arms to recoup some of their losses. It was after this that their games went downhill. I'd just like to believe it was the straw that broke the camel's back. Square was known for having ideas fly around and new series coming from their developers. Very loose atmosphere. After Spirits Within, they went to more of a corporate culture that I believe strangleholds anything coming out. They pander to the fanbase for sequels to a franchise, when they don't need it, and damn near refuse to try anything that hasn't been proven. It's sad when you see a company fall.

Square fell after FF X.

 

[Amnestic]

Square fell after FF X.

As someone above said, FFX-2 had some of the best turn based combat of any FF game to date, with the combo and dress sphere system being both intuitive and interesting.

FFXII had its faults, but was generally okay if a bit slow at points and I think FFXIII was pretty damn good actually. I enjoyed it.

And FFVIII is still the worst FF in the post-FFVI era. Luckily they fixed some of their mistakes with IX.

 

[Korten12]

There's been a general consensus that the Final Fantasy series has, for a long time, been in decline, starting with FFX (this is particularly evident with the public opinion on FFX-2, FFXII, and FFXIII). Meanwhile, the games that came out on the Nintendo consoles are seen as timeless classics. So my question is this: do you think Sony has ruined Square-Enix?

Personally, I see Square-Enix's recent moves as an attempt to distance themselves from the company that's at least partially responsible for their downfall. They have yet to produce a PS3 exclusive, yet they HAVE made 360 and Wii/DS exclusives. Versus will likely be multiplatform and KH3 will probably be Wii exclusive. What do you think?

A final question, which is similar to my earlier thread about SE: could Nintendo or MS buy SE and make it a first-party developer? Both SE and either MS/Ninty would see it as a good move, in my opinion.

why would KH3 be a wii exclusive? first couple games are on Ps2, and only one game is on ds and the main one to the story is on psp. most likely it will be on ps3/360.

you could argue that Star Ocean the last hope was part of a series that was on ps2 but for 360 but it came out on ps3 after a while.

 

[NoElixir]

I'm sure Nomura wouldn't mind using the Wii for Kingdom Hearts 3. I like my PS3, but I think KH3 would fit perfectly with the Wii as well. Kingdom Hearts 3 doesn't have to be an exclusive title for the Wii though.