A (hopefully) mature discussion: Is it really okay to hate smokers?

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Cliff_m85

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Feb 6, 2009
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Is it ok to hate smokers?
Is it ok to hate anybody?

Well, certainly...but the reasoning must make sense. I'd say most people don't "hate" smokers but are just annoyed at the smell. I grew up with two parents who chain smoked. The smell got into all of my clothing so at school I was thought of as a smoker. I'm of the mindset that it's a disgusting addiction, entirely at the fault of the person who picks it up. I'm of the same mindset of that of alcoholism, it's the fault of the person who picks up the glass.


When you choose a hobby, some people are going to not enjoy it. The problem with smoking is that it becomes so easy to become used to the stench of tobacco that you forget that nonsmokers smell something a bit offputting. If you want to smoke, go for it, but if I move away from you when you're doing it then don't give me a dirty look plz.
 

Outright Villainy

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Jan 19, 2010
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It's silly to hate someone just for smoking.

In fact, the people that do make a big deal about fake coughing or pointing it out to every smoker they meet are the real dicks.

It's just a funny way society has come to reject it as completely abhorrent, when alcohol, the much more dangerous substance is perfectly fine to them. It's the hypocricy that's the worst.
 

UberNoodle

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Apr 6, 2010
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This is a bit of a carpet bomb on the subject. You can't hate the people but you certainly hate what they do. There's certainly enough reason to justify doing so. Smokers really need to take a step back from their pasttime and look at it in the context of the world, environment and the people around them, the majority of which do not smoke.

Look it's simple - smoking is a personal pasttime and as such other people should be able to ask smokers, when in public, to moderate themselves. Unlike reading a book, smoking has an area of affect. Many smokers will argue that the harm of passive smoking is 'unproven', but that is beside the point. Passive smoking certainly is not comfortable and making others endure it is certainly not considerate.

The standard response to this, that I get from smokers, is that it is 'equally inconsiderate' to infringe on their right to smoke. The thing is, I am not infringing on their right to smoke. They still have that right and are free to use it. However, just as we have a right to do a great many things but not in public or particular contexts, so too must it be with smoking.

It is illogical and downright stupid to impose a cut off before complaints or requests to stop are allowed. By cut off I mean the assertion that passive smoking must be 'proven' harmful or otherwise it's 'okay'. People have a right to smoke just as they have a right not to. People also have a right not be affected by other people's personal habits or pasttimes, within reason of course.

Many smokers have said to me that such complaints are hypocritical because those same people do not complain about car exhausts. That is a severe logical flaw. Cars are part of our society and are integral to its proper function. And yet of course people complain about exhaust fumes, but not much can be done about it directly. And it is against the law to drive a car that does not comply with regulations pertaining to air pollution.

There are laws pertaining to air and water pollution and laws pertaining to sound pollution. There are legal avenues for people who feel that their personal boundries in public are not being respected. If smoking were not an entirely personal and private and what's more, optional act; and smoke from the cigarettes did not cause surrounding people physical discomfort; I'm sure there'd be no debate. Smoke all you like.

Sadly, a great many smokers in the country I live in, partake in their habit in ways quite disrespectful of others and the environment. The footpaths are covered in butts, yet I'm certain many of those same smokers would balk if they saw somebody throw a can on the ground. I've seen smokers light up in the middle of a queue for a bus, right next to children and the elderly. Smokers amble down the streets leaving noxious clouds in their wake.

They appear to live in a world in which they are the centre, and they then get upset when other people say that 'NO', that world does not exist. Smokers take the entire act of smoking, and all that it entails, for granted. For them, I'm sure, being stuck in a small room full of smoke, or in a queue stuck in a cloud of smoke, is A-OKAY. Of course! They smoke! A majority of people do not, however, and it is unfair and plainly selfish to demand that they endure the by-product of other people's personal and private act.

Now, I'm bracing for a savage reprisals from smokers who'll skip through all I've said and only take from it that I 'must be' a person of incredibly arrogance, desiring to take away their rights. As per usual, I'll be lectured in all manner of Ad Hominem and Reductio ad Absurdum attacks. Usually, I'll be hit with something like, 'well what if you see a girl wearing a mini skirt and you are greatly offended - would you ask her to change it?' To that I would say no, I wouldn't. Obviously there are limits. If her mini skirt was covered in offensive language or imagery, then yes, I'd have grounds to complain. If she was dressed that way in a context in which such clothes were inappropriate, I'd also have grounds. The fact is however, to split hairs over these hypotheticals is absurd when clearly, its only purpose is to avoid discussion on the real issue.
 

Blue_vision

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Mar 31, 2009
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I don't generally hate smokers, but I do hate smoking, how it continues to present itself as a cool thing to do, and kills millions of people from its side effects. I generally have lower esteem for people that pick it up, but I certainly don't hate them, and especially not if they're suffering from bad addiction.
 

TheDarkestDerp

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Dec 6, 2010
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"How should we treat people who smoke? For those who don't smoke, how do you treat people who smoke, and why? For those who do smoke, perhaps you would like to share stories about how people treat you because of your smoking?"

Well, we all have nasty habits. We all do self-destructive things. Finger-pointing doesn't really accomplish much besides division. This all taken into consideration, much like any other preference, as long as it's not affecting me and mine, ie 'I have to breathe in someone else's smoke' I see no reason to care. Geddown whitcha bad smokin' selves. It's their life, their decision, if they want to quit badly enough, they will, if they don't they won't.
 

s0p0g

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Aug 24, 2009
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thaluikhain said:
Hatred is a strong word, but it's quite understandable.

Smokers are putting an immense burden on the health system, which is both very important and under pressure as it is.
precisely this. i don't care for the smell as i can stand aside, and as long as they don't breathe their smoke into my face. if i'm at a smoker's home i have not much of a right to criticise them (beside the point that there is a high probability that they are going to cost me a large ammount of money (cancer treatment is so effing expensive; cytostatica, highly potent analgesics, oxygen, medical doctors and nurses,...)) for no other reason than their pleasure of smoking (at best; if they become addicted after having started smoking because they somehow felt forced to do so to be cool, it's even worse. i guess.)

reminds me a bit of that thread about those girls who drove drunk (!) on a snowy (!!) road and now have to undergo expensive medical treatment - and people collect money for them (duh? own fault?)

BUT (there's always a "but", isn't there?): i'd really miss the smoke at the local bar. if i enter a bar and can clearly see the other end of it, something's missing. then again, if people never smoked at all, i wouldn't know about the improvement of the local bar's atmosphere by smoke, and thus i couldn't miss it. BUT that's all hypothetical now, right? so what gives.


someone mentioned fat people; that's hardly the same, as there's a fair amount of genetic influence on how their metabolism works. and one needs to eat, otherwise you die. as far as i know the same cannot be said about smoking.
 

Baby Tea

Just Ask Frankie
Sep 18, 2008
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Kpt._Rob said:
TLDR: How should we treat people who smoke? For those who don't smoke, how do you treat people who smoke, and why? For those who do smoke, perhaps you would like to share stories about how people treat you because of your smoking?
I treat people who smoke like any other person, and that's how they should be treated.
Hating smokers is just stupid. But, I think smoking as a habit is beyond stupid. I don't hate people who smoke, but it's for sure a dumb habit to pick up. It's their right, of course, to smoke all they want. Just don't be irritating about it.

That goes with most any habit/activity, though:

- Talking on your cellphone in public? No problem.
- Being an irritating douche-bag on your cellphone in public? Shuttup and get lost.

- Giving your girl/boyfriend a little kiss, or holding hands in public? Fine.
- Making out while sprawled on a picnic table or park bench or on the bus or something? Knock it off.

And so on and so forth.
The thing about smoking is that it's potentially harmful to people around the smoker. Aside from long-term exposure issues, there are plenty of people who are allergic to cigarette smoke.

Bottom line is: If someone wants to suck tar and nicotine into their lungs and kill themselves, well fine. I'm not going to treat them like some pariah for it. The habit is just retarded, but the person is still a person. Just don't smoke in my car, in my house, on my property, or be an inconsiderate, irritating douche-bag when you DO smoke. You're a normal person who smokes? Fine. You're a loud jerk who thinks that because they are smokers they are entitled to some special treatment, or that they are martyrs for some unseen cause? No. Go away.
 

Mr Pantomime

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Jul 10, 2010
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This reminde me of the non-smoking ads they have in my country. Pretty much some b-list celebs telling people to shun and abhor smokers. Its all dressed up, but thts pretty much what it is.

Personally, I dont mind smokers, but dont like being near them when they smoke, second hand smoke and all that
 

Dumori

Dumori(masoddaa)
May 28, 2010
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I've not read all the posts above me so if the opic has shifted slightly I'm sorry.

I have no problems with smokers or being around them. Though I can say some brands of cigeretts are plan offensive to the nose. I've never smoked anything my self as I tend to find large amounts smoke in my lungs disturbing. I do recall at one point having a nicotine addiction from second hand smoke. As I would crave to be around my smoking friends. While this is half explainable due to said friends being awesome. The fact they smoked(one of them extremely heavily) was also a factor in retrospect.

As for second hand smoke if inhaled in identical quantiles could be just as bad for you but in reality I've never been in a room so smoky that would be the case and I've been in very smoky rooms. It's an issue and it effects people around you but it is most certainly hyped up. Much like how people say video games make people murders the idea that any second hand smoke is going to damage you is at best a miss representation of data. I noticed one poster said he avoid smokers from fear of their own health I find that most irrational(unless they are heavily asthmatic or such but they didn't say so) if smoking was that dangourus no one would do it. As the negative effects would be really prominent. You start smoking 1-6 months later you'd likely be dead if a wiff of the stuff could significantly effect ones health more than the pollination in the air due to industrial activities and traffic.


In conclusion I just don't see this smoker hate. I do some times cough in the presents of smokers but if I do its a real cough not some faked gesture to show my disdain.
 

paladork

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Dec 7, 2010
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I grew up with most of my family smoking and quite honestly, hate is one of the last things I feel for smokers, but rather pity that they can't kick their habit. Almost every smoker I know has expressed how much of an awful and disgusting habit it is and to never pick it up. I do agree that I hate the habit of smoking cigarettes, but never smokers. My family came from rural South Dakota where it was just a common place thing most people did and most people didn't really know better.
 

clipse15

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May 18, 2009
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s0p0g said:
thaluikhain said:
Hatred is a strong word, but it's quite understandable.

Smokers are putting an immense burden on the health system, which is both very important and under pressure as it is.
precisely this. i don't care for the smell as i can stand aside, and as long as they don't breathe their smoke into my face. if i'm at a smoker's home i have not much of a right to criticise them (beside the point that there is a high probability that they are going to cost me a large ammount of money (cancer treatment is so effing expensive; cytostatica, highly potent analgesics, oxygen, medical doctors and nurses,...)) for no other reason than their pleasure of smoking (at best; if they become addicted after having started smoking because they somehow felt forced to do so to be cool, it's even worse. i guess.)

reminds me a bit of that thread about those girls who drove drunk (!) on a snowy (!!) road and now have to undergo expensive medical treatment - and people collect money for them (duh? own fault?)
Again like I pointed out before Cigarette tax money goes into the health care system so no you are not paying for there medical treatment
 

Kanatatsu

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Nov 26, 2010
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My attitude toward smokers is a combination of disgust (foul habit) and a lack of respect (re the addiction itself).

I don't think it's a stretch at all to say that smokers are generally more selfish (putting others at risk with their habit), weaker willed (having the habit in the first place) and less hygienic than non-smokers ... so it's pretty easy to develop strong feelings of antipathy toward them as a group.
 

Kyoufuu

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Mar 12, 2009
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I just wish they would realise that once you drop a cigarette on the ground, no, it does NOT, in fact, disappear.
 

Arcane Azmadi

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Jan 23, 2009
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Ugh, I WAS going to make a lenghty post about my thoughts on smoking, but then I realized I was going to end up getting wound up, making a lot of very strong statements and probably getting whacked by a moderator who doesn't like my tone. So I'll just keep it short and sweet and say I hate smoking, dislike smokers and hold them in utter contempt. They're universally selfish and, if not stupid, then at least incredibly thoughtless.

Now don't ask me to justify that, or I'll be here all day. It's a very touchy subject for me.
 

Negatempest

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May 10, 2008
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After a few years of eternal thought, there is no logical reason whatsoever to hate smokers or for others to be "harmed" from their smoke. Is it like fire smoke? Sure it is, but your looking at something like a pin needle size smoke compared to a roaring fire. Is there "statistics"? Sure there is, just like there is "statistics" for how harmful video games are to play. Like we say, in moderation is the best. If your face is in a smokers face for YEARS day in and day out than i'm sure you'll get physically sick from it. But a single smoker outside in the open, no...no you won't get harmed in any meaningful way.

So yeah, hating smokers is actually nothing more than a witch hunt, it's pretty damn sad.
 

Angerwing

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Jun 1, 2009
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There's a time and a place. I've personally enjoyed a smoke from time to time, but you need to be considerate.

Smoking at a restaurant? Dickhead.
Smoking at a bus stop? Dickhead.
Smoking where it's crowded, and people don't really have a chance to avoid the smoke? Dickhead.

Smoking isn't inherently bad at all, but people need to use a little tact and courtesy while smoking.
 

Gigano

Whose Eyes Are Those Eyes?
Oct 15, 2009
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Without a group doing discernible harm to others, it's unacceptable bigotry to hate it.

Smoking does have adverse health effects, so I'm all right with asking them not to smoke in public buildings, just like I'm all right with asking people to keep their clothes on in public; doesn't mean I hate nudity as a concept though.

Outdoors or in their own homes, smoking harms nobody, and thus cannot reasonable be condemned. It might have some detrimental effects on the smoker himself, occasionally leading to health problems which are costly to treat under free health care, but who can seriously say they've never done anything unnecessarily unhealthy or taken any unnecessary risks? If you're going to have people for doing unhealthy things, then you damn well better be perfect in all aspects of health and safety (in which case I pity you for presumably being unable to enjoy life)
 

Verlander

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Apr 22, 2010
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I hate smoking, not smokers. Anyone who goes through life hating other people is wasting their lives. If you don't like smoke, don't be around it. If you ahte smokers, don't befriend any. It's that simple
 

Phlakes

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Mar 25, 2010
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Smoke all you want, just not near me. I don't want to share the consequences for your choices.