Are games getting dumber?

[TerraMGP]

be it about the nature of humanity or what kind of a road we're heading down.

The nature of humanity is a question for psychologists not artists. More often than not artists have gotten it wrong, true this is because we didn't know much about human nature at the time but then all the more reason we shouldn't be filling our stories with musings on it, The ignorant should not speak with authority.

The problem is that modern games dont' focus as much on the particulars of Story or mechanics as often anymore.

True.

Instead of borrowing verbatim from Tabletop games or writing systems that have similar rule complexity

Complexity is not a virtue, but a flaw.
Depth is a virtue, they are not the same.

we have to 'balance' everything so people don't cry about it and say something is not fair.

Chess, MtG, Poker. Two of those are balanced, one of those strives to be balanced. Balance creates depth, without balance one creates meaningless choices and newbie traps, both of which are bad game design.

But if you take Balance too far then you sacrafice creativity. Just look at RIFTS, it is very unbalanced and yet balanced in a way, and the end result is quite fun once you learn the particulars. Balance is important to a point but when that becomes your ultimate goal you lose sight of the freedom of choice. People are always going to min max things on the tabletop and they are always going to strive for the absoulte 'best thing' in games, but what game designers no longer do is make it so there is a reason not to do so, or imply that any path other than the one that gives you the maximum yield for minimum effort is fun.

Balance is a tricky thing and too much will spoil a game totally. You kind of pointed that out when talking about chess and poker. These games are balanced yes but relativly simple when stacked up against the mechanics that most people desire or demand from games. I personally consider this a good thing. The more complexity you wish to add the more balance you have to give up, so in a sense you have to balance balance.

 

[hellthins]

be it about the nature of humanity or what kind of a road we're heading down.

The nature of humanity is a question for psychologists not artists. More often than not artists have gotten it wrong, true this is because we didn't know much about human nature at the time but then all the more reason we shouldn't be filling our stories with musings on it, The ignorant should not speak with authority.

Whether or not you think artists should touch on what makes us humans, they do and that is often what helps solidify a story as a classic, that it makes us think about such things. Art is as intellectual as it is emotional when it is done right. And whether or not we know for certain never means we shouldn't muse. If some one doesn't pose the question, then we will never get the answer.

 

[thenuminator]

lots of my friends agree their is a definite lack of inivation in the gaming market. its because of componys like EA who who make billions a year on recycled ideas. and every body who tries something different usually dosent meet much succses

 

[Iori Branford]

No.

story higher than gameplay

As said, you are throwing out good meat because it hasn't your favorite seasoning on it.

 

[J-Man]

No.

story higher than gameplay

As said, you are throwing out good meat because it hasn't your favorite seasoning on it.

Uhm... do you consider Halo, perhaps the most commercially successful game yet, to be thought-provoking or have a rich story? You may think I'm throwing out good meat, but all I'm asking for is some lobster with our daily portion of gruel.

 

[hellthins]

No.

story higher than gameplay

As said, you are throwing out good meat because it hasn't your favorite seasoning on it.

Uhm... do you consider Halo, perhaps the most commercially successful game yet, to be thought-provoking or have a rich story? You may think I'm throwing out good meat, but all I'm asking for is some lobster with our daily portion of gruel.

Name a game with a really good story that was popular at its time. I'll even let you say Final Fantasy 7.

And to start you off with modern and popular games with good stories, Half-Life, Portal, Bioshock, GTA IV, and I'll even say Call of Duty 4.

 

[Anton P. Nym]

Uhm... do you consider Halo, perhaps the most commercially successful game yet, to be thought-provoking or have a rich story? You may think I'm throwing out good meat, but all I'm asking for is some lobster with our daily portion of gruel.

Says the guy with the Team Fortress 2 userpic. Deep, meaningful story there...

(And yes, I do find Halo thought provoking... and though the in-game story is not in itself terribly deep, the back story of the series (as revealed by incidentals in the game and by fiction in the novels and on its website) is very rich and holds a great many themes surrounding the use of power, the dangers of dogmatism, and the hazards and necessities that come from posessing free will.)

-- Steve

 

[Deegh]

Unfortunately the games are getting worse, but it's nothing we can really change. And as many people have pointed out they are fun so why change it?

Is that the most we gamers can aspire to? Fun? Are we not intelligent enough to demand a proper story or a beautiful game, without yelling about how awesome 'last stand or martyrdom' is?

Most game companies don't care. Though personally i would love for them to make a game with a great story, action, adventure everything the old games had. Unfortunately today's gamers have changed, so even if we demand a better game the companies just won't listen.

 

[Flaming budgerigar]

I agree. They should get their act together.

 

[SteveDave]

I wouldn't call crysis that succesfull.

 

[Iori Branford]

No.

story higher than gameplay

As said, you are throwing out good meat because it hasn't your favorite seasoning on it.

Uhm... do you consider Halo, perhaps the most commercially successful game yet, to be thought-provoking or have a rich story? You may think I'm throwing out good meat, but all I'm asking for is some lobster with our daily portion of gruel.

I don't know shit about Halo's story, and I don't care. At least it remembered to actually be a game and follow good video game design principles that "intelligent game" developers are apt to forget about because they can't quit jerking it to their grand literary masterpieces or their cliff-like n00b-killer learning curves or whatever.

There are good "intelligent games" because they, too, remembered to be games.

 

[Hunde Des Krieg]

Games are for fun, dawg.

And to answer your question, no. Because well, when I was a kid I played Earth Worm Jim.

I know games are purely for entertainment, but does that mean they can't have a good story or be intelligent?

It doesn't mean they can't, it just means a lot of them won't

 

[Bulletinmybrain]

Is it just me, or is the gaming industry going in a steep intelligence decline regarding the content of their games? Let's have a look at some of the most recent commercially successful games:

1.Call of Duty: World at War
2.Crysis
3.Far Cry 2
4.Left 4 Dead


1.In which you run around shooting everything that moves. No brains, only skill is required.
2.As above.
3.Some of the worst story I've seen in a game, and you kill literally everybody in the end.
4.In which you run around shooting infinite amounts of zombies.

While these games can be undeniably fun, what happened to the games that required brains, or prioritised story higher than gameplay or graphics?

What about Psychonauts, which had the best story and central idea of any game I've ever played. What happened to Deus Ex, which consistenly comes in the top 5 of PC Gamer UK's top 100? What about Monkey Island?

These are the games I talk about when I discuss the best games I've played, and how come I can't think of any recent releases that are just as good as them in story or style?

By the way, feel free to disagree with me.

STALKER, Fallout 1&2, Civ4, MGS4 on the high difficulties.(Really on Big Boss Extreme if you get into a fight you will most likely die seeing as how being a old man on a battlefield is quite hard.)

 

[Deadarm]

They arent getting dumber, all the Doom games were like that way before any of those 4 games were even thought of. Also they were funner 'n hell. (Yes I know that ain't a word but ain't is a word even though this is the first time I think I've ever used it outside of actual speech.) Besides if you want a smart game go play something like Chess or Hexen (it may be onld but its actually pretty puzzly) or Splinter Cell.

 

[hypothetical fact]

Games aren't getting dumber, devs just want to aim for the most profit which means dumb people.

 

[Shiki101]

NO there arent getting dumber. The companies just are getting lazier and dont want to stretch out to find new things to do. They just tweak the ideas of the previous games and sell it as something new.

 

[MeTheMe]

Hmm, well, I don't think they're getting dumbeer in general, but there are a few games that make me feel a little stupid. The most recent has been Tales of Symphonia 2. Almost five minutes after a character said something, they were going to a flash back of them saying it, and now have the flash back occuring again and again. It's making me feel stupid that they think I wouldn't remember it.

 

[klaypeeple]

I agree with the OP:
It seemed to me the longer I have been playing games, the less lasting fun and charm they possess. But I don't think we're just out of ideas, I just think things have gotten so immensely complicated on a technological basis, that we've lost the things that really matter. Let me elaborate...
I'm old... Unlike a majority of gamers, I come from the "oldest" school. My first video games came on a system called "Intellivision"; a clunky yet simple game system. But my most cherished years were spend playing the NES, basically from inception until demise, and then add a few years. From then I've owned atari, SNES, gameboy, sega genesis, N64, PS1, PS2, psp, xBox360. But with the NES being my favorite of all game platforms, I'll use it as a reference point to the games we have today.
Back in the 8 bit world, programming was simple. Graphics were simple. Music was simple. Think of all the energy/resources/manpower that goes into things like physics engines, billion color GPU, Three-dimensional collision detection, character and atmosphere rendering, full orchestral soundtrack, surround sound... basically; Realism. None of that existed in the NES days. They didn't need hundreds of staffers to try to collaborate on these massive undertakings 25 years ago. They had 20 guys in an office; one guy at a midi keyboard banged out the entire soundtrack. Three or four guys drawing out the story and level layouts. A few here and there to type in code and test. And the obligatory coffee-boy.
Most of the development dollars put into games today are just to keep the sights and sounds as cutting edge as possible. Gameplay and story are all but forgotten. Also your character can't just have directional, jump, and shoot. No you've got to duck, crawl, dive, strafe, scratch your arse, handle an inventory that can fill a garage, look around in 360 degrees, chew gum, smoke cigarettes, call your mum, and bleed in 96 different shades of red. Instead of trying to produce something new and whimsical, they just take something that's already been a success, add a few bells and whistles, paint it a different color, and pawn it off as something new. We'll never see anything as groundbreaking as a Mega Man 2, Shadowgate, Adventures of Lolo, Faxanadu, Crystalis, A Boy and His Blob, Star Tropics, or Dragon Warrior. Just to name a few.
They were simple "Move and Action" games that gleaned every bit of creativity and imagination from the limitations of the technology at the time. Games back then were only competing on having the most compelling story and gameplay, and you know what, that's what matters most to me when playing a video games. We've lost our beloved roots.
(Thanks guys now I feel old)

 

[Copter400]

I don't think we are currently living in a world where someone can have this background and add up numbers in that pastime and be able to get crystal-clear evidence that everything is sliding into oblivion.

So no, games aren't getting dumber, especially since everyone has different opinions.