Are games getting dumber?

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SunoffaBeach

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Sep 24, 2008
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Only games give you the oportunity to have no brain and no skills and still save the world.

Seriously, you can still find smart and challenging games today, maybe more than ever.

But dumb entertainment rules. Just like in books and TV and music etc.

I think it's not the games that have changed, it's you!

+1 for the indie scene.
 

jamesworkshop

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Sep 3, 2008
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I dont really agree games requiring Intelligence are few and far between scattered across the years I don't think a linear time scale can really be applied,
 

GenHellspawn

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Jan 1, 2008
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If I want story, I'll read a book. There's already about a million of them in existence, and most of the authors of said books actually do a good job of telling a story.

To me, story in games is just a cool little extra: it can make the experience better, but the lack of it isn't a real deal-breaker. I think it just detracts from the most important part of making a good game: the good game.
 

SimuLord

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Aug 20, 2008
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I know it's beyond the ken of most posters on this forum, but have you seen the complexity they've been putting into sports games lately? Baseball games, for example, used to be Pong-like in their "avoid missing ball for high score" mechanics, but these days there's "swing zones" and all kinds of management-sim elements with your franchise and touch pitching with an AI that adjusts to what you're throwing and starts sitting on a fastball when it knows you're going to throw one...

Football games used to be "choose one of four plays and hope the defense didn't guess which one you picked." Nowadays, as EA puts it, "if it's in the game, it's in the game" and the realism can be downright overwhelming. That's not to say you can't beat an AI opponent with cheap plays (EVERY sports game has money plays, it's an immutable law of the universe, and I once won a national championship in NCAA Football by running exactly one play over and over all season long), but the level of realism (and thus the level of thought you have to put into it) is through the roof.

There are plenty of mindless shooters and frat-boy games, but most of the games that are derided by the nerds as "frat boy bait" are as complex as you like it if you actually pop the hood and have a look inside the game's mechanics. I have my own theories about why "hardcore" gamers hate sports games, and I think it has mostly to do with ignorance of the nuances of the sports depicted (so it only looks like a trained seal act with throwing a ball through a hoop when in reality there's a lot more to it.)
 

blunted

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May 9, 2008
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Yes. games have been getting dumber ever since they started including the mandatory tutorial that always begins with "push left analog stick to move"
 

mooncalf

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Jul 3, 2008
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Considering we're stemming out of roots like PONG, no - games are not getting dumber.

I'm of the opinion that the more games you play, the more apathetic you become towards new games and begin viewing games of the past as residing in an enshrined and untouchable golden era.

When discarding the bathwater of the hype surrounding a game (fair critique), try preserving the goodness of the games.

I don't know three of your examples, but L4D should be taken a bit like portal, it proves a technology (AI Director) which is unique and special, even if it keeps things simple.

I will always treasure that game for the zombie which ran into a lampost - head snapped back and leg snapped forward - after I shot it in an unscripted moment of Z-movie black comedy perfection.
 

lee99

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May 28, 2008
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I disagree with Left 4 dead (yes im kinda of a fan boy) the game requires alot of teamwork and cooperation between each other to survive especially in harder lvl's half of the bosses emit a negative effect when u shoot them (smoker = smoke screen, boomer = vomit , witch : insta kill if she gets you) making u think before u shoot them.
With the other games i agree you just shoot anything that moves and farcry 2 was a horrible
game.
Games do feel like they are starting to numb down a bit.
 

xitel

Assume That I Hate You.
Aug 13, 2008
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Well, they're getting to be a different kind of intelligent if you ask me. Instead of he waiting and thinking that they used, people want to be more active. It still uses your brain, that's obvious, but it uses reflexes and intuition rather than intelligence and thought. Then again, commercially successful games do not make up games in general. There are plenty of less than popular games that have come out that force you to use your brain like Mirror's Edge, where you have to make judgements about your path, where to run and when to jump, when to run and when to fight.
 

Silver

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Jun 17, 2008
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To repeat the mantra of a dear friend of mine, the more advanced we become, the more limitations are put into place.

Yes, many old games were awesome, and really deep, and beautiful, but would they work today? I personally loved the dialogue in Fallout 1, or Arcanum, or whatever.

But today, would it work, technically? Players would demand talking heads for every important character, and voice acting for almost all of the dialogue. The amount of dialogue in any of those games are staggering. Recording it all, and animating the dialogue today, even creating the models for all the npcs in game (unless you use the Half-life way, with about 10 models!) would take so long most people wouldn't even dream of trying. It's not doable anymore. Sad perhaps, but true.

I mean, look at it. If you want to create a scene, a village, of 300 people, 50 of them have their own personality, and each of them have opinions on all the quests you do, and there's five ways to solve each quests, of which there are hundreds, how would you do it? If we look at the simplest engine ever made, a text-based game. That takes maybe a month of concentrated work (the village, not all the quests). In that month, you have created a situation where you can fight the whole village, you can save it from a dragon, you can kill the dragon and the village, leave the dragon to kill the village, or tame it, and make it the guardian of the village.

If you try the same in a 2D engine based on sprites, you can still make it pretty easily. It takes maybe a year instead though, but you can reuse a lot of the graphics.

Try to make it in full 3D today though, with full audio recordings of all the dialogue, with custom models for all the npcs, with several different solutions for the quest, and several models of every npc and building (burned down, broken, killed, alive, rebuilt) and make the different versions of the dragon, the newly built dragon lair, and you're looking at 5 years of concentrated work.

Sure, we've got amazing graphics these days, technical graphics, and we've got really pretty audio effects, and the immersion can be good (it's not, since most games these days suck though). But as we gain this, we lose a lot of other stuff. As we get more advanced engines, they also become more limited, and harder to work with. Sure, what they can do they do well, but they don't really do well with new stuff.

Look at the size too. The first example is 100 kb, the second example is maybe 200 mb and the third example is 5 gb.

Some people, mostly people who have gamed for a long time, can accept the old way of making games, and some indie developers still make games that way. They can be found. But the mainstream, the regular gamer, while nostalgic, couldn't accept a game like that these days. It's again sad, in my opinon, but there's not much we can do about it.

Well, except try to make such games yourself, but let me tell you, and this is from experience, it's BLOODY hard work. It's hard enough to make a simple, linear game today without a huge budget and a big team, trying to make something interactive and cool and stuff, that takes effort. A lot of it.




However, when someone puts Half-life 2 forward as an example of an intelligent game, I am inclined to agree about the decline in gaming. I don't think I've ever played a more shallow, boring, linear game.
 

MSORPG pl4y3r

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Aug 7, 2008
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I'm reminded of the "In group Out group" theory. Its like high school trends, there all the rave for a while then sudenly everyones after somthing else let me show this as an example: when games were new side-scrolers were the most popular and most commen, then point and clicks, then RPGs, then third person action, And now were plonked onto FPSs (I blame halo in hind-sight) and that was ok for a while but now the gamers with brain want somthing else, I think that in time somthing inexplicably popular will apear and every one and every thing will like it for a few years and then it will be gone to be rememberd as "the good old games" until then just stick to the smart ones or (I cant belive I'm sugesting this) get annother hobby. I also say want depth and story line read a book for you smarts fill and play games for mindless fun.

Oh and while I'm here I recomment the Legacy of Kain series. Exept the first Blood Omen but old RPG fans might like it but I know I dident.
 

Hellion25

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May 28, 2008
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As an overall scene it would be nice for more games to have intelligent storys or difficult puzzles, but as relates to the question, I odn't believe there is any era that could be considered all that smart in gaming, after all it is easy to boil games down to essentials like the OP. We could say that Pacman is nothing but moving a pizza with a slice missing in different directions, or that Mario and Sonic games are just about jumping.

So no games aren't getting dumber as a whole. There are always dumb games that don't require much thought, but there will be other games that are smarter that you could play too. For every fiendish puzzle game or RPG from ye olde times, there is another puzzle game or RPG for the current times.

Of course if we are talking in terms of story than I would say we've moved on considerably from "The princess is missing... she is in another castle", wouldn't you old sport?
 

Darthracoon

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Aug 27, 2008
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Their is a problem with what you are saying OP, Because COD:W@W is trying to convey the message that war is horrible and it makes people do terrible things(especially the Russians) and the same goes with Far Cry 2 apart from replace war with diamonds and then try to fit civil war in the background(although the former had Nazi zombies and they both have multi-player).

Now Left 4 Dead is strictly multi-player so it applies to the doesn't need a story because it supposed to be fun not mind boggling or thought provoking.

Now Crysis is the only game i can't defend because it has aliens and macho dicks for main characters, i mean fucking aliens and Koreans now that makes no sense to me(note i haven't actually played Crysis)

It seems that you haven't played Far Cry or W@W(world at war) Mr.OP it seems you have only judged them by there genre not their under-laying storyline and brutality to real life issues.
Of course they still are bang-bang enemies go boom games but you have to think about it and actually realise that shit like that happens(or happened) in real life.
 

Tomw1812

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Nov 9, 2008
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I'd agree with there being dumb games out at the moment, but there were dumb games out in the past, no story, plot or anything if they did it would be "you here, objective there, bad guys in way, go kill they ass" (yes that was zp :p)

Anyway then, games aren't getting dumber they are as dums as ever, but hey just cos it's dumb doesn't mean no fun.
On a side note you can very easily argue that these games show the horrors of conflict and war, because well, they do! Farcry, CoD, hell even halo does and that's not exactly got a mind blowing story. Games like pokemon or mario for example can't really claim that can they
 

Prons

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Nov 19, 2007
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J-Man said:
Would you rather play Halo, or an FPS with a beautiful, deep story with human characters and an incredible art design?
I'd rather play one with a lot of actions and explosions. Cutscenes are just excuses for me to take a sip of soda and crack my knuckles.

With that said I did in fact like MGS3, but mind you after the cutscenes they let me shoot people in the balls with tranqulizer guns
 

superbleeder12

agamersperspective.com
Oct 13, 2007
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You're just not looking at some games. There are pretty good stories out there. I'll agree that story writing in a lot of games is butt (I agree with this guy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1jdG2LHair0 )

But there are a lot of developers out there making games with awesome stories.
 

Zac_Dai

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Oct 21, 2008
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thiosk said:
Games ARE getting dumber, but not in sense you imply.

Lets look at pong, not exactly mentally stimulating. Compare that to crysis, you'll probably think a lot more than when playing pong. I chose the worst example here to make the general point. Games are dumber now because they hold your hand, they give you ad nauseum tutorials, half of most games are tutorials, including some of the best games in recent memory (portal is a giant tutorial for the final like 2 levels. insert rabid comments about how much the cake lies here) Remember Star Control II? That game did not hold your hand, if you did the wrong thing, OOPS, game over, and they would be happy to let you play for weeks without telling you that you had already lost. But now, try not holding peoples hands, and you'll have screaming and hate on interweb forums.

Moving ahead from pong several years, lets look at some immortal games:

1. Super Mario Bros.
2. Space Invaders
3. Galaga
4. Super Ghouls and Ghosts

1. Jump on things, minimal thinking, mostly skill.
2. Flying from the left to the write shooting an infinite number of ships. Timing and skill.
3. Same as above.
4. Absolutely the hardest game ever made, only skill.

But we chose the games we wanted to make our points about. If you want your shooters to be intellectual, good luck. Enjoy the few and far between you get-- your deus exes-- and get over it because its not going to happen very frequently. Proof? Dead Space as an intellectual story shooter? Shock horror at best. If you want highly intellectual or crazy long stories, theres places to look. Gal Civ. Civilization. Total War. Europa Universalis. Sins of a solar empire maybe. Baldur's Gate 2. But if in depth strategy, and tactics, and learning the entire dungeons and dragons rule book on the fly isn't what you want, and you want to use in depth strategy and tactics while executing perfectly timed boom headshots, you may be dissapointed yet, though theres options out there.

And one little pet peev: if you want a great story, seriously, read a book, because the best storyline games often don't compare to average movies. We are biased towards games because we are gamers, and overlook the glaring issues. Proof? I love resident evil. And beautiful dialog they have not.
Needs bolding for emphasis.
 

ChromeAlchemist

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Aug 21, 2008
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curlycrouton said:
Jursa said:
You're looking for intellect in FPSs?
Half Life (1&2)
Portal (shooter?)
Deus Ex
Bioshock

and many more.....
lol sorry to be irritating, but deus ex is action adventure/action rpg, not fps. And still one of the best games i've played. HDTP FTW!
 

Dr.Doctor

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Nov 5, 2008
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I don't think the right question is Are Games Getting Dumber? Because there have always been dumb games and smart games.

Whether or not the latter is decreasing is a diffrent question.
 

CmdrGoob

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Oct 5, 2008
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Hmmm. Classic older shooters:

Doom 1 & 2.
Quake 1,2 & 3.
Unreal tournament.

Run in guns blazing and shoot everything pretty much sums up them, which is fine and fun but I don't see how they're more intelligent.

Compare it to your list.

Crysis is dumb? If you run in with your guns blazing on the higher difficulty, you'll be dead in an instant. You'll have to find an use cover, manage the different suit modes while keeping suit energy up, and find more clever and stealthy ways to approach your objective and pick your enemies off.

I haven't played CoD5 yet, but take CoD4. Even though you don't have as much choice in approach, you still have to move between cover and use nades and flashbangs for clearing rooms. You can hardly just sprint in guns blazing.

Back in the day of Doom or Quake, cover was an alien concept. All I knew was running around guns blazing.