"Athiesm"

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ThrobbingEgo

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chrisdibs said:
The Volume said:
I'll stop attacking baby raping priest's about their religion when they stop attacking me for not having one.
have you ever been personally attacked by a baby raping priest? I'm willing to bet the answer is no. an for that matter i'm willing to bet that very few people ever have been; most christians are as mild mannered and accepting as anyone else you'll ever meet. the most dogmatic asshole i ever met was an atheist and i have never met a christian who is belligerent on the matter and it seems from my perspective (coming from a school so christian it actually has a large christian association and so anti-religious that a teacher nearly got sacked for making us pray in school) that the atheists are worse than the theists by far because they're so fucking smug about it, so stubborn and so closed minded. how about we all just try to get along and accept that no one will ever know (in the correct technical definition) and that pretending to know is the most stupid and ignorant thing ever?
also, most religious people aren't catholic priests, and most catholic priests don't rape little children so you tone is utterly uncalled for.
The child molesting priest a vivid example, and a stereotype. As an atheist, it bugs me when other atheists - or people in general - make ignorant remarks like that. That said, you're doing the same thing right back. Vivid example, followed by a stereotype. Wash, rinse, repeat.

And, please, let's not make comments about the correct definition of "knowing," or we might as well all turn to solipsism. There's no point saying "you don't know it didn't go down this way," when an alternative theory is better established and yours stops at "you don't know." Please, prove me wrong and prove that a god does exist. Otherwise, saying "you don't know" is of no use to anyone.

GenHellspawn said:
ThrobbingEgo said:
These "what if" scenarios are neither practical nor convincing.
But what is practical? If it is an idea that promotes your survival as an entity, then practical is merely the belief that it is better to be alive than dead.
You enjoy twisting words, don't you? I address "practical" a paragraph up in this post.
 

ThrobbingEgo

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101194 said:
This is what comes out when people are misinformed about Athesim, Do I know for a fact there isn't a pony butsexing me right now? I'm 99.99% sure there isn't one, But you know I feel the same way about god, Lack of proof and Scietific Research=Orginized Religous people. Plus I'm a Secularist, Not an Atheist, But I guess you could say I'm an Atheist, But Atheisim doesn't carry and real thought.
But how do we know there isn't a pony butt-sexing you right now? If there's a 1 in 10000 chance (99.99%) of you being pony-butt-sexed and there are X number of people on the internet... There must be a whole lot of people getting pony-butt-sexed!

SCIENCE! :p
 

SilentHunter7

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Nov 21, 2007
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101194 said:
Plus I'm a Secularist, Not an Atheist, But I guess you could say I'm an Atheist, But Atheisim doesn't carry and real thought.
That's another thing many people should learn to make distinctions between. Just because you don't want the church in the government does not mean you're an atheist. Likewise, just because you believe in God does not mean you want the world to be subject to Vatican rule.
 

ThrobbingEgo

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SilentHunter7 said:
101194 said:
Plus I'm a Secularist, Not an Atheist, But I guess you could say I'm an Atheist, But Atheisim doesn't carry and real thought.
That's another thing many people should learn to make distinctions between. Just because you don't want the church in the government does not mean you're an atheist. Likewise, just because you believe in God does not mean you want the world to be subject to Vatican rule.
Eh, he did said "I guess you could say I'm an Atheist."

Why can't he be... you know... both? Do we really need to change the word for atheism to "bright" to keep people from saying "I'm not an atheist! ...But I guess you could call me one." Why's atheist such a bad word?
 

Altorin

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May 16, 2008
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secretsantaone said:
To be an Athiest is to conclude that the evidence suggests that there is no God, not that there isn't one for definate.
that sounds like agnosticism, not atheism. Atheism is the position that dieties do not exist. Agnosticism is the position that the existence of dieties is impossible to prove or disprove, therefore its folly to argue for or against their existence.

the problem is, you're arguing against atheism from an agnostic viewpoint. You're saying "You can't prove that god exists or doesn't exist, therefore to say that god doesn't exist doesn't make you an atheist, it makes you an idiot."

But that's exactly what atheists believe. It's not so much that they have proof, but they are so sure that something like a deity is so incredulous, and all the claims of the religious are so ridiculous, that they can say without a shadow of a doubt that they believe people are making it all up.

Atheism is a rejection of deity. If tomorrow there was empirical proof of god, many atheists would not believe, as they're hardwired to be skeptical about god. They'd think that somehow the biblehuggers falsified the proof. They'd be sure that it was a lie.
 

SilentHunter7

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ThrobbingEgo said:
Eh, he did said "I guess you could say I'm an Atheist."

Why can't he be... you know... both? Do we really need to change the word for atheism to "bright" to keep people from saying "I'm not an atheist! ...But I guess you could call me one." Why's atheist such a bad word?
There's no reason you can't be both, I was just saying that being a Secularist != being an Atheist.
 

ThrobbingEgo

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SilentHunter7 said:
There's no reason you can't be both, I was just saying that being a Secularist != being an Atheist.
Thought you were making an either/or distinction, like the person you responded to.
 

ThrobbingEgo

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Altorin said:
But that's exactly what atheists believe. It's not so much that they have proof, but they are so sure that something like a deity is so incredulous, and all the claims of the religious are so ridiculous, that they can say without a shadow of a doubt that they believe people are making it all up.
We don't all believe you're "making it all up." Look into intentional stance (folk psychology), or Daniel Dennett's book Breaking The Spell.

Here's a video of him talking on TED - he touches a bit on some points in his book: about religion being a natural phenomenon. It's a well written, respectful book, feel free to read it.

http://www.ted.com/index.php/talks/dan_dennett_s_response_to_rick_warren.html

And some info on intentional stance.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intentional_stance
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Folk_psychology <- here's the interesting one.
 

toasterslayer

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jeez isthis like a house of athiesm? i dont why SOME athiest think they're are smarter than people that have a religion. why is believing in nothing smarter?
 

ChristOnIce

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The OP should perhaps seek education before trying on the daddy pants. Your stupidity on this subject is made only more rich through your self-appointed authoritativeness.

Atheism refers to the lack of belief in gods. That is it. It says nothing of what is believed. It need not be based on science, facts, or logic. It is not mutually exclusive of religion (many religions are atheistic.

it can be split into two primary forms. Negative atheism is simply the lack of belief in gods. This includes what most people think agnosticism is. While these atheists are agnostic, this is not what the latter term means (clarification below). There is also positive atheism - the belief that there are no gods. This form can be agnostic (you simply believe that no gods exist) or gnostic (you know that no gods exist).

Atheism is not a belief system. This may rattle your self-appraised genius, santa-boy, but it is also not a proper noun and neither it nor "agnostic" should not be capitalized unless at the beginning of a sentence (on another grammatical note, definite is not that hard to spell). There is no such thing as a "true" atheist and those who suggest there is come off as far more ignorant than the Christian denominations that decry anyone they don't like as not being a true Christian.

As much sand as this may shovel into your vagina here, idiots who just want to make inflammatory posts attacking religion clumsily (not including valid attacks) are atheists. You have no authority (and no such authority exists) to shame them out of it on account of being an atheist. How stupid would it be for a non-Democrat to assume the position to dictate the behavior of all other non-Democrats? Then again, what do I know? I'm not as Scottish as the OP.

If junior would like to actually learn about issues before spouting off and brandishing ignorance, the Iron Chariots website is a decent (if skeletal) wiki that should point you to some very good sources.

And for those insisting that agnosticism is the position of "I don't know if gods exist" - you are wrong, though this may be a permissible ignorance. The word has been misused and bastardized since inception (never let a bulldog play wordsmith). While it does refer to claimed absence of knowledge, it has nothing inherently to do with gods. It doesn't say what one's position is, it merely describes that position. Saying "I'm an agnostic" is like saying "I'm inherently...". It must be accompanied by a position. One can be an agnostic theist, an agnostic negative atheist, or an agnostic positive atheist.

And before anyone goes quoting lay dictionaries, don't bother. They show common usage, not meaning. They will also tell you that "theory" means guess. It does in conversation, but not in a scientific context. The terms we're dealing with here are philosophical, not conversational. In this context, words carry more precise meaning.
 

electric_warrior

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ThrobbingEgo said:
chrisdibs said:
The Volume said:
I'll stop attacking baby raping priest's about their religion when they stop attacking me for not having one.
have you ever been personally attacked by a baby raping priest? I'm willing to bet the answer is no. an for that matter i'm willing to bet that very few people ever have been; most christians are as mild mannered and accepting as anyone else you'll ever meet. the most dogmatic asshole i ever met was an atheist and i have never met a christian who is belligerent on the matter and it seems from my perspective (coming from a school so christian it actually has a large christian association and so anti-religious that a teacher nearly got sacked for making us pray in school) that the atheists are worse than the theists by far because they're so fucking smug about it, so stubborn and so closed minded. how about we all just try to get along and accept that no one will ever know (in the correct technical definition) and that pretending to know is the most stupid and ignorant thing ever?
also, most religious people aren't catholic priests, and most catholic priests don't rape little children so you tone is utterly uncalled for.
The child molesting priest a vivid example, and a stereotype. As an atheist, it bugs me when other atheists - or people in general - make ignorant remarks like that. That said, you're doing the same thing right back. Vivid example, followed by a stereotype. Wash, rinse, repeat.

And, please, let's not make comments about the correct definition of "knowing," or we might as well all turn to solipsism. There's no point saying "you don't know it didn't go down this way," when an alternative theory is better established and yours stops at "you don't know." Please, prove me wrong and prove that a god does exist. Otherwise, saying "you don't know" is of no use to anyone.

GenHellspawn said:
ThrobbingEgo said:
These "what if" scenarios are neither practical nor convincing.
But what is practical? If it is an idea that promotes your survival as an entity, then practical is merely the belief that it is better to be alive than dead.
You enjoy twisting words, don't you? I address "practical" a paragraph up in this post.
what particular steoreotype am i using? the only people i made reference to were those who i had had personal experience of; the more scientifically minded atheists i know are more dogmatic than the christians I know. it a personal observation.

also what i said wasn't about the correct definition knowing, what i said was people who pretend to know are idiots and that perfectly civil conversations about gods existence can be had without the inflamation that seems to occur when people come to these things with closed minds, acting like they know for certain. that's what i meant; pretending to know, and refusing to accept that anyone else can be right is a terrible, dangerous thing, and it seems that more atheists are like that than christians
 

ThrobbingEgo

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chrisdibs said:
also what i said wasn't about the correct definition knowing, what i said was people who pretend to know are idiots and that perfectly civil conversations about gods existence can be had without the inflamation that seems to occur when people come to these things with closed minds, acting like they know for certain. that's what i meant; pretending to know, and refusing to accept that anyone else can be right is a terrible, dangerous thing, and it seems that more atheists are like that than christians
You attribute these negative qualities to atheists, having only met a small minority. That's called vivid example. You had a few unpleasant confrontational experiences, so all atheists are like this.
 

JamesR

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toasterslayer said:
jeez isthis like a house of athiesm? i dont why SOME athiest think they're are smarter than people that have a religion. why is believing in nothing smarter?
Yikes, you don't make a very good case for being smarter with a misinformed statement like that.
 

electric_warrior

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ThrobbingEgo said:
chrisdibs said:
also what i said wasn't about the correct definition knowing, what i said was people who pretend to know are idiots and that perfectly civil conversations about gods existence can be had without the inflamation that seems to occur when people come to these things with closed minds, acting like they know for certain. that's what i meant; pretending to know, and refusing to accept that anyone else can be right is a terrible, dangerous thing, and it seems that more atheists are like that than christians
You attribute these negative qualities to atheists, having only met a small minority. That's called vivid example. You had a few unpleasant confrontational experiences, so all atheists are like this.
no, i'm not saying all atheists are like this, but i took exception to the tone of you original post and took you to be one of that sort of atheist, and there are a lot of them out there. I'm an atheist, pretty much, so i am well aware that not all are like that its just that, based on my experiences, atheists can be just as, if not more, obnoxious as any theist. it, therfore, irks me when people call all christians dogmatic which is basically what you did in your original post
 

nikosuave

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Mar 14, 2009
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Epifols said:
nikosuave said:
Leorex said:
this will not end well.
I hope that he's got some flame proof armor.
All of you who are posting about the "incoming flame war" are just a bunch of spammers who are as good as the trolling flamers! Now stop it and either participate in the thread or don't post anything at all.

If you actually looked at the forum you would notice that I did make a serious post. I was simply agreeing with him on how this post was sure to cause some controversy and that the poster may have to fend off several insults in the near future.
Thank you good sir.
 
May 1, 2009
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Lexodus said:
The Ruler of Nosgoth said:
Also a lot of "Atheists" are dumb high school kids who think its "cool" to not believe in a god.
That is a generalization, and a shit one at that. You're always going to have the 'glory supporters', if you will, but, in that case, what the fuck is Jesus Camp?
All right, I didn't say ALL atheists are high school kids, nor that all high school kids are atheists. Get your facts straight before you call my opinions shit. Thanks :)