Biggest plothole in gaming?

[Nieroshai]

I just started playing POP sands of time (Older one..) and you get to a point very early on where a guy releases the sands of time, and it got me thinking, why doesn't the prince just use the dagger to reverse time until before that? It was only a minute ago...

That got me thinking about plot holes in other games, and I wanted to know the escapists opinion on what the most glaring plot hole is in any game.

There's a theory that a time machine cannot go back to a time before it existed, and the dagger was not a time machine until the sands were released. I haven't played 2, so I don't know if my friend's right in saying 2 happens somehow before 1 and whether or not this kills my theory.
EDIT: I KNOW THE REAL REASON!!!

The dagger is empty when you get it. You can't go back any farther than you have the amount of sand to do so. And to go that far back, you need more sand than the dagger can hold and than you can ever find in any one place.

 

[KefkaCultist]

I've seen a few other Final Fantasy ones show up. No one mentions the "favorite" though. =)

Srsly -> Aeris + Phoenix Down = [does not compute] apparently. I know it bothers you, too. =D

Spoiler: unnecessary nonsense

(Speculation: While dead, Aeris/Aerith understood that she needed to join up with the lifestream or whatever and decided she was happier with Zach since he was all the dead too and perhaps you can only revive those that -want- to keep on living. Works perfectly if someone would just bother to at least attempt closing the hole.)

I have a theory that I like to toss around whenever someone brings up the Aeris/Pheonix Down scenario.

In a FF7 battle when a character is knocked to 0 hp they are not killed, but in fact knocked unconscious. Pheonix Downs cure the knocked unconscious effect, but not death. When Sephiroth stabs Aeris he mortally wounded her and she died.

 

[Nieroshai]

Kingdom Hearts. Just, Kingdom Hearts.

I do not follow. Maybe I was too immersed to notice, so help an inquiring mind ouut.

 

[King of the Sandbox]

Am I too late to point out the "anyone dying in FF/Phoenix Downs" plot canyon?

 

[Trivun]

This isn't really huge, but it still pissed the hell outta me:

Spoiler: Assasin's Creed 2 spoilers

So the nerdy, Yahtzee-esque guy is the history buff, right? So how did he not realize that the Spaniard, a.k.a. Borgia, was a GODDAMN POPE? That's basic European History crap. Hell, I got that info from looking up 'Borgia' on Wikipedia, and I'm not in a super-awesome assasins club.

If you pay attention, he says that Borgia became Pope RIGHT FROM THE VERY START!!!!! The only people who show surprise to him getting the Papacy are the Italian characters, Ezio and the other old assassins. Which makes sense. The modern-day characters show no surprise whatsoever, because they already know Borgia becomes Pope. So no plot hole there. Simply you not paying enough attention when playing the game .

My plot hole would probably be from Halo, and the existance of the Halo rings.

If one guy with a shotgun can clear out thousands of them in a single day, how long would they last against a billion guys with shotguns?

Failing that, the Forerunners probably have orbital-death-ray-things. Nuke them from orbit!

Simple. Explained in the expanded universe. The Forerunners tried to document the Flood and research them, they didn't exactly plan a war. When the war did begin, the Flood were already too far spread and infiltrated too much with the Gravemind to be simply nuked from orbit. They had access to ships and weaponry, not just the lower-tech weapons that John has in the games, but advanced Forerunner weaponry. They had the equipment and intelligence (via the Gravemind) to easily fight a long drawn out war of attrition (with the Maginot Line later, just before the rings were fired), or a simple standard war of shooting guns at each other in a line, or whatever. The plan to starve the Flood by wiping out life in the galaxy wasn't simply a random plan. It was literally the only way left to stop the Flood, and a measure of last resort. It does make sense, in the end.

Not to mention, the Flood knew what weaponry and technology the Forerunners had, and could plan against them. They had inside info from the renegade AI, Mendicant Bias, remember? (from the Terminals in Halo 3)

 

[Nieroshai]

I've seen a few other Final Fantasy ones show up. No one mentions the "favorite" though. =)

Srsly -> Aeris + Phoenix Down = [does not compute] apparently. I know it bothers you, too. =D

Spoiler: unnecessary nonsense

(Speculation: While dead, Aeris/Aerith understood that she needed to join up with the lifestream or whatever and decided she was happier with Zach since he was all the dead too and perhaps you can only revive those that -want- to keep on living. Works perfectly if someone would just bother to at least attempt closing the hole.)

I have a theory that I like to toss around whenever someone brings up the Aeris/Pheonix Down scenario.

In a FF7 battle when a character is knocked to 0 hp they are not killed, but in fact knocked unconscious. Pheonix Downs cure the knocked unconscious effect, but not death. When Sephiroth stabs Aeris he mortally wounded her and she died.

In FF6 the status screen will even tell you that a player is unconscious as opposed to dead. Also, in 7, if "death" is really death, why does a body come back to life if you take it to an inn?

Basically, being "killed" in FF7 is being put in a near-death state. You are bleeding out but not dead. This happens in D&D too, you lose all HP but you're not really DEAD until you reach -10 HP, which indicates death as opposed to incapacitation.

 

[Biosophilogical]

How do game characters live without eating?

Why do game characters never have to go to the bathroom?

What is sleep to a Pokemon Master?

And you rarely see them breathing! But what is oxygen to a ten year old boy?

Why was a ten year old given control of a creature that could destroy a city and then instructed to go catch more of them?

Why can a deity pokemon a) be beaten by other pokemon, and b) be trapped and brain-washed by a man-made spherical container?

 

[King of the Sandbox]

I've seen a few other Final Fantasy ones show up. No one mentions the "favorite" though. =)

Srsly -> Aeris + Phoenix Down = [does not compute] apparently. I know it bothers you, too. =D

Spoiler: unnecessary nonsense

(Speculation: While dead, Aeris/Aerith understood that she needed to join up with the lifestream or whatever and decided she was happier with Zach since he was all the dead too and perhaps you can only revive those that -want- to keep on living. Works perfectly if someone would just bother to at least attempt closing the hole.)

I have a theory that I like to toss around whenever someone brings up the Aeris/Pheonix Down scenario.

In a FF7 battle when a character is knocked to 0 hp they are not killed, but in fact knocked unconscious. Pheonix Downs cure the knocked unconscious effect, but not death. When Sephiroth stabs Aeris he mortally wounded her and she died.

Except don't the item descriptions for Pheonix Downs say somewhere "return a party member to life?" I seem to remember reading that somewhere.

 

[Azaraxzealot]

Guitar Hero, HOW COME NO IMPORT ALL SONGS?!

jk.

any RPG ever where you get captured by some people you had slaughtered by the millions just seconds ago

 

[thethingthatlurks]

there are 2 civil wars you could be talking about in DA, the civil war between ferelden and the nation to the north (which was over well before the start of the game) or, the more likely one you are talking about, the small civil war between ruling factions for the empty throne. in DA the guy who betrayed the king at the beginning dismisses the fact that a blight is occurring and says it is just some dark spawns that will be easily cleaned up so he worries about securing his throne more than the coming blight

the elves did not know their leader was responsible for the curse, they had too many wounded to move even if they wanted to, and they were not going to leave any of their people behind. the elves thought they could defeat the werewolves if they could kill the spirit of the forest and so they held on to that hope. the leader never said he caused the curse because he felt responsible and he wanted the werewolves to suffer

in the DA universe the darkspawn are ALWAYS in the deep roads and so the only hint that a blight is happening for the dwarves is when there are fewer darkspawn in the deep raods (because they are now mostly on the surface). and so things are as usual for the dwarves facing darkspawn so they didnt see any threat (since they dont go to the surface) so they argued about who would rule their kingdom

A war between nations is not a civil war, so yes, I did refer to the squabble over the throne business. I don't know if you've noticed this before, but reports of destruction spread quite easily. There is no way that all of Ferelden could have been ignorant of the incoming Blight, given numerous reports of destruction.

As for the elves, yes, they were in bad shape. That still doesn't explain why the idiot who started the curse led them back into the forest in the first place, though that might have just been out of his own vanity. Also, why don't the werewolves just wipe the elves out? Yes, the forest spirit has something against that, but there is literally no opposition to the beasts!

Uhm, then how the hell did that dragon get down there? Or for that matter, how could the dwarfs not have known about the broodmother (or the delightful porn of it)? And don't forget, you actually see a bloody army of darkspawn marching down there. Man, those dwarfs must be really good at fightin' them darkspawn considering how much attention they pay to them.

Ooh wait, I've got another one: where the hell did the mage faction that summoned the sloth demon come from? I played as a mage, and I did not hear of any such organization when I started in the tower. Or did they just form after my amazing betrayal of my supposed best friend? I'm sure they were all awestruck by his masterful use of the emo I'm-cutting-myself-and-sprinkle-things-with-blood magic. But whatever, I don't exactly expect coherence from Bioware games, or fantasy stories in particular. I just enjoy poking holes into them while playing the game, basically the same approach I take with SyFy original movies.

 

[nukethetuna]

FFVIII. Guardian Forces eat your memory. Just kidding, only that one very plot-crucial memory that you all happened to share.

 

[Spencer Petersen]

the reapers in ME, fucking bioware keeps insulting my intelligence with their explanations

I don't accept that their only purpose is to make space terminators.



ALSO WHY FOR THE LOVE OF GOD IS JIM RAYNOR TRYING TO SAVE KERRIGAN IN STARCRAFT 2?!
BROOD WAR ENDS WITH HIM SAYING THAT HE'S GOING TO HUNT HER DOWN AND KILL HER NO MATTER WHAT
WHAT THE SHIT
SUDDEN RAGE

Spoiler

Zeratul mentioning and him actually experiencing the end of the universe caused by Kerrigans death might have helped his decision.

 

[Nieroshai]

How can Kairi destroy heartless in one hit on her first time when it takes Sora 10 hits to kill a heartless even when he mastered the keyblade a long ass time ago.

Heartless die in one hit in cutscenes, it's the dreaded Squaresoft Syndrome where cutscenes follow a slightly different canon where recovery items and XP don't exist. Also, there are keyblades that massively boost attack power, as an alternate explanation. Maybe Sora shoulda stolen that one and one-shotted through the rest of the story.

 

[KefkaCultist]

Except don't the item descriptions for Pheonix Downs say somewhere "return a party member to life?" I seem to remember reading that somewhere.

Not sure on the exact wording, but if it does say that then it's by this: a pheonix down is restoring their life. revitalizing, if you will. They may not be dead, but they've had the life knocked out of them and are now unconscious so the downs revitalizes the party member to a state wherein they are able to act. a.k.a. life.

In FF6 the status screen will even tell you that a player is unconscious as opposed to dead. Also, in 7, if "death" is really death, why does a body come back to life if you take it to an inn?

Basically, being "killed" in FF7 is being put in a near-death state. You are bleeding out but not dead. This happens in D&D too, you lose all HP but you're not really DEAD until you reach -10 HP, which indicates death as opposed to incapacitation.

Yep (although in D&D it's also possible to return a "dead dead" character to life with a revive spell and I don't like bringing that up in these debates because theres a revive materia in FF7 and I can't explain that one lol)

 

[Doomcat]

Kingdom hearts 2 (As silly as this sounds)

The whole first game is about how the big dark things are bad and how Sora is the chosen of this keyblade, and cause of that he's awesome and the only one who can stop it...

KH2 rolls around: Lets see...who doesn't have a keyblade in this game? (not counting world-centric characters) um...uh...Donald and Goofy, thats about it. What really got me was how Riku somehow managed to get ANOTHER one even though Sora DESTROYED ONE HE HAD in the first game.

Lol its so silly, but if you're going to go through the trouble of writing a plot, at least make it click with what was being said in the first game, there were a bunch of other things there too...those holes organization XIII used? those are actually giant plot holes.

 

[Thelonesun]

Am I too late to point out the "anyone dying in FF/Phoenix Downs" plot canyon?

In FF5,

Spoiler

they actually did try to revive Galuf when Exdeath mortally wounded him, even going so far as to using Arise on him, which didn't work

and that supports the theory that the "dying" in Final Fantasy is just mostly an unconscious or "bleeding out" state.

 

[thedeathscythe]

I just started playing POP sands of time (Older one..) and you get to a point very early on where a guy releases the sands of time, and it got me thinking, why doesn't the prince just use the dagger to reverse time until before that? It was only a minute ago...

That got me thinking about plot holes in other games, and I wanted to know the escapists opinion on what the most glaring plot hole is in any game.

Double jump. NEXT QUESTION

 

[BodomBeachChild]

Metal Gear Solid games.
They don't contain plot holes, they are one gigantic plot hole.

And I love them so.

 

[Qizx]

ALSO WHY FOR THE LOVE OF GOD IS JIM RAYNOR TRYING TO SAVE KERRIGAN IN STARCRAFT 2?!
BROOD WAR ENDS WITH HIM SAYING THAT HE'S GOING TO HUNT HER DOWN AND KILL HER NO MATTER WHAT
WHAT THE SHIT
SUDDEN RAGE

Spoiler

I believe they find an artifact that he learns has the power to turn Kerrigan human or some such nonsense. Then he starts thinking with his cock and shoots my favourite character in the face. I hated the end of that game.

Spoiler

Actually the whole point of the game is that they CAN'T kill her, if you played through the Zeratul missions you see the future in which Jim, did kill her. Let me tell you, it's NOT a pretty place. The whole point is that they need Kerrigan to control the zerg to prevent the entire universe from being overrun by Hybrids.

 

[Nieroshai]

My favorite plot hole ever is how the character reputed to be the purest, most sin-free woman ever born decides not just to fuck the devil but to become queen of Hell, despite the knowledge that Satan is more evil and heartless than Dante will ever be. It is also a plothole, as the Inferno is based on the Christian mythos, that all the demons in the game other than Satan were humans once. Demons are angels who follow the devil.

It's not just that I'm mad that this would happen. I'm mad because by Beatrice's character this occurrance is absolutely impossible. Another plot hole: if Beatrice was so pure, why did she sleep with Dante and wager her soul away? Normally these wouldn't be plot holes, but if you're going to base a game on a story, at least get the basic important things about a character right. It's like saying the events of Wolfenstein for 360 are based on a true story. Only if you squint real hard...