BLARGH! I IS EVIL!: Villains who were not well fleshed out

[pffh]

All of them, especially in video games.

Galbatorix from Eragon.

"Why would he do such a thing?"

"Because he is evil."

Yay for one-dimensional characters!

Spoiler: Rant about Galbatorix's alledged evilness

I mean, come on! The guy's never seen, and everyone says he's evil incarnate. For all we know he isn't!

Let's look at his evil deeds:

1, Kill the Dragon Riders.
So? They were 'corrupt and fought amongst themselves.' All he did was join in on the fun, be the best there is, and win. Now he's the bad guy and mad to boot? Riiiight.

2, The Empire is evil and bad, and war rages.
The war the REBELS STARTED. Without them, Galby could go and manage his Empire without distractions.

3, He killed dragons and enslaved them!
Comes with killing the dragon-riders. Why let that power go to waist when you can do some good with it after you slew them in a fit of madness. Seems pretty good to me, as would any normal human being.

Don't forget the taxes!
That go to fund the war...
That the rebels started...

Agreed.
We shall fight against the empire because of the taxes that they levied against us so they could defend themselves!

The Galactic Empire also. I saw Darth Vader kill like 2 people (not counting pilots he killed during the battle of the death star) He killed one during interrogation, and he killed Obi Wan.
He also killed the Emperor, but he was a "bad guy" anyway.
What exactly was the Empire doing that was so bad?
It was ruled by a Sith sure, but the only atrocity I saw was the destruction of Alderaan. All other incidents can be attributed to the state of war between the rebels and their sympathizersand the Empire

Well the empire was pretty racist against non-humans and actively hunted and killed them throughout the empire.

 

[QuadrAlien]

Ultimecia from Final Fantasy 8.

"I shall compress Time and destroy all life, for no good reason at all! MUHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAH!"

This. Kefka was fleshed out more than you may think. He was just a sociopath that wanted to ruin the world. Ultimecia LITERALLY came from right field and became the final boss. STUPID.

While we're on the subject of the Final Fantasy games, who exactly was Necron supposed to be, anyway? Doesn't he turn up literally to be the last boss of FF9, and that's all?

 

[Monkfish Acc.]

... The majority of them?
The problem with most people is that they don't want their villains to be likeable.
I mean, they're the villains. The bad guys. You don't want people rooting for your bad guys, do you?
Give a villain a backstory, and you run the risk of him/her becoming relateable.
If someone is relateable, then they're probably likeable.

See, this is why you should always make sure you love all your characters.
If you write an antagonist you don't like, then he/she's not going to be very deep.
One of the biggest problems in all fiction, in my opinion.
Especially the Bible

Disclaimer: I am not an anti-theist, nor am I in any way against Christianity. It was just far too easy to resist.

Yeah, but there is a difference between making a villain well-rounded and making a card-board cut out that the protagonists knock down. Sometimes having a villain that we can relate to can be a good thing. Why? Because the most frightening or compelling villains are those who are reflections of ourselves through a cracked mirror.

(Protip: I hate to tell you this, but that last line before the disclaimer? Kinda dickish there, friend. I know you were trying to be funny and/or clever, but it just didn't pan out.)

That's what I was saying.
To make that cracked mirror villain, you need to care about him/her, and why he/she is doing the things they are doing.
Making a well-rounded character requires you to think about them. A lot.
And if you dislike your character, you're not going to want to think about them.
You'll take a few bits of personallity, decide you hate him/her, and therefor so will everyone else.
And then you birth a cardboard cut-out villain.


Also, yeah, I know it was. Hence the disclaimer.
I'm not witty. Like, at all.
So when I see the opportunity to make a vaguely clever joke, I bloody well take it.

 

[SamuelT]

All of them, especially in video games.

Galbatorix from Eragon.

"Why would he do such a thing?"

"Because he is evil."

Yay for one-dimensional characters!

Spoiler: Rant about Galbatorix's alledged evilness

I mean, come on! The guy's never seen, and everyone says he's evil incarnate. For all we know he isn't!

Let's look at his evil deeds:

1, Kill the Dragon Riders.
So? They were 'corrupt and fought amongst themselves.' All he did was join in on the fun, be the best there is, and win. Now he's the bad guy and mad to boot? Riiiight.

2, The Empire is evil and bad, and war rages.
The war the REBELS STARTED. Without them, Galby could go and manage his Empire without distractions.

3, He killed dragons and enslaved them!
Comes with killing the dragon-riders. Why let that power go to waist when you can do some good with it after you slew them in a fit of madness. Seems pretty good to me, as would any normal human being.

Don't forget the taxes!
That go to fund the war...
That the rebels started...

Becasue taxes are Evil! No KING would ever demand taxes from his subjects.

Right?

 

[Heart of Darkness]

All of them, especially in video games.

Galbatorix from Eragon.

"Why would he do such a thing?"

"Because he is evil."

Yay for one-dimensional characters!

Spoiler: Rant about Galbatorix's alledged evilness

I mean, come on! The guy's never seen, and everyone says he's evil incarnate. For all we know he isn't!

Let's look at his evil deeds:

1, Kill the Dragon Riders.
So? They were 'corrupt and fought amongst themselves.' All he did was join in on the fun, be the best there is, and win. Now he's the bad guy and mad to boot? Riiiight.

2, The Empire is evil and bad, and war rages.
The war the REBELS STARTED. Without them, Galby could go and manage his Empire without distractions.

3, He killed dragons and enslaved them!
Comes with killing the dragon-riders. Why let that power go to waist when you can do some good with it after you slew them in a fit of madness. Seems pretty good to me, as would any normal human being.

Don't forget the taxes!
That go to fund the war...
That the rebels started...

Or the Ra'zac...that eat people...
Or the Urgals...under Durza...

For all we know Galbatorix may be evil, but then again, he might not be. Only time shall tell...in the forth book.

 

[Rolling Thunder]

Yeah. I get the feeling that The Reapers' motives will be more fleshed out in the sequels though.

As do I - but right now?
For The Evulz.

Max The Reaper. It needs work.

Man that guy is such a dick!
Just the other day he was telling me how big of a jerk I was.

I hope he dies.

Double-meanings and allusion....better, better. Now, let's see some irony...

 

[Avatar Roku]

Sovereign from Mass Effect. When asked why he's doing it, he responds that his motives are too complex for puny Commander Shepard to comprehend. Kind of redeemed with Saren, however.

Sovereign was one of the Reapers. That was his reason. They destroy humanity every time it reaches a certain peak, there could be a million reasons for this. Gurren Lagann comes to mind even.

I know he was a Reaper, but he gave no reason for the Reapers to even be exterminating organic live. He just said "Oh, you wouldn't understand."

 

[Wildrow12]

... The majority of them?
The problem with most people is that they don't want their villains to be likeable.
I mean, they're the villains. The bad guys. You don't want people rooting for your bad guys, do you?
Give a villain a backstory, and you run the risk of him/her becoming relateable.
If someone is relateable, then they're probably likeable.

See, this is why you should always make sure you love all your characters.
If you write an antagonist you don't like, then he/she's not going to be very deep.
One of the biggest problems in all fiction, in my opinion.
Especially the Bible

Disclaimer: I am not an anti-theist, nor am I in any way against Christianity. It was just far too easy to resist.

Yeah, but there is a difference between making a villain well-rounded and making a card-board cut out that the protagonists knock down. Sometimes having a villain that we can relate to can be a good thing. Why? Because the most frightening or compelling villains are those who are reflections of ourselves through a cracked mirror.

That's what I was saying.
To make that cracked mirror villain, you need to care about him/her, and why he/she is doing the things they are doing.
Making a well-rounded character requires you to think about them. A lot.
And if you dislike your character, you're not going to want to think about them.
You'll take a few bits of personallity, decide you hate him/her, and therefor so will everyone else.
And then you birth a cardboard cut-out villain.

So you were saying that these card-board villains are more a product of lazy writing then? I can believe that (just read "Countdown to Final Crisis").

 

[shootthebandit]

ming the merciless from flash gordon

flash! ah ah
saviour of the universe

Any Bond villain.

Seriously they're all just like, "POWER!", "MONEY!" "MORE POWER!", "MORE MONEY!"

And all stupid as hell, with their overly elaborate deathtraps designed purely for Bond to escape from. In fact I think all the villains are jst intentionally incompetent just so that Bond can look good beating them.

agreed totally, the thing is most bond villains ALREADY own a massive worldwide corporation larger than Coca cola, general motors, microsoft, mcdonalds and many more (combined). i dont really think they need anymore wealth or power

james bond is a crap hero, he acts all macho but drinks a martini. a proper bloke is someone who drinks real ale or whisky

 

[Titanguy654]

Slade from Teen Titans. I still have no idea what he wanted...... and the show is over.

 

[Wildrow12]

Sovereign from Mass Effect. When asked why he's doing it, he responds that his motives are too complex for puny Commander Shepard to comprehend. Kind of redeemed with Saren, however.

Sovereign was one of the Reapers. That was his reason. They destroy humanity every time it reaches a certain peak, there could be a million reasons for this. Gurren Lagann comes to mind even.

I know he was a Reaper, but he gave no reason for the Reapers to even be exterminating organic live. He just said "Oh, you wouldn't understand."

All I'm saying is that Mass Effect 2 better offer a damn good explanation for all that noise.

(Though it'll probably amount to some crap about time travel and killing Commander Sheppard before he can do something heroic and/or cartoonishly evil)

 

[Heart of Darkness]

Or the Ra'zac...that eat people...
Or the Urgals...under Durza...

For all we know Galbatorix may be evil, but then again, he might not be. Only time shall tell...in the forth book.

...Lions eat people too.
Are they evil?
Okay, they did do that thing with the village - but why?
A dead village can't pay taxes.

So either he's stupid or he's just murdering people because it makes him giggle.

Well, to be fair...the Urgals were presumably under Durza's control at the time. And murdering people made Durza giggle.

 

[Wildrow12]

Slade from Teen Titans. I still have no idea what he wanted...... and the show is over.

I would say, 'read the source material', but in Deathstroke's (aka Slade) case, that really wouldn't help since the two characters are completely different.

Deathstroke is just a mercenary trying to complete a job his son botched.

Slade......? I'm not sure, but I think he might just be a cycloptic pedophile.

 

[Amethyst Wind]

Slade from Teen Titans. I still have no idea what he wanted...... and the show is over.

Slade, or Deathstroke, was just a businessman, he was a mercenary who worked for both good guys and bad guys, and he had enough money to pretty much do whatever he wanted, he's literally 'in it for the lulz'. He's so rich he's just trying to fill his days.


As for a one-dimensional villain, look at Botched Necromancy (a few posts up), the guy's only got 3 posts to his name and he's already trolling, what's that about?

 

[Sovvolf]

Most villians arnt well fleshed out, most of them want to take over the world, why?? what then, you've taken over the world, what next??, do you just sit there on your throne and waste away or what??, then you have to sort out budgeting, food, research, you have to look after the world now, you run it, you have to keep people happy, other wise you'll be knocked off the throne fast, and most of these evil geniouses done seem the kind off people who'd know what to do from there.

Also there's those who want to destroy the world... again why would you want to do this, whats the potential benefit??.

But Ironically The Joker who doesnt have any motive makes a good villian.

One of the most fleshed out villians in comic book history in my opinion is Adam Susan from V for Vendetta.

 

[Shycte]

Slade from Teen Titans. I still have no idea what he wanted...... and the show is over.

Slade, or Deathstroke, was just a businessman, he was a mercenary who worked for both good guys and bad guys, and he had enough money to pretty much do whatever he wanted, he's literally 'in it for the lulz'. He's so rich he's just trying to fill his days.


As for a one-dimensional villain, look at Botched Necromancy (a few posts up), the guy's only got 3 posts to his name and he's already trolling, what's that about?

So... Slade is a /b/tard?

 

[j0z]

All of them, especially in video games.

Galbatorix from Eragon.

"Why would he do such a thing?"

"Because he is evil."

Yay for one-dimensional characters!

Spoiler: Rant about Galbatorix's alledged evilness

I mean, come on! The guy's never seen, and everyone says he's evil incarnate. For all we know he isn't!

Let's look at his evil deeds:

1, Kill the Dragon Riders.
So? They were 'corrupt and fought amongst themselves.' All he did was join in on the fun, be the best there is, and win. Now he's the bad guy and mad to boot? Riiiight.

2, The Empire is evil and bad, and war rages.
The war the REBELS STARTED. Without them, Galby could go and manage his Empire without distractions.

3, He killed dragons and enslaved them!
Comes with killing the dragon-riders. Why let that power go to waist when you can do some good with it after you slew them in a fit of madness. Seems pretty good to me, as would any normal human being.

Don't forget the taxes!
That go to fund the war...
That the rebels started...

Agreed.
We shall fight against the empire because of the taxes that they levied against us so they could defend themselves!

The Galactic Empire also. I saw Darth Vader kill like 2 people (not counting pilots he killed during the battle of the death star) He killed one during interrogation, and he killed Obi Wan.
He also killed the Emperor, but he was a "bad guy" anyway.
What exactly was the Empire doing that was so bad?
It was ruled by a Sith sure, but the only atrocity I saw was the destruction of Alderaan. All other incidents can be attributed to the state of war between the rebels and their sympathizer sand the Empire

Well the empire was pretty racist against non-humans and actively hunted and killed them throughout the empire.

They might have done that in the books or other(non-movie) star wars. But in the original star wars movies, I don't remember any genocide.