Brink : No Girls Allowed

[Farseer Lolotea]

For a game that "claims" to be customizable...it's pretty fucking customizable regardless that it has female characters or not.

The half of its customization that's there is good. Half of anything is still half, no matter what a nice half it is.

-"No tits to stare at, im sorry but im not going to give your game the time of day"-complainers

Because the only reason anyone would want to play a female character is to stare at tits. Gotcha.

 

[DeadProxy]

For a game that "claims" to be customizable...it's pretty fucking customizable regardless that it has female characters or not.

The half of its customization that's there is good. Half is still half.

-"No tits to stare at, im sorry but im not going to give your game the time of day"-complainers

Because the only reason anyone would want to play a female character is to stare at tits. Gotcha.

It isnt half though, there IS no female option, simple as that. You keep trying to say all the clothing and guns are just half of what the game offers, which it isnt.

Also, I used a very general sentence on purpose, because the idea of that line is exactly why a large portion of people arent playing this game. Before even picking up the game, trying it, running up a wall to jump to another and whip around behind an enemy and shoot him in the back all in about 2-3 seconds, they say, "oh, no thanks, theres no girls in that game so im just gonna bash it for that point till its paste on the ground without any first hand experience."

 

[Farseer Lolotea]

It isnt half though, there IS no female option, simple as that.

But it's half because there's no female option.

You keep trying to say all the clothing and guns are just half of what the game offers, which it isnt.

I haven't said anything of the sort. I've only talked about its customization. Or rather, the half of customization that it has.

Also, I used a very general sentence on purpose, because the idea of that line is exactly why a large portion of people arent playing this game. Before even picking up the game, trying it, running up a wall to jump to another and whip around behind an enemy and shoot him in the back all in about 2-3 seconds, they say, "oh, no thanks, theres no girls in that game so im just gonna bash it for that point till its paste on the ground without any first hand experience."

Because heaven forbid that something that's of no concern to you is a dealbreaker??or one of multiple dealbreakers??to other people, right? And criticizing games and game companies? Simply not done!

That said? The reviewers aren't too fond of it, either.

 

[MasterV]

I can't speak for anyone else, but I for one have a penis, and I am quite proud of it. And guess what: surprisingly enough, I'm not a misogynist pig, and am indeed perplexed that a game that touts customization has no option to change gender in it.

I can, and will, call hypocritical bullshit when I see it though.

You and me both my friend, on all accounts. For it is bullshit of the highest order when developers use the "limitless customization" tagline as central to their precious child and then proceed to make half of the work on it.

Now, some children will find this a nitpicky topic, but really, calling out developers on bullshit they spout is what all self-respecting gamers should do.

 

[Farseer Lolotea]

Yes, cuz there's no such thing as a woman who works out. Or is fat. No fat or muscular women anywhere in the world, ever.

But don't you see...they're not hawt enough! What's the point of putting women in the game if they can't all be hawt?

Yeesh. You don't see me demanding that all of the male characters look like doe-eyed college football players...

I think the problem here is most of the defenders of this ass game aren't thinking of women as "women" they are thinking of women in the terms of "thing I would want to fuck." They don't mind things they would want to fuck not being in the game, and can see it in no other terms aside from that.

Pretty much. But that's all too common among fans (sadly enough).

Of course, it probably doesn't help that game companies tend to aim right at that demographic [http://www.cracked.com/article_18571_5-reasons-its-still-not-cool-to-admit-youre-gamer.html].

I can, and will, call hypocritical bullshit when I see it though.

Hear to the freakin' hear.

Now, some children will find this a nitpicky topic, but really, calling out developers on bullshit they spout is what all self-respecting gamers should do.

It's like I said a few pages back: voice a complaint that they don't share, and fans are going to try to shout you down. But when it's their complaint, the world is ending and the disputed company is pure evil.

 

[Super Happy Cow]

Being a next gen character artist, I can tell you that having a pipeline where you have to create assets that fit 3 different bodytypes, and two different sexes, while maintaining clothing customization, decent rigs, and animations would be incredibly expensive compared to picking one of the two sexes. It's definitely reasonable that you would pick one of the two sexes.

You know...everyone's an expert on the Interwebs. I could claim to be a next-gen character artist myself, tell you that you're talking out the back of your neck, and announce that you must be operating on the notion that female characters in video games have to be horrible pin-up caricatures with plenty of jiggle physics.

Hah. You really are something awful, aren't you? I am a character artist. Is that supposed to be a big deal? If it is so much of one to you that you find it so unbelievable, perhaps you need better priorities in life, and worthier idols? It's just a job, and I'm just entry level. But I know my shit, so don't make yourself look like a complete **** being hyper aggressive and assuming that I don't.

Go ahead. Explain to me the first steps you would take in developing a pipeline that would facilitate the streamlining of the character creation process that would result in 24 distinct looking characters, 3 bodytypes, and both sexes, All within 2 UV spaces maximum, for the base models, and give me an estimate of how long that would take.

But I'm honest. I'm just someone who did some amateur 3D modeling back in the day. So I won't.

I'll just say this: No, if you're selling your game on customization, there is nothing "reasonable" about as basic a component of that as half of your character models being the first thing in line for the axe.

You're quite far from honest, actually. Splash Damage has a ton of money? Do you know how many studios close on average per year? And how many people get layed off after every production cycle?

Splash Damage only made Enemy Territory: Quake Wars, which had only moderate success, and Wolfenstein: Enemy Territory, which was a free, full game.

Which AAA title or MMO with subscriptions did they get their money-vomiting vault of money from that allows them to spend 5 years on a game without ensured success, only to have them ALL potentially lose their jobs if one game fails? Complaining about something is perfectly fine. Even complaining about it vehemently is, just as well. But pretending you know everything there is to know about the subject that you clearly don't only causes your intelligence to come under intense scrutiny.

That's nice. But "there are female characters on 3D art forums" does not add up to "Splash did not, in fact, chop out half of one of Brink's big selling point, then make lame excuses for it."

The artists on these forums are the ones who make the assets for your games for a living. Knowing that many of them spend much of their FREE time perfecting their ability to make female characters, you'd think that these people who get payed to do it would be just as fair about making them for your games when money was thrown into the equation. But no. Females get cut AFTER money is introduced, not before.

Your idea that developers decided to neglect females simply because they were lazy, and not because it costs an exorbitant amount of money to do both is an idea based in pretty superficial ignorance that you're desperately unwilling to overcome.

As an artist yourself, you should know that game companies have separate teams for character design.

There you go, being sarcastic again and trying to appear omniscient. Yes, I am a professional 3D artist. You, on the other hand, seem to be professional only at making yourself look like an assumptive, caustic ass. But I'll give you the benefit of the doubt for the sake of courtesy.

And did you mean the preproduction concept artists? Yeah, they're different. A lot of 3D guys can concept their own assets(I can't worth shit yet), but they generally don't.

The bottom line is money, by the way, hun. Money.

 

[Farseer Lolotea]

You're really in no position to be getting all defensive and rude. After all, you're the one who came in here with a 'tude and boasted of your alleged expertise.

P.S.: Jargon proves jack. And when it's backed up with insults, it proves less than jack.

 

[Treblaine]

Is there an explanation in the narrative of the game? I thought the setting was kind of a giant floating prison, which is male only could be wrong shall google it.

But if that is the case having female characters is plain wrong. Also the first two Gears games managed to make headway without female characters. To be fair I would play a sentient lump of Tofu if the game was good!

Resident Evil 2 is a good game. And yes, that is a sentient lump of tofu.

Turns out those zombies are vegan.

 

[Treblaine]

-"No tits to stare at, im sorry but im not going to give your game the time of day"-complainers

I think the problem here is most of the defenders of this ass game aren't thinking of women as "women" they are thinking of women in the terms of "thing I would want to fuck." They don't mind things they would want to fuck not being in the game, and can see it in no other terms aside from that.

If it is "thing I would want to fuck"... why would I want to look like that?

Fact: I want to look like a woman in a game simply because I want to look like a woman, for the sheer aesthetics of it. Call it artistic vision, but don't dismiss it as lechery.

 

[C117]

Well, I suppose they could always release the possibility to play as a female in some DLC, together with a brand new campaign titled "The Amazons" or something.

I'm serious you know. I can't really see the point of NOT including females in a game with so much focus on customization.

 

[zeldagirl]

As a new person to the forums, I have to say, this topic is horrendous enough to make me want to leave. The blatant sexism from many male members, and the internalized misogyny of some of the women, just makes me really uncomfortable.

But I have to say, to Farseer Lolotea - you are freaking awesome. I really admire your courage, to be taking on this many individuals who just DON'T GET what it feels like to be marginalized by the gaming industry because of stupid behaviors like this on the part of Brink's. Thank you for standing up for women who care about games, and want to see the existence of our gender acknowledged.

And thank you randomfox and MasterV - it's great to see awesome male allies who can see through the bull as well. You and a few other awesome users are pretty much the only reason why I'm convincing myself to stay at the Escapist and not run for the hills.


Keep on keepin' on.

 

[GrandmaFunk]

You're really in no position to be getting all defensive and rude. After all, you're the one who came in here with a 'tude and boasted of your alleged expertise.

P.S.: Jargon proves jack. And when it's backed up with insults, it proves less than jack.

the weakest of cop-outs

 

[Super Happy Cow]

You're really in no position to be getting all defensive and rude. After all, you're the one who came in here with a 'tude and boasted of your alleged expertise.

P.S.: Jargon proves jack. And when it's backed up with insults, it proves less than jack.

Actually, I didn't. I mentioned my skills. You implied that I was dishonest. You subsequently failed to provide a decent argument and pretended that I was "boasting."

Like I said. Dishonest.

 

[Super Happy Cow]

As a new person to the forums, I have to say, this topic is horrendous enough to make me want to leave. The blatant sexism from many male members, and the internalized misogyny of some of the women, just makes me really uncomfortable.

But I have to say, to Farseer Lolotea - you are freaking awesome. I really admire your courage, to be taking on this many individuals who just DON'T GET what it feels like to be marginalized by the gaming industry because of stupid behaviors like this on the part of Brink's. Thank you for standing up for women who care about games, and want to see the existence of our gender acknowledged.

And thank you randomfox and MasterV - it's great to see awesome male allies who can see through the bull as well. You and a few other awesome users are pretty much the only reason why I'm convincing myself to stay at the Escapist and not run for the hills.


Keep on keepin' on.

I'm almost certain that 90 percent of forum posters cannot read, by now. I am going to go.

 

[Kahunaburger]

Go ahead. Explain to me the first steps you would take in developing a pipeline that would facilitate the streamlining of the character creation process that would result in 24 distinct looking characters, 3 bodytypes, and both sexes, All within 2 UV spaces maximum, for the base models, and give me an estimate of how long that would take.

Body armor. See also: Halo Reach, real life. Alternately, I'd transfer some of my budget from clothing to character design. Or, I could choose the more interesting option in the context of the industry and have the characters be all female vs. all male.

And re: the rest of the post, no one is disputing that Splash Damage made the safer choice. It's just not the most interesting or progressive choice they could have made.

 

[Kahunaburger]

As a new person to the forums, I have to say, this topic is horrendous enough to make me want to leave. The blatant sexism from many male members, and the internalized misogyny of some of the women, just makes me really uncomfortable.

But I have to say, to Farseer Lolotea - you are freaking awesome. I really admire your courage, to be taking on this many individuals who just DON'T GET what it feels like to be marginalized by the gaming industry because of stupid behaviors like this on the part of Brink's. Thank you for standing up for women who care about games, and want to see the existence of our gender acknowledged.

And thank you randomfox and MasterV - it's great to see awesome male allies who can see through the bull as well. You and a few other awesome users are pretty much the only reason why I'm convincing myself to stay at the Escapist and not run for the hills.


Keep on keepin' on.

Don't let threads like this turn you off the forum as a whole - most people here seem very reasonable, but some topics just seem to bring the misogynists out of the woodwork for some reason.

 

[bl4ckh4wk64]

Did Halo have female charecters in IT'S multiplayer? What about Section 8? I don't know why Brink is the upset. Of course, it is a little more jaring since there isn't power armor for everyone. Despite Spartans in Multiplayer looking male, it doesn't take much to imigine one as a girl.

I apologize if this has been said before, but yea. You can be a female Spartan in Halo 3.